View Full Version : Volunteering in now a requirement
As part of our new "review" system at work, volunteering is becoming part of what we are scored upon. I take issue with this because 1. There are 15 people in my group and I was the only one to show up at several events over the past few months, with no one taking notice. I mentioned it but I was shut down,quicly 2. Volunteering- from my understand, this means IF you feel it in your heart. Mandartory volunteering time doesn't sit right with me. I have young son and I volunteer through several of his activities in the town I live in. To add more activities, in a town I don't live in, having to drive 20-30 miles one way, I just see as unfair.I also work up to 60 hours a week, as is. Many of the other supervisors cut out of work early. Yes, I know, a messed up place I work at but I have to deal with this, for now. Has anyone been through this before? I feel like a fake if I was forced to do something I can't put my full heart behind.
Sounds hypocritical to me. Volunteering is...well, voluntary. Not mandatory. If their intent is that their employees engage in some kind of community service, it should take under consideration any they are already engaged with, like what you do with your son. If they're picking and choosing where you volunteer (a pet project of theirs?) that seems unethical.
Yes, they are picking and choosing.:0! And I work for a faith based organization, which floors me. But the water cooler grumblings is they push their agenda a little bit too much. I find it sad because I am actively seeking another job. I love the people I work with and I think if they could get rid of the dictatorship way of doing things, it could be a great hospital.
Document the volunteering you do/have done, in writing (email), and ask if these are "acceptable" and if not, what is.
ApatheticNoMore
1-28-13, 12:11pm
It seems to me if volunteering is forced as part of work it should be on work hours that you are paid for. So instead of doing work one day a year or whatever, you all go out and build houses for the homeless or work in a food kitchen or whatever. I could still see plenty of legitimate objections to this (I'm paid to do work in my career, not this!), but frankly personally I'd welcome it as a change of pace! And while I've never worked anywhere like that, I have at least heard of companies doing stuff like this, I've never heard of the must volunteer on your own time thing at work. Now there was a program to give people who volunteer on their own time verbal recognition once at work, but who really cares about that, and it wasn't anymore than verbal recognition it wasn't anything you were evaluated on. And I never entered because the things I was involved in seemed too fringy, and little cared. Forcing volunteering on *top* of a 60 hour week just sounds completely insane. If what is unofficially (not policy but what's actually going on) rewarded there is leaving early and showing up to all the volunteering gigs, maybe you should just do that :)
sweetana3
1-28-13, 12:14pm
All you had to say is "faith based" organization. Although big companies like Eli Lilly have service days. However, huge numbers participate on company time and are paid. It is more for PR.
I agree with creaker. Document and in writing. It was unacceptable for them to shut you down for stating a fact.
Well, I guess I am the only one to open my mouth about it. It's not that I don't want to help the local community but not everyone lives there. We have leaders with 3-4 kids, How the heck are they going to find the time? And personally, I have some physical issues that prevent me from doing things like builds. And then there are some organizations that I just don't want to give my time too- I know that sounds horrible but I like to have my say where my time goes. It's the whole holding it over our heads on our reviews that is killing me.
And no, they won't let us be paid for it. I barely have enough time at work to grab lunch, let alone add another "thing" to my plate. I am already doing 3 jobs, as they never replaced 2 people who left. I think they are headed down a dangerous path. The other big issue is the administrative executives never come to these events. Really? Set the example people.
ApatheticNoMore
1-28-13, 12:33pm
Although big companies like Eli Lilly have service days. However, huge numbers participate on company time and are paid. It is more for PR.
yea that's the kind of thing I've heard about.
Square Peg
1-28-13, 12:38pm
That is ridiculous. Hope you can find a new job soon!
I would find that very objectionable.
Wow.
How much 'volunteer' time are they 'requiring'?
The one faith based sports camp I worked for when they required volunteer events, it was 'turn the message machine on, everyone go, and regular pay'.
Even the church I work for doesn't 'require' me to be at every event, function, or service.
