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Thread: Cutting down sugar

  1. #51
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    I have realized getting Friday lunch delivered with the group at work is not a good idea. Even salads come with dressings that I suspect have sugar in them. At home I make my own with lemon juice and olive oil. A dry salad is not to my liking. Any food prepared commercially by others is probably not good.
    but that just shows the "it's a social problem" people are probably right, it's not entirely an individual problem. Not when you either socialize with people which may involve things prepared commercially, or you hide all alone in your house all day like an extreme hermit (and I'm a serious introvert and even I've never reached those levels of hermitry) and so you can say all the food you eat is unprocessed as you never go out to eat with others (mostly you eat alone, turn down social invitations because your avoiding all processed food etc.).
    If you want something to get done, ask a busy person. If you want them to have a nervous breakdown that is.

  2. #52
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    Well not everyone gets the lunch ordered in. Some don't for financial reasons. So I am not a hermit yet! I will be eating processed food for Father's Day for instance. But I get your point. A man trying to lose weight told me once it was hard because all socializing involves either eating or drinking alcohol or both.

  3. #53
    Senior Member catherine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ApatheticNoMore View Post
    but that just shows the "it's a social problem" people are probably right, it's not entirely an individual problem. Not when you either socialize with people which may involve things prepared commercially, or you hide all alone in your house all day like an extreme hermit (and I'm a serious introvert and even I've never reached those levels of hermitry) and so you can say all the food you eat is unprocessed as you never go out to eat with others (mostly you eat alone, turn down social invitations because your avoiding all processed food etc.).
    At the same time it's important to realize that socializing is a very healthy activity--not just mentally healthy, but it supports long life. I would never be so stuck to diet dogma that I would give up being with friends or even coworkers. There's that famous study about the town in Pennsylvania, Roseto, where the people smoked, drank, ate all kinds of carbs (the town was nearly 100% Italian) and they all lived well into their 90s and even hundreds. The key variable to their long life was their tightly-knit community.

    I'm an introvert, too, and more than 2 hours at a party seems like prison to me, but I still think life is about balance.
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  4. #54
    Senior Member Williamsmith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by catherine View Post
    At the same time it's important to realize that socializing is a very healthy activity--not just mentally healthy, but it supports long life. I would never be so stuck to diet dogma that I would give up being with friends or even coworkers. There's that famous study about the town in Pennsylvania, Roseto, where the people smoked, drank, ate all kinds of carbs (the town was nearly 100% Italian) and they all lived well into their 90s and even hundreds. The key variable to their long life was their tightly-knit community.

    I'm an introvert, too, and more than 2 hours at a party seems like prison to me, but I still think life is about balance.
    Last night, I attended a pot luck dinner, at my wife's request. She's the social butterfly, I am the pretender. We were seated at a table with two other couples. After the main course everybody brought back dessert. My wife and I brought back a tiny sample in order to be social. Not that we both didn't want all the sweets that were available. The other two couples arrived with a plateful of each dessert that was offered. I thought, "Wow, these people are heavy, no wonder." Then the conversation turned to blood sugar readings. Each of the other four had diabetes, each was on medication and each had recent readings that scared the heck out of me yet they were devouring this sugar and chasing it down with wine.

    As we left, I asked my wife if she thought it was strange that people could sit and eat tons of sugary desserts while they talked about their chronic diabetes problems. I thought is was very odd.

  5. #55
    Senior Member JaneV2.0's Avatar
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    Roseto has long been one of my favorite examples of how the "rules" can be rubbish. (I bet they ate mostly homemade meals, and I know they liked their red wine.)

    I can usually find something to eat that fits my needs, but I will want a bowl of pho from time to time, or Ethiopian injera, and the macros be damned.

    I see by this morning's weigh-in that I'm losing 2# a month, not one. So that's something...

  6. #56
    Senior Member catherine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Williamsmith View Post

    As we left, I asked my wife if she thought it was strange that people could sit and eat tons of sugary desserts while they talked about their chronic diabetes problems. I thought is was very odd.
    Having interviewed thousands of doctors and patients dealing with "lifestyle" diseases, it's very complex--the relationship people have with their food. I did one study with a psychologist and we worked jointly on a project with people who had Type II diabetes and kidney disease. Some said that they did everything they could to help themselves, but their actions clearly contradicted that. Some were blatant about just wanting to "eat, drink and be merry" no matter what the consequences were. Very, very few had made the radical changes necessary to turn their health around. My own husband has diabetes, and he still eats pretty much the way he always ate. And he considers walking a few blocks to be a real hardship, although he has no physical reason that should be so.

    It's a struggle to make those changes. Doctors I speak with get emotional about their helplessness in getting patients to change behavior, and their emotions run from compassion to outright disdain. Our relationship with food is a really complex and interesting phenomena.
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  7. #57
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    oh the social stuff, so hard. I started eating significantly different than my family before I went to college. It has been hard, as long as I am in my 'tribe' it is good, but moving in and out of that group makes for challenges. So I am the one meditator who will have a diet soda now and then. Heck most of them hardly eat sugar! And then with my family I can't eat everything very often. There is always something I can eat and I bring things to events. Often my food barely gets eaten unless my sister points out to her in-laws what it is and encourages them to try it. My mother also does not really believe in food sensitivities. So I have heard her tell my kids that I just refuse food, sigh. I know they try but the family bonding that comes from shared food is impacted.

