So what is the answer for health care?

[catherine]

Gregg, I totally agree with you with a caveat. I totally agree that prevention should be key. And I also believe that healthcare should cover alternative treatments like acupuncture. The main problem is human nature. Knowledge about how we should act is not a great predictor for how we *will* act. I can't remember where I read it, but just recently I was reading some health expert who was asked why people don't act on what we know, and basically it's because we are geared for immediate gratification. So as long as those impulses are ratified by advertising, the culture, and our own desires, money towards education will probably go down the drain.

I've worked in companies where we would get bonuses for using the gym X number of times, and personally, that didn't incentivize me enough. People *know* they shouldn't drink too much, but they do. People *know* they should quit smoking, but they don't. I'm going to jump on Alan's side here and say that personal responsibility, along with a moment of grace in the form of an "aha' moment is generally the most effective change agent when it comes to healthy habits.

But education doesn't hurt. And some public service campaigns definitely have helped change people for the better. And I definitely on board with the fact that the more a healthy lifestyle is encouraged and catches hold, the fewer healthcare services we'll need.

[Tammy]

Well then, I spoke before I knew what I was talking about.

[Teacher Terry]

Many diseases can be prevented but also some people inherit certain medical conditions no matter how good care they take of themselves. OUr insurance company offered us a free fitbit & $ off our monthly premium if you were overweight & used the fitbit to complete nutrition & exercise challenges. Well it really inspired me to make a lot of changes. I was exercising but not enough & eating too much. Now with the tracker I can see all day how many steps I take, what level of exertion, track my calories & even figure out in advance if I will be eating out what the foods are at various restaurants. That way I can make a good choice before I get there. Also some restaurants will serve the very same food-in same quantities etc & the calories can vary by triple. It was a real eye opener. I went from walking 6,000 steps/day to 12,000 and lost 12 lbs in 7 weeks. My big dog is loving it because some days we go on a walk 2 or 3x's. At age 60 I had given up on losing weight thinking I was doing the right things but I was not doing enough of them. This little device has been so motivating.

[ToomuchStuff]

There is a lot of effort already put into education and preventative. That is countered by the tv ad's for sugar, drugs, etc. etc. etc. (aka why do something hard, do something easy, take this pill). People still look for the magic diet and exercise pill.

I also view preventative a little different though. I grew up with a father working for a company with incredible health insurance. The littlest sniffle and one would traditionally get dragged in (started to change as kids got older). Part of that was I am sure, new mother syndrome (with little kids close together), but letting ones get sick, also helps build up the immune system. Now days, people can't do what was done back then for the most part, but they still do it in part (see a lot of the antibacterialing everything type of parent).

[catherine]

OUr insurance company offered us a free fitbit & $ off our monthly premium if you were overweight & used the fitbit to complete nutrition & exercise challenges. Well it really inspired me to make a lot of changes. I was exercising but not enough & eating too much. Now with the tracker I can see all day how many steps I take, what level of exertion, track my calories & even figure out in advance if I will be eating out what the foods are at various restaurants. That way I can make a good choice before I get there. Also some restaurants will serve the very same food-in same quantities etc & the calories can vary by triple. It was a real eye opener. I went from walking 6,000 steps/day to 12,000 and lost 12 lbs in 7 weeks. My big dog is loving it because some days we go on a walk 2 or 3x's. At age 60 I had given up on losing weight thinking I was doing the right things but I was not doing enough of them. This little device has been so motivating.

Congratulations! I've heard the fitbit really does motivate people to step up their walking (excuse the pun). That is really fantastic! You doubled your walking--something you were doing anyway, and had great results. That's awesome! I remember when my kids were acting in NY, I'd spend my time waiting for them to get out of rehearsal by just walking around the City. Not trying to lose weight--just enjoying the sights, the stores, the people, etc. Well, the weight dripped off me. I had a size 4 skirt that was too small when I bought it, but too big after 3 months in NY.

I also do think that the laws requiring calorie information on menus is very, very enlightening and motivating. The first time I sat down at a restaurant in CA after the law was passed, I couldn't believe how calorie-ridden 80% of the menu was!! Even the salads were 800 calories. The "healthy" choices were 600 calories.

So, you bring up two great points in support of Gregg's argument.

[ApatheticNoMore]

If you live long enough odds are you will need significant medical care regardless of how well you take care of yourself (the odds of being perfectly healthy if you live to 95 for instance are small and perhaps mostly down to genes ...).

As for there being enough education around as is: no there's not! I didn't know about grass fed beef (*IF* one eats beef EVER that is) until I read the Omnivore's Dilemma, nor much about that approach to food raising. I didn't know certain foods were highly effective in preventing cancers (mostly very specific fruits and vegetables) until I read about them (Anti-cancer etc.). I didn't know that what I may well be tasting in most processed food was the natural or artificial flavor until I read an article about it (Eric Schlosser). But no one can know everything? Obviously. But it's lacking ENOUGH understanding to be suspicious of the processed food system and know why most processed food should be avoided. And it's deliberately so? I suspect so. Meanwhile what is taught is that healthy food tastes blah and unappealing but people should be forcing it down. The very advertisements teach it. But whole cultures eat healthier diets and don't find the food unappealing (now one's food preferences were to some degree perhaps formed early in life - so some tastes may be cultural - but there are definitely eating patterns from other cultures for home cooked foods even the average American would enjoy that are healthier).

But people will do unhealthy things even if they know better? I question how much they actually know. Do they really know that if they improved their diets they could maybe get off some of their medicines? I think in most cases they don't. That knowledge is often NOT mainstream. I mean are dietary approaches to not just preventing but curing heart disease, types II diabetes, etc. mainstream? I think knowledge is more powerful than it's given credit for .... but, but people still do things they know they shouldn't? Yes well, it's probably a psychological matter, that's my guess, though it's seldom acknowledged as being so. People do it because they are in pain and they aren't able to/ don't know how to prevent short term aspects of the psyche from dominating in those circumstances. Ack: shame, embarrassment, inferiority, boredom, purposelessness, angst, fear, bad memories, darkness, melancholy, depression, anger (but don't know how to express it constructively), stress, pressure, worry, regret etc.. - I know a piece of cake, a Sneakers bar from the vending machine, potato chips etc. - that will make it all better ...

As for the kids? I see them mostly as hopelessly screwed. What in the food supply isn't hopelessly screwed these days and getting worse? But if they were really taught about food it would be darn near subversive! Put processed food companies out of business. Oh and they would also be need to be taught to cook.

[catherine]

As for the kids? I see them mostly as hopelessly screwed. What in the food supply isn't hopelessly screwed these days and getting worse? But if they were really taught about food it would be darn near subversive! Put processed food companies out of business. Oh and they would also be need to be taught to cook.

Coincidentally, I just closed out of this window and opened up my Facebook page the first thing I saw was this--a documentary called "Free Range Child: Raising Children Connected to the Earth & Their Food" Looks promising…

http://www.filmsforaction.org/watch/...lm-sneak-peek/

[SteveinMN]

As for there being enough education around as is: no there's not!

Oh, ANM, most folks are nowhere near your level of understanding of nutrition. Pretty much any health-provider's office and numerous Web sites, popular magazines, and social-services locations post advice on how to eat better. Maybe not at the lofty level you're at, but even something as simple as "make meat a condiment" can move the needle quite a lot.

While the basic education exists, though, so much of the rest of the system makes it harder to act on the lessons.

Those tasteless apples and carrot sticks offered as "healthy alternatives" to so many commercial meals? Ick. Maybe if the choice were a cookie or juicy mango slices or a bag of chips or fresh berries, the good stuff would stand half a chance. But food grown primarily for its transportability? It certainly doesn't encourage anyone to eat better.

Processed food is cheaper to buy and keeps longer than whole food. A family of five can buy a pound of grass-fed ground beef for $8-9 or mystery-meat "wieners" for $2 a pound. The ground beef will go bad quickly if it's not used or frozen, and will require time to prep before it's even cooked. The weiners? They'll keep for weeks and the toughest part of prep is taking them out of the wrapper. What's the choice if you're time-pinched between two jobs and/or running kids around to and from activities/day care?

And many times the choices are illusory. Anyone downing glass after glass of orange juice is taking in as much sugar as a pop drinker. Many commercially-sold salads are full of calories of cheese and greasy croutons or bathed in dressing. Yes, some of that is education. But some of that well could be having the salad-maker ask if cheese/croutons/dressing are wanted on the salad.

Ack: shame, embarrassment, inferiority, boredom, purposelessness, angst, fear, bad memories, darkness, melancholy, depression, anger (but don't know how to express it constructively), stress, pressure, worry, regret etc.. - I know a piece of cake, a Sneakers bar from the vending machine, potato chips etc. - that will make it all better ...

Truer than you know: article in The Guardian about why (poor) people make the choices they do by someone who lives it. Not that Tirado can represent millions perfectly and not that she has no responsibility for her choices, but...

As for the kids? I see them mostly as hopelessly screwed. What in the food supply isn't hopelessly screwed these days and getting worse? But if they were really taught about food it would be darn near subversive! Put processed food companies out of business. Oh and they would also be need to be taught to cook.

The children's menu at most restaurants is a travesty -- the same overprocessed choices which, for many, form preferences which persist into adulthood. Why did "home ec" disappear from most school curricula?

And I'd be careful about calling out "processed food" companies. Beans in a can are processed food. Whole-wheat flour is a processed food. And so many of the brands some of us have trusted, like Cascadian Farm, Annie's, and Muir Glen, are now owned by those very same "processed-brand" companies.

People would be much better off simply making their own chili instead of buying it in a can or take-out, without worrying about bean GMOs, BPA in the cans, and whether the beef is grass-fed or corn-fed. There's time for that later.

[mira]

I think part of the poor-nutrition problem has to do with overanalysing foods and relying on science rather than intuition when it comes to what we eat. The abundance of cheap, processed, food-like substances doesn't help either...

[Teacher Terry]

Thanks Catherine! Walking is really the only kind of exercise I enjoy & I will do it no matter how bad the weather is. After living in Wis a good part of my life it is never to cold to walk outside here. Also some health conditions are hereditary no matter what. Everyone on my Mom's side of the family gets HBP usually in their 30's although no one was fat & unhealthy. I didn't get it until 50 but I think that was because I was exercise walking fast 4-6 miles a day in addition to the normal walking around I did to get thru the day. My Mom said that she did not think the baby boomers would live as long as her generation mainly because of all the processed foods.