View Full Version : Self-employment Support?
fidgiegirl
1-9-12, 11:06pm
Someone was posting that they wanted to see more support threads. I was thinking it's hard to start one unless you're in the situation, but I'm gonna go for it.
As you may know, I am very, very, very interested in self-employment. I'm not really starting this thread for advice, which you have soooooo kindly offered in the past. It's welcome, of course, but I do have a few ideas to try to get me going . . . I'm kind of holding off a little so I don't overload and go crazy as we try to finish up this remodel and move. In another month or two I can start to implement my ideas whole-hog.
I just thought maybe this could be one of our support forums, that people at different stages of self-employment could post successes or challenges, getting advice or simply offering inspiration.
For me, at this point, anyone actually making any money would be a huge inspiration for me!! :)
I am feeling more and more committed to this goal. Today I left work at noon to do some things on the house, and it felt so good. It felt good to be out in the sunshine and able to do the things my mind were actually on instead of having to force my mind to be on work at that time just because it was day time . . . often I find myself thinking more about work in the evening which is "supposed" to be my home time. I know it won't be a picnic of no work ever, but I pine for the flexibility.
Although as far as working for someone else, this is muuuuuch more flexible than teaching.
Well, there you have it. Hope it's a useful thread.
DH has been earning a modest living since the day he stopped working for a tree company. After urging of many neighbors here, he went out on his own as a handyman. He actually does a lot more than that, he does light construction and small building projects. He can build anything: he does carpentry, tile and marble, brick work, light electrical and plumbing, and of course painting. He puts up fences, installs appliances, cleans up and tidies houses for our friend in real estate, etc. In our neighborhood of Victorian houses his specialty is crown molding.
In the housing boom there were lots of small construction people, now there aren't many left. Even though his customer list has shrunk since at least half of his regulars have moved away, he is still always busy. In this economic climate it just means that his waiting list isn't as long. When he doesn't work he doesn't make money, but that's ok. With my job and since we have no kids, we are just fine.
ps--I just looked at your house renovation blog. I love the cove molding you put in! And the wood floor job in the kitchen, wow! That plus the bead board makes it so cozy! I'd love to have wood floors in the kitchen but we are way too hard on floors. Your house is really cute!
fidgiegirl
1-10-12, 8:49am
Thanks, Iris Lily! We have been mostly enjoying the project, although we are both ready to be done with it now. We are really happy with the results.
Sounds like DH is doing well. I worry a little about what the fluctuation in income would look like for us. I don't want DH to feel he has to be stuck in his job so that I can do what I want. He's not in love with his, either. I'll be there at least another year, I think . . . we'll just have to see!!
What I can offer as support is to remember to keep a balance. Being self-employed can be overwhelming. We really put everything into our business and then last year realized that we couldn't even have a single conversation about anything without bringing up some bit of business. We're trying to work on us a bit more this year.
Bastelmutti
1-10-12, 9:41am
I have been self-employed since 2001. Many times on the old forums, I recommended the book Secrets of Self-Employment by Sarah and Paul Edwards. I think it's a great introduction and offers a lot of help with the mental/emotional shift needed to move to self-employment. I have an old copy from the 90s - haven't checked to see if there is a new edition. Definitely read it (even the old edition)!
mtnlaurel
1-10-12, 10:24am
fidgiegirl -- thank you for starting this thread!!!!
I too am contemplating self-employment.
iris lily
1-10-12, 10:32am
A side benefit of being self-employed and determining your own time is that there is usually someone available to do those household tasks and chores during the workday. It's like having one household partner at home, sorta.
Bastelmutti
1-10-12, 10:55am
A side benefit of being self-employed and determining your own time is that there is usually someone available to do those household tasks and chores during the workday. It's like having one household partner at home, sorta.
Totally true. Just got back from the grocery store, actually. If you have kids, this is a great thing, too. I can take my kids to school/pick them up and share after-school care with another self-employed parent. Nice!
It sounds like you are in an excellent position to explore the possibilities, since you now have a somewhat more flexible work schedule and are not tied to a job. Take advantage of the fact that you don't have kids to worry about, too -- if we didn't have kids, I would definitely be exploring side job possibilities. But there are only so many hours in the day, and it just isn't realistic for me to take on anything else right now, even if just for a few hours a week.
Can't remember if I have suggested it yet, but Pam Slim's blog and book "Escape from Cubicle Nation" are also a great resource. She says a lot of stuff similar to Ramit Sethi, but in a gentler way. She worked with Martha Beck, who is also one of my favorites. Both are very funny and I think you'd like their stuff, if you haven't read it already.
lhamo
Bastelmutti
1-10-12, 5:15pm
I attended a Founding Moms meet-up today - finding a group like that might be helpful. We listed our goals for the year and are going to have accountability partners to check in with us about taking the steps toward meeting them! Plus if you decide on an in-home business, it's nice to get out, meet people in person, talk shop, network, socialize, etc.
I am in my second year of self-employment, after a whole career of working in salaried positions. I am painfully aware of the limitations of my situation. I have to work to earn money. When I take time off, I don't earn money. I don't have a pension plan (they still have those here in Canada, at least in the public sector), I don't have unemployment compensation or disability benefits (I could pay for them but boy, are they EVER expensive) and did I say that I don't have vacation? I have lots of flexibility...sort of. In my work, I schedule appointments with clients several weeks in advance and these are face to face meetings. I don't do work for people in between sessions, I just get paid for the session (lawyers have a better compensation model when self employed). ETA correction: I do some work between sessions but don't usually get paid for it.
On the positive side, I can earn a lot if I am willing to work a lot. There does seem to be a demand for my services but of course that could change. Oops, that's not on the positive side, is it? I work out of a space I added to my home, so there is nice flexibility there and it keeps costs low. Lately, though, I have been looking at the no-benefits side and wondering how I can provide myself a similar safety net to what my DH has with his long term public sector job.
I have been thinking about applying for a job, but when I really consider it, I realize that I do enjoy not having to answer to anyone, taking a day when I need it (even though I have to schedule it pretty far in advance), and working on stuff that I am particularly interested in. So I guess for me this self employment is a good option. (My years as a prof were pretty good, too, though....lots of autonomy plus a salary and benefits.....).
I can't wait to hear about what you are planning, fidgie, but good idea to take time with the house project going on. Looks wonderful, by the way!
Great thread to start, fidgie! I'm self-employed, and although I sometimes worry about things like unemployment, cost of insurance, and all of that, I don't think I could go back to working for someone else (a partnership, maybe)
It's good to have a home office because I can have the dogs with me all day, save on gas and eating out, play "mood music," and all of those good things. But sometimes things happen like this afternoon: I was on a conference call and there was this huge crash from right below my window. I looked out the window and down onto the back of a huge elk that had knocked over the compost container and was helping himself. Luckily my client thought it was funny too!
A big kick for me lately has been keeping up with John Williams and his http://screwworkletsplay.com web site. His book's all about self-employment in creative fields, with good emphasis put on earning your first "playcheck" :)
Looking forward to hearing how you fare, what you choose to do, etc. There's a lot of opportunity out here.
mtnlaurel
1-10-12, 10:10pm
Those of you that have replied, could you share what fields you are in?
Bastelmutti
1-11-12, 8:48am
I am a translator. Going it alone is the norm in my business - many companies have gotten rid of their translation depts. in recent years or have transformed them into project management depts. Some people do work for companies or the government/agencies/courts, etc., but there are many, many freelancers (and agencies - some more mom-and-pop than others).
flowerseverywhere
1-11-12, 8:48am
I always worked for "the man" but yesterday I had an interesting experience that I think could be helpful to people here.
Yesterday I called a local petsitting service because I will be out of town for a few weeks when the new grandchild comes. I wanted to have someone in place that will come to my house to care for my cats. Of course, cats only need a visit every day or two not like dogs.
I called a woman who had advertised in the paper. She told me she relocated here in May and once she put some ads out she has been absolutely so busy. There was no-one anywhere near here who was insured, bonded and licenced to do this service. She gets calls from people who are twenty and thirty miles away, but her limit is 15 miles round trip, and she has more than enough business to make a full time living. She also will take in your mail and paper, and put your garbage to the curb if you want. Price is $15 per half hour which includes litter boxes, food and petting and visiting with the cats (I live in a low cost area where you can get a decent house for less than $125,000). With two cats boarding it would be three times that per day and I don't think they would get personal attention.
I have no idea how you would break into this but I thought was a great way to make a living if you are an animal lover.
One more thing, sicne I only work on call I have slowly built up a sewing business. I am very far from making any kind of decent wage but you would be surprised how many people are looking to have hems done, buttons sewn on etc. Not my favorite thing to do but I make a little money here and there. I am currently making placemats out of fabric to match someones drapes they had made. Not a lot of money but some.
fidgiegirl
1-11-12, 8:55am
flowers, do you find that doing the sewing for your own business makes it more enjoyable? I'm trying to say that I read in Making a Living Without a Job that it's a whole different deal to do certain work when it is for yourself, or the tasks related - like stuffing envelopes. That's why I like her profit center model and am really working toward that. You could start with the sewing and the petsitting, and if one grew big enough or you thought of another, you could drop the sewing if it was no longer profitable.
I also find people are scared of the sewing machine. Not that I'm good at it, and probably take way too long accomplishing sewing tasks . . . haha but I can usually get 'em done in some way or another!
Bastelmutti
1-11-12, 8:56am
Petsitting - that is a good idea. We pay a friend $15 to take care of our cats in the same way, but this is a higher COL area, so the market rate would undoubtedly be higher. Not bad, esp. for cats (no walking).
Bastelmutti
1-11-12, 8:57am
flowers, do you find that doing the sewing for your own business makes it more enjoyable? I'm trying to say that I read in Making a Living Without a Job that it's a whole different deal to do certain work when it is for yourself, or the tasks related - like stuffing envelopes. That's why I like her profit center model and am really working toward that. You could start with the sewing and the petsitting, and if one grew big enough or you thought of another, you could drop the sewing if it was no longer profitable.
I also find people are scared of the sewing machine. Not that I'm good at it, and probably take way too long accomplishing sewing tasks . . . haha but I can usually get 'em done in some way or another!
Is that book saying that the tasks are more enjoyable because you are doing it for yourself? I have also heard the converse is true. A lot of people like to do crafts, but if you make 100 prs. of earrings for a craft show, it can get tedious and kill the fun of the craft.
A different attitude toward your tasks does occur when you're doing it for yourself. When I was in corporate, I got a salary no matter what I did. So I tended to subconsciously look at the task as whether or not I was happy doing it. If I was working a 70 hour week, you can bet I wasn't that happy doing my tasks, no matter what they were.
But now, doing the same tasks for myself, I do think about the intrinsic "enjoyment score" of each task, but I get a bit more satisfaction in being able to say, "oh well, this task is not fun, but it's my car payment (or, half my mortgage, or the phone bill, etc.)." For instance, I had to write a report over Christmas, when I was visiting my kids. If I had to write the report at my salaried job, I would have been resentful having to work over the holidays. But I was able to tell myself, OK, it's a few hours away from the kids today, but it pays for Christmas and our visit to see them.
There's more of a direct link between the sowing and reaping as it were.
AND there's the added benefit of recognizing that I took on the work. It was my choice. I could have turned it down. Try telling your boss, "nah, I don't want to write that report. I'm visiting my kids."
We've been self-employed and incorporated since '97. Today I'm sitting down to do one of my least favorite tasks. Quarterly taxes. It wouldn't be so bad if I just had to do our state and federal but because we travel to do art shows I've got more on my plate. Some states only require a sales tax report right after a show (easy) but I've got 8 other states that require me to fill out quarterly reports, every quarter as well. Each one is different. And by far Texas is the worst. They treat us like a franchise owner (like a McDonalds). Their reports are the worst for an out of state incorporated company.
flowerseverywhere
1-11-12, 9:39am
flowers, do you find that doing the sewing for your own business makes it more enjoyable? I'm trying to say that I read in Making a Living Without a Job that it's a whole different deal to do certain work when it is for yourself, or the tasks related - like stuffing envelopes. That's why I like her profit center model and am really working toward that. You could start with the sewing and the petsitting, and if one grew big enough or you thought of another, you could drop the sewing if it was no longer profitable.
I also find people are scared of the sewing machine. Not that I'm good at it, and probably take way too long accomplishing sewing tasks . . . haha but I can usually get 'em done in some way or another!
I don't do much sewing for others, just a little here and there and I am very careful what I take on. I have too much to do myself. I also don't do things that are very time sonsuming or things I don't enjoy.
I have no plans to do the petsitting, just wanted to throw out the idea. I would advise getting the insured/bonded thing going though, protect yourself from a liability suit if something happens to an animal or a house is broken into for instance. Lots of risk if you aren't careful, like any business.
Dh and I have been self employed since 2001. It is stressful and overwhelming at times. Basically seems like a 24/7 job. Not hard but a ton of hours both in the business and outside just to maintain. It is really hard for us to have a day off together. There have definitely been times when I would have rather had a 9 to 5 with set days off and benefits!
Positives:
1. Dh has a 6th grade education. Finding a good career elsewhere would be a challenge when you combine that with the fact that english is his second language (self taught). I do the office stuff-he runs the kitchen and we compliment each others strengths and weaknesses very well.
2. No day care when ds was little. He came with us to work. I set him up with a nice little area where he could finger paint and get creative with clay to his little heart's content and never worried about the damage-lol!
3. Money was really tight in the beginning but we're reaching FI quickly. There are a lot more ways to manipulate money to your greatest advantage when you work for yourself. BUT, business assets do not equal personal assets!! We've seen many places struggle and fail through the years because they ignore this fact.
4. I never, ever have to worry about being unexpectedly laid off.
5. If business ever got bad enough dh and I could handle the entire operation without outside help.
I'll be happy to answer specific questions if anyone has them.
Bastelmutti
1-11-12, 11:37am
But now, doing the same tasks for myself, I do think about the intrinsic "enjoyment score" of each task, but I get a bit more satisfaction in being able to say, "oh well, this task is not fun, but it's my car payment (or, half my mortgage, or the phone bill, etc.)." For instance, I had to write a report over Christmas, when I was visiting my kids. If I had to write the report at my salaried job, I would have been resentful having to work over the holidays. But I was able to tell myself, OK, it's a few hours away from the kids today, but it pays for Christmas and our visit to see them.
There's more of a direct link between the sowing and reaping as it were.
AND there's the added benefit of recognizing that I took on the work. It was my choice. I could have turned it down. Try telling your boss, "nah, I don't want to write that report. I'm visiting my kids."
I do agree with this, Catherine. I just know, particularly in art and crafts, that what seemed like fun as a hobby might not be so fun as a business. It's just a matter of choosing something you think you would be comfortable doing for many hours at a time! And then if it's a good fit overall, doing those taxes and other obnoxious tasks doesn't seem so bad.
I actually pay someone to do my taxes, even though it's an additional expense, because i find it so confusing.
I'm in the process of transitioning to another money management system, which churns out the tax documents for you, and then having the accountant look through them to make sure that they are correct -- which will save me a fair bit of money. but, i like to do all of the rest of the accounting -- the invoicing, the weekly reconciliations, etc. So, i'm looking forward to using this system.
I really love every aspect of the business -- from the basics of teaching to the customer service to the marketing and so on. It's all good.
I have a few different small profit centers (VERY small) and one major one, which is web consulting/designing/etc.
I'm worried that the smaller ones are tugging at me much more strongly than my main source of income. Writing, for example, really pulls me, as does building organic garden spaces for people. I might starve if I tried to live off those alone. I'm also starting a blog/site that is centered on having an amazing life (food, art, spirits, travel, etc) and still being "green" - that's such a strong pull that I find myself staring out the window daydreaming about it when I should be programming somebody's web site :(
I know it's not for everyone, but I love having more than one profit center. It keeps me energized and interested in life. And it's a way to do things now, rather than the perpetual "oh, I'll have time to do that when I retire".
fidgiegirl
1-11-12, 5:32pm
I do agree with this, Catherine. I just know, particularly in art and crafts, that what seemed like fun as a hobby might not be so fun as a business. It's just a matter of choosing something you think you would be comfortable doing for many hours at a time! And then if it's a good fit overall, doing those taxes and other obnoxious tasks doesn't seem so bad.
I can totally see this side, too. I was talking about the more mundane office-y type tasks, though.
fidgiegirl
1-11-12, 5:34pm
I know it's not for everyone, but I love having more than one profit center. It keeps me energized and interested in life. And it's a way to do things now, rather than the perpetual "oh, I'll have time to do that when I retire".
That's how I foresee it for myself!! If I just went from one job, employed by someone else, to another single-focus job, but self-employed, I think I'd end up feeling largely the same. It's the variety I crave . . .
Also have to be careful to avoid the "grass is greener" syndrome. I tend to fall into that. Ever since high school I've always been planning the next great thing for my life. Sometimes the great thing I'm in right now is the great thing, y'know?
Yes, I know how that is.
