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Xmac
1-19-12, 12:46am
I've been noticing that Ego is viewed this way.

Isn't Ego what is? A web of interwoven ideas that enables the grand façade, a beneficent "agent" that facilitates the escape from nothingness. Is it not the yin that enables the yang, it's dualistic counterpart?

Two cool quotes:

'It's all been a big misunderstanding, to me the ego is a beautiful thing'. -Byron Katie

"The biggest ego trip going is getting rid of the ego". -Alan Watts

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ftZ3UCdTuWQ

creaker
1-19-12, 8:19am
I don't think ego itself is the problem - it's the competition between some to have the biggest and gaudiest one.

catherine
1-19-12, 9:11am
I've been noticing that Ego is viewed this way.

Is it not the yin that enables the yang, it's dualistic counterpart?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ftZ3UCdTuWQ

So, the journey to no-self is not the elimination of the ego, but fusion of it with Oneness? Or with something else?? Is that it? ??

Xmac
1-19-12, 11:00am
So, the journey to no-self is not the elimination of the ego, but fusion of it with Oneness? Is that it?

In the fusion, it appears to disappear. Well, that's one way of "seeing" it.

Rogar
1-19-12, 2:36pm
I don't know if "ego" has the same meaning to everyone, but I tend associate ego with self importance, selfishness, and materialism, which gets in the way of compassion and spiritualism.

“It is the nature of the ego to take, and the nature of the spirit to share.” old proverb

"The ultimate aim of the ego is not to see something, but to be something." Muhammed Iqbal

Xmac
1-20-12, 12:06am
Rogar, I regard the ego as the exaggerated "I". Shyness, low self esteem, self pity and unworthiness are also ego as well as the ones you mentioned which are frequently used as compensation for the ones I mentioned. As I see it, it is an unbalanced or confused view of a self that is separate, isolated and vulnerable, in varying degrees.

In the quote that says that the nature of ego is to take, it is worth remembering that taking enables the beautiful feeling of giving: no taking, no giving.

The ego kindly projects our truth on to others until we're ready to face it...ahh I mean, see it.

JaneV2.0
1-20-12, 3:03pm
From the top of my head, I propose that ego is the material (earthly) expression of one's soul.

Xmac
1-22-12, 11:12pm
From the top of my head, I propose that ego is the material (earthly) expression of one's soul.

I like it.......ahhhh...that is this ego does.

puglogic
1-23-12, 6:35pm
My ego is what gives me the impetus to project my gifts, my strengths, and my kindness out into the world - into a world that needs everyone to do that. If I can be head-over-heels in love with this Self I have ended up with, I think I can generate a great deal of love outside myself. No evil here.

Xmac
1-24-12, 1:14am
If I can be head-over-heels in love with this Self I have ended up with, I think I can generate a great deal of love outside myself. No evil here.

Puglogic, I may ask you if I can quote you on my Facebook page.
Especially the "head over heels" has a very strong resonance with me.

puglogic
1-24-12, 2:31pm
With my blessings. I should add that it is very hard to do. Our puritan ethic tends to frown on people who "think highly of themselves," which is how this is often interpreted. Imagine a world where we all felt an abiding love for ourselves and for the unique gifts we have to offer?

Spartana
1-24-12, 4:14pm
I regard the ego as the exaggerated "I". Shyness, low self esteem, self pity and unworthiness are also ego

I agree, and think these are the more self-centered, self-focused, negative aspects of the ego because they serve no purpose. A person wallowing in self pity and low self esteem - even shyness - is doing nothing but focusing on themselves, and what others think of them, and waiting for others to lift them up by telling them they are worthy. Where as a person who has an ego based on things like self-love, self-agrandiation, self-respect, and self-worth often lift themselves up to a higher calling. They use the ego as a great motivator to achieve something beyond ourselves. Even when the "reason" the person does something is ego-driven by things like a desire for glory and praise rather than more altruistic reasons, they still use it as a motivator to achieve something beyond themselves rather than climb inside their shell and hide - thinking only of themselves and worrying about how other's view them. For instance, a person who chooses to make a change in their lives movivated by their desire appear more worthy or have greater respect from their spouse or child or friends or co-workers, achieves something more valuable compared to a person who wallows in low self esteem, shyness and self pity without doing anything. So whether someone's ego to achieve or change or help others is motivated by the need to feel self-worth for a job well done, or is seeking glory and praise for doing the same thing, it's the end result that matters.

