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Thread: Obsess about China and its plans...

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    Senior Member razz's Avatar
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    Obsess about China and its plans...

    While all the conversations are about Trump and his activities, China must be delighted to have the US public so distracted. China has goals of world domination and now dominate their citizens with facial recognition enabling authorities to know what each citizens is doing and where. How will this be prevented from taking place here?

    Source:https://www.mauldineconomics.com/fro...ese-chess-game

    "As Jonathan Ward, author of China’s Vision of Victory, whom I quoted at length last week, says in one of his client briefs:

    As of now, many US businesses, financial institutions, and Allied nations continue to contribute to the advancement of China’s economy and industrial base: In other words, to the foundations of China’s growing global power.

    This ongoing situation has roots in a prior American strategy towards China. For decades, American strategy towards China was known as “engage and hedge,” meaning that the United States would engage commercially and diplomatically, while “hedging” by maintaining our advantages in military deterrence.

    But because of China’s intentions, which we overlooked, this policy amounted to funding an arms race against ourselves. We have empowered and emboldened our greatest and most dangerous rival.

    Rather than converting the People’s Republic of China into a trusted friend or “responsible stakeholder,” engagement has led—and continues to lead—to the enabling of a massive strategic adversary.

    Engagement will eventually lead also to the demise of our military deterrence, as China continues to convert economic and industrial power to military advancement.

    The problem, as we will see, is that like generals preparing to fight the last war, we are looking at our military “hedge” through the lens of past conflicts. And while there is no question the US would prevail in any conflict that remotely resembled past wars, the rules are changing.

    Just as we say in the investment world that past performance is not indicative of future results, geopolitical engagements don’t always end as we expect.

    Hundred-Year Marathon
    Another good resource is Michael Pillsbury’s The Hundred-Year Marathon. He marshals a lot of evidence showing the Chinese government has a detailed strategy to overtake the US as the world’s dominant power. They want to do this by 2049, the centennial of China’s Communist revolution.

    The strategy has been well documented in Chinese literature, published and sanctioned by organizations of the People’s Liberation Army, for well over 50 years. And just as we have hawks and moderates on China within the US, there are hawks and moderates within China about how to engage the West. Unfortunately, the hawks are ascendant, embodied most clearly in Xi Jinping.

    The Chinese Communist Party recently concluded its Fourth Plenum, a gathering of top party and government leaders. It left little doubt about the party’s intentions. Bill Bishop had this reaction in his Sinocism letter (an invaluable resource, by the way):

    The Plenum Communique reiterated that China is facing many risks, as one would expect given that nine months ago, Xi convened a three-day meeting of just about the same audience on risks; it articulated the advantages of the PRC’s system of socialism with Chinese characteristics; it emphasized that the Party needs to lead everything, and discussed further refinements to the “Party eats the State” reforms from last year’s Third Plenum…

    … On the first couple of passes, the document and its goal of advancing the modernization of China’s system and capacity for governance reads a bit like a top-level roadmap for a highly functioning authoritarian superpower.

    Xi’s vision of the Chinese Communist Party controlling the state and eventually influencing and even controlling the rest of the world is clear. These are not merely words for the consumption of the masses. They are instructions to party members.

    Grand dreams of world domination are part and parcel of communist ideologies, going all the way back to Karl Marx. For the Chinese, this blends with the country’s own long history. It isn’t always clear to Western minds whether they actually believe the rhetoric or simply use it to keep the peasantry in line. Pillsbury says Xi Jinping really sees this as China’s destiny, and himself as the leader who will deliver it.

    To that end, according to Pillsbury, the Chinese manipulated Western politicians and business leaders into thinking China was evolving toward democracy and capitalism. In fact, the intent was to acquire our capital, technology, and other resources for use in China’s own modernization.

    It worked, too. Over the last 20–30 years, we have equipped the Chinese with almost everything they need to match us, technologically and otherwise. Hundreds of billions of Western dollars have been spent developing China and its state-owned businesses. Sometimes this happened voluntarily, as companies gave away trade secrets in the (often futile) hope it would let them access China’s huge market. Other times it was outright theft. In either case, this was no accident but part of a long-term plan....
    Gandhi: Happiness is when what you think, what you say and what you do are in harmony .

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    Look at it this way: several decades ago blue chip athletes like Ted Williams took time out from their careers to bomb Chinese forces in Korea. Today, Lebron James makes excuses for them when they crack down on their citizens.

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    Actually, we already have things like facial recognition and tracking (is that a cell phone in your pocket), here. That doesn't cover electronic warriors, breaking into systems for their own nefarious uses, let alone an actual war.
    What I remember from some conversations with different people of Asian descent, was China has always had the belief that it was superior, from the time it believed it didn't need the outside world, through communism, and into modern days with spying/obtaining our tech, not honoring patents, etc. and then buying things like part of our shot down fighters, to learn from.
    That says nothing of the old timers in the military who said, China could line up a billion people, with rifles and just replace the person and rounds, and defeat us with one batch of guns, or now with all the tech, swarm us with inexpensive, not manned drones.

    As I was typing this, I left because I was trying to find/remember our members name that used to live in China. I would be interested to hear @Ihamo's perspective. (not sure how to quote so they will see their name)

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    Senior Member Rogar's Avatar
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    I have read articles about how as Chinese labor has become more expensive they have been expanding into Africa and Latin America, both for labor and natural resources. Their coal plant expansion is rather egregious but some claim they are leaders in green energy and have over a hundred electric car manufacturers, mostly start ups. They will certainly be a growing global economic force. They could learn a lot about quality control from Japan and improve their humanitarian issues. Unfortunate, as we continue to fuel their economy.

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    Senior Member bae's Avatar
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    Sounds a lot like "Oceania was at war with Eastasia: Oceania had always been at war with Eastasia" to me....

    China can't even deal with Hong Kong, has major environmental issues impacting food production and health/welfare, and we're supposed to believe they are some Sophisticated Highly Organized Evil that is Bent On World Domination.

    Not buying it.

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    I think it is safe to say that China will act in it’s own best interests, as informed by it’s communist-mercantilist-nationalist view of the world. These have and will often come into conflict with ours. They are neither a pitiful helpless giant or an overwhelming threat.

    I think our best long term strategy is military preparedness in the Pacific and robustly defending our trade interests and intellectual property rights worldwide.

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    Senior Member Rogar's Avatar
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    China depends on us and the rest of the world for it's exports to sustain their economy. What hurts us hurts them. Unlike Russia, although it's a global economy for most everyone these days.

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    There was an interesting Frontline on PBS last night about the development of AI. Included info on all the efforts China is making to use AI surveillance both at home and in the places they have infiltrated.

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    Senior Member bae's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pinkytoe View Post
    Included info on all the efforts China is making to use AI surveillance both at home and in the places they have infiltrated.
    Where has China "infiltrated"?

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    Investment is a more accurate word...China's Belt and Road. The way it was presented though on Frontline made it sound insidious. The show mentioned parts of Africa and the Middle East.

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