View Full Version : who CARES!!!! about the stock market!
I get real annoyed with all the gloom and doom the media puts on the stock market. It went up 500 points today - whoop whoop. It went down 500 points today - whoop whoop.
WHO CARES? SERIOUSLY?
If you are near retirment, your money should be in low risk (bonds, etc.) and the stock market should not matter to you.
If you are not near retirement, then you should be loving the summer clearance prices of the stock market. Buying LOW is the whole point.
The only people that should care about the stock market, are the investors, (who should all have enough money / cushion to survive fluctuations easily!!!!).
GRRRRRRRRRRR.
There was an awesome article in THE ONION that was about a loser named Joe who remained unaffected by the stockmarket. (Stocks crashing does not affect Joe who says he still has money for rent and the occasional netflix and that even when stocks go high, he still remains a loser).
Plus the news always quotes the Dow Jones Industrial average. The DJ only covers the price of 30 stocks out of the thousand of listed stocks. I am a long term investor and the ups and downs do not cause me to lose sleep at night. I also look at the dips like we have been having as buying opportunities. Today I buy for dividends being paid by solid companies. I am not looking for capital gains.
ApatheticNoMore
8-22-11, 1:24pm
Stocks crashing is also a possible signal of the general direction of the economy. Stocks crashed in the Great Depression and the economy followed (actually they crashed several times I think). When stocks crashed in 2008 the economy followed. Stocks recovered after 2008 (at least somewhat and temporarily), unemployment NEVER recovered! (maybe went down for around one month around here and then right back up!)
If what is going on with the stock market now is any kind of signal about the general economy. Uh oh ..... I mean what then? Official unemployment increases from 10% to 20%? (unofficial unemployment tends to be double the official figures). Then we've got a 100% genuine real probably worse than the Great Depression depression on our hands.
Guess I still have too much in stocks to avoid worry though I am tempted to just sell. Because a part of me would like nothing more than just "sticking to my knitting" and ignoring the chaos outside. Now "my knitting" may be doing stuff so that I might land a job and if things continue to worsen it can not but have an effect on me. But I can't control that and I'd rather focus on what I can.
I guess in a perfect world nobody would care? Assuming we have enough to eat, a place to live, and our health then all should be well, right? ;)
Well, as a retiree that has survived a couple of these downturns already I really do care about the stock market. In my case when I was planning for retirement I used that somewhat standard assumption that I could live on 4% withdrawal rate of my investments. That was in 2003 when you could get a 5-7 year CD ladder at anywhere from 4-7% easily and the market was exceeding that quite handily. My equity/FI allocation was 70/30 simply becuase I was only 52 at the time. Since then as I aged I am now about 50/50 as a 60 year old. Like Free I am more interested these days in dividends in what are hopefully relatively stable companies. Because we are now in such a low interest rate environment I think more and more retirees are being forced to take more risk than in previous times.
My two major financial concerns as a retiree are inflation (in the 8 years since retirement it is pretty obvious that is an issue, especially healthcare) and capital preservation within the margins that I described.
My other concern with the stock market is the well-being of my former employer. If they were to go bankrupt then everything changes for all retirees with access to healthcare being the primary issue for anyone under 65. Maybe someone that is a government employee this would not be an issue?
Peace
I get real annoyed with all the gloom and doom the media puts on the stock market. It went up 500 points today - whoop whoop. It went down 500 points today - whoop whoop.
WHO CARES? SERIOUSLY?
If you are near retirement, your money should be in low risk (bonds, etc.) and the stock market should not matter to you.
If you are not near retirement, then you should be loving the summer clearance prices of the stock market. Buying LOW is the whole point.
The only people that should care about the stock market are the investors, (who should all have enough money / cushion to survive fluctuations easily!!!!).
My, my my. A post full of "shoulds" written by someone who knows so little about investing.
For sure, there are things in life far more important than financial markets, but life as we know it wouldn't be possible without them. What happens in markets affects everyone on this planet, even undiscovered tribes in the Amazon rain forest, because markets determine where and how capital is deployed. In this country, the financial well-being of everyone of us is determined by what happens on financial exchanges, which isn't to say that a lot of craziness doesn't happen there as well. But that, too, has consequences. As the simplest of examples, there has been an nearly 80% decline in DB pension plans and a corresponding increase in DC ones. That change hasn't changed the dependence on financial markets. It has merely shifted the management of assets from those with some experience to those with little and decreased the chance those people will be financially secure in their retirement.
If you truly knew anything worth knowing about investing, you wouldn't be saying the things you are, however heartfelt they might be. And there is nothing low risk about bonds. I run a $600k, all-bond portfolio for myself, and I know the risks that bonds carry.
Charlie
What drives me crazy is that they report everything moment to moment. Its up! Its down! Its up! Its down! Its up! Its down! I wish they'd just shut up for at least a few days and then give a report.
That's the nature of the news these days, CathyA -- and now THIS is happening, and now THIS, and now THIS. It drives me insane as well, and makes me turn off the TV and stick to the Economist. But I fully understand why it's important what happens in the market (though I wish it didn't matter), so my beef is with the shrill, shrieking media rather than anything else.