JaneV2.0
1-25-12, 11:49am
With my blessings. I should add that it is very hard to do. Our puritan ethic tends to frown on people who "think highly of themselves," which is how this is often interpreted. Imagine a world where we all felt an abiding love for ourselves and for the unique gifts we have to offer?

I like this, and I think John Lennon would as well.

Xmac
1-25-12, 2:00pm
With my blessings. I should add that it is very hard to do. Our puritan ethic tends to frown on people who "think highly of themselves," which is how this is often interpreted. Imagine a world where we all felt an abiding love for ourselves and for the unique gifts we have to offer?

I agree with JaneV2.0. Puglogic your killing me softly.

catherine
1-25-12, 5:05pm
Is there a difference between loving ourselves and loving the God within? I agree that "love is the answer" as John Lennon would say, but an ego-love is different than a love of the Divine that flows through you. That's what I think anyway, in my humble opinion.

ETA: Seems that there's a distinction between "ego" and "self".. this description from Swami Shraddhananda

The ego has to be trained to dissociate itself from whatever ideas of attachment come into the mind. This is a very difficult task, but if we gradually train the ego through spiritual identification, the ego can then be detached enough to take up these negating practices. Do these negations lead to emptiness? No. They eventually lead to the discovery of the Self, which is beyond both affirmation and negation. Then the ego will discover that its true nature has always been in timeless Existence, Consciousness, and Bliss—the vast tranquillity and freedom that is the Self. Not for a single moment were we ever dissociated from That.

The experience of the Self is quite different from the experience of the ego. It does not have to take the form of "I am." For the sake of contemplation we have to use such language as "I am of the nature of eternal bliss, eternal knowledge," but in actual experience there is no question of "I." The actual experience cannot be described in the language of the ego.

Why? Because the Self is not something that stands outside of myself; the Self is my true nature, the eternal subject of all experience. We cannot express the Self as an idea or in words, in the way that we can express a concept or describe an external object. This is why Vedanta says, "neti, neti"—not this, not this. The Self can never be known as I know an external object; the seeker is the Self. When the veil of ego identification has been removed, the seeker finds that the Self was always there. Though the ego can point to the Self, the Self is, in fact, revealed only by Its own nature, and that experience is unspeakable.

puglogic
1-26-12, 10:28am
I love that, Catherine. I suppose, if I search my heart for what I believe, that the "gifts" I speak of might be nothing other than the Divine flowing through us. I don't feel as if I own them in any way - I didn't ask for them, I didn't buy them. I might have unearthed them, but their root was always inside me, waiting. When I pour love into my life and community, it feels like a pure form of energy that passes through me like rain. Good food for thought as I start my day :D

With gratitude that I can be here for yet another day, and all of the ten thousand tiny miracles that it will hold.

madgeylou
1-26-12, 1:12pm
great discussion.

i like how ken wilbur talks about the ego not as something to be given up, but as something to be transcended and included as we continue to evolve.

i see my ego as my avatar in the world. i need it to function in the world, to make goals and achieve them, to make decisions.

what's problematic is 2 things:
(1) the ego sees itself as fixed, never changing, never any need to change, when in reality we are more like rivers than rocks
(2) the ego sees itself as the only valid lens through which reality can be experienced, the only valid perspective

so i think we need the ego, we need to be able to inhabit it and use it in the world. but we also need to be able to step into a wider perspective that sees how small the ego actually is, and not allow ourselves to be limited by it.

it's an evolutionary artifact, one that we will continue to transcend and include and build upon as we continue to evolve.

chord_ata
1-28-12, 1:28pm
The "Satan" is the culture that worships the ego concept as the end all, thus encouraging over-use of the ego beyond its useful place, and not explaining how to understand the limits of the ego, and how to manage life with those limits.

Xmac
1-28-12, 2:00pm
When I pour love into my life and community, it feels like a pure form of energy that passes through me like rain. Good food for thought as I start my day :D

With gratitude that I can be here for yet another day, and all of the ten thousand tiny miracles that it will hold.

:):+1: