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Thread: Too many gun deaths going on.........

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by peggy View Post
    the fact is, it is pretty dang easy to buy a handgun in this country. Without any background check or waiting 3 days or whatever. Private sales are completely unregulated, as are gun show sales. But they shouldn't be.
    Where do you get your information from? All licensed dealers at gun shows must do a background check and have the buyer fill out form 4473 just like they would if they were at their place of business. As far as private sales, it depends on where you are at, some States you would have to go through an FFL holder, others you don't. So no, your claim that private sales are completely unregulated is as misinformed as your claim about gun show sales. It is also illegal to sell handguns across State lines without going through a FFL if you are a private seller.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by peggy View Post
    And those who resist reasonable gun legislation certainly have an agenda.
    so, you do not agree with the gun laws of NY. No surprise there, but I'd hardly call this 'confiscation' . These are the laws on those books, these guns don't comply, so the owners are given several options, one of which is get the gun within regulations and go on your merry, shootin' way.
    Why then would you object to reasonable, consistent laws across the states? This is what I want. And should be what all honest, reasonable gun owners want. Why should NY and California have different laws from Wyo and Co whose laws are different from Florida and Ohio? It's confusing and unnecessary.
    Any reasonable person would disagree with what's going on in NYC. The guns that are now illegal were legal when purchased and registered. They changed the magazine capacity law in 2010 to 5 rounds and are now going after the owners. There are rumors of court cases challenging what they're doing under ex post facto and bill of attainder Constitutional protections.

    So you want consistent laws nationwide huh? Let me guess...you would want NY, CA, Mass, IL, style restrictions rather than laws in peaceful places like Vermont? Wyoming had 5 murders via firearm...NY 517...seems like Wyoming's laws are working fine just like they are.

  3. #63
    Senior Member Tradd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peggy View Post
    Gun laws, on the books now, whether 10 or 1000, are ineffective. They do not work.
    Well, at least in Cook County (Chicago), they appear to not work because the state's attorney does not enforce them. Gang bangers are regularly charged with firearms laws violations, yet those charges are pled away very commonly.

    So bleating that gun laws on the books are ineffective in themselves is false. Enforcement of the current laws, as Bae has said before, would go a long way towards combating the problem of violent criminals. But you choose to conveniently ignore that fact and just charge that gun laws are ineffective.

  4. #64
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    And an addition to my "why aren't there laws about this" pondering:

    If my high school kid takes my shotgun to school to kill his teacher, why aren't there repercussions? Every law-abiding gun owner knows that firearms should be kept safe from children. Give me one good reason why a kid's parents shouldn't be held responsible -- and their right to have said firearm rescinded or temporarily suspended until they go through further training -- ? Oh, right. Because they're gun owners, and we're in Amurrica, where the only people who have to exercise personal responsibility are the poor.

    My kid shot somebody with my gun? Not my problem. I can't watch my kid 24/7 and shouldn't have to lock up my gun.
    I'm in poverty and would like some help? All my problem. Must have been something I did, or didn't do. Personal responsibility!

    And this:
    Registration leads to confiscation. Maybe not immediately, but eventually, yes.
    Is typical of the paranoia of some gun owners that keeps them from being a useful contributor to whatever conversation might lead to solutions. No restrictions, no registration, no limits, no background checks, no, no, no.




    What a fun country we live in.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by DocHolliday View Post
    Where do you get your information from?
    http://www.governing.com/gov-data/sa...-laws-map.html

    Where are you getting yours?

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by puglogic View Post
    What is your point? The link you shared confirms what I said.

  7. #67
    Senior Member peggy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tradd View Post
    Registration leads to confiscation. Maybe not immediately, but eventually, yes.

    No way, no how.

    That is something I will not compromise on. Period. And if you (and you know who you are) think I'm a yahoo, f'ing idiot, whatever, I don't really give a flying fig.

