Are you a leader or a follower? [Archive]

iris lilies

8-6-14, 12:13am

DH and I talk about this a lot. A LOT! We are followers. We are worker bees. We do not want to be President, we want to set up tents and write emails and drive trucks and organize parties and pull weeds and etc.

That said, we've chaired house tours and major fundraisers and special events for our neighborhood that have brought in thousands of dollars. But we do not want to be The Prez.

And now that I am older, I have even LESS interest in organizing humans. I just want to go out and do work, I do not want to wheedle work out of volunteers ugh, that is too much like the work I get paid to do.

We have a very strong neighborhood organization that runs through $100,000 annually, so it's like a small business. Each year we get a new President. Some are weak and truly do not know WTF they are getting into. I have to wonder where their brains are, but--!!!--I always support the person who stepped up into the role because guess what--I didn't and some one has to do it, haha. Back in the days when DH and I had real power in the 'nabe, all of our friends were running through the Presidency of the neighborhood, and t was fun, those were active days.

Now the younger people have stepped up and run the organization, just like we did 20 years ago. Bless their hearts. DH bitches and moans about "the young people" but I think it is great.

Meanwhile, we are active in the sister organization, the Park Conservancy. I've got ideas for selling iris and lilies at the farmers' market next summer, to benefit the Conservancy. We shall see how that goes.

herbgeek

8-6-14, 5:21am

I'm typically a leader. I over think/over analyze everything, so that the idea/solution i come up with is often better than other alternatives suggested. I grew up in a family that stressed not sticking out and going along with the crowd, and it wasn't until my 30s where I had the confidence to speak up. I found quickly that I was saying what other people were thinking but we're to scared to say our loud.

razz

8-6-14, 7:13am

Funny to see this thread now as I was thinking about this but along the line of innovators and adopters http://www.ou.edu/deptcomm/dodjcc/groups/99A2/theories.htm.

Leaders need to be aware of the mindset of the group, recognize the unique talents of each and then find the best role for them. I know that I am an innovator so people look to me for the ideas but I need and step back to a supportive team to make it all work and that team often does not happen - egos, power struggles, biases, etc. When it does, it is wonderful to see.

I do see situations more in terms of the mindset of each person involved rather than the person in the making of a leader.

awakenedsoul

8-6-14, 8:08pm

Thanks for all the replies. In work and at home I've always been given leadership positions. I like being under a great leader, though. I'd rather dance in a Broadway show with a fabulous creative team than own my own business. I guess I like both...but I'm not a good follower when it comes to Argentine Tango.

Anybody else?

bae

8-6-14, 8:15pm

I am a chameleon, my outlook depends entirely on the situation and the resources.

Manage a great nation as you would cook a delicate fish.

To govern men in accord with nature
It is best to be restrained;
Restraint makes agreement easy to attain,
And easy agreement builds harmonious relationships;
With sufficient harmony no resistance will arise;
When no resistance arises, then you possess the heart of the nation,
And when you possess the nation's heart, your influence will long endure:
Deeply rooted and firmly established.
This is the method of far sight and long life.

Blackdog Lin

8-6-14, 9:50pm

pcooley

8-6-14, 11:05pm

I would say I'm neither. I really don't like telling other people what to do. I'm an awful supervisor. But also, I don't like being told what to do. I'm lucky in my job that I have a lot of latitude for creativity as to how I get things done. I've been switching everything over from Excel spreadsheets to Access databases, and I'm having fun with that. But ideally, what I've always aimed for, is being sort of an anarchist Buddhist hermit type. (I would not do well in an organized Buddhist group). I like being out in the mountains, on my own, with no schedules and no one to entertain or look after.

