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Thread: When the president ignores a supreme court ruling

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan View Post
    You're just being argumentative, popular vote by state which translates to electoral college electors. Without electoral college the population of the two coasts would overwhelm the vast center leaving them to the whims of the elites.

    I know it can be confusing to folks who think the Federal Government was conceived and created to provide for them, but it wasn't, it was conceived and created to provide security and oversight in the event of disputes between the states while providing them with a republican form of government. Granted, the federal government has expanded its role greatly since the Civil War and people have been led to wrongly believe it is a Democracy rather than a Republic but the fact remains that the states elect the president based upon the electoral college wishes of the individual states. A national popular vote means nothing.
    BS Just recently there was hoopla about if "electors" of states being required to vote for what the populace of the state wants or if they can go rogue. If the "electors" vote as they should ie as in WI... the popular vote matters greatly.

  2. #32
    Simpleton Alan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frugal-one View Post
    BS Just recently there was hoopla about if "electors" of states being required to vote for what the populace of the state wants or if they can go rogue. If the "electors" vote as they should ie as in WI... the popular vote matters greatly.
    That's an issue with the individual states as there's no uniformity in how much leeway each allows their electors. Popular vote is important within each state but not nationally. Complaining about popular vote versus electoral college on the national level is wasted effort since the overall popular vote is irrelevant, and always has been.

    And if I recall correctly no rogue electors, as rare as they are, have ever changed the results of a Presidential election. Not ever.

    Edited to add: This appears to be a timely topic since the Supreme Court ruled just a few weeks ago that the individual states "faithless elector" laws are constitutional which therefore gives them the ability to remove whatever rogue elector may show up. I must have missed that in the news because I only discovered it while verifying my earlier statements.
    "Things should be made as simple as possible, but not one bit simpler." ~ Albert Einstein

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan View Post
    That's an issue with the individual states as there's no uniformity in how much leeway each allows their electors. Popular vote is important within each state but not nationally. Complaining about popular vote versus electoral college on the national level is wasted effort since the overall popular vote is irrelevant, and always has been.

    And if I recall correctly no rogue electors, as rare as they are, have ever changed the results of a Presidential election. Not ever.

    Edited to add: This appears to be a timely topic since the Supreme Court ruled just a few weeks ago that the individual states "faithless elector" laws are constitutional which therefore gives them the ability to remove whatever rogue elector may show up. I must have missed that in the news because I only discovered it while verifying my earlier statements.
    Just because something has not happened before is not an indication that it will not happen. Look at all the crap trump has done that has not been done before. Ignoring supoenas is only one example.

    Popular vote in a few key states could turn the election, so therefore, is relevant.

  4. #34
    Simpleton Alan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frugal-one View Post
    Just because something has not happened before is not an indication that it will not happen.
    That's true, but the real question should be what is the likelihood that some particular thing will happen considering the protections against it? As an example, it's possible that I could win the Mega Millions, but it's protected against my making good on that possibility by the fact that I don't play it.
    Look at all the crap trump has done that has not been done before. Ignoring supoenas is only one example.
    Oh that's been done before, maybe as many as 8 or 9 times during the previous administration, I forget the exact number. What are your other examples?
    Popular vote in a few key states could turn the election, so therefore, is relevant.
    That's true as well but we should always distinguish between popular votes in individual states and national popular vote. It seems to me that people who use the 'popular vote' term seldom, if ever, do.
    "Things should be made as simple as possible, but not one bit simpler." ~ Albert Einstein

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    There are so many ridiculous things that trump has said and done. The most recent is that trump said the election should be delayed. Just do a google search and you will come up with many.....

    https://video.search.yahoo.com/searc...efore&fr=aaplw

  6. #36
    Simpleton Alan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frugal-one View Post
    There are so many ridiculous things that trump has said and done. The most recent is that trump said the election should be delayed. Just do a google search and you will come up with many.....
    Yeah, he says a lot of goofy stuff, seemingly unaware that he doesn't have the authority to follow through. But his detractors don't seem to realize that either and their trusted sources won't tell them.

    Viewing retail politics from a distance a dis-interested observer might conclude that our politicians are not qualified to lead, our media is too biased to be believed and our voters are too caught up in ridiculous dogma to be trusted with the responsibility. Of course that's just my opinion.
    "Things should be made as simple as possible, but not one bit simpler." ~ Albert Einstein

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan View Post
    Yeah, he says a lot of goofy stuff, seemingly unaware that he doesn't have the authority to follow through. But his detractors don't seem to realize that either and their trusted sources won't tell them.

    Viewing retail politics from a distance a dis-interested observer might conclude that our politicians are not qualified to lead, our media is too biased to be believed and our voters are too caught up in ridiculous dogma to be trusted with the responsibility. Of course that's just my opinion.
    I agree some politicians are not qualified to lead. There are reliable news sources. Sometimes just seeing is believing. Also not all voters are gullible. Sadly, there are too many sheep.

  8. #38
    Senior Member jp1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan View Post
    Yeah, he says a lot of goofy stuff, seemingly unaware that he doesn't have the authority to follow through. But his detractors don't seem to realize that either and their trusted sources won't tell them.

    Viewing retail politics from a distance a dis-interested observer might conclude that our politicians are not qualified to lead, our media is too biased to be believed and our voters are too caught up in ridiculous dogma to be trusted with the responsibility. Of course that's just my opinion.
    I suppose it’s theoretically reasonable to laugh off all the shitty authoritarian ideas he spouts because he ‘just can’t do it.’ But if you had asked me four years ago ‘could a president get away with withholding foreign aid from an ally in order to extort them into making up dirt about his likely next election rival?’ I would have LOL’d and said ‘of course not.’ But now that’s a perfectly acceptable thing for any future president to do. (Thank you soulless crappy ass republican senators...) If the masses are stupid enough to re-elect trump there is no reason to think he will feel constrained by something as quaint as the constitution. He already doesn’t. And isn’t. Once the inconvenience of having to face re-election is past his illegal actions of this first term will seem quaint.

  9. #39
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    Don't discount the machinations of Russians and widespread voter suppression in changing the course of this election. The masses may be stupid, but they aren't working alone.

  10. #40
    Senior Member iris lilies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JaneV2.0 View Post
    Don't discount the machinations of Russians and widespread voter suppression in changing the course of this election. The masses may be stupid, but they aren't working alone.
    what do
    I watch out for in my local election, evidence of Russian influence,
    I mean?

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