HappyHiker
8-22-11, 11:00pm
I care because I'm not bright enoughto be out of it..
iris lily
8-22-11, 11:46pm
That's the nature of the news these days, CathyA -- and now THIS is happening, and now THIS, and now THIS. It drives me insane as well, and makes me turn off the TV and stick to the Economist. But I fully understand why it's important what happens in the market (though I wish it didn't matter), so my beef is with the shrill, shrieking media rather than anything else.
pug, agreed, so true, am sick of the hourly hysteria about just about anything, really.
Stocks crashing is also a possible signal of the general direction of the economy. Stocks crashed in the Great Depression and the economy followed (actually they crashed several times I think). When stocks crashed in 2008 the economy followed. Stocks recovered after 2008 (at least somewhat and temporarily), unemployment NEVER recovered! (maybe went down for around one month around here and then right back up!)
If what is going on with the stock market now is any kind of signal about the general economy. Uh oh ..... I mean what then? Official unemployment increases from 10% to 20%? (unofficial unemployment tends to be double the official figures). Then we've got a 100% genuine real probably worse than the Great Depression depression on our hands.
Guess I still have too much in stocks to avoid worry though I am tempted to just sell. Because a part of me would like nothing more than just "sticking to my knitting" and ignoring the chaos outside. Now "my knitting" may be doing stuff so that I might land a job and if things continue to worsen it can not but have an effect on me. But I can't control that and I'd rather focus on what I can.
I am retired, have a government pension, some saving in bank CD's, etc... but I have zero money in the stock market or in any kind of investment that I can lose money. But for the reasons that Apathetic points out, I DO care what happens to the market. A major economic downturn could effect me (although minimally) in terms of the housing market if I want to buy or sell, my pension (Calif State pension fund lost several BILLION in one day due to the falling stock market), the bank interest rates, drop in my city and county funds (money lost in markets and in tax revenue from people not spending and falling property taxs) and the possible decay and unavailability of city and county services, etc... So while I personally won't feel much effect financially, the world around me falling into a depression and decay will effect me.
I just had my quarterly investment review yesterday with my Schwab guy. Amaziningly, he agrees with me and not my DH. Sit tight. Stocks are above where they were this time last year. The people who watch stocks for a living (not the media idjits) are predicting a solid rise by the end of the year.
Both of us are retired. We're well diversified, which includes stocks. And stocks affect other areas. So we care. Still, I like to watch the roller coaster because I like roller coasters in general. I just smile and hang on.
So while I personally won't feel much effect financially, the world around me falling into a depression and decay will effect me.
My thoughts too, but my take on this is: I know there's a terrific risk of this anyway. We live in a world of increasing population, declining natural resources, rampant greed, and ineffectual government, and any good blips imho are just that: blips on the way down. So, being the demi-doomer that I am, I'm already doing everything I can to secure our lives against that eventuality. And there's not a single solitary thing I can do about whether we slip into that depression or not.
Ergo, there's no real point to following it all on the news for the play-by-play. Nothing I see on Fox is going to change my strategies....all it's going to do is freak me out, like watching a horror movie right before bedtime.
I agree that the short term market swings get way more attention than they deserve. When you think about, stocks are actually public ownerships of the companies that comprise our economy. Long term changes are usually less investor emotion, but a prediction or reflection of how well those companies are doing. Bottom line is that stock prices over the long run affect everyone.
The thought that retirees should not be invested in stocks is not mainstream. Most retirees listen to advice of some sort through books, articles, or personal advice, who say to have some money in stocks. Right or not, lower stock prices affect the future of many retirees.
Most of my retirement money is in fixed income investments, plus a few stocks, and I'm actually more concerned with our low interest rates.
That's the nature of the news these days.
And it's always been the nature of the stock market. Anyone remember what "ticker tape" was originally? You know, those old movies with people watching the ticker machine anxiously? One reason for the push to invent electronic communication in the first place was to move information on the movements of financial markets around the world fast, and act on it equally fast. All major news is effectively financial news, and feeding the need to supply it to the financial movers and shakers was what fueled (and paid for) development of the telegraph. Our public attention to it is a bit feverish at the moment due to anxiety and market volatility, and perhaps the need of talking heads to have something to talk about, but the stock market has been watched minutely in real time for well over a century, nothing new.
!pow!
iris lily
8-24-11, 10:27am
I just had my quarterly investment review yesterday with my Schwab guy. Amaziningly, he agrees with me and not my DH. Sit tight. Stocks are above where they were this time last year. The people who watch stocks for a living (not the media idjits) are predicting a solid rise by the end of the year.
Both of us are retired. We're well diversified, which includes stocks. And stocks affect other areas. So we care. Still, I like to watch the roller coaster because I like roller coasters in general. I just smile and hang on.
I've had a similar thought the past month. The roller coaster is fun, in a way. If you let it affect your life negatively, that's your (the generic you) fault. At this point it's just paper. Which is not to say that it could turn deadly, but not so, not yet.
catherine
8-24-11, 10:32am
The stock market seems to reflect self-fulfilling prophesies, and for something as "rational" and "mathematic" they are really at the whims and vagaries of the collective consciousness (and unconsciousness).