In any of my relationships, I have been bad about waiting to see what my partner, (and now my wife), wants to do. I feel rude if I say, "OK, I'm heading out to climb Lake Peak now." My wife likes to come home from work and watch television shows on Netflix. I have NEVER wanted to be in a house where passively watching shows is a form of entertainment, (though I do like a movie once or twice a month). I would much rather read, or translate Chinese, but I end up sitting on the sofa with my wife because a) I really do like spending the time with her, and b) I feel like I'm being rude if I shut myself up in my office. I'm not sure if that's really a "follower" trait. I'm just trying to be polite and spend time with my S.O. even if I don't like the activity.

awakenedsoul

8-6-14, 11:40pm

I don't know. It's all interesting to me. It sounds like you compromise, which is considerate. I'm sure your wife appreciates it. I just think it's a question that makes you see how you are in different situations and with different people. It really becomes apparent in a group. When I was going to knitting groups, all of the women kept saying to the leader, "I want to make that," and they'd point at what I was wearing. They weren't interested in the leader's patterns or ideas. I didn't intend for that, I kind of marched to the beat of my own drummer. I would find patterns I thought were interesting or flattering. I was shocked at how many of the knitters were followers. I don't mean it as a criticism, just an observation. They would depend on the leader to do every stitch with them. I was more interested in learning the skills so that I could be independent and work on my own. If they made a mistake, most of the women would just wait for the class or group and ask the teacher. They didn't memorize the methods or techniques. I took a workshop on fixing mistakes.

In shows, people would always ask me to help them with the choreography or to teach them yoga. I usually would give a warm up before the show. Teaching was a great side income for me. Same thing happened in knitting groups. People would ask me to help them or if I could fix their mistakes. (I could.) My mind just works that way. Even in my sight singing class, if the students didn't understand something, and the teacher didn't see why, I could see exactly where their confusion was, and why. (I had a lot of master teachers. They were incredible.)

When I was in Vienna, I had a wonderful boyfriend. Because I didn't speak German, he would ask me what I wanted, order for me, pick out these romantic restaurants and cafes, etc. I learned to follow and be more passive. It was really nice. He was a natural leader. When with his friends, they always would ask his advice, and defer to him. I told him he was like a lion...

Keep em comin'! I'm surprised at some of the replies. Blackdog Lin, you sound like a leader to me in your posts. I guess we all do both, depending on the situation.

How do other people see you?

herbgeek

8-7-14, 5:48am

I have a different definition of "leader" than you, Paul. I see a leader as someone with an idea/vision that other people want to voluntarily join in on. I don't think a true leader is the same sort of person that wants to tell others what to do. I'd call that a micro manager, or a control freak. :)

I've worked under a few great leaders, and all of them made the vision so compelling, you couldn't help but want to participate. I would find myself asking how can I get in on this and help. I've also worked with people who just saw the "leadership" position as a way to exercise control over others, or as some sort of status for themself. This type of person doesn't get the best out of people, if they comply, its typically begrudgingly and only to the letter of the law.

I tend to be an accidental leader, because I speak up with my ideas and others often find them a good idea to try. At work, I do have a leadership role (project management) which really uses my talents well. In social situations, I try to tone it down a bit but like Blacklin will step up when no one else will make a decision -- as I said earlier in the thread, I tend to think about things more than other people do, and I also tend to see trends developing before other people do, so I've already had time to think about alternatives. As a result, when I do speak up I often have a better idea. Not because my ideas are inherently better, but because I've had more time to think through the possibilities and ramifications of any decision.

Following a strong leader is fine for me too, its nice to have the break. But I can't "follow" a weak leader or one drunk on power. Then I just go and do my own thing.

Gregg

8-7-14, 8:51am

I've usually gravitated toward leadership roles, some by choice and some just because everyone else got their name out of the hat first. In work situations I've never been comfortable with inflexible schedules devised by someone who doesn't know $@#^ about my life so have almost always been self-employed, which requires leadership thinking. The most ironic part is that now that I should have a little bit of wisdom from decades of trial and error (lots of the latter) I'm also less interested in leading anyone else. At home I'd be happy to let DW wear the pants, but she insists on an equal partnership arrangement.

awakenedsoul

8-7-14, 10:22am

It sounds like a lot of us are dropping some of the responsibility that comes with leadership. When I worked as a dance captain/asst. director on some of the shows, people would tell me I was really good at it. But, I realized I preferred just being responsible for myself. It was hard dealing with people who created conflict or were doing stuff on stage that was unprofessional. I was the one that had to confront them.

