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Thread: Bernie Sanders/Single Payer Plan

  1. #11
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    If you want good health care, take care of your self. Eat right (let thy food be thy medicine), exercise, don't drink, don't smoke and stop eating sugar. Do you ever listen to the side effects of the prescriptions the medical profession wants us to take. Jesus is my primary physician, all the rest of them are just practicing.

  2. #12
    Senior Member Ultralight's Avatar
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    Bernie is the best!
    I came from a real tough neighborhood. I put my hand in some cement and felt another hand." -- Rodney Dangerfield

  3. #13
    Senior Member bae's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan View Post
    He doesn't have a plan to pay for it, making it no different than the various state initiatives in California, Vermont and Colorado that failed once ideology met reality.
    I was puzzled by this. If California, one of our wealthiest states with a vibrant economy and a good population base, couldn't afford to do it individually, how then would the country as a whole be able to afford it?

  4. #14
    Senior Member Ultralight's Avatar
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    Just gotta tax rich people quite a bit more, then tax the middle class just a wee bit more. Then make a Medicare for all situation.

    This ain't no big mystery. Other nations do this quite successfully.
    I came from a real tough neighborhood. I put my hand in some cement and felt another hand." -- Rodney Dangerfield

  5. #15
    Senior Member Ultralight's Avatar
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    Or we could cut the military budget by half, pay for medicare for all with that. And we'd still be able to be The World Police.
    I came from a real tough neighborhood. I put my hand in some cement and felt another hand." -- Rodney Dangerfield

  6. #16
    Simpleton Alan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bae View Post
    I was puzzled by this. If California, one of our wealthiest states with a vibrant economy and a good population base, couldn't afford to do it individually, how then would the country as a whole be able to afford it?
    I think the entire enterprise is based upon the principle of 'take it from bae', while the reality is there aren't enough bae's around to seal the deal.
    "Things should be made as simple as possible, but not one bit simpler." ~ Albert Einstein

  7. #17
    Senior Member Ultralight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan View Post
    I think the entire enterprise is based upon the principle of 'take it from bae', while the reality is there aren't enough bae's around to seal the deal.
    There aren't? Then how do all the other 30+ nations do it?
    Does Canada have more bae types? Sweden? Australia?

    Cut the crap here. You know this is not about money. It is about will and ideology. Just own up to this. We'll have a more mature debate this way.
    I came from a real tough neighborhood. I put my hand in some cement and felt another hand." -- Rodney Dangerfield

  8. #18
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    the problem with just California doing it isn't necessarily that they couldn't afford it for those who currently reside in California (and actually the estimates were they COULD afford it of course, it didn't fail because of affordability but just because the state legislature voted it down). A potential problem is though that people from other states would flock to California or wherever such a state plan was passed unless you have pretty strict residency requirements (lived somewhere many years at least). Of course California also doesn't have the ability to create money like the Fed gov does.
    If you want something to get done, ask a busy person. If you want them to have a nervous breakdown that is.

  9. #19
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    Cut the crap here. You know this is not about money. It is about will and ideology. Just own up to this
    it's about money to the extent that basic costs at present may very well be too high, but the other nations do control this (and with better lifespans), basically just don't want to pass a plan that doesn't take costs seriously is all.
    If you want something to get done, ask a busy person. If you want them to have a nervous breakdown that is.

  10. #20
    Simpleton Alan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultralight View Post
    Cut the crap here. You know this is not about money.
    Sure it is. If we take the example of California, they discovered that their single payer health care initiative would impose an annual cost roughly double their annual budget. Now, their graduated state income tax schedule averages roughly 9 to 10% per payor. In order to pay for the scheme, that would have to be increased to approximately 27 to 30%. They realized that their citizens didn't have the will or strong enough ideology to support it, ergo, the initiative failed.

    Then how do all the other 30+ nations do it?
    By force.
    Just own up to this. We'll have a more mature debate this way.
    A mature debate requires numbers and other real world effects. I'll be interested to hear your take on how the money is procured and what effects it will have on the economy.
    "Things should be made as simple as possible, but not one bit simpler." ~ Albert Einstein

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