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Thread: So Why Do We Have (Or Want) To Be The Big Dog?

  1. #81
    Helper Gregg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yossarian View Post
    I don't think the issue is the security of the US. It's more what kind of world do you want to live in. Sure you can say **** the neighborhood and stock up on M855, but it's not irrational to want to keep the neighboors daughter from being raped. The number of deer hunters in the Midwest doesn't let you influence who stands against ISIS or who gets to vote in Kiev.
    Exactly the reason(s) no one is proposing eliminating our military. The notion of protecting our people and assets has been hashed out already. There is still a need for that, its just a matter of finding a sane and sustainable level.

    When it comes to humanitarian efforts and working to thwart groups, like ISIS, who don't seem to operate with the same moral compass as the rest of us it would be nice to see the US as part of a larger force. Part of it, rather than the de facto leader and provider of the force who may or may not receive additional support from the rest of the world. The UN is a good idea, its just not operated very sensibly and is too disproportionate to be valuable to most of the world. Plus the forces tend to be heavily skewed with US troops or we simply send troops to areas in addition to UN forces. If that changed the US could still play a part in stopping genocide and other atrocities around the world, just as a supporting player rather than the constant point man and there could be more leadership from the areas that are most effected.
    Last edited by Gregg; 3-26-15 at 12:30pm.
    "Back when I was a young boy all my aunts and uncles would poke me in the ribs at weddings saying your next! Your next! They stopped doing all that crap when I started doing it to them... at funerals!"

  2. #82
    Senior Member bae's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yossarian View Post
    Sure you can say **** the neighborhood and stock up on M855, but it's not irrational to want to keep the neighboors daughter from being raped.
    That's not what I said, of course...

    I simply recommended a drastic cut in the amount of $$$ we throw at the problem, and a more forward-looking approach to the compostition of our force.

    Besides, M855 sucks, though I do have about 25,000 rounds of XM1022, M20, M8, M903, and M2 sitting around the place somewhere.

  3. #83
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    Agreeing with you Gregg.
    And can we reiterate that all of the cost for the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan - All of it - has been done with borrowed money? The impact on our ability to do Everything Else in our society has been severely limited because of this tremendous debt.
    Not sustainable by any means.

  4. #84
    Senior Member bae's Avatar
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    I don't have any problem in general with "borrowed money". If you look at what "money" is in the USA anyways, it's all created from borrowing, there's no actual "money" there anymore. Still, it works for us, and allows us to expand the money supply as needed for a growing population/economy. Well, it would, if you trusted the people controlling the knobs.

    In specific though, if we're going to go into further "debt", I'd rather have us borrow the money to build schools, roads, bridges, railways, hospitals, fire/police stations, and other stupid infrastructure thingies. Things with some enduring value that produce network effects.

  5. #85
    Helper Gregg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bae View Post
    In specific though, if we're going to go into further "debt", I'd rather have us borrow the money to build schools, roads, bridges, railways, hospitals, fire/police stations, and other stupid infrastructure thingies. Things with some enduring value that produce network effects.
    Agreed. In the end its the difference between spending and investing. Wars and their ilk are kind of like taking out a loan to buy fast food. They'll keep [the economy] alive for now, but will probably do more harm than good in the long run. The other 'stupid infrastructure thingies' can produce a very tangible return over a very long period of time. The interstate highway system, for example, is coming on 60 years old. If we pay for the new generation of such things by selling China more 30 year T-bills (borrowing) we get the benefit of 30 years inflation before the debt comes due, which likely negates the interest, and another 30 years use after its paid for as a bonus. That's a good investment. War? Not so much.
    "Back when I was a young boy all my aunts and uncles would poke me in the ribs at weddings saying your next! Your next! They stopped doing all that crap when I started doing it to them... at funerals!"

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