I like hearing what leadership means to you, personally. Reading everyone's posts has made me see that I've worked with some exceptional leaders in my career. Directors Tommy Tune, James Jameson, and Nick Castle...They were all quiet, inspired, creative men. We really respected and admired them. They hired exceptionally talented people. They also picked personalities that meshed well together. The older I get, the more I appreciate those experiences. I always tried to emulate them when I was put in a position of leadership.

happystuff

8-7-14, 4:45pm

It really depends on the situation, the other people involved, etc. Sometimes I lead and sometimes I follow.

awakenedsoul

8-7-14, 6:47pm

happystuff, Can you elaborate? (If you have time and it's not too much trouble....)

I was thinking how leadership reveals itself in childhood. My 5th grade teacher used to have me write down the homework for whoever was sick that day. (This was in addition to writing my own assignments.) He was very old school: He wrote the math problems on the chalkboard, and everyone copied them on newsprint for homework. I was "the babysitter" at home and in the neighborhood from a very young age.

I was watching a video clip on Youtube of one of Charles Manson's followers. It was shocking to me the behavior these young women engaged in for and with him. I guess drugs had a lot to do with it. I always had an inner radar that warned me away from following those types. They hook people, though. It's eerie.

But, I think being a healthy follower is a great thing. They get things done and keep things moving. That way there aren't too many cooks in the kitchen.

ToomuchStuff

8-7-14, 8:17pm

Neither, either or both (as the situation dictates). I have situations where I follow (things like instruction manuals are made for that purpose), because someone has more experience then I do. I've had situations where I am in charge of a group, but still have to answer to someone (even CEO's have to answer to a board and shareholders). But in a lot of ways, I just prefer to be off on my own.
I would generally say the more extroverted might lead, while introverted might follow, but either can choose to go off on their own.

awakenedsoul

8-7-14, 8:30pm

I see what you mean. I remember my dad telling me, "Even when you own your own business, you still are working for your customers."

Lainey

8-7-14, 8:37pm

Lilke many others, I've been both over my adult years. And I agree that with many situations you only need to have a little foresight and vision to figure out how to proceed.

But I think it's also a fairness situation: in any church, social, or community groups that I've belonged to, I felt it's only fair to step up at some point and volunteer some leadership. That could mean either organizing an event, or taking a Board position, or similar. It's not forever, it's just for a few years and then it should rotate to someone else.

On the workfront I've been fortunate to have senior management who are open to all suggestions and ideas, and they like what I propose then I can run with it. It motivates me to take on more leadership of projects or events. Contrast that with jobs I've had many years ago where the bosses were micro-managers, and who basically crush any leadership initiative in its infancy because the idea didn't come from them. I much prefer my current position.

kathryn

8-8-14, 9:31am

I tend to be a follower. Most of the time I'm ok with that, but I wish there were times when I would have had the courage to be a leader. I think the only time I feel comfortable enough to speak up is when I see an injustice. Otherwise I think I lack the confidence to be a leader.

Sad Eyed Lady

8-8-14, 9:47am

As a serious introvert, I aspire to just be a follower in all aspects. In actuality, my whole life, I end up being a leader, in that I end up in groups/situations where SOMEONE needs to make a decision, and no one will, so I end up saying "okay, we're gonna do it this way, ok?"