I've already fallen victim to the recession so for me, "freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose." It's nice to not have to sweat about your portfolio because you don't have one.
It sure effects me. I'm in my early 50's and live off my investments. I keep track of my spending and investments monthly. I really don't have any worries, but I do put off any large purchases if I see my net worth drop in the 5 and 6 figure range. The market is supposadly forward looking on the economy. And as others have said with the Fed keeping interest rates artificially low you need to be diversified.
On the plus side, all those who worry about income inequality, the rich own more stocks so when the market tanks their net worth is affected more.
catherine
8-24-11, 11:17am
I'm sorry--I'm going to be totally obnoxious to DMC and Spartana:
So while I personally won't feel much effect financially, the world around me falling into a depression and decay will effect me
It sure effects me.
http://www.grammarbook.com/grammar_quiz/effect_vs_affect_1.asp
Take this quiz--or not: It won't affect me in the slightest if you don't but if you do it may have an effect on your understanding of a common grammatical error. ;)
I'm sorry--I'm going to be totally obnoxious to DMC and Spartana:
http://www.grammarbook.com/grammar_quiz/effect_vs_affect_1.asp
Take this quiz--or not: It won't affect me in the slightest if you don't but if you do it may have an effect on your understanding of a common grammatical error. ;)
Ya know why that's a common error? Because it's hard to remember all the rules. I simply stick with the affect=verb, effect=noun rule and get it right about 75% of the time. I'm happy with that.
iris lily
8-24-11, 11:56am
I'm sorry--I'm going to be totally obnoxious to DMC and Spartana:
http://www.grammarbook.com/grammar_quiz/effect_vs_affect_1.asp
Take this quiz--or not: It won't affect me in the slightest if you don't but if you do it may have an effect on your understanding of a common grammatical error. ;)
I took the quiz and scored 100% and I am bragging about it because I have occasional trouble with effect/affect and while I can skim read on a good brain day and choose correct answers, that doesn't mean that I can writie it myself when I need it.
Last week I had trouble with Laying down/lying down and chose the wrong one I think.
"I am lying on the couch"
I said "I am laying on the couch." Wrong?
I hope this forum does not turn into a correct grammar is required to post forum. My grammar is bad and my spelling is even worse.
http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/effect_an_effect.png
catherine
8-24-11, 12:16pm
Sorry!!! Thanks, Alan, for putting me in my place. Truly don't want to come off as "that guy."
I'm sorry--I'm going to be totally obnoxious to DMC and Spartana:
http://www.grammarbook.com/grammar_quiz/effect_vs_affect_1.asp
Take this quiz--or not: It won't affect me in the slightest if you don't but if you do it may have an effect on your understanding of a common grammatical error. ;)
Ha! Ha! I read somewhere that Marilyn Monroe once said "I'm a blonde, I don't need to know how to think". So "I'm a blond, I doesnt kneed to no any gramer or nothin' like speling and writin'!" :laff:!
But I do get mixed up on alot of words: payed or paid? affect or effect? then or than? So many more I just can't think... cause, well, I'm a blonde and I ain't gotta :devil:
No worries Catherine, just having a little fun with your gentle suggestion.
I always try to overlook spelling errors, if they're harmless, and have a high tolerance for common mistakes such as affect/effect. Where I get myself in trouble is when the wrong word is used for something. Most times I can overlook it, but repeated use causes me to channel Inigo Montoya. Probably because I'd be more embarrassed to continue using the wrong word than the momentary discomfort of being corrected.
Life_is_Simple
8-26-11, 12:48pm
I look at the Dow, and think it will go back up again some day. I guess that means that even though I have *some* invested in stock, I also have some bonds and safer funds.
So I can sleep at night. Though I am not going to look at my account at the present moment. ;)
No worries Catherine, just having a little fun with your gentle suggestion.
I always try to overlook spelling errors, if they're harmless, and have a high tolerance for common mistakes such as affect/effect. Where I get myself in trouble is when the wrong word is used for something. Most times I can overlook it, but repeated use causes me to channel Inigo Montoya. Probably because I'd be more embarrassed to continue using the wrong word than the momentary discomfort of being corrected.
I LOVE inigo Montoya... "My name is Inigo Montoya!..." LOL
Ha! Ha! I read somewhere that Marilyn Monroe once said "I'm a blonde, I don't need to know how to think". So "I'm a blond, I doesnt kneed to no any gramer or nothin' like speling and writin'!" :laff:!
But I do get mixed up on alot of words: payed or paid? affect or effect? then or than? So many more I just can't think... cause, well, I'm a blonde and I ain't gotta :devil:
You can't fool me--Blondes saying they're dumb is the greatest cover of all time...
You can't fool me--Blondes saying they're dumb is the greatest cover of all time...
We're busted :-)! (or is that were busted?). Actually my grammer and spelling ARE terrible because I don't have internet access at home so am usually writing on the fly - like now in the parking lot of McDonalds. So I never check anything I write as I don't have time - probably explains alot :-)!
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