The thing that is cool about my business is how quickly it is growing! I'm so amazed! I've seen probably 10-12 new people this week, and all of them have become returning students! yay!
I really, really need to lead a teacher training. I gotsta get people in who teach similar to me, for my students as we grow. I could teach more classes (not a problem for me), but I need to balance that with my son's and husband's needs as well. It's an interesting balance.
fidgiegirl
1-19-12, 6:25pm
I am really, really digging this goal lately.
We are trying to move and redo this house and basically work just feels like it stands in the way. :) Obviously I get that self-employment is not where you do NOTHING and get money for it, but let's say I'm' going to have a blog as one profit center. If when it's daylight out I feel like packing my house to prepare it for moving, and then want to veg out on the couch blogging in the evening when it is dark and cold and I have the packing compulsion out of my system, well then, I can! But now? I have to go to work in the day, no matter what. I have to go to bed at 10 and get up at 6:30, no matter what, even if my body wants to be awake until midnight and get up at 8:00. I have to put in those eight hours, even if there is nothing meaningful for me to be doing at work during hours #7 and #8.
However I am not at a point where I can leave paid employment. It just makes me even more determined to get this as a goal and work towards it . . . now DH, that's a different story . . . I can't read him sometimes. I think he still believes he just has to slog through until retirement . . . he's not very happy in his job and less so every year . . . but he's resistant to more formal training in order to change positions within education, and so his only route out would be entrepreneurship, too. I would like to start something that we can both participate in, but then a very small part of me says, well, I don't have to worry about that. If he wants to leave his job, he can work on that himself. However, I think the risk is bigger that he will see any foray into self-employment as a luxury that I can do only because he puts in the 8 hours and carries the insurance, and will be the silent martyr, damaging our marriage. So I am trying to be very sensitive about that possibility, without sacrificing myself in the process. When I tell him I don't think I'm going back to the same school next year (even if I continue to teach, I think I will have to go somewhere new, by choice) he doesn't say much of anything.
I have all these ideas, but the frustrating part is that right now I have no time - because of work, and the house project - to put any of them into action!!
Maybe I need an achievable goal, like 100 subscribers on my blog by the end of the year. Something to start with . . .
I keep getting ideas for profit centers. My most recent one is kind of a ripoff of a volunteer service I heard about, though: kids read to pets. It's like a tutoring thing, with a special motivation and reduced anxiety (what dog or guinea pig is going to rush you through? or provide the word before you can think about it?) But the fact that it is available as a free thing makes me question if it would be a good thing to do. But I guess, well, there are some people who can find free tax preparation, for example, if they are in the right circumstances, but others pay for it. Well, anyway, it's a wacky idea, but I will put it in my idea book. You never know when the time is right :)
iris lily
1-20-12, 12:21am
fidgie, you are right to think about how your DH may consider your leaping into self employment an exercise in self coddling. OTOH if you take the leap, and get some income streams set up, he will see that it can be done.
We do the pet read thing at my Library and it is very cool, I love that program.
The reason why DH's self employment worked for us is because I love my job (with the health benefits) and he did not, and it was fine with me if he left. He is the most hard working, self motivated person I know so that was part of my trust that he'd give it a good go. He starts work at 7 am every day and doesn't knock off until 6 pm. I had the health benefits for the household though we have to pay for his health insurance, but that is fine.
ApatheticNoMore
1-20-12, 5:48pm
However, I think the risk is bigger that he will see any foray into self-employment as a luxury that I can do only because he puts in the 8 hours and carries the insurance, and will be the silent martyr, damaging our marriage.
As a single person I would find it hard to make the healthcare thing work without a job. Yes if you earn enough at self-employment you can afford the premiums at an individual rate, but you do need to earn enough.
fidgiegirl
1-20-12, 6:03pm
Yes, health insurance is worrisome, but people do make it work. I found this article (http://www.wisebread.com/why-i-heart-my-high-deductible-health-insurance-plan) a while back when doing a little research to help out my sister. It helped me feel a little better about the whole thing. And this year, DH and I are going on a family plan with a VEBA account.
The way I see it, no matter how good your insurance, if you get sick enough, you will be ruined regardless. :(
fidgiegirl
1-20-12, 7:01pm
OMG, I feel like an idiot about the reading to dogs idea. There is a HUGE established volunteer network already doing this. Mean old me, trying to make a buck!! Geez!!!
http://www.tdi-dog.org/
gimmethesimplelife
1-20-12, 7:25pm
I have been self-employed since 2001. Many times on the old forums, I recommended the book Secrets of Self-Employment by Sarah and Paul Edwards. I think it's a great introduction and offers a lot of help with the mental/emotional shift needed to move to self-employment. I have an old copy from the 90s - haven't checked to see if there is a new edition. Definitely read it (even the old edition)!Thanks for the advice, I will check this book out!
All ideas are worth exploring. I hate to keep harping on him (no, he isn't paying me commissions -- he's too cheap!), but Ramit Sethi's methods seem spot on to me. For any small business idea, one of your first goals should be to get 3 paying customers. If you can find people who will pay for it within a relatively short period of time, chances are it might be a workable long-term business. If you can't find paying customers then it is pretty much dead in the water. And you should know that before you spend X months or Y years of your life trying to develop your great idea. Might not apply to every situation, but seems to be very straightforward and practical advice. And he's had tons of people get a jump start on their self-employment dreams by taking this approach. It is kind of like Dave Ramsey's baby steps for paying off debt. It forces you to do something very practical that may not match what the "professionals" tell you you need (RS is not big on business plans, for example), but it works at both a practical and a psychological level.
So, keep exploring your ideas, kelli -- I'm sure you will find one that works!
lhamo
gimmethesimplelife
1-20-12, 7:40pm
Yesterday I was at a farmer's market here in Phoenix and I met a lady who makes soap to sell at the market - she seemed so incredibly happy and joyous about life, like she had found just her niche and was just basically doing ok with life. Maybe some of it is just that - finding something that works for you AND is a viable niche in the marketplace - perhaps easier said than done but there do seem to be some that figure it out or stumble across it or somehow make things work. Rob
fidgiegirl
1-20-12, 9:12pm
Rob, did/has/will the affiliate thing go anywhere?
And thanks lhamo for the encouragement :) Barbara Winter has a similar idea in that you work any idea until it makes $100. After earning $100 you have a much clearer picture of if it is something you want to continue doing or that will be successful.
gimmethesimplelife
1-21-12, 9:58am
Rob, did/has/will the affiliate thing go anywhere?
And thanks lhamo for the encouragement :) Barbara Winter has a similar idea in that you work any idea until it makes $100. After earning $100 you have a much clearer picture of if it is something you want to continue doing or that will be successful.Hi Fidgegirl.....Once my mom gets released from the rehab facility, things will be a bit saner I am thinking and I am going to try starting up a blog or two and see where that goes. One thing about blogging is that I have always been good at writing and this would be a way to express it - but let's see about getting an audience lol. Something else I would like to do is to download some photos to a stock photography site and hopefully make a few dollars here and there from downloads of the photos - that would sure be cool, and I do like photography and know a little bit about it though I am no pro. About the affiliate marketing, I think I am going to sign up with clickbank once the dust settles and see if I can make some money there promoting some of their products - I have already seen a few ebooks I can get behind, such as one for maximing growing potential in a very small space.....I like the idea of promoting something that can make people more self sufficient in times like these. So we will see where all this goes but right now I am working on getting the dust settled. Rob
We were approached about investing in someone's self employment dream, but it sounds like a money loser to me: a bakery and dry goods store that provides a place for neighbors of all ages to connect and share. His words. Sounds too much like The Collective to me and that gives me the willies. How that social action will generate income isn't clear to me. Oh also, he will grow vegetables on the roof. There's been quite a lot of that idea for our flat rooftops in recent years with none coming to fruition, of course, because it's not practical.
Since we've already got a fair number of coffee/bagel/snack types places here, I'm not seeing the need for the community. So I wish him well, but will continue to write my charity checks to true 501c3 charities.
"How that social action will generate income isn't clear to me. "
Three words: video poker machines. :~)
had a pretty extreme week with the accountant. it was fine. the money is good and things are improving and our business plan is fine. but she kept going "but that's not what this business IS, your business IS THIS." and then kept recommending that we go and get business loans. I finally just told her that i was happy to invest my time/money, that i am debt adverse, and that it's not up to her to define for me what my business is or isn't. I'm well aware of what my business is and how to get it where I want it.
Yes, health insurance is worrisome, but people do make it work. I found this article (http://www.wisebread.com/why-i-heart-my-high-deductible-health-insurance-plan) a while back when doing a little research to help out my sister. It helped me feel a little better about the whole thing. And this year, DH and I are going on a family plan with a VEBA account.
The way I see it, no matter how good your insurance, if you get sick enough, you will be ruined regardless. :(
I retired at age 53. I'm now 62 and have carried individual insurance for the last nine years. The article you link to is right on. My cobra was much more expensive than individual insurance. As prices have gone up I've increased my deductible/out of pocket. When I started it was $92 per month with $1500 out of pocket. It is now $329 with $1500 deductible/$5000 out of pocket. I have travel money in my annual budget and I look at it like this: if I need the $5000 out of pocket, I will not travel that year. I did NOT set up the HSA account. I have an HSA eligible plan but the HSA fees are high and I didn't like giving more fees to banks. Also the tax benefit wasn't really that important to me.
Her point about reduction in price even when under deductible is right. I see a doctor for my thyroid a couple times a year; his fee is run through my insurance company so I get it at reduced price. Also my high-deductible-plan pays for my annual maintenance. I have good health and don't use doctor much. I did break my hand cross-country skiing and that cost me about $1700 before my insurance kicked in. But I'm covered for anything catastrophic. To keep myself anchored to my job and my desk for the insurance is wacky. I'm always amazed at how many people won't leave a job because of health insurance. We pay car payments, visa payments, house payments ----why are we so afraid of paying for health insurance? I see employer-paid health insurance as part of a conspiracy by the government powers to keep us all behind the desk and anchored to jobs so we aren't out in the world causing trouble from 8 - 5 pm.
I am enjoying this thread. I've been retired from paid employment for nine years. My bucket list had 109 things when I retired and one of them was to start my own business. Time gets away from me and I've been doing volunteer work and social justice activism which I thoroughly enjoy, after a work life as a tax accountant. This year I have to have some dental implants and the estimate is $14,000. So I was thinking it might be a good time to start my little business and make a little money towards that project as I'm not very happy about giving my travel budget over to dental bills. I have files of idea, I love Barbara Winter's "Making a living without a job", I like the idea of streams of income. I think it sounds like so much fun to try and get a business up and running. I have ideas but nothing "sticks" with me for long. I'm inspired by listening to all of you.
it is great to live in a place with socialized health care.
we can also buy insurance as well -- and that is in our budget for next year. the cost for our whole family is $250/annum, and it's awesome. We get two dental check ups for each of us, up to 10 osteopathic/alternative medicine/massage of various sorts treatments as part of our care plan with a doctor which would then flip to a "$5 copay" for every visit after that; eye exams each year; and we can get moved up for surgeries and any other special needs that we might have (as opposed to having to 'wait in line' for non-emergent surgeries); and they offer additional prenatal care if we would want it (e.g., cover acupuncture, massages, or lactation consultants, etc).
I don't think we would have been able to start the business in the US like this because we would not have had health care, and likely would not have qualified for state care (other than for DS).
Another reason why we moved to NZ in fact. The opportunity was here, but the other two reasons are 1. we didn't have to worry about health care; and 2. we are able to afford our son's schooling because all schools are subsidized by the government, have fundraising for additional stuff, AND private schools have "special consideration fees" which are donations to the school.
iris lily
1-22-12, 11:39pm
"How that social action will generate income isn't clear to me. "
Three words: video poker machines. :~)
now THAT is an idea!
Rob, read this today and thought of your blogging venture: http://www.chrisbrogan.com/97/
He's a very smart guy, and has some really good insights here on how to create something successful.
gimmethesimplelife
1-23-12, 8:38am
Rob, read this today and thought of your blogging venture: http://www.chrisbrogan.com/97/
He's a very smart guy, and has some really good insights here on how to create something successful.Thanks Puglogic, read through it and it does sound good. I like the humble aspect of it, there's far too little of this in today's world IMHO. Rob
I started an Etsy shop a couple of months ago, in the hope that it would contribute to the household income.
Aside from a couple of sales to friends, it hasn't done very well. I know I need to put more items into it, and more work, though.
If anyone out there is successful on Etsy, please feel free to jump in and comment!
I always worked for "the man" but yesterday I had an interesting experience that I think could be helpful to people here.
Yesterday I called a local petsitting service because I will be out of town for a few weeks when the new grandchild comes. I wanted to have someone in place that will come to my house to care for my cats. Of course, cats only need a visit every day or two not like dogs.
I called a woman who had advertised in the paper. She told me she relocated here in May and once she put some ads out she has been absolutely so busy. There was no-one anywhere near here who was insured, bonded and licenced to do this service. She gets calls from people who are twenty and thirty miles away, but her limit is 15 miles round trip, and she has more than enough business to make a full time living. She also will take in your mail and paper, and put your garbage to the curb if you want. Price is $15 per half hour which includes litter boxes, food and petting and visiting with the cats (I live in a low cost area where you can get a decent house for less than $125,000). With two cats boarding it would be three times that per day and I don't think they would get personal attention.
I have no idea how you would break into this but I thought was a great way to make a living if you are an animal lover.
One more thing, sicne I only work on call I have slowly built up a sewing business. I am very far from making any kind of decent wage but you would be surprised how many people are looking to have hems done, buttons sewn on etc. Not my favorite thing to do but I make a little money here and there. I am currently making placemats out of fabric to match someones drapes they had made. Not a lot of money but some.
Hmmm... I bet if you specialized in exotics like birds and reptiles, that would be an even bigger plus. I always worry about finding a sitter for my bird who will understand the socialization needs of an uppity parrot (one reason I haven't gone anywhere in years), and if I had snakes I'd really need to find someone who didn't mind dealing with them and their live foods. I've actually thought of doing that, but my chemical sensitivity makes going into other people's homes pretty dicey. There's a website or two where you can list petsitting services based on location, might be useful.
Great thread, Kelli. I'm trying to get established in self-employment as well. My biggest challenges are marketing my services/products, and trying to work around multiple crises and health problems. I do back-of-the-book indexing (not bad pay but the deadlines are killer), freelance writing, beaded jewelry, and photography/digital artwork. I'm probably going too broad, but I have quite a sense of floundering around. I didn't leave regular employment in an orderly fashion (lost my job when my employer got impatient with some disability needs), so it's been quite the maelstrom.
Helen
Bastelmutti
1-25-12, 11:51am
In case this helps anyone - I recently joined a MeetUp for entrepreneurs. You can find these groups on Meetup.com. We are going to set goals and have accountability partners to check in on us about steps taken to meet them. This particular one is for moms, but looking at MeetUp, there is a group for everyone.
For anyone who's just dipping their toe in the waters re: self-employment, I wanted to share this. It's not for everyone --- it's kinda like Making a Living Without a Job on steroids, and with an edge --- but I go back and read it frequently and always get good inspiration from it (ymmv): http://www.fourhourworkweek.com/blog/2011/09/29/8-steps-to-getting-what-you-want-without-formal-credentials/
Dh and I have been thinking about self-employment for a while but the thing that keeps us back is the health insurance. I would love to know what companies people are using for their insurance - especially the high-deductible policies, which is what we would want. Are people using group policies, ie, industry pools?
I'm also curious to know how many people who are self-employed are going without insurance. And if you are forgoing insurance, how long have you been doing so?
Bastelmutti
1-30-12, 5:45pm
When I was a sole proprietor, we used BCBS - it was expensive, but decent. Not great coverage. We didn't do high deductible. Now I have an S-corp and DH has a full-time job, so we use his insurance, which is much better than we had before.
The 4-hr work week is a great idea for understanding how you want your business to work.
Essentially, you want the business itself to be able to function without you. That, btw, might take some time to get to, but it is still a good goal.
If you really look at our work, we are running 3 businesses:
1. our big business which is essentially a rental/licensing business -- this is the one we are going to franchise;
2. my yoga business -- which is independent of the big business/franchise from which i rent time/space to teach;
3. DH's writing/editing contract work -- which is independent of both businesses and entirely ad hoc.
The first business is an actual "business" as opposed to a "job." A business is something that can function without you. A job is basically something that cannot function without you -- you have to do the work or labor of that job in order to earn income from it, etc. And it is this that you want to get to the least amount of administrative work as possible.
Teaching my classes requires me. Editing/writing that my husband does, requires him. Both require their own admin as well. Each of us spend about 20 hours per week in our job-businesses. And, we each spend about 2.5 hours a week in our franchise business's admin.
Right now, my job-business supports the franchise business while we continue recruiting and growing that business. As I develop the job-business (and train teachers), I'll be able to expand the yoga schedule as needed, putting in teachers whom I have trained to pay rent to the franchise business. Once those teachers demonstrate their capacity to maintain and grow a class, I may reduce the number of evening classes that I teach (from 3 to zero), and possibly even some of the lunch time ones (as on friday, for example -- it was nice to have Fridays off for a while there!).
