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Thread: Las Vegas

  1. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Williamsmith View Post
    The real failure is law enforcement intelligence. This person did not accumulate these guns in a vacuum. BATF and federal intelligence agencies both covert and overt constantly monitor situations of purchases and black market deals. I find it incredible that this man was not on some ones radar. I don’t find it unusual that no one would admit it after the carnage he unleashed. It would not be a surprise to learn that he was part of a small group of similar minded nutjobs.
    I found myself thinking, didn't the maid go into the room and see a lot of guns? Of course, I am not suggesting it's the maid's duty to fend off a serial killer, but why didn't someone see smething in the room itself?

  2. #72
    Senior Member Rogar's Avatar
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    WS, yes, you would certainly think the ATF would have an algorithm in their gun registration system that would raise a big flag with the purchase of 20 or more like 40 or more assault type rifles by the same person. This guy was a different breed of criminal or terrorist. Sophisticated, well planned, intelligent, and quite deadly. I don't know if he had links to a small similar minded group, but he certainly raised the bar for copy cat attacks and I'd expect we now have a higher risk for similar acts from other people.

  3. #73
    Senior Member iris lilies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rogar View Post
    In the late '60's California proposed a ban on open carry. The Black Panthers were opposed to this and claimed the armed police state had singled the black community out and was violating due process of law. The police were apparently breaking down doors without warrants and occasionally shooting the occupants among other things. The Panthers claimed the need for arms for self protection. If this were indeed the case and more than a few isolated incidents, I could could see open carry as a proper exercise of the second amendment. Some of it was probably true.

    Interesting, at the time the NRA supported the movement to restrict open carry (the California Mulford Act). So maybe it all depends on who has the guns.
    I was just this week thinking about gun control from a racial politics point of view, as I am i doctrinated here to do. I was thinking that the African American community could claim disproportionate targeting in gun restriction in the scenario you describe, protection from renegade cops.

  4. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tybee View Post
    I found myself thinking, didn't the maid go into the room and see a lot of guns? Of course, I am not suggesting it's the maid's duty to fend off a serial killer, but why didn't someone see smething in the room itself?
    It's easy to hang the "do not disturb" tag on the door. I've spent as much as a week with that hanging on a hotel door (I don't like the sheets or towels changed daily because the chemicals give me hives). It's easy to notice when the hotel cleaning cart is in the hall and meet the maid and say "all I need today is a shampoo and to trade out these washcloths", hand her a nice tip and she/he is thinking good thoughts because you just saved them 10-20 minutes.
    Float On: My "Happy Place" is on my little kayak in the coves of Table Rock Lake.

  5. #75
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    Yes he should have been on someone's radar buying all those weapons. I am sure he hid them from the maid or did not let her in. Europe and Canada have basically solved the gun violence problem and we should too. When is enough well enough? But if it wasn't when the little kids got killed it won't be now. In Europe sure you can kill people with knives but you won't get many before they get you. Even the people that survived will be scarred for life. Some will have PTSD, lose jobs, marriages etc all from the residual effects of this horrible incident. Not everyone will suffer in this way but many will.

  6. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rogar View Post
    Several years ago I was in the grocery store when an older fellow collapsed on the floor. When I got over to him a circle of maybe ten people had gather around him and were just looking. He was pasty white, but breathing. The EMTs showed up fairly quickly and hauled him off. I decided then to go through CPR/first aid training. I did it through work and actually got bonus points for getting a whole class full of co-workers to go. I've been re-certified twice, but it's been a while now. It's good training that everyone should have. I think I could handle some very basic CPR/first aid, but should probably have a review and certification.
    I have it always current in my work, Never needed the CPR portion but use the first aid over the years often. It is amazing how many people don't have common sense about first aid situations so I recommend that more people take it. When I worked at Target they called me over for anything after I handled the staff that caught the tip of their finger in the meat slicer. She kept arguing as she turned more and more pale and started to go into shock. The manager tried to argue with me that I didn't need to do anything like apply a lot of pressure, have her sit down and hold her hand up above her head. Later he did come back and talk to me and I recommended he take a course. The advantage of being that bossy middle aged lady.

  7. #77
    Senior Member Rogar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bae View Post
    There was a case a few years back where a fellow was convicted of "constructive possession" because he had a piece of string and an AR-15. Probably he shouldn't have filmed it in use.

    The "crude manual methods" work just as well as that overpriced stock, which is just a toy to part idiot shooters from their money.

    The reason it isn't a "machine gun" involves technicalities of the law - basically the trigger is being independently pressed for each round fired. The basic legal difference between a fully-automatic firearm and a semi-automatic firearm is simply that - how many rounds are fired per press of the trigger.
    I have the feeling that commercial bump stocks may be a thing of the past.

    he National Rifle Association has called for "additional regulations" on bump-stocks, a rapid fire device used by the Las Vegas massacre gunman.
    The group said: "Devices designed to allow semi-automatic rifles to function like fully-automatic rifles should be subject to additional regulations."
    Republicans have said they would consider banning the tool, despite years of resisting any gun control.

    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-41519815

  8. #78
    Senior Member Williamsmith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rogar View Post
    I have the feeling that commercial bump stocks may be a thing of the past.

    he National Rifle Association has called for "additional regulations" on bump-stocks, a rapid fire device used by the Las Vegas massacre gunman.
    The group said: "Devices designed to allow semi-automatic rifles to function like fully-automatic rifles should be subject to additional regulations."
    Republicans have said they would consider banning the tool, despite years of resisting any gun control.

    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-41519815
    If this is correct, which it appears, then the NRA has done a quick evaluation....seen some real problems with defending an accessory and not a firearm and rightly realized that the emotional reaction to the carnage could not be withstood. And I would venture a guess that the Oval Office told them they would not defend it either nor will most of the heads of in law enforcement. It is a losing scenario for gun advocates since the only thing this attachment does is make automatic fire facsimile possible. The effectiveness of such a law notwithstanding.

    But they also shrewdly married it to the future advancement of the right to carry reciprocity which is well worth the trade off. A plastic bump stock that doesn’t benefit the firearms industry one bit for the expansion of gun owners Rights is a no brainer. Dems may be so eager to claim a victory that they would champion their “fight” against the evil gun lobby while rolling over. Or they might just have something up their sleeve.

  9. #79
    Senior Member bae's Avatar
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    Well, IMO, “bump stocks” are a basically useless accessory (unless “reducing accuracy tremendously” is a use) and cause safety issues. Most of the ranges I use do not allow them.

    But you can’t have my Gatling gun.

  10. #80
    Senior Member bae's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jp1 View Post
    A steady stream of dead people because super smart people like bae can't see a solution beyond "better first aid".
    1) I did not propose "better first aid" as a solution. Or offer it as the best solution. So that's a misrepresentation on your part.

    2) In the past dozen "conversations" on this on these forums, I have proposed measures that might have some effect. Since my proposals generally don't focus on "banning the scary firearms feature of the month", they aren't often popular...

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