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Thread: California breakup?

  1. #1
    Senior Member jp1's Avatar
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    California breakup?

    So apparently I'm going to get to vote on whether California should be split into three states in November. Honestly, I have no idea whether this is a good or bad idea and look forward to reading opinions about it over the coming months. I assume the goal/expectation is that Southern CA, which would include the moderately conservative counties of Orange and San Diego, as well as the more conservative central valley farming area, would be expected to be at least somewhat red, even with the more blue counties in the southeast corner of the state. But that would still leave New California with the rest of LA as solidly blue, and North California with San Francisco and the entire northern coastal area as solidly blue.

    Of course even if this does pass in the election I imagine he11 will freeze over before the US congress agrees to implement it.

    https://www.cnn.com/2018/06/13/us/ca...lot/index.html

  2. #2
    Senior Member iris lilies's Avatar
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    Hell will freeze over.

    Next.

  3. #3
    Senior Member bae's Avatar
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    I can imagine some of the other states might have issues with California having 6 Senators.

  4. #4
    Senior Member jp1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bae View Post
    I can imagine some of the other states might have issues with California having 6 Senators.
    True, although the three new californias would still be 3 of the biggest states. It's not as if we're wyoming looking to gain even more over-representation. And turning 1/3 of our electoral votes red in the next presidential election would at least partly counteract the shift from 2 blue senators to 4 blue and 2 red senators. (all predictions being total speculation at this point, of course. reality has a habit of surprising people on a regular basis, so who knows how it would all actually play out.)

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    Senior Member bae's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jp1 View Post
    True, although the three new californias would still be 3 of the biggest states.
    It's not a state-size issue, or a red-vs-blue issue. The grand compromises that led to the formation of this nation, and then the ratification of the US Constitution, are based on some concerns about big states oppressing little states. Thus we have both a Senate *and* a House of Representatives.

    This has been at issue before:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missouri_Compromise

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    Senior Member jp1's Avatar
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    Personally I was more worried about how to put 52 stars on the flag in an attractive pattern. I suppose we could go with 4 rows of 13, but the triscadecaphobics will probably have a cow over that idea.

    Since this is the first I've heard about this new ballot initiative I have no idea what the motives are of the people pushing it. I assume that will get written about extensively over the coming months. So I'm not necessarily for or against it. I'll read the differing opinions and make a decision at some point before the election. Obviously the country has split states in the past so I don't have any deep philosophical resistance to the idea, but I also don't think we should do it just for the sake of doing it.

  7. #7
    Senior Member bae's Avatar
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    I'm more in favor of some of the Cascadia proposals, where some portion of the Pacific NW (including pieces of BC) cut loose from our slip and sail off into history together.

    Then y'all can have as many senators as you like :-)

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    If Puerto Rico gets statehood there would still be an even number of stars in the flag. They aren't doing too well as a commonwealth.

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    Senior Member catherine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jp1 View Post
    Personally I was more worried about how to put 52 stars on the flag in an attractive pattern.
    Yeah, 50 is a nice round number. Well, maybe the overcrowded star field will compel a state or two to secede--Vermont might be willing. Or consolidate. Up here in the NE we have a whole bunch of tiny states so maybe we could form ConneRhode, or Dela-Maryland.
    "Do any human beings ever realize life while they live it--every, every minute?" Emily Webb, Our Town
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  10. #10
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    I'm interested to see how this vote goes too. I do think the U.S. will fracture apart in some future date, although not in my lifetime.
    Related to this, an interesting article in The Atlantic: Red State, Blue City. That's where the real divide seems to be, rural vs. urban.
    https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine...e-city/513857/

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