The point is to get the franchise business to create a healthy passive income (both in the offices where I teach plus also from the franchises themselves), and then the yoga teaching -- which I love -- will be secondary. But, I can teach when I want, as often as I want, and based on our family's needs without having to worry. And if I do -- for example -- go back to the US for 3 months to travel, be with family, and to teach, then I know that the franchise business is healthy and can continue without me, and that the yoga side of the business will also be healthy and maintain itself in my absence, so that when I return, I'll be able to pick up classes again based on the schedule that suits our family.
DH's business will always be job-business. That's the nature of writing and film. But, it's thrilling work, and one can't argue. But, he'll also still enjoy the passive income of the franchise. And, we're' designing it so that you can either A. be like me and work in the business, or B. be like DH and manage the business and recruit people, but not have to be a practitioner yourself to create income from the business.
Anyway, once we get the franchise business down to a clear 4 hours a week, we'll get everything sorted for our franchise book. So far, we are looking at about 5 hours a week on the business, which isn't too bad. I'm working an additional probably 5-8 hours a week right now on recruiting new practitioners and on sales (getting new clients -- particularly corporate clients). It's good, though.
I think if someone wanted to just work in management/recruiting/sales, they'd probably have a business that took them about 10 hours a week? More if they were feeling completely excited about doing that all day long. :)
I am self employed as a massage therapist and would never go back to paid salary work. It was very scary to be my own boss, but it is working out well :) I am able to get an "ok" health insurance through a company that provides it for massage therapists and yoga instructors which works out well. I am also looking to get into doing some craft shows and the like. I have a lot of time to take care of our house, the cooking, and the odds and ends which helps my fiance to just focus on his work. He is salaried, but gets commission as well which gets quite tiresome as he tries to make the numbers every month.
catherine
1-31-12, 12:01pm
For anyone who's just dipping their toe in the waters re: self-employment, I wanted to share this. It's not for everyone --- it's kinda like Making a Living Without a Job on steroids, and with an edge --- but I go back and read it frequently and always get good inspiration from it (ymmv): http://www.fourhourworkweek.com/blog/2011/09/29/8-steps-to-getting-what-you-want-without-formal-credentials/
I agree--Tim Ferriss is brillant at delegation, that's for sure! I've been tempted to get a VA (virtual assistant) myself, but just have not had the nerve to take the plunge.
I have considered self employment at some far-distant date, but this week two separate people who barely know each other asked me if I would be interested in doing a little part-time teaching of their kids next year. That caught me a bit off guard. By trade, a million years ago before I "retired" :) I was a technical writer and software tester and now I am a homeschooling SAHM. Other than working as a preschool assistant in college I don't have any formal teaching experience, but these people have been seeing the stuff I'm doing with my own kids and would like their kids to have some similar experiences.
Beyond the actual teaching, I would probably be helping them put together a loose curriculum for their kids that is specifically targeted for those particular kids and their particular needs and interests.
One of the kids is a pre-K kid who is five in early September but not going to Kindergarten because of the cut-off dates. His mom wants him to have some extra learning beyond a typical preschool curriculum. He has a real love of learning and she wants to be able to feed that in a way that keeps the spark alive.
The other kid is a very bright middle schooler who is just totally floundering, mostly because he is bored out of his mind. He has a real passion and a clear idea of what he wants to do in life and is really craving learning experiences that he can connect both to his real life and to his future goals. While I couldn't personally teach him all of the stuff I think would benefit him, I would be able to be sort of the "general contractor" in this situation. I can research opportunities for him, work some of my contacts in the field he is interested in and, in conjunction with his mom, oversee some of that learning and combine it with the stuff his mom and I can teach him.
This has really got me thinking. It's still kind of a nebulous, unformed thought at the moment, but it seems to strike at something I know a lot of people are looking for. I keep getting hung up on this "I'm not actually a teacher" thing, but I know with my own kids they take on a lot of the actual learning themselves. I'm more of a partner in their learning. A sort of guide. I am really good at helping them navigate all of their options, design learning opportunities based on subjects they are interested in, find out what resources are available and connecting them to the people who do have the expertise to help them explore subjects more deeply when I know I'm out of my league. It is possible that this could somehow become a sort of business idea, or at least I could do it for a few friends who want me to. I'm under no pressure to produce income, I just think this would be fun to try.
Stella I think that is a wonderful idea -- great for you and a wonderful service to parents and kids. Can you move to Beijing? Or maybe I should move to MInnesota. On weeks like this one has been, it is pretty darn tempting to put the fancy apartment up for sale and get the heck out of Dodge....
lhamo
Stella, I'm a former homeschooler and I have a friend that has a 'school house' to target science and math for homeschoolers in the area. She does have degrees in biology and other sciences and she has done very well with her school house. So much so that she bought a small house to be the school. She has been able to have labs and equipment and more hands on material than most homeschoolers could have in their homes. She is meeting a need in a target area and her classes fill quickly. She has been doing this for maybe 13 years now.
Stella, you would be doing the kids a great service! My oldest son was a product of "square peg in round hole" syndrome when it came to his public school life, and his father and I wound up sanctioning his dropping out at age 16. I homeschooled him when he wasn't at a full-time job, and I really enjoyed the challenge. Meanwhile, he started feeling better about himself on DAY ONE of leaving school. Even his siblings said, "Mom, J__ doesn't act crazy anymore."
He has always been extremely energetic and curious, and so he was a natural at finding his own path, which took him from skibum to golf pro to GED student to community college student to undergrad to law student.
I have always maintained that kids like him need an alternate route. I was so angry at the public school system at the time he dropped out (they essentially took away from him the two things he excelled at--singing and soccer--because his grades weren't good enough) that I've also had it in the back of my mind to start a charter school or something. Of course, I also have no experience in teaching, other than a few months of subbing.
Stella--think about it!
Thanks for the support everyone! I think I might really go for this.
I talked to Zach and he is interested in this idea too. He has been working with our kids and some friends on building and engineering related learning projects. He is working on setting up a workspace in our garage for the kids and their friends to tackle projects along the lines of Tinkering School. (http://tinkeringschool.com/) He's setting up an adjustable height workbench, tools and scrap supplies to see what kinds of stuff they can come up with. He said he'd like to do more of that in his spare time. He says he's had a few adults even ask if he can teach them some basic handyman-type skills. Come to think of it, Gever Tulley of Tinkering School is actually a software developer, if I remember correctly. Maybe this isn't such a crazy idea.
I think to make myself feel more confident I'll run whatever I come up with past my mom, who was not only a teacher but a curriculum developer for a community college. I'll see what she thinks and get some advice.
There really does seem to be a need for something like this. I know so many people who just don't know exactly where to go to get their kids what they need. I tend to think that if I am doing something, it's not a big deal and anyone could do it. I need to stop thinking like that.
Stella- You can definitely make a go of something like this. In my area, a woman set up a homeschooling "school" in a cheap rent district. She taught some of the initial classes herself, but as there were more students, she brings in experts in other topics. Her outfit is geared more towards middle and high schoolers.
This is the website of the place I mentioned:
http://www.thethinktank-worcester.com/
Stella - go for it! What a perfect match for your skills and your passion.
HumboldtGurl
2-3-12, 3:39pm
Dh and I have been thinking about self-employment for a while but the thing that keeps us back is the health insurance. I would love to know what companies people are using for their insurance - especially the high-deductible policies, which is what we would want. Are people using group policies, ie, industry pools?
Jumping in here....splash!
DH and I Have been self-employed since 1998 and would never, ever go back to punching a clock. I tried it once for a seasonal job and failed miserably! ;)
Ever since we started our first business, we have had individual insurance coverage. I've looked into trying to get a group policy on our own or though a trade group in our field (writing & design) with no success. The coverage was worse than what we have now and more expensive too. To put it bluntly, our medical coverage as self-employed people has just always sucked! But it has been there for us when we needed it for major accidents, including a deer vs. motorcycle collision (I won!), and when I got conked on the head by an aspen tree (http://www.liveworkdream.com/2011/10/05/one-head-injury-can-ruin-your-whole-day/) last year.
We have a high deductible policy ($11,500 per year), which covers us at a 100% should we need major coverage. However the policy doesn't cover us for anything before we hit that deductible. What it does give us is a discounted rate on services we do need. For example, when I needed a CT scan, I paid a few hundred dollars less than I would have if I had gone into the hospital without coverage. Thanks to Obama, we don't need to pay for annual physicals, which is a huge relief now that we're over 40 and I need the ol' mammograms. I would forgo them otherwise, just can't afford it.
I've considered dropping coverage before, especially since we're paying $220 a month for coverage we hope to never use. But we just can't go that far. The number one reason for personal bankruptcies is: medical bills. I hope to never, ever be one of those statistics.
Still, having this type of insurance really makes us think twice before using it. Our rule is, unless we're bleeding to death from a major artery or unconscious, we don't go to the hospital.
Hey, giving this thread a little jumpstart with something fun!
I'm self-employed and have always thought I should have some form of business plan, but have shied away from the process and the standard, rigid, stuffy definition of business plans in general.
But someone (here?) turned me on to this fun thing: http://www.rightbrainbusinessplan.com/
It's more for people who have a creative bent or a creative business (hence the right brain part) but I think the process is still really valuable for anyone with a small business, and it's gotten me to make myself a plan for the first time in many years. In general, if something's not fun, I don't really want to do it.....this was definitely fun. And I think my business(es) will benefit from the newfound clarity.
Hope all our self-employed folk are having a good year!
pug
fidgiegirl
8-31-12, 4:38pm
Pug, thanks for this AND for the bump!! :)
I find myself being self-employed by sheer virtue of not being able to find just one full-time day job. However, I'm really enjoying cobbling together these different streams of income that I've managed to generate here so far. I'm doing freelance writing assignments for two regular clients, voiceover work for another client, online English teaching for an Indian company, and have just started a petsitting business locally, which I absolutely adore working on. When work is slow, it gives me time to pursue marketing or other business development ideas, and when work is hot and heavy, I just work and bring in the money. Right now, lots of my earnings are going back into the business(es)...I have to get some new textbooks, for example, and spend some money on supplies and marketing materials for my petsitting business. But it's a very creative, interesting, and flexible way to live, which I REALLY love.
I have been self-employed since 2001. Many times on the old forums, I recommended the book Secrets of Self-Employment by Sarah and Paul Edwards. I think it's a great introduction and offers a lot of help with the mental/emotional shift needed to move to self-employment. I have an old copy from the 90s - haven't checked to see if there is a new edition. Definitely read it (even the old edition)!
Thanks for the book recommendation--it looks really interesting!
So glad I logged on and found this thread: I'm a self-employed writer who dabbles in alternate streams of income. I like reading about everyone's businesses and careers--such a pleasant change from the regular ole' full-time jobs that most people don't enjoy. Inspiring!
Gardenarian gave me a really interesting idea when I had the thread about having to clean out my teaching supplies from my Spanish program. I am no longer doing that for my day job, but she gave the great idea to do it for homeschoolers.
Not even sure how to go about this. Ideas?
I like the idea because I miss kids :( Plus, all the after school opportunities I've found conflict with my full-time schedule. Additionally, if I could tap into a co-op or some kind of network in order to get a handful of kids, then I can charge a rate that makes it worth it for me yet when split among several kids/families makes it still worth it for the families.
I hate to start a new thread on the topic but might do so.
Thanks all!
Oh hey! And I started a gluten free blog that I hope to develop into something bigger with affiliate links and local ads as well as web ads. I think I will buy a similar domain name for Door County, WI, too - hardly any info out there for that area - I'm sure there are tourists who go there who would read and appreciate the info.
Kelli, way to go! If you haven't gotten The $100 Startup out of the library yet, it might be worth a read. There are at least a couple of examples in there of teaching-related microbusinesses (one is for a music teacher, I forget the other) that sound like they really took off. Plus, I found all the case studies inspirational (as in "inspiring my own ideas" :) ) I'm also part of this community, which is a pretty neat bunch of people who are cobbling together different interests into income, or just to be a bigger part of life: http://puttylike.com
fidgiegirl
9-10-12, 5:40pm
Thanks, pug! Will check it out!
fidgiegirl
10-2-12, 8:44pm
I have gotten the $100 Startup just today, and am excited to really dig in. Looks great - boils down the essence of concepts like the business plan to a useful template, not just the pages and pages of how-can-I-know-yet details that every other proposed one contains. And so I like it, what I've skimmed so far!
My hubby and I are also going to write an eBook. Gotta put it out there! Gotta "speak" it, so they say, to realize the goal.
fidgiegirl
10-2-12, 10:26pm
I've read about a third of the book so far, so it's a quick read. At first I was eating it up but by the time I put it down I was feeling a little, not sure, maybe disheartened? Not sure where that came from. But anyway, I'm still excited by the practical advice and been there-done that stories the author presents.
Also, unlike other books where they recommend just taking the plunge, he offers up stories of people who continue in their day jobs and supplement with a side income. That's where I see this going for right now. Not so sure I can think bigger than that at this point! Man, uncertainty is really rearing its ugly head tonight!
try2bfrugal
10-2-12, 11:27pm
Also, unlike other books where they recommend just taking the plunge, he offers up stories of people who continue in their day jobs and supplement with a side income. That's where I see this going for right now. Not so sure I can think bigger than that at this point! Man, uncertainty is really rearing its ugly head tonight!
Good luck Kelli and just hang in there through the uncertainty. Think about it this way....If you make a page of content a day and each page makes just 10 cents a day, at the end of a year you will be making over 13K a year (365 pages of content X 10 cents a day X 365 days in a year). If it doesn't work out you can always start over with another topic or look for new ways to market your existing sites.
fidgiegirl
10-3-12, 8:01am
Thanks, try2bfrugal!!
Keep your head up, Kelli. There are all kinds of things to try -- there is no one right way, and no magic bullet. But you can explore different things until you find the one that does what you want it to do. Starting with a side business is a great thing....you can grow it as you wish.
Are you thinking of an online business or a in-person business? Passive, or active?
fidgiegirl
1-6-13, 10:33pm
Hi all! Coming back around to this thread, which has been so full of great ideas and inspiration.
I have been exploring the Puttylike site more deeply and read a sample chapter of Emilie's book, Renaissance Busines (http://http://puttylike.com/renaissance-business/)s. I am definitely a scanner/multipotentialite (http://http://puttylike.com/terminology/), and I very much liked what she had to say, but $49.99 is steep for an eBook. I am surprised she's priced it that way. Even for $19.99 or $24.99 I might go for it, but $49.99 . . . has anyone read it?
From the sample chapter, I did get a good idea which is for someone who has diverse (sometimes wildly diverse) interests, it's good to choose an overarching theme for a business rather than a narrow focus. So my gluten free blog? I lost interest (unsurprisingly) in relatively short order. Same with another blog I started. But with an overarching focus, one can go in many directions and still "fit" into the business. So I might be doing some soul-searching about what that overarching focus could be, and right now I'm thinking it might have something to do with learning. The first blog I started, actually, about being frugal and green, might be broad enough, but I have to commit to doing at least SOMETHING with it.
I also liked the idea of an accountability group (did he call it "mastermind group?") from Zero Hour Workweek (http://http://paidtoexist.com/the-zero-hour-workweek/). Basically it is a few people who agree to get together and keep each other on the straight and narrow, doing high leverage activities like creating (as he says, "not checking e-mail or blog stats all day".) I am still very interested in the topics of my first two blogs I started up, but I don't populate them. I could have TONS to put on either of them, but I don't - I mean, look at how much I post here, and about 90% of it is about being frugal and green. Tons of possibilities. Perhaps something like this - even if I got my DH started posting! - could make a difference.
And the one that I can't quite get my head around how this idea works yet . . . in Zero Hour Workweek, he says that monetizing blogs as THE way to make money is the biggest mistake most bloggers make. That it's in publishing excellent, authentic and WANTED content, which leads to other moneymakers like eBooks and ____? Like I said, not quite understanding it. But I can see where to make a decent amount of money from ads is quite difficult.
Lots to mull over.
I do feel reassured by something else in Emilie's book: building a business takes time. And effort. (I'm not really putting in the effort, to be honest. So no wonder nothing has happened). Other books, like Making a Living Without a Job (which don't get me wrong, I LOVE) propose just DOING IT . . . quitting your day job and going for it. Not gonna happen in this house. So I guess it was good to read, ok, it's alright to take some time doing it . . . but DO IT.
How's it going for others? It's been a while since much action on this thread . . . do we have some new business ventures? Or lessons learned? I really appreciate all the expertise that's flowed on the thread so far. Happy new year, all!
And the one that I can't quite get my head around how this idea works yet . . . in Zero Hour Workweek, he says that monetizing blogs as THE way to make money is the biggest mistake most bloggers make. That it's in publishing excellent, authentic and WANTED content, which leads to other moneymakers like eBooks and ____? Like I said, not quite understanding it. But I can see where to make a decent amount of money from ads is quite difficult.
