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Thread: Long-term economics of the pandemic

  1. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teacher Terry View Post
    Tammy, all good ideas. If there was a universal income you might have people moving to rural areas where COL is lower because they wouldn’t be so dependent on jobs. This could be either good or bad. Good if people used the time to have huge gardens, etc or to pursue passions such as art and they wouldn’t have to worry about the level of sales. Bad if people just sat idle, developed substance abuse issues because of boredom, etc. SSDI recipients should be excluded because their benefits are based on work history and frequently more than what UI would be.
    Still early in this discussion, but I don't think a universal income should mean people shouldn't "work". There are all kinds of jobs that folks could do - even on a rotating/short term basis. Some things that come to mind include clean-up of various parks, beaches, highways, various volunteer jobs such as Meals on Wheels, hospital helpers (aka old-fashioned Candy Stripers), assisting at public libraries, etc. And I don't mean for these to take away from already salaried employees, but as "help". And, also, having all necessary back-ground/security checks for those areas that would need/require such a thing. Just throwing out some ideas.
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  2. #72
    Senior Member razz's Avatar
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    Why does the term universal income mean only government payments? I have believed, perhaps incorrectly, that a universal income meant that there was a base income defined but regular employment would continue, only to be topped up by supplemental benefits when needed to meet the defined base.. Those unable to work would still have to meet the same criteria as they do at present.

    A Scandinavian country tried a full government base income for two years to test the idea for those unable to find employment. Their conclusion that it didn't help anyone. People need to change their jobs or location if necessary. Jobs could be changed by education, training or apprenticing different skills.

    https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2019/...is-it-working/
    https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2018/...Rutger-Bregman

    BTW, I have watched a number of sources where the physically compromised with excellent job skills are now employed by working from home where their support structure was in place. Companies did not have to create accessible settings onsite for them.

  3. #73
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    the main problem has always seemed to be that it is highly likely to be inflationary. You get $1000 a month, your landlord raises your rent by $1000 a month in response. Cheers! Or tell me why that won't happen? Seems better to make the necessities of life cheaper.
    If you want something to get done, ask a busy person. If you want them to have a nervous breakdown that is.

  4. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by razz View Post
    Why does the term universal income mean only government payments? I have believed, perhaps incorrectly, that a universal income meant that there was a base income defined but regular employment would continue, only to be topped up by supplemental benefits when needed to meet the defined base.. Those unable to work would still have to meet the same criteria as they do at present.
    I see what you are saying, but I thought that was basically what a minimum wage was.
    To give pleasure to a single heart by a single act is better than a thousand heads bowing in prayer." Mahatma Gandhi
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  5. #75
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    I will say that if the basic income only goes to those who most need it, it will not be inflationary in the way I described, only a UNIVERSAL basic income (like Andrew Yang's proposal) would be.

    I don't see why raising the minimum wage wouldn't be a the first way to try to deal with the problem either though, why subsidize low wages?
    If you want something to get done, ask a busy person. If you want them to have a nervous breakdown that is.

  6. #76
    Senior Member catherine's Avatar
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    Since Andrew Yang is the big proponent of the UBI, here is how he explained it, as well as the rationale.

    Basically, everyone gets it. It's not welfare, and it's not a supplement. It's just a check in the mail to be used by anyone for anything, which he says will stimulate the economy. So if you don't need it to pay your bills, you can go out to dinner.

    I get what ANM is saying, though. I can see the opportunistic danger of inflation scooping that up. But, who knows.
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  7. #77
    Senior Member Yppej's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by razz View Post
    Why does the term universal income mean only government payments?
    Some nonprofits have run UBI pilot projects. It does not have to be government money.

  8. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yppej View Post
    Some nonprofits have run UBI pilot projects. It does not have to be government money.
    Yes, but only governments have pockets deep enough to go beyond small scale experiments into permanent programs because only governments have the power to tax and redistribute income on the scale required.

  9. #79
    Senior Member Yppej's Avatar
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    I heard on the radio a supermarket chain in the area has 1000 jobs to fill. The job market is shifting with the demise of restaurants.

  10. #80
    Senior Member jp1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yppej View Post
    I heard on the radio a supermarket chain in the area has 1000 jobs to fill. The job market is shifting with the demise of restaurants.
    That makes sense. And one of our members has jumped on the new opportunity.

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