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Thread: Preparing for death

  1. #11
    Yppej
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    It shouldn't be as complicated as it is.

    I like the ideas of a burial tree as described in Returning to Earth by Jim Harrison or sky burial, both Native American practices that are now outlawed although sky burial is successfully practiced elsewhere by Parsis and Tibetans.

    A special interest lobby has convinced our government that the practices original to our continent are wrong and must be replaced by expensive and in many cases toxic practices. Even with a growing Muslim population green burial, which does not use toxic chemicals, is rarely allowed.

    People usually don't get to wash and wrap their dead, which was common in colonial times, or to hold wakes in the home of the deceased, also once the norm. An industry has taken over a key milestone, and government allows them and them only to sign off on how we exit this world.

    I hope you are able to find simplicity and peace as you make these plans.

  2. #12
    Senior Member catherine's Avatar
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    Wow.. This thread instantly makes me think of past regrets--things that I'm ashamed of regarding my mother. I have a very unmaterialistic view of death. I have no intention of having my body hermetically sealed in an expensive box taking up real estate in a cemetery. I truly look at my body as the skin of a snake that I will shed unceremoniously when I die.

    This attitude is fine for me, but I realized shortly after my mother died how "radical"--maybe inappropriately so--my beliefs in this area were. When she died, we were going to cremate her (her wishes) and she was going to be put in a closed casket for the wake. It didn't even occur to me to bring something for the funeral home to dress her in. Once my brother asked me to, I certainly did find an outfit for her, but I gave it no significance whatsoever. Same thing with the urn. We were going to scatter her ashes in the Long Island Sound, where she, like I, spent wonderful summers. But our memorial service/scattering of the ashes was to take place a few months later, in the spring, when it was warmer and my brother had recovered from a heart incident. It never occurred to me to buy a fancy urn in the meantime. So when we took out her ashes to walk over to the dock where we were going to scatter them, my older brother quipped, Mmmm. Nestle Quik! Because it was just in the utilitarian rectangular tin box that the crematorium provided for free. The way I behaved with regard to my mother's funeral could easily be misconstrued as lack of respect, but it really wasn't. Of course I loved my mother, and we had a beautiful memorial service for her. It's just that I knew she was "somewhere else."

    So, I think it's great, Tybee, that you are thinking seriously about this now. My MIL was an earth sign (Taurus), and was much more materialistic than I.. and we knew for decades before she died that she wanted to be buried in the gown that she wore to my/DH's wedding. And she was. She also was the last one in in the plot of 4 that she purchased way back when her husband died in 1965, and which also accommodates her parents. The plot is at Kensico Cemetery, which is absolutely beautiful, and it's where there are a ton of celebrities buried--her husband had wanted to be buried on a hill, and that's where they are--overlooking the Westchester valleys. I've never seen a more beautiful cemetery, and it was so like my MIL to get the best in this type of situation.

    We have no other elders to worry about in the family. We are the elders. So, honestly, I have no attachment to my body. Donate it to science, give me a burial at sea, cremate me and put me in a shoebox with the ashes of my two dogs. Whatever. DH wants to be cremated, and he has specified where he wants his ashes scattered. I will insist that he is cremated in his kilt (his cheaper one--not the expensive one).
    "Do any human beings ever realize life while they live it--every, every minute?" Emily Webb, Our Town
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  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yppej View Post
    It shouldn't be as complicated as it is.

    I like the ideas of a burial tree as described in Returning to Earth by Jim Harrison or sky burial, both Native American practices that are now outlawed although sky burial is successfully practiced elsewhere by Parsis and Tibetans.

    A special interest lobby has convinced our government that the practices original to our continent are wrong and must be replaced by expensive and in many cases toxic practices. Even with a growing Muslim population green burial, which does not use toxic chemicals, is rarely allowed.

    People usually don't get to wash and wrap their dead, which was common in colonial times, or to hold wakes in the home of the deceased, also once the norm. An industry has taken over a key milestone, and government allows them and them only to sign off on how we exit this world.

    I hope you are able to find simplicity and peace as you make these plans.
    Thank you, Yppej, that is very kind.

  4. #14
    Senior Member iris lilies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yppej View Post
    It shouldn't be as complicated as it is.

    I like the ideas of a burial tree as described in Returning to Earth by Jim Harrison or sky burial, both Native American practices that are now outlawed although sky burial is successfully practiced elsewhere by Parsis and Tibetans.

    A special interest lobby has convinced our government that the practices original to our continent are wrong and must be replaced by expensive and in many cases toxic practices. Even with a growing Muslim population green burial, which does not use toxic chemicals, is rarely allowed.