I'll admit to not having read the book, but I think lots of bloggers try to monetize their blogs as soon as possible -- and forget why people would want to come back, which is compelling content with a high level of experience/expertise in a unique area, or at least a unique perspective on a more common topic.
I look at a lot of blogs for the sake of information and enjoyment, and many of them either are rehashes of information that exists elsewhere or meta-indexes connecting to Amazon or eBay. If I wanted that kind of thing, I'd go to Amazon or eBay. I won't be back to that blog. Then there are the fake blogs set up to attract link love from search engines and not provide much useful information (http://www.cheapestblueuprightvacuums.com and the like) but lots of links and ads.
But a good blog will provide information and attract people who want that information -- who then will feed the blog and, sometimes, even be the major content providers as the blogger provides a framework or jumping-off point for discussion. Then the blogger becomes recognized for whatever the blog specializes in and becomes a subject-matter expert and ... can write articles or (e)books, give public speeches, make public appearances, etc. It's not a path everyone will be able to achieve, but I don't think it can happen with just mediocre content.
fidgiegirl
1-6-13, 11:07pm
How is your photography business going, Steve?
How is your photography business going, Steve?
Heh. When I found out we were doing okay-to-fine on just DW's salary, I retired. :D
I kept the business name and insurance and all that. I think I'm going to -- err, focus -- the business on fine-art photography. That would have been my first choice all along, but I didn't think it would bring in the kind of money we needed. Now I think it will. That will, however, require some rejiggering of the Web site (still unpublished) and some of my equipment. I let myself coast through the holidays without doing much with the business; now it's time to get going on that.
Thanks for asking!!
I look forward to hearing about your progress. :D
HumboldtGurl
1-8-13, 2:11pm
I can't believe it's been a year since you started this topic Fidgiegirl!
How are everyone's business ventures going? Did you run your numbers for last year yet?
Last night I finalized our financial reports for 2012 and all of our business efforts are paying off, finally!
It's taken us 5 years to get to the point of making enough money that we're not dipping into savings every month, and we'll actually owe income tax this year. I guess that's a good thing but it kills me to pay it!
Our previous business which we sold in 2007, was started in 1998, when the dot-com craze was in full-swing. We grew fast, made decent money from the get-go, and boy was that much easier than trying to get our most recent business efforts up and running during a recession. At least now I can say "been there-done that" during all types of economic climates.
What IS your business, HumboldtGirl?
Unlike Iris' DH, I am lazy and a know-it-all and generally speaking a poor enough employee that the only way I was ever going to get a job was by working for myself. That was 30 odd years ago and nothing in that time has changed much. A couple of the ventures I tried ended up being pretty successful. I hated those, too much work. Some never got past the business card stage. Hated those, no money. Most were in the middle. I have now made it to that lovely stage where I can be a little eccentric and scheme to do what I enjoy and when I feel like doing it without a whole lot of pressure to make it pay off. That's nice. And its a good thing because at this stage God knows no one would hire me! Just hold your nose and jump Kelli, the water's fine!
Well, I decided some action was better than spinning my wheels deciding on the PERFECT business, so I made a post to my GF blog. Part of me wants to say to myself: BIG DEAL - but why the negative self-talk? It is! It adds up. I also figured out that you have to submit your blog address to the search engines so I did that. I also put up another page I'd been mulling over and changed my signature here on the forum to reflect the blogs I actually update. So! A few steps!
we did our numbers.
I doubled my clients last year, but we didn't gain any new practitioners (new goal for 2013 -- to get 4 half-day rentals sorted!). We also doubled our revenue again, which is awesome, and had several very successful marketing strategies pan-out.
We also decreased our workload. I have been pushing and pushing and pushing myself to get the business *MORE* successful. Of course, it was at the expense of my own health/wellbeing and family life. So, I worked on getting more life-work balance and we have a good plan going right now that is working *really* well for us.
First, we "work hard" during the school terms, and set up for the school holidays so that we can spend less time in the office and more time with the kiddo/family time. DH also aligned his writing schedule to this, which also opens up more family time. Thus, we technically take off about a quarter of the year -- we still work, but we cut the work-load in half with careful planning.
Second, we prioritize the work we want to get done, dividing it up. We gave ourselves 3-big-tasks for this year, one on each of our lists is training the other in an underlying system of the business so that both of us can do "all" of the work. That leaves us two tasks, and we divided that into quarterly goals. Each quarter is the 10-week school term, so it's set up to keep the work at work and the life just going outside of that.
It's been working really well so far.
Third, I decided to step back from high-intensive, low profit activities to develop the low-intensive, high-profit activities. For example, our Kids Yoga Training is proving really popular among kindergarden teachers. So, I'm making sure that the foundational information (our curriculum) is rock-solid and clear, and hten making sure the training is properly managed (so that's a secondary curriculum process). In the mean time, we are setting up more teacher trainings, and working with our first 'test batch' to make sure that their questions are answered as well as their training needs. This provides us with a good way to make sure the curriculum/etc is solid. Once those teachers are out there, it expands our brand (high visibility), and they pay an annual license to use our curriculum. This means it's less wear and tear on me (i'm not teaching the classes), and yet high profit.
To demonstrate the other side, a friend invited me to utilize her space to open a second location in a "slow growth" process. It would require about 10 hours of work per week (both teaching and admin), which would dramatically increase my work load (see above information about cutting work load). It would also take a long time to get to profitability in terms of the cost-of-time vs earnings, so it's just not the right time.
Since I'm training teachers this year, and I do have a plan to run a second location in the near-future, I will have teachers to take on classes here, removing about 10 hrs of hourly work, which will allow me to expand into a new market without having the struggle of need to find an "extra" amount of time under my current schedule.
It just means waiting until things are ready to move forward before moving forward, and not over-taxing myself.
So, I'm learning. :D
gimmethesimplelife
1-8-13, 10:12pm
What a great thread! I have been AWOL from this board for a few days as I have had better luck doing secret shops lately - higher quality ones with better pay and fewer situations that give me pause - so I have been applying like mad with mystery shopping companies and am not looking to do this F/T but as a sideline. Something really cool is I am getting myself a digital voice recorder - not to tape shops - which legal in Arizona without consent but I'm not comfortable with that - but to record my impressions as soon as I leave a shop and am out of sight. This is a freebie, too, as points I have earned doing surveys last year are paying for it.
I have also bought the domain name for my first and last name and am now pondering what exactly to do with it.....Rob
HumboldtGurl
1-9-13, 5:04pm
Oh this thread is getting good!
What IS your business, HumboldtGirl?
I never did explain what we do, did I? We work on a number of different things (we call them "projects") that make us happy and allow us to work from wherever our home is parked. After having a single-focus marketing and design business for the last 15 years, we've found that now we would rather have lots of little ventures so we can diversify our revenue sources, which helps us live anywhere as full-time RVers. Most of what we do is internet-based.
Our main project is more of a labor of love...it's our Tripawds (http://www.tripawds.com) three-legged animal community. We offer support and resources like assistive devices to people when their dog or cat is losing a leg. It makes us very fulfilled to be of help to others, but it doesn't pay all of our bills so we do other things like: paid freelance journalism, graphic design, website development, small business coaching, jewelry making, and we are also marketing executives for a health and wellness company. I know it sounds like we don't have focus but it really does all gel together in the end.
Zoebird, you sound like you are right on target with how your business is growing. I like your long-term thinking and strategizing.
Gimme...I've always been curious about secret shopping work. Have you been doing it for a long time? Do companies want people who can move from location to location? Would this be something that I could do as full-time RVers? We move around a lot.
Very interesting, HG! Thanks for sharing.
Zoebird, I found your post very interesting as well. I've always been impressed at all the angles you take for your business. I wouldn't have thought curriculum development would be part of yoga, but heck, why not?!
Rob, glad the SS thing is going well. I've never heard of people being able to really actually get any of them! So congrats!
I am kind of working on one little "tweak" to my GF blog every night. Tonight I will populate the blog roll. I want to get some more readers, and from there will decide what to do about them. :)
I'd kind of like to do ads, but not the clickable ads - old fashioned ads that the business pays for. That way they are targeted and relevant and local. Some Google Ads are starting to appear but I must not have enough content yet, because they are for restaurants like pizza places. What a tease on a GF blog. I want all the stuff to be vetted . . . maybe that's naive to think I can do it.
Are there other ad server services other than AdSense?
I am kind of working on one little "tweak" to my GF blog every night. Tonight I will populate the blog roll. I want to get some more readers, and from there will decide what to do about them. :)
Let me know if you could use someone to seed comments on your GF blog, Kelli. (I'm interested in your topic, and so there wouldn't be anything shady about it :) ) It's always good to have a community or conversation going on a blog, so it's not just us bloggers talking to ourselves LOL...... I need to get back to my own. It's super fun to do, but I've been too busy to give it much love lately. I don't plan on doing Adsense on mine, for just the reason you mention. I don't know of any service that's as pervasive as Adsense. Maybe direct ads for specific GF products? Have you signed up for any affiliate programs, and could maybe advertise those, as you could be sure they're helpful and relevant to your readers?
I have another one I want to start that's about super-easy organic food gardening, and another still about growing your own medicines (herbs). Some day I'm going to have to find a way to get them to pay for themselves, but that'll come when it's time.
cow-hi
fidgiegirl
1-9-13, 10:33pm
Affiliate is a good idea . . . I have some Amazon affiliate but meh . . . well, of course, I've had a total views of all time of less than 200! So that could be part of it :)
Would love any and all comments!! I enjoyed what I read of your blog, too, and would be happy to do the same.
Thanks - I'd welcome your comments too! I am always so surprised and delighted when people comment :)
For Amazon, have you considered doing a blog post or posts with GF book reviews, cookbook reviews, etc.? That might help.
Also, check out Googling "gluten free affiliate programs" -- some good possibilities there
Kelli and pug, I have just visited and enjoyed your blogs...Kelli, as I am a gazillion miles away I don't know how much use I'll make of your local information but hey, I could visit someday! Actually, in writing that I know of someone who could actuallY USE your info so I'll forward it.
Please keep your conversation going.....my little blog is not intended to make any money but only to provide a voice for my practice (and my inner writer) but I sure could use ideas about how to get some readers.
Pug, is Web Sites for Good also your business? Looks like a very friendly, comfortable company....which makes a difference to me.
HumboldtGurl
1-10-13, 4:22pm
[QUOTE=fidgiegirl;123397
I'd kind of like to do ads, but not the clickable ads - old fashioned ads that the business pays for.[/QUOTE]
You are right on track with this FG. Our websites have a combination of both, and the direct relationships we have with advertisers pay more than standard click-through ads. Have an advertising kit, even if it's just a page, then get out there and show relative businesses why they should advertise with you. You'll be so glad you did.
fidgiegirl
1-10-13, 6:12pm
HumboldtGurl, do you have an sample advertising kits? I don't seem to remember it being anything common - maybe if I start to try to notice, I will see something on different blogs.
Pug, I did Google that, and am thinking about it! Lots of choices.
leslieann, I found this article really helpful (http://weblogs.about.com/od/bloggingtips/tp/TipsIncreaseBlogTraffic.htm). I also have my blog set up to connect to my Facebook through Networked Blogs. It's a bit of work to set it up but among my miniscule readership the bulk comes from FB - bless my friends! :) Then when you make a blog post it automatically posts to your FB feed.
ETA: Yippee!! Yippee!! Since I did some of the tips in that article, I've gotten comments two days in a rows, and today is my highest traffic day (on a day that I didn't make a post, thus no population over to FB) yet! So something is working! :)
Now I just have to go out to eat at more restaurants. ;)
Pug, is Web Sites for Good also your business? Looks like a very friendly, comfortable company....which makes a difference to me.
Thanks, leslieann - nice to have another visitor :) And yes, that's my company too. I love what I do, and love who I do it for.....it IS a very friendly, comfortable little livelihood. How did you deduce that was me, by the way? This month I'm deep into a whole site overhaul (new theme, new material, new portfolio) and can't wait until my online "face" is more up-to-date and cool. What's that old saying about the tinker's children always being the ones without shoes? Seems like my own site is always the last to get worked on.....:treadmill:.
fidgiegirl
1-10-13, 8:29pm
Pug! It was you who commented on my blog, wasn't it?! :) Thank you!
You are a really engaging writer! I'd like to think I could write like that, but I don't! :D
gimmethesimplelife
1-10-13, 8:47pm
Oh this thread is getting good!
What IS your business, HumboldtGirl?
I never did explain what we do, did I? We work on a number of different things (we call them "projects") that make us happy and allow us to work from wherever our home is parked. After having a single-focus marketing and design business for the last 15 years, we've found that now we would rather have lots of little ventures so we can diversify our revenue sources, which helps us live anywhere as full-time RVers. Most of what we do is internet-based.
Our main project is more of a labor of love...it's our Tripawds (http://www.tripawds.com) three-legged animal community. We offer support and resources like assistive devices to people when their dog or cat is losing a leg. It makes us very fulfilled to be of help to others, but it doesn't pay all of our bills so we do other things like: paid freelance journalism, graphic design, website development, small business coaching, jewelry making, and we are also marketing executives for a health and wellness company. I know it sounds like we don't have focus but it really does all gel together in the end.
Zoebird, you sound like you are right on target with how your business is growing. I like your long-term thinking and strategizing.
Gimme...I've always been curious about secret shopping work. Have you been doing it for a long time? Do companies want people who can move from location to location? Would this be something that I could do as full-time RVers? We move around a lot.
Hi Humboldt Girl!
Sorry it has taken me a bit to get back to you here. About secret shopping, one idea I have is to check out and possibly sign up with www.mysteryshopforum.com - it is free and there is a link at the bottom to some very good (and not so good) mystery shopping companies. About your constantly being on the go - there are people who make a living doing this by doing what is called a route - driving a long distance and doing one mystery shop after another after another in a very condensed time period, and then doing and submitting all the reports involved. I think you might need to be in good with a few mystery shopping companies before you can do this - but you could sign up and ask at that forum site I gave you, they are mostly very helpful folks there. I only shop Phoenix, so I am pretty much one location only.
I find mystery shopping for me is not going to pay all my bills BUT it is a nice side income. I have been doing it for two years now for one company and am trying to branch out to others but it is quite competitive here and it is hard to get your foot in the door with a new company I'm finding, though I understand that this varies depending on location. Sometimes you get nice reimbursements too for required purchases for shops. Lately I have snagged a free Tommy Hilfiger coffee mug (destined for ebay maybe) and a free lawn and leaf fold out bag (something I can really use). There are those in mystery shopping who are content to only do restaurant shops (which I will not do as I have too much experience in the business and will automatically side with the server most times) that involve reimbursed meals for a report, and those who shop only hotels which involve reimbursed stays (with frequent hotel stay points) at hotels. All in all, it is a nice side gig I think and it seems to attract an interesting sort of person that does it. Anything else you'd like to know, let me know, I'll be glad to advise. Rob
Pug! It was you who commented on my blog, wasn't it?! :) Thank you!
You are a really engaging writer! I'd like to think I could write like that, but I don't! :D
You're welcome.....and I LOVE the style of your writing, Kelli. It's so unpretentious, and so comfortable for me to read, like you're having a conversation with the reader. Don't change anything about it :) And I am totally going to find those Conte ravioli....
fidgiegirl
1-10-13, 10:11pm
You're welcome.....and I LOVE the style of your writing, Kelli. It's so unpretentious, and so comfortable for me to read, like you're having a conversation with the reader. Don't change anything about it :) And I am totally going to find those Conte ravioli....
Awwww . . . thank you!
Rob, funny, I looked up some mystery shopping stuff just now and found out I was already registered with a company! And have been for several years! LOL. Have never actually done a shop, though.
fidgiegirl
1-12-13, 7:54pm
It's going well to keep doing one little task a night for my blog and/or other businesses. I told my girlfriends an idea today that I got from work - we have over 100 people signed up for an online course about iPads and a specific aspect of instruction. Like, wow. Why couldn't I try to run similar courses on my own time? If they were paid, I might not get SUCH a response, but if they cost a little but lots of people take them, then, well, wow, that could be fruitful. I was even thinking I could run something through Google+ Hangout or zoom.us live and even if 10 people took an hour-long online "class" at $20 a piece that's $200 for one hour of work (plus the planning, but that's the beauty of classes - once you've delivered them a few times, they are pretty much down and it's just a question of delivering again).
My one friend might be interested in the "mastermind" group idea, with the periodic meetings for accountability (in speaking actions aloud and having a "deadline" of the next mastermind meeting to report back). That'd be cool.
Oooh I'm glad I came across this thread! Although I am employed 28-30hrs a week, I have just registered as self-employed. I'm going to try and start up as a freelance translator in addition to being employed (if it goes well and I enjoy it, maybe I'll think about leaving employment). All the tax and contributions crap is incredibly confusing, but the bulk of my work at the moment is editing my resume and trying to get clients... the finance side of things only becomes problematic if and when I actually make some dough!!
