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Thread: Siblings now estranged, estate issues were last straw and maybe for me

  1. #31
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    It seems that the executor has the responsibility for the estate. So why would the non-executor children be held responsible for the bills, taxes, etc?

    Honest question ...

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simplemind View Post
    Saguaro and Teacher Terry.... I wish we lived closer. I would take the two of you out for drinks!!

    My husband and I have a saying. If you have watched the Pirates of the Caribbean movies there is a shot of Johnny Depp standing at the top of the mast of his sinking ship as he comes to shore. Just as the ship goes under the surface he lightly steps off onto the dock. We look at our money and the end of our life the same way. At this point none of our kids want to have kids so the line stops with them. None of them have debt or kids to save for college. None of them have ever needed a loan from us. We want to downsize in 10 years and spend ours down so that none of the kids has to care for us and we get to do what we want while we have our health to do it. We call our plan - Johnny Depp'ing it.
    @Simplemind, and I could use a drink after this, lol. Johnny Depp'ing it, I love it and exactly describes me and DH. We have no kids and a similar plan, but now I have a really cool name plan, thanks to you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Teacher Terry View Post
    My siblings have always been difficult and for years I bent over backwards trying to keep the peace. Once my mom died I stopped. My brother quit talking to me and I have no idea why. My sister and I email once a week. Last year when I went home to see my friends I went to see her for a day. My mom spent all her money and we were all glad. She got to vacation and enjoy herself. I don’t miss them at all.
    MS was always the difficult one of the 3 of us, even my parents acknowledged that. She was the instigator of most of the conflicts between the 3 of us but after a point I think my parents just gave up and told YS to suck it up because family. By this time, I had moved out but MS and YS were still in the family home for some time after, so conflicts between them were constant. YS was a people pleaser sort and MS took advantage of that. YS acknowledged to me years ago that she did what she did to keep the peace but now that our parents are gone, combined with MS's behavior towards her around the time our last parent died, she's done. I don't blame her. YS and I have always gotten along but as the relationship with parents and MS became more strained, we became closer because she could trust me and I supported her. I think this bothers MS but frankly she brought it on herself. A closer relationship between YS and me does not preclude a relationship with MS and YS, it's been MS's abusive behavior and lack of support toward YS and her DH over a 20 year period that is the cause of the breakdown in their relationship. YS has told MS this but MS denies it all.

    Re: parents, I miss them in some ways and in others, I don't. Like Simplemind's parents, I think they played us against each other a bit, not out of malice, but out of their own emotional needs. They were loving parents and raised us well in many ways, but when it come to us leaving the nest, that's when the trouble started. They were very private people, insular really, due to their moral and religious ideas plus the idea of family is all you need and should always stay together. I think they could not fathom us going out into a world where they would not have control over what we did, what choices we made, that we would make mistakes, that we didn't need them anymore. This is a normal feeling for a lot of parents but their particular response to it was not. They could not let go and they harbored this fantasy that we should all live down the street from each other where we can still show up for Sunday dinner and go to the same church. It sounds nice but I had spent over 20 years of my life doing what they wanted now it was time to do what I wanted. Which is the right and healthy thing, but rather than being proud of having raised an independent adult, they were hurt that I was abandoning them. The response was to close ranks around MS and YS to keep them close unfortunately the narrative of "abandoning the family" was perpetuated all too well. One of the things YS has been accused of was "abandoning the family" when she moved out and "abandoning your mother" when she flew in to assist with my mom during her final months only to leave the house when Dad had a serious meltdown / psychotic break that required MS and YS to call the police (I had already left the house when this happened). So YS is unloading a lot while MS keeps wanting to perpetuate this abandonment narrative that I think is underlying her preoccupation of "who is worthy" as a estate beneficiary.

  3. #33
    Senior Member Teacher Terry's Avatar
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    My sister was a accountant as well as extremely honest, fast and efficient so she was perfect for the job. My brother I don’t trust with money. Both of them are much better off financially then we are. My parents encouraged us to explore the world. Never any quilt trips.

  4. #34
    Senior Member catherine's Avatar
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    saguaro, your story of your parents' belief in family and the need for everyone to stick together rings true me in the sense that my DH and MIL have/had some of that--not to a pathological extent, but maybe it was a Scottish clan thing with them. I've talked about the damage that MIL did to BIL because she was widowed when he was 3, and she was committed to never remarrying (that would be a betrayal of the core family unit)--so she established a sick, symbiotic relationship with her son. The first time he tried to use his wings and live in California she would send him letters saying it would never work; she missed him; the job he was going to win wasn't the right job for him..and so he caved and returned back East and lived with her until she died. [I hope that he finally can realize his dream now--he's trying again, at 57.. this is Day 4]

    DH also had a bit of this.. we went on 30 annual family vacations, and 25 of them were with MIL and BIL. We wouldn't consider going on a vacation without our kids or MIL/BIL. One of my deep regrets is that I went along with this to the detriment of opportunities to spend time with my own mother.

    I related to that scene at the end of My Big Fat Greek Wedding when you see the Greek dad happily walking down the driveway in the morning to get the paper, and then the camera pans out to the house next door where his new son-in-aw is walking down the driveway to get his paper--the father bought them a house next door. DH's dream would be a family compound where we would all live together. For the most part I love that, and it has served us well. But it's a fine line between being close as a family and being unhealthily enmeshed.

    Sounds like you were able to navigate those waters, and your sisters were not as successful. I truly hope it works out for you in the long run.