A leader by default - that's me.
The same here. I don't WANT to be a leader, but more than not in a group situation I tend to be the one who does the organizing, scheduling, the getting things done part. I wonder at this often, how it happens when I don't want or mean for it to. A couple of examples: A few years ago I started a book club to get together once a month to choose a book to read and discuss. We met at night at our local library which is closed nights. I would get the key for the meeting room, go in, get the room set up, coffee pot going, hot water going for tea, set out cups, tea bags etc. Order the books for next month, (we were able to get them through a program in our library so we did not have to buy the books), make sure the books got returned and close up, lock the room and return the key to the library. The book club, after a bit, seemed to settle into just the right mix of people who really enjoyed it. So, after a few year of doing this I thought it had taken on a life of it's own and would go on with or without me. I told the group I was taking a break but I hoped they continued since everyone seemed to enjoy it so much. They never met again after that night!

At my congregation we participate in an International Festival held once a year in the city. This town has a large and growing ethnic population and the festival is well attended and colorful. I have been in it for years and this year very politely said "I have been in our booth for years and would like to take a break this year". We'll see. So far it seems to be falling on deaf ears. Not sure this really qualifies as "leading" but in some aspects there it does as there are things no one else "thinks" to do for some reason.

So, a leader by default who would like to be a follower - or just a bystander sometimes!

Aqua Blue

8-8-14, 9:52am

When I was working, I always rose like cream to the top. Even now, I have ended up the unofficial director of groups. I am very much an introvert which actually I think made it easier to be the "boss" ; I really don't need positive strokes from coworkers. I get my recharge from being alone. On the other hand I felt I was a good coworker. I was respectful and made every effort to know the job and do it well(which meant when there was an opening I ended up moving up)>

Rosemary

8-8-14, 5:49pm

In family activities, I am the leader. DH is fine with that most of the time. When we have a home repair project to do, it can be difficult because we both know the best way to solve the problem, and our ideas are not the same! So we usually work on different projects. When we travel, I am also the leader and will never take a tour because of my need to be in charge of my day.

In work situations I avoided management positions, although they were offered more than once. I did not want to spend my life at work. However I enjoyed leading my own projects.

awakenedsoul

8-8-14, 5:58pm

These are all great responses. Thanks. I really appreciate it. I think as we get older, we really start to value our time. So, even if we have strong leadership skills, we might not want to be fully booked.
kathryn, Welome! I speak up if there is an injustice, too.
Lainey, Glad to hear you enjoy your current position. What you described is so important in your work, in order to enjoy it.
Sad Eyed Lady, I can relate! It sounds like you are very responsible and dependable...a caretaker. It sounds like the situation was out of balance, though. (where you were pulling all the weight.)
Aqua Blue, I feel the same way. I have a lot of those same characteristics and responses. That's why I started the thread.

awakenedsoul

8-8-14, 6:00pm

Rosemary, That's a good solution for you and DH. I think you were wise to turn down the projects at work.

happystuff

8-12-14, 5:30pm

happystuff, Can you elaborate? (If you have time and it's not too much trouble....)

It's really as others have already written. If I have a responsibility in a particular area or job, I usually take on a more leadership role. If it is something where I am joining late, I tend to follow (leaders have usually already been decided - lol) However, whether I take a leader or follower role, I tend to give my input/opinions - lol.

SteveinMN

8-12-14, 6:51pm

Interesting question. I've been both, though not always out of choice.

