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jennipurrr
11-29-11, 11:36am
I wasn't sure where to put this, and I don't want to seem to be shilling for DR, but I think his program is pretty decent for people struggling financially. This is the online version of his program and it is usually $150 I believe.

I guess this is his post black friday special, haha.

$39.00 (77% off) - Financial Peace University Online + Audio CDs
If you've been looking to do Financial Peace University but had trouble finding the time, this is the bundle for you. Take FPU 24/7 Online plus get the 13-lesson Audio CD Library FREE!

http://www.daveramsey.com/store/prodfpuolpromo3.html

lhamo
11-29-11, 6:12pm
I wish there was a secular version of Dave Ramsey. I do listen to his podcast, because I find the success stories to be so inspirational and motivating (even though we have never had any debt other than our mortgage), but sometimes the religious/conservative bent of things gets a little annoying. But you have to hand it to the guy -- his system has changed many, many people's lives in a positive way.

lhamo

Bastelmutti
11-30-11, 10:03am
+1 I have to skip the libertarian rants. But the basic advice is very sound.

ljevtich
12-2-11, 5:06pm
Quite honestly, I never really got into anyone else after I read YMOYL. It is just one book, and it helped me out. Ramsey seems to make you buy book after book, workshops and other such nonsense. The YMOYL book can be had for much cheaper prices, and then you can ask questions and find answers here on the forums. There are also coaches available in your area if you really need the handholding.

No I am not a fan of Ramsey. He is getting rich off of other people's pain.

Weston
12-7-11, 4:08pm
Quite honestly, I never really got into anyone else after I read YMOYL. It is just one book, and it helped me out. Ramsey seems to make you buy book after book, workshops and other such nonsense. The YMOYL book can be had for much cheaper prices, and then you can ask questions and find answers here on the forums. There are also coaches available in your area if you really need the handholding.

No I am not a fan of Ramsey. He is getting rich off of other people's pain.

Well said. I agree completely.

jennipurrr
12-7-11, 4:36pm
I don't really see Dave Ramsey in that vein...his program is $39 at the link above and its a fairly comprehensive program for someone starting to manage their finances. I don't think there are additional products to buy?!

I love YMOYL, but the mindset isn't what everyone is looking for. I've recommended it to a couple of people who just found it too earthy for their tastes...Dave Ramsey certainly removes that element.

I have never found Dave to be incongruent with what he teaches about finances...I believe he does not accept credit cards on his website.

ljevtich
12-8-11, 4:48am
Look at his home page and tell me that there isn't a discrepancy here: http://www.daveramsey.com/home/ (http://www.daveramsey.com/home/)
How many systems do you need to get you on the path?

And while they do not accept credit cards, they do accept debit cards:


We understand what is running through your mind right now. "I can't believe Dave Ramsey is accepting credit cards! This can't be true! He's sold out on his principles!" But before you shave your head and run outside on your front lawn screaming, "The world is coming to an end, save yourself!" let's clear up a few things:

Number 1 - We are NOT accepting credit cards! Never have and never will. I mean, come on, do you listen to the radio show at all? Have you ever heard of a plasectomy? Please understand that accepting credit cards is something that will NEVER happen as long as Dave is still alive (and even forever after that!)

Number 2 - We are accepting DEBIT cards. We know that some people will go nuts when they hear that, but one factor is being overlooked. Debit cards do not work unless there is CASH available.

But the trouble with buying stuff is that you still have to pay the price. A YMOYL book costs $10 while even going to see him speak costs $29 or to get his envelope system costs $10 or one of his many new books costs $14.95. WHERE does it end? He comes out with something new and he writes a book. And then people buy it. He has gear, he has paid coaches, he has t-shirts, stuff for the kids, budget software, etc. etc. etc.

And now he has endorsed local providers that would kick back money to him.
No, I do not like him. If you like him so much, go to one of his free forums and see advice from him. Oh wait, you can't do that, as it is not available. He doesn't have anything for free.

Selah
12-8-11, 10:35am
I read Dave Ramsey's book ("Extreme Money Makeover") in a bookstore, and then eventually kept checking it out from my library, over and over again. I never bought it, because I was trying to get out of debt, LOL! Once I got out of debt, I didn't need the book anymore, so I STILL haven't bought it. I've recommended it to friends, though, and suggest they check it out of their library. They, too, get out of debt and end up buying it as a gift to give to someone else.

Yes, he is a pitchman and has a big organization he's built up around selling his message. But the message, i.e. getting out of debt, is still a good one. I'm more interested in the message than I am in the messenger.

treehugger
12-8-11, 12:01pm
Yes, he is a pitchman and has a big organization he's built up around selling his message. But the message, i.e. getting out of debt, is still a good one. I'm more interested in the message than I am in the messenger.

Ditto that. And I got his book out of the library, so that was free. I actually checked out at least 10 different books from different authors on budgeting and frugal living and debt reduction. All were helpful in some way. I took notes and all of the advice was free. Most people have libraries at their disposal (thank goodness for libraries!!!).

Kara

jennipurrr
12-8-11, 1:17pm
No, I do not like him. If you like him so much, go to one of his free forums and see advice from him. Oh wait, you can't do that, as it is not available. He doesn't have anything for free.

Was I supposed to read this as sounding as inflammatory as it did? I usually enjoy this forum because we can have great discourse without being snarky...I would never expect someone infer that I am not welcome here and to tell me to go to a different forum if I love DR so much?!?! That is ridiculous. I just posted a product I thought might interest some people here. I am not a shill for DR.

I am actually not a huge Dave fan. He's too religious and a bit dogmatic for me. I just don't think he is one of those schiester financial gurus. He has a good plan to help people and I feel his products are reasonably priced. For example, he offers envelope sets, but he will also tell you how to make your own out of regular envelopes. I don't see the debit card thing as an issue. He is taking a big financial loss by not accepting ccs, and while he does offer a lot of products, he has not compromised the principles of his plan there.

IMO, there really is no difference in purchasing the Total Money Makeover book or YMOYL. They are both solid plans for financial change. While I love YMOYL, I wonder if in practice more people might be helped with the "baby steps" approach of TMM. YMOYL is a very broad thinking type of book, TMM is very step by step. They are both readily available used and at the library. I listen to the podcasts occasionally (for free btw) and just don't get the vibe you do from him. Different strokes.

leslieann
12-8-11, 1:43pm
I listen to DR podcasts, too, for free, and he makes me laugh, sometimes, and often inspires. The free podcasts are a great option, IMHO.

puglogic
12-8-11, 2:12pm
I "take what I need and leave the rest" with Dave Ramsey and everything else.

I have nothing against someone running a business that helps people. I don't think it's evil to make money selling products that have a bigger social benefit. Mind you, I am always suspicious of people whose life plan includes a trillion-square-foot house, but that's just me. He benefits a lot of people - and the book prices are tiny compared to the savings he makes possible for people. Not everything good has to be free, and not everything free has to be good. {shrug}

Thanks for the link, jennipurr!

ApatheticNoMore
12-8-11, 2:30pm
Still your parents or if not them your grandparents probably gave you a lot of the same advice, for free :laff:

catherine
12-8-11, 3:16pm
Still your parents or if not them your grandparents probably gave you a lot of the same advice, for free :laff:

And if your parents didn't give you good advice--if they were spendthrifts (like my mother who blew through an inheritance by buying big luxury cars and blazers (she had more than 25 of them in her closet at the prime of her spending)--Dave is a great father figure. I much prefer his style to the Suze Orman "girlfriend" style. He is certainly opinionated and you can take or leave what he says, but when it comes to money, I take issue at the idea that he is profiting from the pain of others. Au contraire--those who have heeded his advice are nothing but joyful and finally financially sane, and find that the return on investment in his products is enormous.

ljevtich
12-12-11, 9:44pm
If you can get his books in the library, and other frugal books as well, then go for it.

I do like YMOYL for the fact that these were successful people before they started and continue to be successful people based on their own ideas of success. I like the fact that they give back to others. I do not think of them as "crunchy or earthy" just as normal people that helped out thousands of people.

In my own opinion, if you are going to say a product is great, why say buy it from XYZ? Why not say, see if it is available at the library or on Amazon? Like this: Relating-Money-Financial-Peace-University (http://www.amazon.com/Relating-Money-Financial-Peace-University/dp/B002HESZH2) As you notice, the price on Amazon is even cheaper than Ramsey. But getting it in the library is a better way to go.

I do think Ramsey has put the "getting out of debt" discussion on the table and made it more visible and more talked about. Maybe because there are so many people out there in debt, maybe it is not as shameful as it was before. I do not know. But I am glad that he is making the discussions be more open, honest and out there to be discussed. I just don't like his selling techniques and religious talk. I guess I should
"take what I need and leave the rest" with Dave Ramsey... it seems like good words to live by.

razz
12-13-11, 10:23am
There are many paths for every bit of information for a very diverse world and we need to give a variety of options on this forum site for those who are seeking. The info sought may be financial, family issues, gifting, abuse, work challenges, emotional support, etc.
Thanks for posting the link for an option on dealing with financial challenges.

Spartana
12-13-11, 3:34pm
My only negative issue with Dave Ramsey vs. YMOYL is that Dave's focus is to get out of debt so that the money you do earn can be used to buy more things - bigger and better things ("live like no one else, so you can live like no one else") debt-free. A sentiment that I don't share but many do. They really want the finer things in life, they just don't want the debt that goes with it. Finding a way to live that life seems to be what DR focuses his financial stratigies towards. Where as YMOYL is about consuming less and living on less "irregardless of your earnings" so that you can use your "life energy" towards other things besides endless hours at work to buy consumer "stuff" to make your life better. Personally I don't care if he makes a buck - or a million bucks to go with his fancy mansion - even if I think his info is all just common sense and can be had for free by just...er... thinking about it and stop living beyond your means (Duh!). Where as YMOYL was a "new" way of thinking about living - one which did away with the need/want to be consumer driven, to be on a never stopping rat race threadmill while trying to attain all the new fancy things that are out there. It was about trying to find happiness and fulfillment in your life with other things besides money and stuff. Much more useful to me then a Dave Ramsey "get out of debt" course which says to basicly "live within or below your means - or increase your means - and then you'll be able to afford the luxuries you deserve".

catherine
12-13-11, 3:49pm
Spartana,

You're right and I don't disagree with you or others who say that they are put off by the endgame in the Dave Ramsey approach. But still the journey is the important thing, and I think he's got that right.

In addition, a lot of people, unfortunately, need that "prosperity gospel" to stay motivated.. their carrot and stick is the thought of being able to have a ridiculous home like Dave's and pay cash for it. But my version of "taking what you like and leave the rest" is following him on the journey and then taking a different path at the crossroads--he and his followers can have their mansions, and I'll follow Vicki and Joe the rest of the way. So I don't think you have to throw the baby out with the bathwater here.

As a sidebar: I would love to see evidence to show that the mass of people can be motivated to live small like we do. I read a great book called The All-Consuming Century, and the sad conclusion that the author, Gary Cross, made was that people gravitate towards consumption (conspicuous and otherwise) for reasons of identity or as a backlash against having experienced want, or just because stuff is shiny.

I personally believe that the evolution toward living according to our need and not our greed is going to be a long, long time in coming. I wish I could provide a digest of Gary Cross's findings because they were compelling. Even Scott Nearing said that his constant demon was putting his "wants" on the back burner.

I would love to conduct a study on why we (meaning those of us on this forum) are motivated to live small, and see how it could be duplicated on a broader scale.

Spartana
12-13-11, 4:09pm
As a sidebar: I would love to see evidence to show that the mass of people can be motivated to live small like we do. I read a great book called The All-Consuming Century, and the sad conclusion that the author, Gary Cross, made was that people gravitate towards consumption (conspicuous and otherwise) for reasons of identity or as a backlash against having experienced want, or just because stuff is shiny.



I'd like to see that too. But I agree that for most people, living small isn't a goal for them or a lifestyle that they want. Why? Probably because it isn't recognized by the mainstream as anything valuable - to society or to the individual. It's still equated with poverty, lack of ambition, laziness, moral digression, etc... I had hoped that more people would value a smaller life as a good life choice during this recession, but it seems the opposite it true. People only think about what they are missing out on - things they can no longer afford to have - rather than looking at it as an opportunity to grow in a new direction - one that may be better for them financially. socially, mentally, physically, and even spiritually in the short run as well as the long run. But peer pressure is peer pressure, and until more people opt to choose a more humble lifestyle and see it as a great thing, only a few of us independant thinkers will join that bandwagon.

As for DR, yep his end goals may be different then many of us simple livers, but I agree that his message can be very inspirational to most mainstream folks. I do wish that he would focus more on attaining other future goals once out of debt than just monetary/consumer ones though.