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Thread: Nearly half of Americans can't afford survival basics....

  1. #21
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    Tammy, your father was correct. I also agree that the trades should be taught in HS for those kids that want to pursue that line of work. It can be very lucrative. When we lived in KS by age 16 kids could choose to go to HS half days and technical school for a trade the other half which was great.

  2. #22
    Senior Member bae's Avatar
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    Also see:

    1 in 3 adults have essentially no retirement savings:

    https://www.studyfinds.org/third-ame...ement-savings/

    And, a great article on the new upper-class, hiding as middle class:

    https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine...ocracy/559130/

    And - wealth inequality:

    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/18/o...n-elderly.html

  3. #23
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    Coincidentally, I just read the article in The Atlantic and found it very interesting. I have two relatives who would be considered to be in the 9.9 subset; it is interesting to see how they have steered their kids to repeat their successes. "Failure" is not an option. Sometimes I am guilty of thinking lower income folk have just made bad choices (looking back, I certainly did); but I know from experience how important it is to have structure, positive role models or at least some kind of inspiration when one is young and still forming to prevent a bad outcome.

  4. #24
    Senior Member iris lilies's Avatar
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    In the Mathew Stewart article, where is the explanation of how assets are measured? I skimmed beginnig to end, and saw references only to “ the .01%” and the “9.9%” and etc, but how much ARE those assets that determine these classes of wealthy people? Which measure is he using? There are several.

    he is clearly is a disciple of the Dream Hoarders book author. Eyeroll.

    I warned you all some months ago that “the 10%” is now the target of activist wrath. Forget about The 1%, they are coming for us now.
    Last edited by iris lilies; 5-18-18 at 10:33pm.

  5. #25
    Senior Member flowerseverywhere's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bae View Post
    Also see:

    1 in 3 adults have essentially no retirement savings:

    https://www.studyfinds.org/third-ame...ement-savings/

    And, a great article on the new upper-class, hiding as middle class:

    https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine...ocracy/559130/

    And - wealth inequality:

    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/18/o...n-elderly.html
    that Atlantic article was fascinating.

    The first retirement savings statistic is true. My kids tell me they know a lot of 30 somethings who say they have not taken advantage of contributing enough to even get matching 401 contributions. Free money down the drain.

  6. #26
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    About 1/2 of 401ks out there seem not to have matching anyway. Oh there is the place I worked at for 5 years whose total matching was $500 a year no matter how much you put in the 401k. I took the money, yep why not, but anyone thinking that's some great help with retirement has another thing coming.
    If you want something to get done, ask a busy person. If you want them to have a nervous breakdown that is.

  7. #27
    Senior Member flowerseverywhere's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ApatheticNoMore View Post
    About 1/2 of 401ks out there seem not to have matching anyway. Oh there is the place I worked at for 5 years whose total matching was $500 a year no matter how much you put in the 401k. I took the money, yep why not, but anyone thinking that's some great help with retirement has another thing coming.
    I agree but everyone who gets any kind of match should take it. Even having some retirement savings might be the difference between homelessness and at least having a place to live.

    There are many facets of a successful retirement. Enough money to have a comfortable life is one of them, perhaps the most important. The loss of pensions and 401k availability and matching makes it far more difficult. Good health to the best of your ability is very important as well. Taking care of yourself through maintaining a lower weight, blood pressure and cholesterol, and higher rate of fitness than most is certainly helpful in that regard. A house of any kind that is paid off is helpful. Availability of good supplemental health insurance is as well. A good social network and close availability of services like physicians, libraries and transportation is a plus.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by iris lilies View Post
    In the Mathew Stewart article, where is the explanation of how assets are measured? I skimmed beginnig to end, and saw references only to “ the .01%” and the “9.9%” and etc, but how much ARE those assets that determine these classes of wealthy people? Which measure is he using? There are several.

    he is clearly is a disciple of the Dream Hoarders book author. Eyeroll.

    I warned you all some months ago that “the 10%” is now the target of activist wrath. Forget about The 1%, they are coming for us now.
    I prefer the 10% criterion. I can just make the income and net worth numbers, and I like the idea that Iíve succeeded enough in life to be a class enemy.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by LDAHL View Post
    I prefer the 10% criterion. I can just make the income and net worth numbers, and I like the idea that I’ve succeeded enough in life to be a class enemy.
    I like this. I make the top 10% in net worth but not in income. Does this mean I'm not a complete class enemy?

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultralight View Post
    I agree with universal basic income or "mincome" or what-have-you.

    I still say workers need to organize into unions. It is an excellent way to better redistribute wealth and resources. It also teaches people to be agents for their own betterment.

    I also think that it would be wise and helpful for people to stop feeling so entitled to so much. Things people feel entitled to they really ought to think of as special privileges for those that can afford it.
    Knowing someone whose publicly stated goal was to be the worst member of the union and still have his job, as well as those who try to excel and have their union brethren tell them to slow down, your making us look bad, etc. I am unsure how you consider a union to teach one to better themselves. That doesn't even bring up things like embezzlement, political infighting, etc. etc. etc. that all too frequently happens with them. To me they seem to teach relying on a nanny state.

    As for feeling entitled, between "keeping up with the Jones" (which is in part what a union is about), TV (and entertainment in general), product marketing/placement, etc., your dealing with emotions verses reasoning. How many people react, instead of act/plan/study, etc? How many people get emotional?

    Quote Originally Posted by pinkytoe View Post
    Coincidentally, I just read the article in The Atlantic and found it very interesting. I have two relatives who would be considered to be in the 9.9 subset; it is interesting to see how they have steered their kids to repeat their successes. "Failure" is not an option. Sometimes I am guilty of thinking lower income folk have just made bad choices (looking back, I certainly did); but I know from experience how important it is to have structure, positive role models or at least some kind of inspiration when one is young and still forming to prevent a bad outcome.
    I can't stress firmly enough how much positive role models can/do have an inspiration. Even then, they aren't complete as life happens (high school friend whose goal was to be a police officer, was hit in a three car, crash, in such a way that he would never walk right (unassisted) again, by an uninsured motorist, as an example)
    I came from the "wrong side of the tracks", and while many lessons I learned were wrong or screwed up (do as I say, not as I do), those I met after I graduated school, taught me a lot more then all the lessons I learned in life prior, where I was taught little/no self worth and my most common dream was being vivisected. What I learned later, got me to the place where my house is paid for (which is great after nearly losing everything/being homeless once, via a long lawsuit), and putting some money aside for a rainy day. I will not be able to "retire" and will have to work until I die (which could be today for all I know), but I don't have the interests/aspirations that some do for retirement (seems to me to be doing boring things, or spend all day frequenting the same stores/etc. bugging people because your lonely).

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