    BTW, I also love that term "Johnny Depp'd". I'm going to keep that image in my mind!
    "Do any human beings ever realize life while they live it--every, every minute?" Emily Webb, Our Town
    www.silententry.wordpress.com

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by catherine View Post
    The first time he tried to use his wings and live in California she would send him letters saying it would never work; she missed him; the job he was going to win wasn't the right job for him..and so he caved and returned back East and lived with her until she died. [I hope that he finally can realize his dream now--he's trying again, at 57.. this is Day 4]
    @catherine, I remember you talking about your BIL. It's too bad that he caved and came back, it was not good for him or your MIL even she didn't see it that way, here's hoping that even at 57, he will become truly independent.

    Quote Originally Posted by catherine View Post
    DH also had a bit of this.. we went on 30 annual family vacations, and 25 of them were with MIL and BIL. We wouldn't consider going on a vacation without our kids or MIL/BIL. One of my deep regrets is that I went along with this to the detriment of opportunities to spend time with my own mother.
    YS spent probably 90% of her annual vacations coming back and staying with our parents, during which she pretty much stayed at their house, doing a lot of housework and did very little visiting with other family and friends. A few months before our mother died, some extended family indicated they wanted to see her on her next visit and started to arrange a family gathering for this purpose. My mother went ballistic, basically saying that this was "their time" and they would decide if they wanted such an event. It pretty much said it all, they commandeered nearly all of YS' vacation time.

    Quote Originally Posted by catherine View Post
    Sounds like you were able to navigate those waters, and your sisters were not as successful. I truly hope it works out for you in the long run.
    I remember beginning in my early teenage years starting to feel rather smothered by my family and wanting to get away when I was of age and completed my education. I really couldn't put my finger on as to why, but now I know it was feelings as a result of the enmeshment. I managed to take a few trips in my later high school / college years, with groups of course, and I remember the feeling of absolute liberation of being away only to feel seriously depressed at the prospect of coming back home. Of the 3 of us, I managed to complete college in 4 years, while working my way to help pay for it (MS and YS were required to do the same but both dropped out). Parents could only pay for part of the tuition and absolutely required that I work my way, they didn't want me taking out loans. Fair enough. However, after 4 years of hard work earning a university degree, to tell me that I wasn't "ready" to go out and live on my own, that they didn't want me leaving, well, I was having none of that.

    In other news, MS was at yesterdays family gathering. She brought pictures to give to family members who she thought would want them and other items, chiefly belong to our maternal grandparents for everyone to choose from. We did not talk about YS, but MS did indicate that she is "under pressure from somebody" to get things moving. Seems that she is working on things, though once again, she fell through on her promise to let me know about what's going on or about any help but still complaining about how much work it is. I can't stop her from being the martyr and making it more difficult for herself but there does seem to be some progress.

  6. #36
    Senior Member iris lilies's Avatar
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    I will still be contacting the attorney so that you can see what progress is being made. There is not a way you are going to salvage your relationship with your middle sister. If pressure is on her now to be moving, make her move until the deed is done.

  7. #37
    Senior Member Teacher Terry's Avatar
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    I can’t imagine parents trying to get adult children to remain dependent. It’s so unhealthy. Glad you escaped Sag.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by iris lilies View Post
    I will still be contacting the attorney so that you can see what progress is being made. There is not a way you are going to salvage your relationship with your middle sister. If pressure is on her now to be moving, make her move until the deed is done.
    Agree that pressure has to be maintained until this is done. Contacting the attorney is still on the table, but for now, I am staying my hand because it was clear to me the pressure was on, though she's mad as hell. But we seem to be getting results, at least for now. I reminded MS again to contact me for assistance, she acknowledged not following through from our last conversation.

    It would be good to get into the house to assess for myself how things are going, but while I have a key, I would not go there without MS being present.

  9. #39
    Senior Member Simplemind's Avatar
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    Sigh..…… saguaro, I think our parents are related. I had such a fractious relationship with my mom. She was highly critical of everything I did and I began to repress everything. One of her most hurtful comments was that I was nothing but a parasite. I had a job all through HS and saved every penny. Without telling anybody I got my own apartment and furniture. A couple of days after HS graduation I told her I was moving. At first she thought I was talking about moving and again went on to tell me that I would never make it. I told her I had already had one for a month and had been furnishing it. She came unglued. I honestly think a lot of it was being deprived of being asked for help only to deny it and show it was another example of my incompetence. I stayed away from home for a long time coming back only for holidays with extended family. It was liberating to have people relate to me in a completely different way. Every time I went home all the labels got slapped back on. All three of us kids had parts we played in the family dynamic. We were very distrustful of each other.
    Imagine my surprise at being made Trustee since black sheep me had always been told I didn't have a head for anything but useless trivia. My sister and brother had always stayed in the folks pockets with loans and goodies as long as they didn't buck the system. I never borrowed a dime and was never in debt. As trustee I wanted to ask a couple of questions and dear sweet mother said in front of the attorney that it was none of my G*d d*mned business and that she preferred to remain an enigma. Imagine my confusion after they had both passed having both the attorney and the financial advisor say to me that my folks praised me all the time as their kid who had made something of herself and was the best with money and the only one capable of taking over the trust. Who the hell were these people??? I think that is also why my siblings were generous at the end. The parents were gone, we could all breath our own air and they knew I took the heat all those years and did all the work at the end to their benefit. We now all get along without our mom steering our relationships. We have become very close since their passing and get together often. We love being able to laugh and talk openly about our odd upbringing. Believe me, there is a book in all that.

  10. #40
    Senior Member Teacher Terry's Avatar
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    So glad SM that you guys are now close.

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