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Thread: Vegetarian men: Seen as less manly, but more ethical. Your thoughts?

  1. #11
    Senior Member Ultralight's Avatar
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    I have been back on the veggie bandwagon for a bit now. Except oysters (but to me they are not sentient, like fungi, so not animals).

    I feel better. My binge eating and my presence of mind when I am about to overeat is much improved. So I can stop myself before wildly jumping overboard.

    But I will confess two things:

    I derived much of my masculine identity from being a fisherman. So I feel a bit like: "Who am I?"

    And my libido has improved since going veggie again. I am not 25 again. But I feel more... uh... more. haha

    (Note: I acknowledge that this is not science, just my anecdotes).

  2. #12
    Senior Member Teacher Terry's Avatar
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    My son was a vegetarian for 10 years when he was with a woman that was. Then they broke up and he met his polish wife that eats meat sandwiches for breakfast. Gradually he became a meat eater. I was glad as it was much easier for me to plan meals. I have a good friend that can no longer tolerate meat due to her stomach issues and I always accommodate it.

  3. #13
    Senior Member herbgeek's Avatar
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    And my libido has improved since going veggie again. I am not 25 again. But I feel more... uh... more. haha
    Well when I have a big heavy meat meal, I get sleepy. Not a good attribute for beginning dating. If I were dating again, and the man was a vegetarian, I'd be thinking hey I bet he'll have more energy after dinner.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultralight View Post

    I derived much of my masculine identity from being a fisherman. So I feel a bit like: "Who am I?"

    I acknowledge that this is not science, just my anecdotes).
    The Livestrong.com website has articles on "anti-estrogenic" and "anti-androgenic" diets. As I understand, if a person wanted a diet that would raise testosterone (T) and lower estradiol (E2) … (the healthy liver determines the ultimate balance in the body) … they would opt for anti-estrogenic foods:
    wild-caught FISH
    aged cheese
    whole grains
    nuts and seeds (but avoid walnuts and flax seeds)
    olives
    beans

    Livestrong did not mention red meat, and I wonder if it might be anti-estrogenic as well. I have seen claims that red meat not only boosts T, but supplies zinc, which is good for blood circulation, and higher levels of nitric oxide in the blood, which is the stuff of "male enhancement".

    Mind you, "male enhancement" can be a cringe-worthy concept. And really there are all sorts of potential partners, including those who would say, "Give me a man who reads!" <wink>

    It is possible to get blood tested by labs and keep track of T and E2 levels, and compare one's own hormone levels to the average range for men or women in one's age group. I am not passing a judgement: I like the idea of people being who they are, and becoming whoever they desire to be. Diet choices may be part of the process.

    By the same token, a person might decide to change his or her diet to increase E2 and reduce T. (And a masculine-insecure peer group might shame a guy for his diet choices or any observable feminine traits). I imagine that some men a few months into a vegan diet may have consumed a significant amount of anti-androgenic foods, especially soy products.

  5. #15
    Senior Member bae's Avatar
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    I don't think I'd be particularly interested in a lady who wanted me to be "masculine", so perhaps I'll start eating more veggie burgers in public as a sorting mechanism.

  6. #16
    Senior Member JaneV2.0's Avatar
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    I didn't notice my ethics changing as I transitioned from omnivore to vegetarian and back.

    I'd date a vegetarian, but probably not a vegan. I'd prefer a fellow omnivore with an interest in LCHF eating.

    I look askance at people who strongly skew stereotypically M or F anyway.
    Last edited by JaneV2.0; 9-6-19 at 12:06pm. Reason: to correct illegible format

  7. #17
    Senior Member bae's Avatar
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    When I am going to be engaging in athletic activity, I tend to eat fruit, veggies, nuts, and so on before the activity - too much red meat makes me feel slow. Fish is OK.

  8. #18
    Senior Member Ultralight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dado potato View Post
    The Livestrong.com website has articles on "anti-estrogenic" and "anti-androgenic" diets. As I understand, if a person wanted a diet that would raise testosterone (T) and lower estradiol (E2) … (the healthy liver determines the ultimate balance in the body) … they would opt for anti-estrogenic foods:
    wild-caught FISH
    aged cheese
    whole grains
    nuts and seeds (but avoid walnuts and flax seeds)
    olives
    beans

    Livestrong did not mention red meat, and I wonder if it might be anti-estrogenic as well. I have seen claims that red meat not only boosts T, but supplies zinc, which is good for blood circulation, and higher levels of nitric oxide in the blood, which is the stuff of "male enhancement".

    Mind you, "male enhancement" can be a cringe-worthy concept. And really there are all sorts of potential partners, including those who would say, "Give me a man who reads!" <wink>

    It is possible to get blood tested by labs and keep track of T and E2 levels, and compare one's own hormone levels to the average range for men or women in one's age group. I am not passing a judgement: I like the idea of people being who they are, and becoming whoever they desire to be. Diet choices may be part of the process.

    By the same token, a person might decide to change his or her diet to increase E2 and reduce T. (And a masculine-insecure peer group might shame a guy for his diet choices or any observable feminine traits). I imagine that some men a few months into a vegan diet may have consumed a significant amount of anti-androgenic foods, especially soy products.
    Interesting stuff here. Though I do wonder how much of it is evidence-based.

    Do oysters count as wild caught fish? They are farmed, I suppose, but on open water.
    Do Romano and Parmesan count as aged cheese? Those I actually like.
    I am not a big fan of whole grains, but I do eat some oatmeal.
    I like peanuts and cashews. I eat one or the other daily.
    I LOVE olives.
    Beans are okay -- do lentils count? Those I eat often!

    I don't like soy foods, except soy sauce (and not terribly often). Tofu has no flavor. Soy milk tastes okay but nowhere near as good as cannabis milk or even almond or cashew milk!

  9. #19
    Senior Member Ultralight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teacher Terry View Post
    My son was a vegetarian for 10 years when he was with a woman that was. Then they broke up and he met his polish wife that eats meat sandwiches for breakfast. Gradually he became a meat eater. I was glad as it was much easier for me to plan meals.
    Why are you planning your grown son's meals? Do you cook for him and his wife?

    I want a woman who eats rice for breakfast.

  10. #20
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    Terry, I read it that you invite them over for dinner!
    We just had a family reunion and everyone was asking about food preferences/allergies/issues, and everyone just concluded it was too complicated to cook for everyone!

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