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ! Molon labe
    Do you own a car? Has it been confiscated? No..really? I thought registration leads to confiscation. Do you vote? Have YOU been confiscated? What about your drivers license? Are they going door to door to confiscate drivers? Has your pet been confiscated? Are they lining up old people, registered for SS, to confiscate? When they count your toilets in a census, do they then come to confiscate your toilet?

    ((sigh)) No, registration DOES NOT lead to confiscation. This is a total BS straw man argument fed to the less than stellar (low information) mass. It's just registration. And maybe a way to keep some of the guns off the street. And what, exactly, about that do you object to? Those of us who don't think it should be a free for all no weapon restricted society see what this unregulated NRA wet dream of a civilization is doing to our country, and we want to try, at least, to do something about it.

    Maybe you are comfortable with tens of thousands of gun deaths a year, but I will never for the life of me understand why any HONEST, NON-CRIMINAL person would have reservations about reasonable regulations for a weapon (tool, if you want) that has a single, sole, solitary purpose, to kill. That is the only purpose for a gun. That is what it is designed for, and it does that quite effectively. It kills. People, animals, whatever it is aimed at. It kills. That is what guns are for. TO KILL.

    The real question is, why don't YOU want to reduce gun deaths? Why do YOU want unrestricted gun ownership for just about anyone who wants one? why are YOU against reducing gun violence and deaths?

  8. #68
    Simpleton Alan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peggy View Post
    The real question is, why don't YOU want to reduce gun deaths? Why do YOU want unrestricted gun ownership for just about anyone who wants one? why are YOU against reducing gun violence and deaths?
    Owning a gun doesn't logically lead to violence and death. In some cases, owning a gun may prevent it.

    Here's an example:
    "Things should be made as simple as possible, but not one bit simpler." ~ Albert Einstein

  9. #69
    Senior Member Tradd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peggy View Post

    ((sigh)) No, registration DOES NOT lead to confiscation. This is a total BS straw man argument fed to the less than stellar (low information) mass. It's just registration. And maybe a way to keep some of the guns off the street. And what, exactly, about that do you object to? Those of us who don't think it should be a free for all no weapon restricted society see what this unregulated NRA wet dream of a civilization is doing to our country, and we want to try, at least, to do something about it.

    Maybe you are comfortable with tens of thousands of gun deaths a year, but I will never for the life of me understand why any HONEST, NON-CRIMINAL person would have reservations about reasonable regulations for a weapon (tool, if you want) that has a single, sole, solitary purpose, to kill. That is the only purpose for a gun. That is what it is designed for, and it does that quite effectively. It kills. People, animals, whatever it is aimed at. It kills. That is what guns are for. TO KILL.

    The real question is, why don't YOU want to reduce gun deaths? Why do YOU want unrestricted gun ownership for just about anyone who wants one? why are YOU against reducing gun violence and deaths?
    Holy crap, Peggy, and you call gun owners unreasonable? Paint with a broad brush much?

    Being against registration does not mean a responsible gun owner is against restrictions for those with criminal records, a history of violence, demonstrated mental health issues, etc.

    Yes, that's right, a gun is to kill. And that's why I practice a great deal, to be able to be effectively protect myself. But then in your mind, someone who has a gun and actually <gasp! oh, the horror! oh, the humanity!> practices with it must have some diseased mind. Well, you know what, bully for you! Must be doing something right if I've peeved off a liberal.

    And you say registration doesn't lead to confiscation? Look up the High River gun grab this past summer in High River, Alberta, where the RCMP forcibly broke into homes of people kept away after a flood and took their guns and ammo. They knew what homes to target due to the now defunct Canadian long gun registry. The records were supposed to be destroyed, but the RCMP still seem to have had electronic access to the information.

    http://www.calgarysun.com/2013/12/09...bertas-floods1

  10. #70
    Senior Member bae's Avatar
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    As I said, not much point to this discussion.

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