Wow, in my faith, lying is pretty much discouraged. Compulsory volunteering is a form of lying to me, since it's being called volunteer, but it ain't. It's conscripted labor. Is there an HR department involved?
Yes, HR is spear heading the event. :)
When I took this job, I told them I had no issue working for a faith based hospital. My feeling is I can be part of a team with having to push it on people. Well, my first month in, now they want daily huddles, which are great for keeping up with daily/weekly/monthly events. But they force us, as leaders, to say prayers. I am not comfortable with that so I keep it generic and some of my staff will take the lead. I think they should spend more time working on patient issues and care than pushing their religious agenda. I am quite the religious person but it's my choice of where, when and how. To have it interrupt at work is just weird to me and I can say, many patients have a negative reaction to it. It's almost cultish.
Yes, this is abusive. An employer can't compel volunteer time from their employees, because that's called making you work without pay. Being faith-based doesn't make it okay, either!
I would research the employment laws in your state, and check this page at the US Department of Labor -
http://www.dol.gov/elaws/esa/flsa/docs/volunteers.asp
Whether you're a salaried or hourly employee has something to do with this. Most salaried managers, for instance, don't get paid time and-a-half or double-time for working outside their normal shift. I think the idea is that you'll be frequently working more than 8 hours because you're a manager, and your higher salary takes that into account. But it sounds like that's not you. Ha, how revealing that the execs don't come to the events you're being compelled to participate in.
It is one of those touchy situations - others at your organization who also resent being compelled to work without pay, may not be rocking the boat because they want to keep their jobs. Once you start documenting the situation, you're throwing down the gauntlet. If you go up against your employers and make a formal complaint to the state or the Feds or the Attorney General (sometimes it works!) or the hospital board or whoever, you've got to be ready to be told to go take a hike. You're risking everything in a move like this. They may not want to lose you, though, in which case it's possible they'll clean up their act.
But best to have some other irons in the fire just in case, so I applaud your desire to find another job. Sounds like it can't happen too soon!
I am salaried and I do work for every penny I earn. In 8 months, I turned 2 departments around because they needed a good shake down. I have to deal with a supervisor who constantly undermines me. I was told "Well, you need to work it with her" because they don't want to lose her. HUH??? She is a troublemaker and a road block. So, on top of being the bad boss that made the slackers leave, a supervisor who is worthless yet I can't document enough to get her fired and now this, I am at my wits end.
Wow, I sure hope you get an offer somewhere else, and can then give this org some pointed feedback! Especially if patients are uncomfortable. Yuck.
MamaM, on the volunteering issue, you might consider this:
List the groups/places/activities you already volunteer and how much time per week. Get a letter - real paper letter on some sort of organization letterhead, not just an email - from one of the people in charge detailing how long you've been working with said group, frequency of volunteering, how much time (2 hours per week, for example), and what exactly you do. Take to bosses.
Gardenarian
1-28-13, 3:18pm
MamaM - sorry you're having to deal with this. I agree with others - if they want you to volunteer then they must pay you for the time. And I don't see why it should matter whether you put in the time in the town where you work or in your hometown - except that your supervisors came up with this scheme to improve public relations. Total BS. I would not do it.
Well, I guess I am the only one to open my mouth about it. It's not that I don't want to help the local community but not everyone lives there. We have leaders with 3-4 kids, How the heck are they going to find the time? And personally, I have some physical issues that prevent me from doing things like builds. And then there are some organizations that I just don't want to give my time too- I know that sounds horrible but I like to have my say where my time goes. It's the whole holding it over our heads on our reviews that is killing me.
It doesn't sound horrible - I have a fairly active volunteer life, I've built up experience and relationships in particular places. I've won President's Awards. I'd be annoyed as hell if all that didn't matter except for what HR deemed "acceptable".
Blame it on Disney.
I learned some years ago through a work improvement seminar that one Golden Truth of Disney Corp was that employees wanted to volunteer through their workplace. It was an overwhelming percentage at Disney who wished their corporate mommy to arrange volunteeer opportunities for them.
There are many things I feel like saying about this, but I would start with the question: who are these people?