HumboldtGurl
1-18-13, 7:05pm
Hi Humboldt Girl!
Sorry it has taken me a bit to get back to you here. About secret shopping, one idea I have is to check out and possibly sign up with www.mysteryshopforum.com (http://www.mysteryshopforum.com) - it is free and there is a link at the bottom to some very good (and not so good) mystery shopping companies. About your constantly being on the go - there are people who make a living
Rob, thank you! I'm going to look into this and will let you know if it turns into something for DH and I.
gimmethesimplelife
1-18-13, 8:53pm
Rob, thank you! I'm going to look into this and will let you know if it turns into something for DH and I.Humboldt Girl - Wishing you the best with it! My experience has been that it can be a funky way to make some extra cash on the side. Am looking forward to hearing if it turns into something that works for you and your DH. Rob
HumboldtGurl
1-19-13, 5:44pm
Oooh I'm glad I came across this thread! Although I am employed 28-30hrs a week, I have just registered as self-employed. I'm going to try and start up as a freelance translator in addition to being employed (if it goes well and I enjoy it, maybe I'll think about leaving employment). All the tax and contributions crap is incredibly confusing, but the bulk of my work at the moment is editing my resume and trying to get clients... the finance side of things only becomes problematic if and when I actually make some dough!!
I think that's a great idea. What languages do you translate?
The finance side of things is a pain, but it's well worth your time to have systems in place so that when you do make money, you're ready to deal with it and not making stuff up on the fly. Take time to learn the basics and it will reward you for years to come both in your business and in your personal finances too. Good luck!
fidgiegirl
3-20-13, 6:43pm
Resurrecting this thread! :)
The "is work a waste of time" thread has me once again thinking about this thread. I am a bit despondent about work lately. It's feeling somewhat negative and draggy. I get excited about DOING, but I am stuck in what feels like eternal meetings and also in working with negative individuals who do not want to engage in our mutual work anyway, so I'm feeling a bit discouraged. When I was in the classroom, even though I was exhausted, I could DO, and RIGHT NOW. Even that was probably unique. It's not all bad, really - there are a lot of positives and it's a leadership position so I am indirectly impacting a lot more kids than I would have impacted directly, and I have remind myself of that. But some days I'd rather just charge teachers directly for focused coaching to help the ones who really want to do something new or different DO IT. But then who'd pay for that . . . grrr. My boss and coworkers are great, too.
So anyway - puglogic, I am in looooove with Puttylike. I am thinking of joining her Puttytribe, a monthly fee-based group she has going but not sure if I am in the right place. Today's post has my head spinning! http://puttylike.com/the-lateral-freelancer-how-to-make-a-living-doing-a-little-bit-of-everything/
I think Life_Is_Simple's "how much do you want to work?" thread has revealed something for me: I couldn't even bring myself to respond. If I can't state my goal, how will I reach it? The harder part of what she posed was the "how much do you want to make doing it?" part of her question. I don't know! Lots! More than I make now! But HOW much? Or is it even important? I mean, we moved so I can't make nothing, but would I have to make what I make now? Or is it a case of visualization - if I think I will only make $X.00, well, then, I'll only make $X.00!
In Barbara Winter's Making a Living Without a Job, she talks about sometimes full employment being the biggest impediment to getting started in self-employment. I'm starting to really appreciate that sentiment, so to speak . . .
Well, sorry, it was kind of "stream of consciousness." Where are others at with this?
Life_is_Simple
3-20-13, 8:27pm
(snip)
I think Life_Is_Simple's "how much do you want to work?" thread has revealed something for me: I couldn't even bring myself to respond. If I can't state my goal, how will I reach it? The harder part of what she posed was the "how much do you want to make doing it?" part of her question. I don't know! Lots! More than I make now! But HOW much? Or is it even important? I mean, we moved so I can't make nothing, but would I have to make what I make now? Or is it a case of visualization - if I think I will only make $X.00, well, then, I'll only make $X.00!
:laff: No one was responding to that thread initially, and I thought I was being too flippant with the "how much do you want to make" part, so I cut that part out ;).
First, a comment on the Barbara Winter comment you had. When I jumped into self-employed the first time, I had gone to a bunch of workshops (Barbara Sher Success Team workshop), and read a bunch of books ("Why Aren't You Your Own Boss?") prior. And that helped prepare me a little bit. But what really helped was jumping in. There is a point where a person has to jump in and swim. If there are people who can fully prepare, and jump out of a (usually tiring) full-time job with ease and grace, I don't know who these people are.
I learned a lot while self-employed the first time (2004-2005), and wrote down that my ideal "job" was 1/2 my regular field, which is pretty high paying, and 1/4 maybe wellness coach-related, and 1/4 something else fun. Something Barbara Sher said, if you have read her books.... sometimes the job in your field funds the really fun or more meaningful jobs. I experimented a lot in SE #1, but was only making 70% of what I needed, so eventually jumped back into a Corporate Job to regroup. Oh yeah, and one time I went to a Barbara Winter seminar and had her sign my copy of her book ;)
Right now I am in Self-employment #2 (2009 to present). During SE #1 I learned that I had to take longer gigs in my field, instead of the really short ones I was finding. And during the Corporate Job in 2006-2009, I watched consultants we hired, to see what other ideas I could form about the in-my-field job that I could put into practice in SE #2.
I may have swung too far the other direction, because now in SE #2 I have a 30-hr-a-week gig (with a client I had met in SE #1, incidentally). And he has so much for me to do, that I am lax in experimenting and adding some fun income streams. I could also do more than 30 hours if I wanted to. But I don't want to :laff:
There's another book I read: "Making Work Work for the Highly Sensitive Person," by Barrie Jaeger. She talks about work being Drudgery, Craft, or Calling. All my corporate jobs started out as Craft, and went to Drudgery. My SE #2 is probably Craft, but maybe sometimes borders on Calling. However, there are things I could do to SE #2 to make it more Calling-like. Like, part of Self-Employment is working ON the business, and part is working IN the business. In SE #1, I spent more time working ON the business, and I found that to be fun. Even things like workshops and training are fun to me, and would enhance SE #2.
Another book I read during SE #1 (are you tired of my rambling yet?) is "Creating Money," by Roman and Packer. This is like the part of my recent post that I deleted, "how much would you like to make?" The first part of the book is about Attracting Abundance. The 2nd part is more, discovering your life's work. Here's a quote "Ask for what you want, no matter how impractical or far-fetched it may seem."
Part of self-employment is to dream what may be possible, even though your rational self tells you to come back to reality.
Fidgiegirl, because you are here in Simple Living, saving your money carefully while 90% of Americans are blowing their paychecks.... I believe that you could err a little on dreaming a little for a while :)
Also, you could kick me and tell me to go out and find some workshops or training, or add other fun to SE #2. But I am waiting for the weather to improve :laff: Which is why I couldn't reply to your thread about "Spring Cleaning," - I see no signs of Spring!! :laff:
Also - the name "Fidgiegirl..." I don't know what that means. You fidget a lot? ;)
fidgiegirl
3-20-13, 8:35pm
So I have been thinking about above whine-fest and I am going to recommit to doing one thing a night toward self-employment. Whether that is spending 15 min. researching a question online, refining some aspect of my blog SEO or marketing, writing up a post, organizing finances, laying out a new idea, working on my network, executing plans . . . something. Perhaps I'll post here, or maybe over in one of my blogs. Or maybe just on a calendar at our house.
Is it worth doing some visioning around this? I feel like I have no concrete goal! When I was in San Diego over spring break, it occurred to me that my friend, who I very much admire, always had the next goal in mind ever since high school. She went to community college, knowing that it would lead to a four year university program in sciences. Then she enrolled in the Navy, knowing the money she would get for schooling would carry her debt free out of undergrad and into a graduate degree. She mostly completed one grad degree while she was in the service and is using GI Bill to work on her second. Even though she's near the end she has a very concrete plan of how the actions she is taking now will get her into the position she wants later. I used to be that way but now feel kind of floaty la la la. Not saying I have to be driven or never satisfied or enjoying the present, but saying if I want to be self-employed so badly then why do I keep just conceptualizing it as a cutesy little side thing? I am a smart person - how can I envision my undertakings as a robust, sustaining business?
I was keeping a personal journal kind of blog a few years ago and wrote this on May 23, 2011 (http://athrivinglife.wordpress.com/2011/05/23/meeting-with-score-counselor/):
His most powerful question to us was what is our goal? And I think it’s something very important that we need to set. I hadn’t thought of this, but it makes so much sense I can’t even believe it didn’t cross our minds. What is our goal?
ApatheticNoMore
3-20-13, 8:43pm
To the how much I would like to make I thought: enough to survive, maybe save a little bit, maybe a little play money. It could be considerably less than I earn now (though I earn good money) Remember I was positing a 30 hour a week job, so I'd expect and gladly take much less than I earn now, my thoughts to "what would I like to make" was more "how low can I go" and still get by.
I have to admit I don't really have starting a business fantasies (wrong thread :)). I have *different* employment fantasies. Like what if I had gone or went (no easy switch) into non-profit work, or what if my work made a difference to anything beyond a bottom line etc. etc..
fidgiegirl
3-20-13, 8:45pm
LiS, we must have been doing a simul-post. :) And I am never tired of your ramblings. And yes, I do fidget a lot. :)
"Ask for what you want, no matter how impractical or far-fetched it may seem."
You know, when I first read YMOYL and decided that I WOULD get out of debt, people around me pooh-poohed it. They tried to convince me it was part of life, and just to stuff it away and try to be happy with it. But I wasn't. It was a weight on me. And I stuck with my guns, and within four years I was debt free. $30K in four years, and during two of those I was making not so very much. I didn't know how long it would take but I plugged away at it and it is quite amazing what focus will result in.
I was just telling someone at work yesterday that I think we have not been big enough dreamers there, either. When we DID commit to a single technology initiative, even though we thought it would take years to realize it, the community's support for it snowballed and we reached our equipment procurement goal within 3 years. That was due to focus.
I also really look forward to getting my hands on the Jaeger book you recommended. I feel like that's where I'm at - drudgery! At least my job isn't a HSSJ - like I said, lots of good things going on - but still . . .
I also think spring will help matters!!! :D
fidgiegirl
3-20-13, 10:36pm
Oh geez, totally dominating this thread tonight.
I am inspired and ready to voice our goal:
Earn enough business income that both Bryce and I can leave outside employment if we choose.
It's a big goal, and it will involve many baby steps. I feel excited. Now to maintain it. . .
SteveinMN
3-20-13, 10:38pm
I think Life_Is_Simple's "how much do you want to work?" thread has revealed something for me: I couldn't even bring myself to respond. If I can't state my goal, how will I reach it? The harder part of what she posed was the "how much do you want to make doing it?" part of her question. I don't know! Lots! More than I make now! But HOW much? Or is it even important? I mean, we moved so I can't make nothing, but would I have to make what I make now? Or is it a case of visualization - if I think I will only make $X.00, well, then, I'll only make $X.00!
In Barbara Winter's Making a Living Without a Job, she talks about sometimes full employment being the biggest impediment to getting started in self-employment. I'm starting to really appreciate that sentiment, so to speak . . .
Well, sorry, it was kind of "stream of consciousness." Where are others at with this?
Well, you kind of know where I am... :)
When I had to get out of my HSSJ, I chose something that I enjoyed doing (photography) in an area (real estate) that I thought needed my services. I knew it was not a unique widget to offer the world. I knew I lack the formal qualifications to do it -- I don't have a degree in fine art nor have I ever sold real estate. I knew I was not going to replace my old job's income. But we ran the numbers. I knew we could make it on DW's income and "something" that I earned, whatever that was and whenever I started earning it. We were prepared for several months with expenses and not much income. Long story short, maybe the answer to "how much do you want to make" can be nebulous -- "something more than expenses". It's not limiting and it's not discouraging when it doesn't happen right away.
The interesting thing about not working at a HSSJ for 45-50 hours a week is that I had time to examine and reduce our cost structure. In my mind, lowering the amount of money we spent each month was as good as making money and then paying bigger bills with it. So the "something" I needed to make became even smaller. And that opened up some opportunities -- or at least made exising opportunities seem more possible.
You and I have discussed (in this thread, I think) that I kind of let things sit for several months. I think I had to do that, partially because I wanted to address our expenses and partially because I was just so done. Finally, after almost a year, I feel creative and energized enough to take on the business again. It will be a mix of fine-art photography and some real estate. And now that I know it's not going to be 50+ hours a week and that whatever I make at it is good, the goal may be a bit blurry but the path is clear.
A book that really changed my life was The Two Income Trap. This talked about making sure that your fixed expenses were on one income. Then, secondary income is just there for support in case something happens to the primary income.
So, my husband and I set about on a 3 year process to get onto one income. It was great! We really started to understand our finances better!
Then, we learned about how our living expenses should go. There are lots of different formulas, but we decided to just "observe" how we lived on that 1 income over several months, and as such, we were able to discern what percentages of our income went where, and then how to decrease those expenses as best we could. Thus, I think something like 50% of our income was fixed expenses (home, debt payments, savings of various kinds), and 30% were floating (food costs, fuel costs, etc), and the remaining 30% went into entertainment/clothing/extra food/travel. And that's pretty high, but it allowed us to live comfortably/well. :)
This gave us a real foundation for understanding how to make adjustments to our way of life and thought processes in terms of spending so that we could adapt to different kinds of financial conditions.
And then another thing came to our attention: we were never going to get ahead with what we were doing. My business, as it was formed at that time, was never going to create a good enough income on it's own. It needed a different formation. And then my husband's work -- well, he did have options to move towards management, but to be honest, he preferred the basic work and it wasn't really in the field he wanted to be in anyway. So, if he didn't move up into managmeent, his job would cap (and it was about 1$10k away from capping), and then it would just be COL after that. This meant, of course, that we wouldn't ever reeally meet any of our financial goals, and that ultimately, we wouldn't be too cheery about it.
That's when we decided to take the risk -- start the business because I knew that I could make it work AND make it profitable for us. And not just "enough for us so that we support ourselves at a basic level" -- but truly a big, successful business. But, our first goal was to get to sustainability (sustaining the business and ourselves), and our second goal financially was to get to our income level (DH's) when we left the US. We are just about there now.
Expenses are higher here, which means that more of our income goes to COL and less to savings/paying down the SL debt, etc -- but because we did this frugality work before starting the business, it's been easier for us to do that and still "live well."
Our next goal is to get into the higher tax bracket and see what the effect is. We have a financial planner who works with our accountant who is helping us to figure it out, because it may mean that we go a bit under our current earnings in terms of "take home after taxes" -- which means a less going to savings/SL debt for a bit -- and then seeing where we need to be to break through that impact and to a comfortable income.
By this point, we figure that SL debt will be paid off (and the financial planner thinks it's do-able). From there, it's just growth from tax bracket to tax bracket. I know that seems a bit of a weird way to look at it, but basically NZ has three tax brackets, so the goal is to get to the top one there. And then the US would have it's tax bracket -- which means we need to jump beyond both of these so that we have the take home of the bottom line of both tax brackets (i don't know if that sentence makes sense).
But, I do know that it's possible because of how it's happening step by step.
And that's just the financial goals, not the other goals that are. . . how to reach those financial goals.
But yes. Having goals helps. And an impetus.
We know how we want to live. We know that we need a certain level of income to achieve that lifestyle. Therefore, we created a way to get that income. And now we're working to it.
It's possible.
iris lilies
3-21-13, 12:04am
...Ramit Sethi's methods seem spot on to me. For any small business idea, one of your first goals should be to get 3 paying customers. If you can find people who will pay for it within a relatively short period of time, chances are it might be a workable long-term business. If you can't find paying customers then it is pretty much dead in the water. And you should know that before you spend X months or Y years of your life trying to develop your great idea. Might not apply to every situation, but seems to be very straightforward and practical advice.
This sound extremely practical and right. That's your market research right there--plunge in and do the work, do it for 3 people, see how long it took to get them as customers, see how the work went and how your estimating skills are. Didya make any money?
and, you might actually work out the kinks by doing things low cost or gratis.
one of my friend's friends is a free lance writer. she's looking to start a new process where she creates and curates content for small business blogs/social marketing.
i am, personally, very interested in this as a service. I know what kind of content that I want, but don't have any time to write it. I have a long list of ideas and also if you just sit around and chat with me a bit, you'll discover that there are lots of other areas to explore that -- honestly -- i just don't have time to do. Also, just finding content in general -- not something I want to spend a lot of time on (ie, funny/uplifting videos or whatever to post on FB).
her first foray is to develop the timelines that it takes. understanding the blog's/business's marketing tone, audience, and so on. How long does it take to curate and/or produce and publish content? How much is that time worth?
From there, she wants to create packages (one blog per week plus X facebook per week; two blogs plus Y facebook, plus D tweets) and the acquire clients. From there, she wants to train other writers and subcontract them as she takes on more clients.