    Over winter break my parents visited and my mom got angry because I was 'picking on' Iowa, my brother and I talked on the phone about how his neighbors do not like spicy food, only one tried his chocolate chip cookies with a touch of cayenne. I kinda snapped and told her they have been making a joke of my food for 30 years, including the night before at a restaurant. I am stubborn and not really great at making friends so it is okay that I am more stubborn about my food than bonding over food. Heck at least I think my DR likes me! I don't secretly eat junk and then go in complaining. He finally told me I didn't need the cholesterol test so often, I was worried about a family history, but I didn't get it and I have been veggie on and off for many years.

    Update: my weight is fluctuating, however I have been able to work on my sugar and it is under the recommended for 3 days now. I noticed that even though I fluctuate up by the end of the day I am starting off with my early morning weight being lower and feeling less like I am starving when I wake up.

  8. #58
    Senior Member JaneV2.0's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Williamsmith View Post
    ...

    As we left, I asked my wife if she thought it was strange that people could sit and eat tons of sugary desserts while they talked about their chronic diabetes problems. I thought is was very odd.
    Not so odd, really, when you find out that diabetes "educators" regularly push high-carbohydrate diets on their clients. Have you ever looked at a magazine aimed at diabetics? They usually have some extreme dessert on the cover. They counsel people to eat 3 meals a day, at 60 carbs per, plus snacks with more carbohydrates. Often their charges end up on insulin, at which point it's "carb up and shoot up." One might think they're afraid of losing business if people get a real education in the dangers of high carbohydrate diets.

    An Australian doctor, Gary Fettke, is an orthopedic surgeon who was so dismayed at having to perform amputations on diabetic patients that he started counseling them on the merits of LCHF eating. As a result an anonymous (read cowardly) complaint was filed by the Australian Health Practitioner Registration Agency, and he was told in no uncertain terms to back down. As a result, APHRA itself is being investigated by the government. But Fettke is still silenced. This has happened elsewhere. In Sweden, Dr. Annika Dahlqvist took a similar stand, was investigated and acquitted, and now LCHF is an accepted dietary choice there.

  9. #59
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    people at work will be eating donuts on friday and I'll be like "good grief, who actually eats donuts?". But more of these people are thin than anything (it probably helps that many are young). But donuts have to be the most unhealthy thing ever created. It's not really possible to go to a restaurant and avoid processed food because you don't really know all the ingredients, I try my best, I often get something vegetarian, I don't like getting meat at restaurants unless they are the rare place that serves grass fed, organic etc.
    If you want something to get done, ask a busy person. If you want them to have a nervous breakdown that is.

  10. #60
    Senior Member SteveinMN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JaneV2.0 View Post
    Have you ever looked at a magazine aimed at diabetics? They usually have some extreme dessert on the cover. They counsel people to eat 3 meals a day, at 60 carbs per, plus snacks with more carbohydrates. Often their charges end up on insulin, at which point it's "carb up and shoot up." One might think they're afraid of losing business if people get a real education in the dangers of high carbohydrate diets.
    Though I am not, generally, a conspiracy theorist, this one hits home.

    For the last six years or so the medical community has considered me a diet-controlled diabetic. For the last six years or so I have not displayed the symptoms that diabetics are warned about (neuropathy, slow healing, frequent thirst, etc., though I had high blood pressure [now controlled] before the diagnosis and I am overweight). I've blown low 6s on my A1cs for years. I've done it through a low-carb whole-foods diet (I may not get 60 net carbs in during a day) and exercise. It's taken some effort, but I've had the results to prove it.

    The conversation with my doctor a few weeks ago included the dreaded "Our protocol says you should be on a statin" statement. No test beyond the (normal) A1c and a (normal) albumen to verify the need. It's "protocol". I will give my doctor credit for not pushing an oral medication on me and for acknowledging that fat is far less of an enemy than carbs. But I flat-out refused the script, and the more research I've done myself the more I'm convinced it was the right answer.

    I really think the advice is based more on economics (of scale) than the sense it makes for an individual. Even the research I did on statins for people without cardiovascular disease makes the American Diabetes Association look incredible -- like they're afraid the diabetic population will go down and they won't be raking in the $$$$ like they used to.

    Like I said, I'm not typically a conspiracy theorist. But one wonders why they don't address avoiding diabetes the way they addressed quitting smoking. Where are the dire labels on food packages warning consumers about the dangers of HFCS? Where are the cross-media campaigns warning that fruit juice is, for all intents and purposes, just non-fizzy sugar water and not "part of this healthy breakfast" and that you're far better off eating the actual fruit? Instead we get magazines with gooey desserts on the covers and TV shows ("Your dLife!"?). I just find it puzzling. Or maybe I shouldn't when I think about it.
    If Americans expended even a fraction of the energy on civic engagement that we spend on consumer ideology, our democracy would be much healthier. Can you imagine people camping out to vote? -- Charles Roberts, Amherst, Mass., Nov. 25, 2006

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