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Thread: April is the Cruelest Month

  1. #61
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    Since when is "nice person" determined by political litmus tests? I think Bernie Sanders is a nice person, but many of his ideas would be horribly destructive if put into practice. Questioning the sustainability and cultural impact of a given social program does not necessarily put you in league with with catherine's capitalist villains.

  2. #62
    Senior Member catherine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LDAHL View Post
    Since when is "nice person" determined by political litmus tests? I think Bernie Sanders is a nice person, but many of his ideas would be horribly destructive if put into practice. Questioning the sustainability and cultural impact of a given social program does not necessarily put you in league with with catherine's capitalist villains.
    Some of my best friends are capitalists...
    "Do any human beings ever realize life while they live it--every, every minute?" Emily Webb, Our Town
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  3. #63
    Senior Member jp1's Avatar
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    Perhaps we should pass a law allowing anyone to opt out of social security and medicare at anytime up until their 25th birthday. Anyone who opts out gets a check for every penny that's been paid in so far and they can then live their Ayn Randian self-sufficiency dream. Those who choose that route, however, would than have to prepare on their own for any of the benefits that would have been available to them and any other government benefits they might qualify for would be reduced according to what they would have been able to get had they been getting a benefit from social security.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by jp1 View Post
    Perhaps we should pass a law allowing anyone to opt out of social security and medicare at anytime up until their 25th birthday.
    Unfortunately, like Obamacare, these semi-Ponzi schemes depend upon everyone contributing to the "greater good", otherwise they don't work.

    I think a better approach is cultural. If we promote the idea of self-sufficiency as a goal and maintain the programs as a limited lifeline response to unfortunate conditions rather than an abdication of our personal sovereignty to a fickle government, our families and culture would be stronger.
    "Things should be made as simple as possible, but not one bit simpler." ~ Albert Einstein

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by jp1 View Post
    Perhaps we should pass a law allowing anyone to opt out of social security and medicare at anytime up until their 25th birthday. Anyone who opts out gets a check for every penny that's been paid in so far and they can then live their Ayn Randian self-sufficiency dream. Those who choose that route, however, would than have to prepare on their own for any of the benefits that would have been available to them and any other government benefits they might qualify for would be reduced according to what they would have been able to get had they been getting a benefit from social security.
    That kind of opt-out clause could well doom Soc Sec. Given the progressive nature of the benefit calculation and tax treatment, and assuming higher-paid individuals would be the most likely to leave, the march toward insolvency would probably accelerate.

  6. #66
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    I couldn't disagree more Alan. People's earning potential and other factors make this not a feasible solution. When people want to cut our safety nets yet give a bunch of tax breaks etc to the super rich our values are very wrong. Obamacare was not a ponzi scheme and would have worked fine if the stupid Repubs had not taken away the individual mandate. They don't want poor people to have health insurance. They would prefer they die because it will be cheaper and their lives aren't as valuable. We used to have a strong middle class but not anymore.

  7. #67
    Simpleton Alan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teacher Terry View Post
    They don't want poor people to have health insurance. They would prefer they die because it will be cheaper and their lives aren't as valuable.
    That's why we can't have meaningful dialog about social issues. The constant slander against anyone not toeing a specific ideological line, not just here, but everywhere, is disappointing.
    Disagree all you want, point out the fallacy of your opponents argument and engage in give and take, but don't shut down all communication with stupid accusations and slanderous statements. Nobody's interested in that.
    "Things should be made as simple as possible, but not one bit simpler." ~ Albert Einstein

  8. #68
    Senior Member iris lilies's Avatar
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    We had an odd situation a few years ago at my workplace where all employees voted on whether to join the Social Secuirty system or not. The reason for the vote was a technicality, an error in history.

    but anyway, it was interesting to see the earnest,furrowed brows of Administrative staff when they discussed the younguns’ resistence. “Dont they realize this is GOOD for them?” and “I wonder WHY they are opposed?”

    I wont say there were many opposed as revealed in discussions leading up to the vote, but I will characterize those as opposed as being thoughtful, independent thinkers, a lot of the tech department seemed to not adopt the group think.

    this passed and my Social Security benefits were not threatened, but it was an interesting time.

  9. #69
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    I am disappointed that when Obama was elected the Repub's said that they would not work with him at all and would obstruct everything. They were not going to work with a black man. Then Hillary lost to a liar, cheat, swindler, racist, person that makes fun of disabled people. She lost because she was a strong smart woman. In the past I was fine with a Republican winning because they did not set out policies to actually hurt people like this administration is doing. I am totally disgusted with their behavior. They are now letting it be known that they will separate migrants from their kids, etc. These kids will most likely be traumatized for years to come. They are separating very small children from their moms. Everything they do is calculated and evil. They want to convince people that social programs are stealing their money when actually they are spending like drunken sailors on helping the rich (their friends) get even richer. Look at how many Repubs are not seeking reelection. I think they are disgusted with Trump and the party. I spent my career and now volunteer work helping people and I see first hand what cuts to programs do and it is devastating. Yes I am passionate and no I don't think anyone in this forum would prefer that poor people die but I truly believe that many wealthy people including Trump and his buddies would be very happy to see that happen.

  10. #70
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    I think young people will make dumb decisions because they are young and dumb and lack life experience pretty much. So of course they don't think about social security (ha I bet half of them aren't even contributing to 401ks either - but that's a long way off right?). It's why it's not very wise for them to be making huge financial decisions at that age, like the future of their social security, or like massive student loans for that matter, because they really lack the experience to make fully wise decisions there. Who of us afterall aren't still regretted some dumb shit we did in our 20s that somehow (sometimes for really unfathomable reasons in retrospect) seemed like a good idea the time ...
    If you want something to get done, ask a busy person. If you want them to have a nervous breakdown that is.

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