Once she understands the time-rhythms of the business, she can understand how many clients she can take on (and therefore the overall value of her time), and then the number of clients she can get per person whom she sub-contracts to (and the value of her time managing the sub contracting and client interface plus then the amount she needs to pay to the sub contractor).
Smart, really. There are lots and lots of us. There are lots of us who wouldn't pay jack-crap for this service, but there are another group of us who would love to have this service if it was affordable and on-brand.
fidgiegirl
3-21-13, 7:40am
And now that I know it's not going to be 50+ hours a week and that whatever I make at it is good, the goal may be a bit blurry but the path is clear.
Such a good feeling!! Or, at least a better one than immediately after you left HSSJ! :)
fidgiegirl
3-21-13, 7:54am
start the business because I knew that I could make it work AND make it profitable for us.
How did you "know?" Do you mean in the self-confidence sense, or in the market research sense?
I like the one income premise. It's somewhat similar to our focus on frugality and reducing expenses, but this gives it a whole new twist. A huge part of being able to reach the goal of "earn enough business income that both Bryce and Kelli can leave outside employment if they choose" is reducing EXPENSES enough that the income doesn't need to be as much. Just like Steve said, too!
I wonder why this particular goal that I've set, even though it's similar, feels so different from a goal like becoming FI3? It's essentially the same thing, although it acknowledges that we'll still have to be earning money through work, not simply through investments. It's just that the work will be through business(es) rather than through outside employment. Perhaps feels more doable? More real? More of what we want our lives to look like, anyway? Interesting.
Kelli, I have this page bookmarked and I go there and re-read it every time I start to micro-analyze all the reasons why I can't do something:
http://www.chrisbrogan.com/106/
It's pretty rough truth, and a lot of it might not be relevant to you, but I find that when I'm in a slump, I re-read this and usually come up with one thing I can do in the evening that moves my goal forward, just by that extra little boost.
I am always doing the same thing you are, by the way, meaning putting a little effort every day into self-employment. The only difference is instead of my first venture I'm on my 3rd or 4th, but the mental morass is the same.
I also love this guy's emails and his book, which has a great 1-2-3 section on earning your first bucks as a happily self-employed person: http://screwworkletsplay.com
Cutting expenses and eliminating all debt aside from my mortgage was the first step for me in taking off on my own, so you're ahead of the curve! I also made sure that my capital outlay for the new business was minimal (easy in my field) and that I kept my day job while I started up my own business. There were a couple of busy months there, but it was so worth it.
My first clients got a real bargain (not free but close to it!), but I made sure my service was so great for them that they referred me to others, who referred me to others, and off it went. I've never really had to market my business very much, aside from a web page and a stack of business cards. I know you can do whatever you put your mind to!
Your goal might feel different because you're not 99% in control of it like FI3 -- you have your intended customers' reactions to think of. Will they buy what you're selling? I think you have the talent to make any service compelling as long as there is a market for it. Talk to some people and ask them point-blank: Would they "buy" this? What would they most like you to offer? How much (range) might they be willing to pay? You can get a lot of answers just by speaking to the people you want to serve.
Life_is_Simple
3-21-13, 3:10pm
LiS, we must have been doing a simul-post. :) And I am never tired of your ramblings. And yes, I do fidget a lot. :)
;)
You know, when I first read YMOYL and decided that I WOULD get out of debt, people around me pooh-poohed it. They tried to convince me it was part of life, and just to stuff it away and try to be happy with it. But I wasn't. It was a weight on me. And I stuck with my guns, and within four years I was debt free. $30K in four years, and during two of those I was making not so very much. I didn't know how long it would take but I plugged away at it and it is quite amazing what focus will result in.
Good for you! Continue to be convinced of your own unique coolness, and ignore others who might drag you down :+1:
I also really look forward to getting my hands on the Jaeger book you recommended. I feel like that's where I'm at - drudgery! At least my job isn't a HSSJ - like I said, lots of good things going on - but still . . .
Yeah, I re-read parts of that book every once and a while, to re-focus. It's on my bookshelf of Favorites
try2bfrugal
3-21-13, 5:26pm
A book that really changed my life was The Two Income Trap. This talked about making sure that your fixed expenses were on one income. Then, secondary income is just there for support in case something happens to the primary income.
That book has a big impact for me, too. We have always tried to follow that advice in the years when we had two incomes.
How did you "know?" Do you mean in the self-confidence sense, or in the market research sense?
It was a combination of both. I'll ramble a bit.
Self Confidence
When I started working for myself, it was a part time endeavor and I didn't know a lot about how to administrate a business. My biggest problem wasn't what I did well -- ie, actual teaching of yoga classes -- but all of the things needed to support that process. I wasn't doing my accounting well, I wasn't marketing well (or consistently). I wasn't providing a safe, consistent business so that people felt comfortable "investing" in things like workshops, class cards, etc. I wasn't doing the "business" side of the business.
I didn't know this. I only knew that 'whatever i was doing wasn't working' and that made me scared to go ut on my own. I did anyway and failed the first go (luckily only loosing $10k), but what I learned is that I required more discipline in the administration aspects. Well, I ultimately learned that. It wasn't exactly linear!
The reality is that I knew what I had to do (in most cases. in some cases I didn't), but I didn't have the personal discipline to actually *do* those things. I was immature, in a way. So, once I decided that I *wanted* to take on that discipline in order to get the benefits of that discipline, THEN i felt like "yes, of course I can do this!"
And what I learned in starting small (ie, I was still running my small business of teachign classes, so I rented a room for $25/class and then took in money from clients and marketed, etc -- I ran it like a business with spread sheets, marketing processes, branding, etc), I then built up the confidence in doing big. And when I felt confident with those processes, I just kept building on it. I started with one class, then two, then three, then workshops, and so on -- each one was "big-ifying" my business in a step-by-step process so that I could learn how to take risks (and/or how risk adverse I was, etc).
So, at a confidence level, the fear was whether or not I could discipline myself to do what the business required beyond the teaching. Once I discovered that I could, in fact, be disciplined enough to do it, then I knew that I had the confidence to go forward.
Market Research
Part of the success of my business was the market research. I've grown so much faster than I expected because instead of looking outward "what are other people in my industry doing?" I started looking inward. "What do I want? What do I want to do?"
I started to look at the "problem" of yoga studios: expensive classes; culture of excess; pressure to buy more classes; classes too long for a busy person to get to; too religious; too feminine focused; poor alignment/weird (or focus on choreography over physical therapeutics), and a myriad of other complaints that I'd had over the years.
THen I started to look at how I could be different -- what was I offering and how was I offering it so that it would be affordable, accessible, therapeutic, open-to-everyone, and non-pressured. I started to swim around a group of 3-4 core values -- which could be not only in my classes themselves but in my business practices as well (how to interface as a business, interface with coworkers, people whom I manage, contractors (like the guys who do our web design), etc). This was the firm foundation on which my business was built.
Then I had to find the location. I knew it wasn't where I lived. I learned that I could buy a business (all of this happened in very quick succession). We identified 5 places in the world. We'd really loved Wellington. I looked for a business in Wellington.
I found one for sale super-cheap, and I started to do the market research. Where was it located in Wellington? Who were my primary competitors (yoga studios, health centers, gyms)? How did they do things (local culture around these things -- so that I knew whether or not what I was doing was different or the same and how)?
From there, I identified the market and looked for how to market to them specifically and effectively. I knew my process (as a teacher) were top quality, so I knew that if i could get them through the door, I could get them to stay.
Finances
Another thing that scares people is whether or not they can finance something long enough to get the return on investment. This is the big mistake that most people make. It takes more than 6 months. It takes *years* -- and if you are going to cash out and just work a business (no outside support), then you need to have enough to support yourself for years.
Yes, you might get extremely lucky like we did and hit everything spot on and get sustainable in two or three years. But most businesses take five to get to sustainable. It just depends.
The better way to start it is to learn how to run a business and fine tune what you offer (and therefore who your clients are -- who your market is and what they respond to in terms of marketing and product/service), while you are supported on another income. The only pitfall to this is that you may not be as disciplined or work as hard because you're not taking a big risk. It just depends upon you though. Some people don't need the big risk to work hard and be disciplined -- but in my experience, most people do.
And, you know, i find it helpful to know that i could finance my business entirely (no debt -- well, the debt to myself) and then make it sustainable and make a living at it. That gave me enough security to move forward, but not so much that I felt comfortable with "biff-ing" (abandoning, failing, not being disciplined, etc).
So, yeah.
fidgiegirl
3-22-13, 3:14pm
Thanks for all your advice, everyone. I read the Chris Brogan post, yeah, some of those sum me up! :) Zoebird, I also thank you for your experience and perspective. When I envision our businesses, I always see them developing as "businesses" rather than "a business." I wonder if that's under the influence of what I've read - mainly have latched onto Making a Living Without a Job as my inspiration so far - or if that's what I crave in leaving employment - not so much of the doing of one thing for most of the time. We have been keeping track of our business ideas for about two years now and have a very healthy list. Some are more passive kinds of ideas, and some more actively managed ideas. We'll see how it goes!
So I have been toying with sharing our goal with some friends, in order to put it out there more, make it more real, tie some kind of accountability to it. And with both groups that I told, both groups immediately wanted to know HOW. But we're not there yet. So the second group wanted to know this, and I said, well, we don't know yet, we have some ideas but we're speaking our goal so that it's out there. Without the goal we'll never get there. And so then they wanted to know some of the ideas on the list and I couldn't conjure any of them! Funny, there are about 50 ideas on there! So I don't know if it is really because I truly couldn't remember or if stating the goal was already bold enough and I couldn't stand to put out the ideas themselves and have them be in any way discouraged, so they wouldn't materialize in order to be spoken - yet.
I honestly, don't know what you are talking about. :)
First, the difference between a job-business and a business-business is that the second one ultimately doesn't need you -- it becomes passive income. Essentially, you just 'manage' the business (which is the administrative work and could be, for example, just 4 hrs a week for a given business). And, you can sell it to another person, etc, with relative ease.
My business is a combination active (job) and passive (administrative). The ultimate goal is to make it largely administrative (licensing, franchising), and providing the space for me to do work that I love (active/job -- teaching yoga). Then, I can decide how much I want to do my "job." Right now, it's mostly job and some administrative. But, in the future (and to an extent already), it's switching over. :D
Second, I don't really know what you mean about whatever you want to do as businesses vs job in terms of a list or how you are going to do it, etc. I think you are right to speak to your goal, but there are times when it's best to keep things close to the vest. The reality is that most people who are not self employed have no concept of it and will poo-poo your process. I think you've already experienced that to an extent, right?
So, your best bet is to keep it to a place like this -- and we can start putting ideas toward you or saying "ooh, that sounds good" or "are you planning on having it look like this or like that?" (in terms of business models, for example).
I would be interested in your list of ideas, just to see what you're thinking about doing and how you think it will work toward your goals. :)
fidgiegirl
3-23-13, 8:51pm
Well now I'm confused too! :D
In terms of ideas, they tend to fall into the following broad categories:
- websites
- blogs
- ebooks
- various forms of rental properties
- events like crafting retreats, craft shows
- personal services like tutoring or coaching on ed tech stuff
- various forms of online commerce, but man, there is so much out there already going on . . . not sure if it ends up being a "play WITH the big boys" effect or a "play AGAINST the big boys" battle. Merits further research.
I am starting to wonder if I shouldn't start taking some coding classes to start building up some of the websites. That seems like something I could handle while still working. Not sure where to start on that, though. For example, one of them is a searchable database of language learning opportunities in the Twin Cities area. The schools/programs would pay an advertising fee to be included and there would be tiers of advertising. So to build this, where people could search by geographic location, style of program, age of student, etc., what would be the best kind of class to take? I have no training in coding. I could see taking a Coursera class or something like that as I am not concerned with getting credit/credential, I just have no idea which language is the one to start with. Ideas on this one? I hate to pay someone to do this work for me because I don't want to outlay the cash up front, plus want to build this skill for future ideas that might come along. That is just one of the website ideas.
I think we want to acquire more rentals but plan to wait at least a year to build up our rental account further and also we think (need to reconfirm this) that after two years of landlording banks are willing to lend against future potential income from the property. Still need 20% down on any property, however.
Well, those are pretty vague, but i'll throw in a dime or two.
First, a lot of them are job-based -- web site building, ebooks (content creation), blogs (content creation), and personal services (tutoring/coaching) are all "you based" -- you would be doing the job for the client. Therefore, if you were hit by a bus, the business is kaput.
So, that's how I look at business: can this exist if I get hit by a bus?
By the end of this year, my studio would "live" if I got hit by a bus. It's insured to pay those teachers who would need to be paid, and bring in an expert from australia for a few months to complete their training. From there, someone would be trained up to manage the teachers, and there's a plan in place for that as well, and then to pay that manager. The insurance that covers me in the business is designed to cover those costs.
It's like a model insuring her legs, yes?
The other three look more passive: rental properties, e-commerce, and event planning. two of these are basically renting time/space. Administrating them is dependent on a lot of factors -- that is, you can decide how hands on or hands off you want to be (which will depend upon the capital that you have to invest).
Beyond this, I'm curious in two ways:
1. these are very 'vague' -- what do you mean by web sites? what sort of ebooks are you considering developing for what audiences? what will the blogs be about? what commerce will you e?
The real estate, tutoring, and craft events seem like the only three that have a clear idea, and these are rather vague as well. Not that you have to give me all of the details, btu there are lots of kinds of "web site" businesses.
2. what experience do you have with these things? what is your background (educational, professional, hobby or otherwise), that would set you up for successfully transitioning these things into viable businesses that meet your financial goals?
Finally, what work are you doing *daily* to move you forward? I feel like you have lots of ideas, but no direction, and no clear understanding of how to get direction. Like, the person who has a lot of great ideas but they never really *act* on those ideas.
I have a friend who is starting a business (again) and this one is just as destined to fail as any other. WHy? because it's a vague idea "I'm going to give psychic readings/coaching" (btw, she's good and experienced, even if you don't believe in psychic readings, a lot of people do). and when I try to help her pin down her actual service, how it works, to whom to market, how, etc -- she gets a bit spooked, goes off half-cocked, and ends up spending a lot and earning a little and theng etting depressed.
most busineses fail due to three things: 1. lack of clarity from the onset; 2. lack of planning; and 3. lack of follow through. You have to have all three. So far, I dont really think you have clarity. You need clarity to plan, and then a plan on which to follow-through.
Just my thoughts so far.
try2bfrugal
3-23-13, 11:52pm
Well now I'm confused too! :D
In terms of ideas, they tend to fall into the following broad categories:
- websites
- blogs
- ebooks
- various forms of rental properties
- events like crafting retreats, craft shows
- personal services like tutoring or coaching on ed tech stuff
- various forms of online commerce, but man, there is so much out there already going on . . . not sure if it ends up being a "play WITH the big boys" effect or a "play AGAINST the big boys" battle. Merits further research.
I am starting to wonder if I shouldn't start taking some coding classes to start building up some of the websites. That seems like something I could handle while still working. Not sure where to start on that, though. For example, one of them is a searchable database of language learning opportunities in the Twin Cities area. The schools/programs would pay an advertising fee to be included and there would be tiers of advertising. So to build this, where people could search by geographic location, style of program, age of student, etc., what would be the best kind of class to take? I have no training in coding. I could see taking a Coursera class or something like that as I am not concerned with getting credit/credential, I just have no idea which language is the one to start with. Ideas on this one? I hate to pay someone to do this work for me because I don't want to outlay the cash up front, plus want to build this skill for future ideas that might come along. That is just one of the website ideas.
I think we want to acquire more rentals but plan to wait at least a year to build up our rental account further and also we think (need to reconfirm this) that after two years of landlording banks are willing to lend against future potential income from the property. Still need 20% down on any property, however.
I think a specialized directory in your field is a great idea. I have had an online directory that I haven't had time to keep up to date in favor of other projects, but in its hey day it did quite well. Once a directory is set up and ranking it can almost be semi-passive income except for marketing it, getting links and keeping the content updated.
If you can make something you write or create once, as in intellectual property, and then sell or display it to customers a million times over, you have a great source of almost passive income in future years. These days it helps to do something that can't be outsourced to coders in a third world country with third world contract rates, so a site that requires specialized knowledge of your area would be good. The thing you would have to check into would be is this something enough people in your area search for online to be profitable, or can you scale your content to include other cities?
Well, it's not exactly easy to create content, and then from there, to sell it so that it has a long tail. I have made several little yoga videos and recordings over the years, which have brought in regular income -- but it's about $60 a quarter. So, it's not like just because you have intellectual property you're going to be raking it in. Marketing it is a huge part of it, too. I don't market those videos/things, they were mostly for my clients.
But anyway. . .