- At work, I was the senior tester. Zero interest in supervision in that environment, though I have supervised elsewhere and did well. I was much happier managing my own work rather than exhorting a bunch of tired coworkers to yell this year's company slogan.
- At home, it's an equal partnership. In my first marriage, my wife was fairly passive. I didn't want to be the "cruise director" in that relationship, but it could not change. Now it's far more equal. DW makes the money and I spend it :D , which works for both of us.
- With my family, I'm the leader. My mom is at the age when she sometimes needs someone who can run the gamut for her. That can't be either of my siblings (my brother out of capacity; my sister out of self-interest), so it's me. Nothing I need to do for myself; just my view that this is what children do in healthy families.
- In volunteer situations, it seems I end up leading. I sit on a Board of Directors now. Frankly, the lack of organizational structure appalls/frightens me. Not that I need a rigid format or Robert's Rules at ever meeting. But a position description would be nice, y'know? Or maybe we should decide collectively if we want the newspaper editor to be appointing himself to paying opportunities outside of the newspaper? So the cleanup has fallen to me. In other organizations, I've ended up as officer many times. I think it ties to my notion that, if I'm going to spend my time on something, I'm in with both feet. If someone needs to lead, it can be me.
- With friends, it's a fine line. I'm always up for the new experience, so when friends suggest a get-together, I'm far more likely to suggest doing something we haven't done before, and people often agree to do it. I'll also ask for follow-up. A group of friends meets monthly for breakfast. I'm the one who asks at most breakfasts who's scheduling the next one. And I maintain the canonical list of email addresses. OTOH I don't think I would accept if they made me the person who sets up every breakfast.

Yup, quite variable. Works out fine most of the time so long as I'm true to myself.

awakenedsoul

8-12-14, 7:26pm

Loved your post Steve, thanks. It was very entertaining. I think that's the secret, being true to yourself. Anybody else?

meri

8-13-14, 4:51am

I am definitely not a leader and I am very uncomfortable when circumstances make me to take leadership (fortunately it doesn't happen that often). I like managing my own work and way of life in general and I am very independent introvert who finds it extremely difficult to ask others to do something (let alone give orders and demand obedience). Need to organize people and make decisions that have direct impact on others leaves me anxious and uncertain. I prefer to be left alone and do things my own way but usually don't have any issues with complying with rules set by the leader if that's what is required. Maybe I am too independent to be a true follower but following rules or finding a way around without breaking them is much more acceptable than trying to be a leader.

I admire the ability to be a good leader, make decisions, take responsibility, speak up and be firm. I admire it but it's not something I wish I had.

Aqua Blue

8-13-14, 9:24am

I think it would be interesting to know birth order and if you are a leader or not. I am an oldest of 4, so I got a lot of practice bossing younger siblings around, lol:cool:

awakenedsoul

8-13-14, 9:59am

I was thinking the same thing, Aqua Blue. I was second oldest, but the only girl. I was always put "in charge" because my older brother did things like teach himself to drive at 13 (on the freeway!) when my parents weren't home. He also spent a lot of time emulating Evil Knievel, which resulted in several trips to the hospital.

Florence

8-13-14, 1:30pm

I am a helper. I love to participate and I will share my ideas but I don't like to try to get others to do something. I am reliable, dependable, and responsible but like to do my part and let it go at that.

awakenedsoul

8-13-14, 3:41pm

Florence, I know what you mean. I feel the same way. When I was a dance captain, I didn't like having to discipline people. I was happier doing my own track, and going home. Once it became my responsibility, I didn't enjoy my work as much. So, I got out of management.

TxZen

8-13-14, 4:41pm

Leader in my work life, leader in my hobbies (I Like to plan things) and I think hubby and I are equals in our marriage. Sometimes, it seems like all I am doing is the worker bee stuff and then suddenly, I have to take charge. I am in the same in social circles. Sometimes, I Like to be up front and out there and other times it's a quiet conversation in a corner for me, people watching.

Spartana

8-18-14, 3:22pm

I was just thinking today how some people fall into leadership positions in their family, careers, etc. I always have. How about you? Are you a leader or a follower? Can you give examples in you work, hobbies, relationships, etc...

Which do you prefer? What about in your marriage or with you SO? If you're single, how about with your friends or when you're in a group? I'm just curious...I'd say I was a leader. But not the kind who does everything herself, more the kind that is very comfortable taking charge of things and then delegating duties to others. In my marriage or with friends I am also more of a taker-charger kind of person but prefer to have things on a more equal basis then I did in my professional live where I liked to be in charge in most cases.