If you could reform welfare type benefits

[flowerseverywhere]

Nope.

If parents spend their stipend on cigarettes, drugs and booze, what happens to the kids?

[flowerseverywhere]

I think if a bunch of rich, old white men smoking cigars behind closed doors in Washington D.C. had dreamed up a plan to make a huge class of people dependent on them, with such a victim mentality that they would never pose a threat to the status quo, they couldn't come up with a better plan that the welfare state. After a generation or two of believing that the responsibility for housing, food, health care, and other basic human necessities can be provided only by the government, there is no incentive to rise above this basic level. The children of the welfare state have an extremely difficult time breaking out of the cycle...they see no incentive. That's why I'd like to see the system re-worked in such a way that recipients are rewarded for working, with affordable day care, without getting food stamps or Medicaid cut if they work extra hours and make more money. And, re: restricting certain foods you can buy on food stamps: if WIC can restrict certain foods, why is that any different?

Intersting theory. People like me would want more stuff and a nice bank account so I would work for it. Unknown how many people would feel like me. Probably most of the people here.

[flowerseverywhere]

Here's one reform: In polygamist towns like Colorado City it is common for the "wives" (wives in name only, not legally married) to claim they are single parents and in need of SNAP and other benefits. They are awarded these benefits which then allows the patriarchs to continue these fake marriages and continue reproduction of 10, 20 or 30 children per adult male. You the taxpayer are generously supporting all of this. Yet any crackdown is seen as being anti-religious. That's a reform I see that needs to happen.

that sounds terrible. Why I hate organized religion. Have as many kids as you want if you are willing to support them.

[Rogar]

It seems to me like there could be a match between the underemployed and infrastructure improvement, maybe a little like the CCC. I"m sure there are plenty of people on the government gravy train, but plenty of others who would just like a decent respectable job and maybe learn some usable trade skills.

[Chicken lady]

I help at the food bank. One source of our food is food donated by grocery stores. The grocery stores get a government write off for the food. The margin on donuts and bread is very high. We get tons of donated "day old" baked goods. Sometimes the "day old" baked goods are a week old - the stores first try to sell them on their discount racks. Sometimes they have started to go moldy, sometimes they are smashed or the wrappers are torn. Many many unsold cakes and stale donuts. We have to sign for the full number or we get nothing.

we get very little produce. The margin on produce us very thin and I guess the government is stingy with it's "per pound" credit. Usually stores keep the produce until it is nearly compost. Then people don't take it. If you are already dealing with the challenges of poverty, you do not have the energy to cut the small usable piece off of 27 green peppers in order to cook food.

one of the other volunteers made me angry last week. He's solid suburban middle class. Plays golf regularly, good church going fellow. We close at 7. A man in a three tone (plus rust and primer) sedan with taped seats arrived at 7:02 to get food for a family of three. He was dirty not in the "unwashed" sense, but in the "I have been doing physical labor that involves dirt and grease" sense. We went back inside to fill his order. And after he left, this volunteer (who is sometimes late for his shift) shook his head in disgust and said "you give away free food and people can't even be bothered to get here on time to get it."

I thought, "you've never wanted for anything in your life, have you?"

we had a woman come in who was riding with a friend. They had been applying for jobs all day. The woman said she was trying to figure out how she was going to feed her kids over the summer, and I told her about the library lunch program. She said that sounded really nice, but she doesn't have a car and can't drive. There is no public transportation out here, so those jobs are non-starters. Even if she gets one, she will only be able to show up if her friend is at the same place, on the same schedule, and not sick.

i have lived in areas where all the kids went to church camp in the summer because it was free, the bus came through their neighborhood and picked them up and returned them, and camp included food. I once expressed surprise that a woman I knew had sent her child to a particular preschool. She said "they had an opening. Right now, I would send him to jack the ripper's preschool if they had an opening."

so, in my community, I would buy the library a bus and gasoline (or better, an electric bus and increase funding for their electric bill) I would create a better source and distribution system for fresh produce. the bigger the system, the more it is going to malfunction.

[catherine]

I thought, "you've never wanted for anything in your life, have you?"


so, in my community, I would buy the library a bus and gasoline (or better, an electric bus and increase funding for their electric bill) I would create a better source and distribution system for fresh produce. the bigger the system, the more it is going to malfunction.

You raise two good points..

1) Yes, people who have never walked in the other's shoes sometimes find it hard to empathize or understand. That's why often the poor are the most generous. I was meeting my DD for lunch yesterday, as she was driving from a photo shoot in Brooklyn back up to Burlington. When she was waiting to get through the tunnel, a homeless guy was weaving through the cars that were waiting in line. My daughter's window was open so she was a great target.

A man approached her and started talking to her, and asked if he could sing her a song, and she let him. Then she said, are you looking for money? And he said, "yes, miss anything you might want to give me!" So she got her wallet out and started fumbling for some money--she had no bills, and so she opened up her change purse and started to pull out the last few coins there.

When he saw her fumbling for the change, he said, "No, miss! I don't want to take your last money! I'll go ask someone else." And he left.

Point two about the local efforts: I agree there as well. Assessing the local needs and addressing those is probably the best way to go. How that breaks out on a federal level, I'm not sure. When I worked at a food bank, it was through the church. We would pick up the food from a county distribution warehouse and then bring it to the church, where the surrounding community could come and take it. But frankly, I don't think we got much produce either. I think the answer to that is community gardens. We have several in New Brunswick.

[Aqua Blue]

If parents spend their stipend on cigarettes, drugs and booze, what happens to the kids?

The other side of that is what if all you have is food stamps and your kid really needs a winter coat?

[iris lilies]

If parents spend their stipend on cigarettes, drugs and booze, what happens to the kids?

Please, this is not a concern. Many voices here and elsewhere say this wont take place. Yes, color me skeptical, but there it is.

[Chicken lady]

Look iris lilies, any time you turn food stamps into drug or beer money, you are going to take a hit on the exchange rate. Cash leaves more for food.

[Alan]

Look iris lilies, any time you turn food stamps into drug or beer money, you are going to take a hit on the exchange rate. Cash leaves more for food.

That's true, my brother-in-law buys EBT card balances for <50 cents on the dollar or sometimes with just a case of beer. If his sellers received cash from the government rather than the EBT credits, they could afford more beer as they receive food handouts from extended family and dumpster diving. BIL is then able to use the majority of his $1600 per month disability benefit (for back pain that doesn't exist) for heroin.

Our welfare state funds a thriving black market economy.