Also, choose something that you're truly, truly passionate about. You're going to need it to have the staying power to get it *all* done and be successful. :)
fidgiegirl
3-24-13, 11:01am
Thanks to everyone for the feedback. Try2bfrugal, what do you think is a good place to start learning how to code to build such a directory? I can put up a website that is static using tools like Weebly and make it look pretty good, but not sure how to make a searchable one. Any advice welcome. I had also thought about the expansion possibilities. Another directory style idea I had is to do a searchable site for GF restaurants. San Diego area had one and it was immensely helpful when we went there, but it was still pretty basic. Twin Cities doesn't really have anything apart from some lists of restaurants.
Zoeb, here's where I think I didn't make myself clear earlier in the discussion. I am not interested in a single big huge business. Don't get me wrong, I think your business and your success at it is interesting, inspiring, etc., but it's not the model I'm aiming for for us. The thought of that doesn't sound doable to me at all, for many of the reasons you discussed - lots of ideas, etc. (which of course, isn't at all to say that YOU are not a person with lots of ideas. I think you are great. :) ) I have come to see myself as a scanner or multipotentialite (thanks to much readings of Barbara Winter, Barbara Sher, blogs like Puttylike, etc.) and am still understanding all of what that means. That doesn't mean I'm flighty, or won't follow through/act. I'm still gaining clarity on all my different ideas and how different profit centers would even fit in our lives - that's why I'm here trying to hash these things out, and that's ok. :)
Let's stick with one idea right now, maybe. I can't bring myself to clearly describe all fifty that I have, not ONE of which I would want to be a whole entire big huge singular business. Perhaps a combination of half a dozen of them or so, or more or fewer, depending on when. :) That may have been why in order to convey that "I have lots of ideas! Look!" they came off as vague, when really, under the website category I have about six different models in mind and have thought through many aspects of each.
Barbara Winter makes this metaphor in her book Making a Living Without a Job, page 115:
Chase Revel, the founder of Entrepreneur magazine, pointed out that it's easier to earn $1000 a month fro ten little businesses than it is to earn $10,000 a month from one big source. I thi of creating profit centers as being akin to what a juggler does when spinning plates on top of sticks. The juggler walks out on the stage with ten sticks and ten plates but doesn't begin spinning them all at once. Methodically, he of she positions the first plate on a stick and gets it into motion. Once done, the juggler moves on to the next, and the next, and so forth. Eventually, all ten of the plates are spinning away, each with its own momentum.
Your success can be created in a similar fashion. You can't produce a lineup of profit centers in a single effort. Follow the juggler's example. Take your first idea, get it started, stay with it until it develops its own momentum, then go on to your next idea, and so on. And, yes, some of your plates will fall on the floor and shatter. Do what the juggler does - pick up another plate and start spinning!
So at least I'm clear on that much. :)
So, the foreign language directory. First, there is no good site to locate this information all in one place. People, especially parents and other teachers, frequently ask me if I know of tutors or classes, particularly in Spanish, for their kids or themselves. And so in researching these offerings in order to help my friends and acquaintances, I've come to realize there are tremendous offerings of many different language classes in our area, some through public schools or community education organizations, some through private institutions, and some through individuals. So then I started thinking of how I could compile all that into a single location that would be easy to use and professional looking. I know what I'd want the final product to look like - searchable by text input or drop-down menus as well as by map. Perhaps there can be a basic, free listing, and then a swanky, paid listing option with graphics and/or special offers. I'd want there to be a free listing because I think part of the success of the site will be if there are many, many options to find. I might even have to do some of the listings myself in the beginning, at least links to webpages of existing programs I happen to know about. I want it to be a site with a catchy enough name where two dads can be chatting - one about how he wants little Billy to start taking preschool Spanish and the other can say, "Oh! I heard about a site for that, it's _______ and they have all kinds of ideas." Language classes for kids will be the initial focus, and I can advertise through Google or FB ads and other social media, something I've been learning about and toying with for "advertising myself," so to speak, last year when looking for a job.
So for this particular idea, I know I need to document this plan in some sort of organized fashion because I'm sure I haven't thought of everything, and I run up against the business plan wall. Puglogic had posted a good one page business plan template earlier in the thread, maybe I should go find that. Because a multi-page, hugely involved business plan will kill me. I can do one, and I know I need to cover all the bases, but simpler would be better. Not cutting corners, just the basics for a first try. Just like I have done with other successful multi-step projects in my past, I need to write out all the steps and begin proceeding.
Still trying to figure out what that coding step will look like, or maybe I don't even need to learn a coding language. Not even sure where to start looking to figure this out. I'll ask a friend at work this week, and also hope that someone here has some ideas.
I feel like I'm hogging up this whole thread now. Sorry!!
iris lily
3-24-13, 12:29pm
fidgie it's your thread, you can hog it all you like!
I like your idea of directory for language learning opportunities. I might approach the technology of it by paying pros to design it and then you learn how to maintain it with updates, adds & deletions, etc. I don't know about the technology of building databases delivered through the web, but in my world we use a lot of expensive databases that one does NOT access for free ('cause the content and technology costs $$$ to build) and --let's just say there is a wide range in quality of these products.
As for the "business plan" sure you've got to have one but if you are self funding as I'm sure you will be, you don't need a formal document to present to a bank for a loan. I've seen a number of friends do those over the years and they go no where. The one page business plan is very cool. Long formal business plan documents tend to be academic exercises.
Very cool idea--and because you are in education you know that money for promoting service is lean or non-existent from many educational places, so that will be one hurdle to get over. They will want you to do it for free, and your idea of a simple free listing is good because you really WILL have to be The Go To Place on the web for language learning opportunities. This is a great idea because if it takes off in the Twin Cities it can be cloned for other geographic places and using the same technology.
The most recent experience I've had with this kind of concept was just last week when I investigated a directory/database of media contacts. At one time a local public relations firm published an annual directory (in printed form) of media contacts, divided into sections such as radio, tv, daily/weekly/monthly print publications. The directory listed contact names phone numbers and address, publishing deadlines, web urls. They would issue occasional updates through page replacements. The subscription was several hundred dollars a year.
Then about 8 years ago it moved to a subscription database form, where the buyers purchased access to it, delivered through the web and accessed via password. Now it doesn't seem to exist as a standalone web product. Since the local Press Club has a password-accessed "Media Directory" I'm guessing that the Press Club took it over. I'm not sure who is making money on it now, someone has to be paid to update it, but that might be a part time clerical type person.
try2bfrugal
3-24-13, 1:44pm
Thanks to everyone for the feedback. Try2bfrugal, what do you think is a good place to start learning how to code to build such a directory? I can put up a website that is static using tools like Weebly and make it look pretty good, but not sure how to make a searchable one. Any advice welcome.
I just have a plain HTML directory, but it is old, no longer gets much traffic and needs to be rewritten. So I do not know if one was starting out today the best software choice. I would just look at what other top ranked directories are using. You don't have to be innovative on the software - use the "the good artists copy, great artists steal" idea. I don't mean to violate anyone's copyright, just use the same basic ideas and whatever software platforms are popular for directories ranking well today. It is also easier if you go after low competition / high potential earnings terms. You might want to read the book the Long Tail if you have not read it yet.
The thing with Internet sites is they are cheap to put up if you do the work yourself. The people I see fail are the ones that order the marketing T-shirts and coffee mugs with the company name before they have ever even figured out how to put up a free blog that makes $1 a week. If you can figure out how to make a blog, site or directory that makes $1 a day, then expand on that site or lather, rinse, repeat. You can support yourself on $1 a day sites if you have enough of them in proportion to your annual expenses. Then if your income isn't tied to a major job market, you can move to a low cost of living area and lower your expenses quite a bit, so you don't have to make as much to have the same basic lifestyle and eventually be FI. Plus with being self employed you may be able to deduct some of your current expenses like a home office, work related journals, Internet cable costs, health insurance premiums, etc. so your taxes might be lower. Even if you never are self supporting in your side business, the extra income, if you have the time, will still help you to reach your FI goals faster.
Still trying to figure out what that coding step will look like, or maybe I don't even need to learn a coding language. Not even sure where to start looking to figure this out.
Kelli, I don't remember who hosts your blogs, but they may already have a couple of choices as part of their hosting plans. My hosting is through lunarpages and they offer both MySQL and PostgreSQL as database engines you can use with other software (or to roll your own). It might be worth checking out WordPress, too, to see if anyone offers database extensions or hooks to engines like MySQL (likely).
My suggestion, though, is that you take a good look at the already-invented wheels, though, before you choose to build your own. There are many many Web sites that offer a collection of resources/external URLs to visitors. They may not cover language classes in the Twin Cities (great for you!). But it's the content and some superficial stuff (colors, fonts) which will make your site different, not the concept. You might want to look at some Web sites you've found helpful in the past (like that California GF restaurant database), View Source in your browser, and see what they're using for their databases (you can search the Web for the info you find in comment boxes). Secure the template (many are free) and start building the data. Frankly, keeping that data up to date will take plenty of time on its own; you likely do not want to chew into site-maintenance time lovingly hand-crafting all kinds of code or even severely customizing existing templates beyond field names, etc.
Take it from someone who worked at a large company that insisted that major software programs couldn't possibly reflect the unique widgets we made for a breathless world: a widget is a widget. We spent a lot of time customizing and then re-customizing software because we'd painted ourselves into a corner with our unique view of the world. Don't do that. There are plenty of open-source tools out there and many templates which will let you minimize the time you spend customizing and give you more time to work on the information of value -- the content.
I agree about using open-source tools as much as possible, so that you don't have to craft and recraft the coding as you go. It takes a lot of time, all of that.
And I do think it's a great idea, the question is -- how is it amortized? Do businesses pay for marketing? Do people join the subscription list for a fee? HOw does it work? to make money?
From there, how much money can it reasonably and realistically make, and how long will it take to get there before you can so easily "toss another plate in the air?"
And trust me, each of these things is a *big* business -- much bigger than you think it is. One of my friends is the director of one crafting event company. They run 3 events per year right now, and it's pretty much a full-time job. It in no-way supports her family (her husband has a job). Her kids are in school, so she works on it then, and then a bit on weekends. It's a lot of planning and marketing, those events.
Another friend of mine runs a blog that is modestly amortized (advertisers). I believe she's priced her advertisers out of the market (ie, a simple event listing is $50 for 30 days, whereas I can use other event listings for free with much better viewership and overall much greater impact in the market -- so I suggested she drop her price to $15 per month, and that more of us might give her business support. I don't mind tossing $15 in that direction to raise my profile, and those sorts of investments (at that price point) have worked well for me in the past in terms of attracting 1-3 people to something that cost them $125-140. So, great ROI.
Anyway, she works on that thing pretty much like a full time gig AND pays an assistant to work on it (via trade in yoga). The reality is that the blog basically makes no money, and that frustates and upsets her. She's been running it and trying to amortize it for over 5 years to no avail (though admittedly, she won't listen to successful people give her ideas, but whatever).
Another friend of mine runs a 'curated' etsy shop. Basically, she creates some material for it, but she also gathers jewelry that she likes from other people who make it. She hand picks things and markets them and so on. This way, it's not all on her to make every item (which makes it difficult, btw, to make any income because it takes a lot of time to design and hand-make jewelry, and so by having several people working for her, she basically "cosigns" all of their stuff, and when they sell, she gets a bit and they get a bit.
Luckily, her husband has a job, too, because otherwise they wouldn't eat. She's been doing this for about 4 years now, and the profit margin is slim. It mostly feeds her habit of loving to make jewelry.
There's nothing wrong with any of this -- but I'm just pointing out that *one* of these ideas can take *a lot* of a person's time and energy just to get it off the ground and earning some income. And, I suppose since each of them is making *some* money (less than $50/mo) on their different web ventures, they *could* "toss another plate in the air" -- but the current plate takes up a lot of time and effort without a ton of financial return to them, and as such they don't have a whole lot of time to toss another plate up there.
On the flip side, I have a friend who designed and created one of those voucher sites. He was a great at giving vendors (like me) exactly what we wanted. He was very clear in how it would benefit him and us, and they had a great process involved. It took him about 2 years to develop and establish well -- and we were one of his first big clients coming in regularly (quarterly voucher deals). We worked well together. He sold that business for $2m, which then caused the whole business to go completely to sh*t, at which point there were several other companies on the scene (currently, there are 3 main ones -- his is no longer one of them) and I went with the most professional and best of the three. This company was recently sold as well, so we don't know if we'll be continuing with them or not -- or with any at all.
So, it's not like it *can't* be done. But, I will tell you that he and I were up past midnight one night because I had a major issue with his company, got wind of it around 9 pm, was able to get out an email to him around 11 pm, which he answered at 11:30 pm, and then we had an online chat about it until 1 am -- both venting about the cock-up, as well as figuring out what needed to happen to make it all go well and good. So, it's not as if his business was "never work a day in your life again!"
And for what it's worth, he's still working -- he's just tossed another plate in the air. . . his current focus being the development of Apps. He's got two launched and two beta -- but none of them is selling very well at the moment, so he's looking at his market position.
In my own business life, i've spent the last 3 years getting this business off the ground. It's sustained us since 6 months in, and we're now hitting that comfortable profit margin. My work has dropped down to classes plus about 8 hours a week. 4 of those are administrative, the other 4 are my work to expand and continue.
My business looks big, i suppose, but it's just following the idea of "toss another plate in the air" under one banner/idea. If you take out my "job" (the teaching), then it's really only about 4 hrs of administration per week for me, 4 for my husband (marketing/etc), and then add another 4 for me under "business development" -- or getting another plate in the air.
In addition, as I said, we have another business venture idea underway. This one is really to serve a niche that DH noticed, and we're going to see how it goes by starting out relatively small and getting rolling from there. Luckily, it's very low cost for us to start it -- and we are putting it on an accessible growth plan that doesn't over-extend us considering the primary business that supports us does need our attention. So, we want to keep this at about 4 hrs a week while we set it up (i'm drafting the business plan now), and then launch it in September. We'll start marketing in earnest in July, and we have plenty of great opportunities to market through many of our local networks and contacts from then until launch date.
From there, I'm also looking at starting a farmer's market in our community. I thought about a food cooperative, but that's a lot of heavy lifting. I also considered a community garden, but there's no profit in it, so it would have to be a volunteer gig for me -- so maybe down the track. But a farmer's market could create a modest profit over time, and would be relatively simple to set up. But, I need to know about the market's interest, and so I have started a process of "tupperware parties" which I use as market research.
I simply ask a few friends to invite some friends from the neighborhood to get their input on whether and what sort of farmer's market they might like. We all bring nibbles and I buy cases of wine for these things (luckily, on coupons), and then after about 40 minutes of chit-chat, we head into an our of focus-group facilitation to see what sorts of products interest people, what sort of "flavor" the market might have, etc. I've even collected the marketing materials of a variety of small and medium local farmers -- to see which brands and information appeals to the people who live here and which do not. I consider this a long-term side project. It is unlikely to get off the ground this year, and possibly not even next year. Maybe a year from Sept when spring comes -- but. . . who knows?
Most of our markets are in the city, and not everyone wants to make the trek or fight for parking. There's a high end, an all-organics/small producers, and one that focuses on unique ethnic produce. Two are just big-old conventional ones (cool though, still, to wander around). Our community's interest seems to be on local, sustainable, and 'good story' in terms fo the producer. I find that really interesting.
Those are basically 3 different big plates -- all of which have multiple sub-plates.
So, I've just started one of my sub-plates in the yoga business.
I've had a client base in a small town on the south island since 2007, and I visit them intermittently to do trainings and classes. I've been working with a studio there to try to form a dynamic partnership where i help develop their business and also serve my client base. But, we haven't been able to come to terms.
So, it got me thinking. I started talking with people in my client base, and . . . well anyway. . . after a lot of discussions, I just decided to go independent. I was a little afraid, because I was like "how will the word get out there? OMG!" After a modest freak out and budget analysis, Dh came up with a brilliant method of handling it all, and through some of my connections, I even have press lined up. LOL figures. It really is a small town.
Anyway, I'll be going there once a month, and then if things grow according to my plans, I'll have teachers trained and be able to take on premises. Even prime locations in that town are super inexpensive -- I found that shocking. Office spaces on the main drag with more space than what I have where I am for $1600/mo (inclusive of tax and outgoings). So, once the client base is developed, then we'd be able to make the leap and that gets our second location going!
It's really fun to have something percolate for a couple of years and then finally have a break through! yay!
Awesome, ZB!
I took a bit of a break from this thread because I was getting so overwhelmed - still am! But that's ok, everytime I come back to thinking about some of my ideas I learn a little more and think through it all a bit more and you all help with that and I appreciate it very much. Now I am going to review the thread for that one-page business plan link.
try2bfrugal
4-4-13, 1:17am
Awesome, ZB!
I took a bit of a break from this thread because I was getting so overwhelmed - still am! But that's ok, everytime I come back to thinking about some of my ideas I learn a little more and think through it all a bit more and you all help with that and I appreciate it very much. Now I am going to review the thread for that one-page business plan link.