Like the OP, I have several neighborhood and hobby groups that take up all of my volunteeer time. I don't need someone to arrange that for me, for heaven's sake.
I wonder, are we becoming a group of child automatons led by corprate 'n gubmnt group-think?
IshbelRobertson
1-28-13, 5:00pm
There's no way I would fold to this coercive type of behaviour!
Personally I don't see it as that big a deal. I'm sure there is a list of oranizations you already give your time to that would qualify. Volunteering is a means of giving of yourself (time, talent, energy etc...) without expectation of anything in return. Lots of corps expect this of their employees. Our public schools here require so many volunteer hours in order to graduate.
I'd have a problem with someone dictating where I volunteer but if there is a list of places or organizations that are acceptable I don't see a problem with this. If it's a corp event and employees are expected to volunteer so many hours to that, that would be ok as well. It's part of being a part of an organization. I know that I belong to several artist groups that require very specific number of volunteer hours (working for the coop, gallery sitting, PR etc..) of all members. Again it's part of being a part of an organization.
As for what can a mom with kids do? PLenty. I know a single mom with two boys who volunteers once a month with her kids serving meals to the homeless at the local rescue mission. I used to bring all my older daycare kids to trail days to volunteer clearing trails in the state park after a storm.
An additional point to make when presenting the volunteer work you already do is to show that the company's influence moves beyond just the city in which it is situated.
This forced volunteering at only designated places would be the last straw for me. What is the worst that will happen if you get a bad review regarding the volunteer work? Seriously, how soon would they fire you? It sounds like they are squeezing you dry already. Stay strong and keep looking for a new job, you'll find one!
Here is another wrench in the system...the group I work for observe their Holy Day on Saturdays, so we are not allowed to do work or even volunteer on Saturday. If we send an email on Saturday between sundown Friday and sundown on Saturday, we can get in trouble. But for those of us who worship on Sunday, they have no issue with having these events on a Sunday nor sending out work related emails on Sunday. Like I said, I have no problem working for a faith based company but when you start pushing your "rules" on the rest of us, then I have a problem. And no, I never signed anything saying I would abide by these "rules." I think they are a bunch of bullies myself. How can volunteering be mandatory? In my 22 years of healthcare, I have NEVER seen or heard of this. Yes, it was brought up on the bulletin board or a hey, xyz needs volunteers if y'all can swing it but that was it.
Yes, they are picking and choosing the events and places. They don't know what people have going on at home. I work full time, am going back to college, have a young son and a list a mile long of things I would like to do, on top of volunteering already and things are always popping up and changing. I guess my best bet is just to find a new job. It's ludacrious to me.
I honestly think they are using this to weed people out. They have been getting rid of people right and left and not replacing them. We are talking some pretty important patient centered positions that compromise care and safety of patients. We have techs doing jobs that only well skilled nurses should be handling. We have entry level associates doing managerial jobs, not getting the pay and can barely keep their heads above water. And it's do or get out.
treehugger
1-28-13, 7:45pm
I guess my best bet is just to find a new job.
Yes, absolutely. Put all reasonable efforts into this. I don't mean to sound unsympathetic to all the work issues you have brought up (they would bother me, too!), but honestly, at this point, there is no gain for you to fight the system there or even to try to overlook it and just get along. There are too many red flags. Just get out as soon as you can and never look back.
Kara
Thanks everyone..I completely see everyone's point. I just wanted to make sure I wasn't the only one who thought this was a little on the crazy side. I am making an all out effort and something good will happen, always does. :)
I worked for a Catholic college for several years. The students were required to do a "service component" in order to graduate. If I recall correctly, the employees were encouraged to take part in such events as the annual United Way clean-up, service trips to the Third World, etc. but they weren't "mandatory." In fact, that sounds illegal.
I think you are doing the right thing in looking for another job. No one should have to work 60 hours a week IMHO. Never mind the volunteering! Yikes!
ApatheticNoMore
1-30-13, 2:35pm
They have been getting rid of people right and left and not replacing them. We are talking some pretty important patient centered positions that compromise care and safety of patients. We have techs doing jobs that only well skilled nurses should be handling.