    People usually don't get to wash and wrap their dead, which was common in colonial times, or to hold wakes in the home of the deceased, also once the norm. An industry has taken over a key milestone, and government allows them and them only to sign off on how we exit this world.

    I hope you are able to find simplicity and peace as you make these plans.
    Oh I don’t think that “toxic chemicals “ are as widespread as they once were. Mr. Google says 50% of bodies in the United States are embalmed. Also, your loved one can go from the hospital morgue directly to the crematorium in my state. Easy Peezy. Cost around $650.

    Muslims are not the only ones not embalmed. Jews are not embalmed. My mother wasn’t embalmed. But I wouldn’t say that embalming is the only complex body ritual, the Jews have their stuff.

    I have no regrets about my father because he stated very clearly multiple times that it didn’t matter how his body was disposed of.those who are left behind need to do what brings them comfort. I think my mother made some kind of dumb choices about him, but that’s fine. It was her decision, she could afford it, and in the end it did not matter to me.

  5. #15
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    " Mr. Google says 50% of bodies in the United States are involved. "

    I love this auto-correct. Sounds like the other 50% are raptured straight to heaven.

  6. #16
    Senior Member iris lilies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tybee View Post
    " Mr. Google says 50% of bodies in the United States are involved. "

    I love this auto-correct. Sounds like the other 50% are raptured straight to heaven.
    Yes! I think that is what happens! Haha

    I fixed it.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by catherine View Post
    I will insist that he is cremated in his kilt (his cheaper one--not the expensive one).
    That is very Scots of you, frugal and sensible.

    My son already took my father's tuxedo, raincoat, and white linen summer suit. They fit him perfectly, and he wore the raincoat yesterday. That makes me happy, as he looks so much like my father.

  8. #18
    Senior Member razz's Avatar
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    Well, you have your priorities. Each person is guided by personal choice, belief systems, changing trends, political persuasions, etc.

    The US experience may also be different than the Canadian.

    A large number of us walk in the local cemetery because it is large and pretty with old trees, a lovely southerly breeze especially in the summer and we regulars visit when we meet. We also see the different funeral choices that others make.

    Over the past 10-15 years, the number of concrete crypts which enclose the coffin has reduced significantly, a lot more holes for urns than coffins are prepared, the columbarium for ashes is in great demand which meant additions needed. There is a lot of history with family plots holding space for later generations.
    I am surprised at the number of death who choose no notification, a cremation and no memorial simply interment of ashes in an urn.

    DH and I had decided years before to do the absolute minimum needed to dispose of the body and donate a sum of money to the community needs rather than a funeral or tombstone. So that is what I did. A simple notification of death in the paper with my favourite photo of him and his ashes were scattered around his favourite spot in our farm's woodlot. Some people were startled by the simplicity, possibly disapproved of the lack of ritual but our family decided what to do. I have no regrets.

    I have prepaid for a pick-up from place of death, a simple cremation in a cardboard coffin, a box of ashes to be given to family and scattered in a green space or under a tree that is planted. Cost $3600. When family is notified of my passing, they are to contact the funeral director who ensures that it all is completed according to plan. I have given my kids any of DH's tools etc, that they might want, a lump sum of money and downsized substantially so I am not concerned about anything further. I expect to live for another 25 years.

    I expect that the dealing with death will continue to change in a number of ways.

    Just one suggestion - contact a local community hall if you wish a simple catered remembrance event as people do love to visit; of course, that means that once covid is cleared away.
    As Cicero said, “Gratitude is not only the greatest of virtues, but the parent of all the others.”

  9. #19
    Senior Member Teacher Terry's Avatar
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    When my friend died the crematorium picked her up from the nursing home and she was in her pajamas. Unless you are being buried I don’t think you get dressed in certain clothes. My mom picked out her outfit for being buried.

    I picked a beautiful urn for my mil. We used it at the funeral. She wanted her ashes scattered. Since then we have loaned it to a few people for their services. I want to be interred in it with all my dogs ashes mixed in. When my friend died I bought her a beautiful urn.

  10. #20
    Senior Member Simplemind's Avatar
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    Holy cow Razz, pick up, direct cremation and box of ashes to be scattered is only $600 (ish) here and that includes several copies of the death certificate. The prices for these services are all over the place (at least in the US) for basically the same service. Most people never think to check it and I advise making at least a couple of phone calls or use a great website I found called Funeralocity where you put in your zipcode and it will give you the prices within different mile ranges.

    In preparation for my mom's death I visited three funeral homes within a mile of each other. I asked for the same thing at all three and one was $550, another was $1500 and the last was $3000. I've since learned a lot about the funeral biz and boy oh boy..... it pays to do your homework. By the time my dad passed I knew exactly who what and where and it was stress free.

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