You might just try your best idea first, and then if that doesn't work go down your list. I had several false starts trying to find something I could do on my own until something clicked. I took a lot of classes at the local colleges along the way.
fidgiegirl
5-10-13, 8:22pm
Anyone have experience with The Right Brain Business Plan book? I am liking it . . . I like that it starts you out at the formulating an idea spot, which is where I have issues (above).
An icky meeting at work has me thinking about this again. I like my actual work, just not the related BS.
Float On is really right, it is very important to have a good balance.
Self-employment can be the most wonderful thing in the world, but you need to have good balance and must be able to put work down and just enjoy the free time you have.
I work, or lets better say I try, as a freelancer and I am at the beginning to start my own little business. And I am really happy that I can do it...
But for me is important to keep in mind that I must have a good balance. I don't want to forget that;)
Resurrecting this old thread to announce that I went back to working on my photography business and I have landed my first paying customer! :cool: It's a remodeling company that, based on their Web site, really could use some help taking decent pictures. I'm their guy...
One thing I've noted in looking at other small businesses is their "social media" presence. My current situation, to be succinct, is that I don't have one. I have a twitter account in my company name, but I haven't tweeted once from it. I do not have a business page on Facebook. And I don't even have personal Pinterest or google+ accounts, nevermind business accounts. I'm figuring I probably need to do a Facebook page out of the sheer volume and penetration of the site. Pins of remodeled spaces I photograph would fit real well on Pinterest and maybe drum up business for me and the people whose work I photograph. The less I have to do with google the better, but that may not be real avoidable. OTOH, I don't want to start all those contact sources and let them die for lack of material or time. How do other small-businesspeople handle that?
My husband does social media for a few businesses. One is a restaurant. They give him breakfast and lunch as often as he wishes in exchange for his work. Itan arrangement that they both like better than any formalized hours and payment. They have Twitter which is updated a few times a day with daily specials. They have instagram, which was used these past two weeks for a contest. The customer who posted the winning pic of their food got a 25$ gift certificate. They have a facebook page. That's less organized, but still updated at least ince a day.
Talking to him now, and he says lots of companies dump this extra duty on a salaried manager who has no heart or skills for it. So it is rarely updated and poorly done. This is worse than no media presence.
Some businesses pay big bucks to have someone do it, but most can't afford a full time media person.
The trick is finding someone who cares and knows how social media works. And figuring out how to compensate in a way they value that is affordable.
I told my husband to start bartering with a gas station, grocery store, car dealership, apartment complex .... Our whole life could be supplied. ;)
Talking to him now, and he says lots of companies dump this extra duty on a salaried manager who has no heart or skills for it. So it is rarely updated and poorly done. This is worse than no media presence.
Some businesses pay big bucks to have someone do it, but most can't afford a full time media person.
Thanks, Tammy. That's kind of what I'm afraid of. My business is me, myself, and I. I would care a whole bunch :) though keeping a lot of social media alive likely would mean less time spent on other things, like looking for customers.
One difference for me is that my customers are other businesses. Certainly there are people at those businesses making the decision to purchase my services. But I don't face customers directly so that I would have a daily special or much seasonality to promote. So I'd have to think of something useful worth reading on a periodic basis. And to keep up with it. Without (my personal peeve) posting only when I have something to sell (that's not social, that's just an overt selling opportunity) and without preaching to the choir (Fb may be a good place to introduce the value of what I do, but if someone is already following me on twitter, do they need to be reminded constantly of the value of good photos? I don't see that as a value-add).
I do follow a few smaller businesses on social media and seeing what they send out makes me think that either I should use pretty much the same stuff in all venues (Fb post looks like a tweet which resembles whatever google+ has, etc.) and let (prospective) customers choose their preferred medium (and risk boring people who follow on more than one platform) or come up with original content for each platform (lots more time spent).
Still thinking....
Not to mention yelp ... It's endless.
Less is more, for business marketing. I don't like being bothered more than once a day by a business.
Not the way most do it, however ...
Deleted because I should read everything I'm responding to first...
try2bfrugal
8-8-13, 3:10pm
Thanks, Tammy. That's kind of what I'm afraid of. My business is me, myself, and I. I would care a whole bunch :) though keeping a lot of social media alive likely would mean less time spent on other things, like looking for customers.
Your best investment is probably trying to come up in the search engine listings for
commercial photography "your city"
and related terms. Or doing some free work for nonprofits in return for portfolio samples, references and maybe some positive Yelp reviews and free links to your business web site.
Steve, what is the goal of the social media presence? Clients for you or clients for your clients? That could be important. My first thought was, "Of course! Images = Pinterest!" But in the case of your remodeling company, if it's male owners, well, they probably weren't cruising Pinterest to find a photographer. May have been, but Pinterest users are overwhelmingly female. But like you said, their clients might be searching Pinterest for remodeling IMAGES, leading to clients for them. You mentioned realtors in the past, if I remember correctly - where to realtors hang out? On LinkedIn? On FB? Not sure how to find this out.
I have different social media approaches for different audiences. Pinterest is personal and some dissemination of good information for work. I am driving a bit of traffic to Twin Cities Gluten Free through Pinterest, which is big for food photography. Twitter is networking for my paid job. There are TONS of techy educators hanging out there.
Here's another thing with social media - you can automate it. You can set schedule FB updates and tweets and pins. Then, you just go to town with your own site and connect it all up and you don't have to do a ton of posting, though there is the monitoring of comments.
Just some thoughts, not real advice. It's easy to be overwhelmed by all of it and I'm figuring it out as well.
In my own business news, I have decided to put on a one-day craft retreat on October. Have booked a space. Will keep you all updated.
Steve, what is the goal of the social media presence? Clients for you or clients for your clients?
Well, some of it is a case of "everybody does it". I remember the days when it was possible to type http//www.nameofcompany.com and not come up with a Web site. Today even the little auto repair place down the block has at least a static Web page with a map, hours, etc. And most businesses seem to have Facebook pages, twitter feeds, etc. So I feel I need to do at least some of it. But I don't want to do it halfway. I see too much of that and I don't think it reflects well on the business.
With Pinterest, though, you raise a good question. Mine is a business-to-business kind of -- umm, business -- so "advertising" what I can do on Pinterest probably would not be fruitful. But being able to provide remodelers/decorators/home stagers with good pictures for Pinterest ... that's a competitive advantage. So I probably ought to know at least how those media work (as I had to learn the rules for MLS listings).
Here's another thing with social media - you can automate it.
I'm liking that! I'll have to figure out how that works. I can preload useful stuff. I really didn't even think I'd have to do it real-time. Good to know I don't have to. Thanks!
fidgiegirl
11-4-13, 6:45pm
Bump!
How's everyone doing?
Nothing much to report here, plugging along with Twin Cities Gluten Free, have raised the readership a bit so that's good, but not making any money with 10 views a day. :D
We are still looking at doing our basement to rent out on AirBNB. We have a pretty good idea of what it will take but it's the doing of it that takes time and $$. Luckily DH has good follow-through on such things.
Hoping to hear some inspiration from the crowd, especially since it's been a few months. Go!
P.S. Join us even if you didn't before.
try2bfrugal
11-4-13, 6:59pm
I have been self employed for about 15 years. I have let things slide a bit lately, but I put in some more hours today. I do need to keep more of a schedule. It was easier when DH worked a regular job and the kids were in school most of the day because then I just worked weekdays like they all did.
SteveinMN
11-5-13, 12:26pm
Terrible. Enjoying retirement too much to put a lot of time into building the business. At one point, I actually thought I had my first customer, but they flaked out on me and there was something in my gut telling me it wasn't worth pursuing this particular job. Gotta push for this winter, though, so I have a stream of work by spring when everyone starts thinking about houses again. I have decided to split the fine-art side of my business from the residential side; that will require some work in (thinking of and) registering a new name, new Web site, etc. Another winter project....
Umm, that wasn't really inspirational, was it? :|(
Our main business, what my DH has done for 27 years is coming to it's end. We had an offer on our equipment and we went for it. Just in the process of closing everything down by the end of the year.
My product photography for jury images is going o.k. and recently I was asked to do some Sr Photo Shoots. One led to a second client and it's been fun and it's brought a few more inquiries. Most of the kids I'm talking to want edgy/industrial and I'm so glad they aren't asking for the standard railroad track or boots and a sundress in a field.
Business has been slow in my main income stream in October, but it is looking like it will pick up in November again. It gave me some time to have a normal life for a couple of weeks, and also do some business planning. My blog is still not intended to make money, just to keep me in the writing habit, though I am always looking for ideas on how I can change it up to make it useful enough to other people to sell something. Suggestions have been: write an ebook, write a real book, start a community, sell products, etc. Any and all thoughts welcome :D Thanks for resurrecting this Kelli!
Gardenarian
11-5-13, 4:31pm
Not self-employed as such, but have taken on renting my vacation home as a source of income. So far, so good. I'm using AirBnB and was very nervous when I started, but things have gone smoothly. I'm getting the cleaning routine down. I am booked as much as I would like to be through November. My goal is to make $1000 per month - my expenses are about $500.
DH is self employed (musician) and has been losing some students - not having to turn them away as he used to. He has more gigs, but they aren't paying very well.
Float On - Sorry to hear about the glass blowing - you guys did beautiful work.
fidgiegirl
11-5-13, 7:39pm
So great to hear everyone's updates, even if they aren't all roses . . . to be honest, it makes me feel a bit better. :)
puglogic, you might find this interesting: http://pinchofyum.com/category/making-money-from-a-food-blog. I learned a lot from these guys. They are from my hometown, but I do not know them; my mom turned me on to their blog.
FloatOn, what will you guys do to replace the income from the business? Not asking in a doomsday kind of way, just curious.
Gardenarian, I would love to chat more about AirBNB when we are closer to ready . . . so glad it's going well for you.
Steve, why the split? Not super knowledgeable about business filings, but couldn't you just do a DBA or something and keep it simple?
I'm having trouble catching a breath. I know going in to the Holiday season that it's crazy busy till about Dec 2nd, but it always catches me by surprise when I'm in the middle of it.
Maybe next year I'll really remember and start getting started in August. Yeah, didn't work this year... maybe next year.
Whooooo!
fidgiegirl
11-6-13, 8:05am
Cecilia, forgive me if you've said earlier in the thread but it's been so long - what is your business?
Thanks, Kelli, and congratulations on your new, er, "developments" (in your business and your life) :D
Steve, why the split? Not super knowledgeable about business filings, but couldn't you just do a DBA or something and keep it simple?
Oh, I definitely could do a dba. Behind the scenes, much of the business information will be the same. Same insurance policy, similar looking business cards, etc.
But I need to separate the kinds of photography as prospective customers see it. I've tried to keep my residential-photography Web site all-business -- stressing the value provided by hiring me, quoting statistics on how houses sell better with high-quality photography, showing pictures of homes and remodeling projects.
None of that matters to people who want fine-art photography. The pitch doesn't speak to their interests. And showing images which are not structures, to appeal to fine-art customers, only confuses RE prospects. So I want to create separate faces for the businesses, which means I need a business name, a different Web site (or at least a different portal to appropriate pages), and all the paperwork/insurance/whatever that comes with that separate entity. I also need to figure out what to do with the phone. Right now I have a separate phone/number for the RE business. I really don't want to have to pay for (and carry) a third phone for the FA business. I know many people use Google Voice for that kind of call redirection, but I try to keep my life a Google-free zone, so I'll have to check out alternatives.
I work in sterling, leather and clay, so I call myself a Maker. Right now is rush for wholesale and then things quiet down by Dec 1st. I'm actually dreaming about being snowed in for a week or so in January, just so I can stop for a while. *laugh.
What would you do with a 'week off' ?
bke, I would love to know more about how you're reaching FI. I need that kind of inspiration!
Dh and I have been self employed since 2001. It is stressful and overwhelming at times. Basically seems like a 24/7 job. Not hard but a ton of hours both in the business and outside just to maintain. It is really hard for us to have a day off together. There have definitely been times when I would have rather had a 9 to 5 with set days off and benefits!
Positives:
1. Dh has a 6th grade education. Finding a good career elsewhere would be a challenge when you combine that with the fact that english is his second language (self taught). I do the office stuff-he runs the kitchen and we compliment each others strengths and weaknesses very well.
2. No day care when ds was little. He came with us to work. I set him up with a nice little area where he could finger paint and get creative with clay to his little heart's content and never worried about the damage-lol!
3. Money was really tight in the beginning but we're reaching FI quickly. There are a lot more ways to manipulate money to your greatest advantage when you work for yourself. BUT, business assets do not equal personal assets!! We've seen many places struggle and fail through the years because they ignore this fact.
4. I never, ever have to worry about being unexpectedly laid off.
5. If business ever got bad enough dh and I could handle the entire operation without outside help.
I'll be happy to answer specific questions if anyone has them.
After a layoff from a fairly lucrative gig, I've been trying to revive a solo art business I started. I'd been working in it sporadically alongside my day gig over the past two years. It's a sobering experience for all kinds of reasons.
It's very frustrating to work with individual clients, because they can't pay much. Also, most individual clients are not "in" the art business, so they sometimes don't exhibit professionalism in their interactions with me. They require tons of changes, or lowball me on price, or don't respond to emails. Just gets to be a hassle for the amount of money I'm making.
A friend of mine who illustrates children's books, on the other hand, has more work than he can handle. The difference: he works with publishers. Publishers are in business, so you're in a completely new world. You rarely have to worry about stuff like nonpayment, poor communication, etc. And it's a well-paying gig.
OTOH, it's not a gravy train for everybody. Another artist friend of mine has a major reputation in the UK, with tons of features in magazines and books, and one hardback in print. He's been doing his thing successfully for the past twenty years or so, but it's gotten harder for him recently. One of his publishers recently informed him that they've cancelled his book contract, because they thought he was a different artist (one whose style his resembles). Wow, wouldn't you try to research that BEFORE you extend a book deal to an artist?
I recently signed up with a freelancer site called oDesk. I confidently stated my fee in my profile, and then started looking at the fees people who were getting hired were asking. It turns out that most of my fellow artists on oDesk, who come from everywhere on the planet, are asking $15 for, say, a logo. This is insane to me - this is a job I'd normally get $150-$300 for. So people think, why shell out 150 shekels to somebody, when you can get an artist in a developing economy to do the same work for $15? Kind of sucks when you live in a big city and pay $2k a month in rent...
Notice the number of views this thread has gotten? I guess a lot of us are in the same boat!
Sorry to hear about your layoff, kitten....
fidgiegirl
11-19-13, 6:02pm
Yes, that is too bad. That was the radio job?
Ha, yep, the writing was on the wall. In a way it was good because it confirmed my suspicion that something was off - I have a tendency to second-guess myself, so I kept thinking: I must be wrong, they can't actually be treating me like I don't exist. I'm just paranoid. But as it turns out, they WERE dismissing every concern, because I didn't matter to them. So I wasn't crazy. It was true.
Anyway, after the station became non-profit, it devolved into an exclusive club. People started getting hired that the board members liked a lot. I was considered a newbie - I've only been in town five years, and I'm not a darling of the moneyed set. Plus, I'm not a musician. They "traded" me for a guy from another station who's been in town doing arts reporting for 30 years, and he's a cellist. (So sue me - I thought I was being hired for a radio gig, not a symphony orchestra). The gist of his peers' assessment of the new guy's work so far (or so I've heard from my former co-workers) is that he's a great guy, but mediocre on the air - adequate but without a distinctive style, and no particular gift for creating a connection with the audience. (Which was one of my strengths apparently). Bizarre that a radio station would care more about hiring cronies than about what comes out of the speakers, but there ya go. Of course I think they screwed up, but then again I'm biased! ;)
Better news - I got an interview yesterday at a different station in town. This is a commercial station, and though it wouldn't be a music gig, it would be a more creative job with a lot of prestige. It sounds like a healthier place in terms of the culture, too, although you never really know until you get in. Anyway, my interviewer said he was blown away by my audition tape, so we'll see. Wish me luck, and thanks for all your advice so far! You guys rock!
fidgiegirl
11-20-13, 8:00am
Well it's probably hard to feel it right now but I wonder if eventually it will seem like a blessing in disguise. Fingers crossed for the other gig!
Good luck on getting the new gig, kitten! Your former workplace sounds like a hellhole, so good for you for getting out of it, in whatever deliverance method it took to get it done! Please keep us posted on what happens.
puglogic
11-20-13, 11:16am
I have to say I'm sorry for your stress, kitten, but not sorry that toxic place laid you off. It sounded like it was killing you --- sometimes things happen for a very good reason.
Hoping you land in a better place where you feel valued, have more fun, fewer idiots (there are always a couple) and overall a less stressful life. That stuff'll kill you faster than any germ.
Good luck, kitten! I think you'll find that once you are in a healthier work environment you are MUCH happier and more productive. I was pretty productive in my job-that-became-a-HSSJ, but that was because I had a serious commitment to the mission. Now I am in a place where I am committed to the mission AND they treat me (and everyone else) reasonably well. Sure, there are little ups and downs like any workplace, but to be away from the serious levels of dysfunction that the other place had is such a blessing.
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