They sound like scum, really. Yea, I know you're just working for them now and have to do whatever. And I don't know thier financial position obviously, but when they are cutting staff performing critical lifesaving functions and yet keep on insisting on "do gooder volunteering", they are hypocrites, plain and simple (or maybe a cult). Charity starts at home, at least run the business right especially a business so critical and life or death and quality of life impacting as a hospital!!! Get that right first, their primary mission as an organization, and they will have done good in the world, only after they have that right should they even be thinking about other things. Patients safety put at risk while their out focusing on non-related volunteering activities ... nothing but obscenities come to mind when I think about this.
(hospitals are of course notoriously run badly and cutting critical staff these days ... not my industry, but I know all about the horror stories).
EXACTLY Apathetic- I spend a lot of time with the a patients. They often have questions about bills and charity and their major complaint is care...as in lack of it. I get the brunt because I am the first line of defense.
Well, received the email as to where to volunteer. I wrote my CFO back and told him that I have a 7 year old. I volunteer as a coach for his soccer/baseball team, provide classroom time for his elementary and we offer our time to the VFW in our town 1-2x a month. This is on top of a demanding job, home life, going back to school 3/4 time, and just life in general. I cannot add anything else to my plate and if this will be held against me, so be it. Awaiting an answer. A gal can only take so much before she is pushed over the edge. :devil:
I'm really interested in your boss's reaction!
Good for you MamaM. Sometimes supervisors need a reality check on how much of your life they own.
Well, he is a CFO..big wig in administration. He emailed me back. He told me not to worry about it. Umm..ok? So I won't. Letting go of a lot more things than just the material items this year. :+1:
SOunds to me like they are trying to find a back-handed way of justifying firing people who don't share their faith. If you play your cards right and don't find greener pastures soon, you just might be able to finagle this into a nice unlawful termination settlement or something.
Good luck with your job search, though. I think that is the best way to deal with this -- focus your energies there and on finding the next gig that will make you happy.
lhamo
iris lily
1-31-13, 11:56pm
SOunds to me like they are trying to find a back-handed way of justifying firing people who don't share their faith. If you play your cards right and don't find greener pastures soon, you just might be able to finagle this into a nice unlawful termination settlement or something.
...
lhamo
Why would you say that? Has the OP undergone religious conversion since they hired here a short time ago?
They are pushing their religion more. We had to sit through "training" to understand their beliefs and how to explain their differences and beliefs to patients, associates, etc. But it was a very one sided conversation. I had a lot of patients complain that while they like the idea of a hospital maybe praying for them or keeping them in their thoughts and being out in the community, they don't want to have a particular religion preached at them, whether they agree with it, don't agree, abstain, whatever the reason is. The old timers who has come to the hospital for years are complaining that it's even too much.
Is there some kind of human rights organization at the city or state level that can hear a complaint about this hospital?
ToomuchStuff
2-1-13, 1:22am
They are pushing their religion more. We had to sit through "training" to understand their beliefs and how to explain their differences and beliefs to patients, associates, etc. But it was a very one sided conversation. I had a lot of patients complain that while they like the idea of a hospital maybe praying for them or keeping them in their thoughts and being out in the community, they don't want to have a particular religion preached at them, whether they agree with it, don't agree, abstain, whatever the reason is. The old timers who has come to the hospital for years are complaining that it's even too much.
I expect a lot more of it to be happening, personally. I would also eventually, expect more of the help to be in that religion, as the religious exemption lawsuits against the medical mandates continue.
I recommend that you ask for an alternative --
tell them that you already volunteer your time, and you'd be happy to provide documentation to that effect for the work that you already do, and that you would like that to be counted as your "volunteering hours."
inform them that you do not have extra time to take on extra volunteering work, as it would take away from your family time (this should be important to a faith-based organization).
If it's truly going to be required in review, just have people for whom you volunteer write letters expressing how many hours you volunteer with them, and hopefully, it will count.
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