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Thread: Sculpture Culture Warfare

  1. #11
    Senior Member catherine's Avatar
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    Just a couple of weeks ago I was completely appalled by the AOC news du jour about Yoho's verbal attack on her. I think she handled it beautifully, as her remarks on C-SPAN attest.

    AOC has three strikes against her before she even gets out of the dugout. 1. she's young. 2. she's female. 3. she's Hispanic.
    I couldn't count the really vile remarks I see on FB about her--remarks that have nothing to do with her politics. It's as if her election and her work and her life mean nothing--everyting she has done is negated by the circumstances of her birth. I have heard many males, family members included, call her dumb, dismiss her election to Congress, and use the same language Yoho used to describe her.

    So that is the frame of reference from which she has come to view the culture--one in which male successes make them a saint and earn them statues and one in which female successes make them reviled, or even worse, invisible.

    I know you males don't agree with me, but there it is. Shirley Chisholm (who had two strikes against her) said that in her life she was far more discriminated against on the basis of her gender than her race.
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  2. #12
    Simpleton Alan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jp1 View Post
    Because suggesting a new statue without pointing out the white supremacy that went into the decision resulting in the current statue kind of misses the whole point of pointing out the white supremacy that is so deeply embedded in our society that a lot of people fail to notice it.
    I guess if you're going to cancel 250,000,000 or so people based on their skin color, you gotta start somewhere.
    "Things should be made as simple as possible, but not one bit simpler." ~ Albert Einstein

  3. #13
    Senior Member jp1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan View Post
    I guess if you're going to cancel 250,000,000 or so people based on their skin color, you gotta start somewhere.
    I just checked on wikipedia. You can still read all about Father Damien there. And all the civil war traitors that have been falsely honored with statues all these years. No cancellation has happened to them.

  4. #14
    Simpleton Alan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jp1 View Post
    I just checked on wikipedia. You can still read all about Father Damien there. And all the civil war traitors that have been falsely honored with statues all these years. No cancellation has happened to them.
    I wonder if 10 years from now this will be proven false?

    I know that after travelling all over this country one site I've never gotten around to is Stone Mountain in Georgia. We're thinking about heading that way soon just so we can see it before it's blown to hell. I'm curious to know if that makes me an evil racist traitor sympathizer or just a guy who'd like to see something neat before it's gone?
    "Things should be made as simple as possible, but not one bit simpler." ~ Albert Einstein

  5. #15
    Senior Member jp1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan View Post
    I wonder if 10 years from now this will be proven false?
    How much money are you willing to place on that happening? I'll happily take you up on that bet.

  6. #16
    Senior Member iris lilies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bae View Post
    I recall seeing Kamehameha I there as well.
    Yes. This Hawaiian King is also there, one of two statues chosen and donated by Hawaiians to represent their state.

    I had to read up on the Hall of Statuary.. The Hall of Statuary is a conceptual Hall, having expanded over decades due to overcrowding. Statues are now placed all over the Capitol grounds due to crowding in statuary hall. Each state is allowed two.


    My take on this is: while Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez has a general point, specifically it’s none of her damn business what the state of Hawaii chooses to submit as a statue to represent themselves. Until she becomes an elected official of the state of Hawaii, she needs to tend to business for her own state. I think it’s nice that AOC and Trump and etc. have time to quack on about things irrelevant to their job.


    For the purpose of this topic, a gloss is needed for anyone reading up on it:


    AOC =Alexandria Ocasio- Cortez


    AOC= Architect of the Capital, the bureaucrat in charge of Statuary Hall


    Both are players in this game, And the acronym AOC is used interchangeably in articles about this issue.

  7. #17
    Simpleton Alan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jp1 View Post
    How much money are you willing to place on that happening? I'll happily take you up on that bet.
    Sorry, I don't gamble. I learned my lesson as a new Airman in the Air Force (probably before you were born). We were paid once per month and there were always a few poker and blackjack games going on in the barracks on payday. I lost two paychecks in a row and decided I wouldn't do that again, and I haven't.
    "Things should be made as simple as possible, but not one bit simpler." ~ Albert Einstein

  8. #18
    Senior Member iris lilies's Avatar
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    Here in the epicenter of Ferguson wokeness, My city is putting up a new piece of statuary that references the struggle of African Americans in slavery. We already have a very important reference point in that piece of history, the courthouse where Dredd Scott was determined to be property. That was a landmark case.

    I don’t have a problem with this new piece of statuary. I don’t even have a problem with Removing a piece of statuary recently from a city park, a statue commemorating confederacy soldiers, bought and erected by their daughters more than 100 years ago. I think public art has its time, and can wane in importance, Or can become irrelevant which is as bad as becoming offensive.

    So I am OK with public art going up, and coming down. In our recent case, the statue in question found a home and will be cared for.

    But I am dreading an attack on George Washington in my local neighborhood park which is an important piece of statuary. It is one of seven casts of the original Houdon sculpture that stands in Virginia’s statehouse. We have spent real money to restore parts of it.

  9. #19
    Senior Member JaneV2.0's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by catherine View Post
    Just a couple of weeks ago I was completely appalled by the AOC news du jour about Yoho's verbal attack on her. I think she handled it beautifully, as her remarks on C-SPAN attest.

    AOC has three strikes against her before she even gets out of the dugout. 1. she's young. 2. she's female. 3. she's Hispanic.
    I couldn't count the really vile remarks I see on FB about her--remarks that have nothing to do with her politics. It's as if her election and her work and her life mean nothing--everyting she has done is negated by the circumstances of her birth. I have heard many males, family members included, call her dumb, dismiss her election to Congress, and use the same language Yoho used to describe her.

    So that is the frame of reference from which she has come to view the culture--one in which male successes make them a saint and earn them statues and one in which female successes make them reviled, or even worse, invisible.

    I know you males don't agree with me, but there it is. Shirley Chisholm (who had two strikes against her) said that in her life she was far more discriminated against on the basis of her gender than her race.
    I voted for Shirley Chisholm, and I remember her saying that. Ocasio-Cortez is often dismissed as being "dumb," which is mind-boggling to me, as I doubt the men criticizing her have remotely achieved what she has. Stupid men feel threatened apparently, by women and POC who are clearly worlds ahead of them.

  10. #20
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    In Boston controversy is swirling about a statue of Lincoln:

    https://boston.cbslocal.com/2020/06/...n-mayor-walsh/

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