View Full Version : and so the wedding planning begins
DD annouonced her engagement six months ago and finally has made time to start looking for venues and other details. I have been sitting on pins and needles because I know this will probably be a big expense for us and therefore we need to budget for it. If DD is soon to be 32, has lived with her fiancee for three years and makes more income than we do, what do you think is appropriate as far as our financial input? I need to have that talk with her. Obviously, I would pay for everything if we had the money, but also need to be realistic about how we spend our money these days. I know weddings don't have to be big, fancy affairs but that is a distinct possibility...
I was 30 when I got married. DH and I paid for our entire wedding. His mother hosted a rehearsal dinner but we did not ask her to do that, and we would have paid for that if she had let us. Although my parents had sufficient means, I had long considered myself completely independent and never considered asking them to pay any part of it.
awakenedsoul
8-8-14, 6:05pm
Are you set for your retirement? I would make that my first priority. Since your daughter makes more money than you do, it seems different than a 20 year old just starting out and getting married. Do you have other children? Did you give them money for their marriages? My parents gave each of my brothers $10,000. for their weddings. I'm single, so I didn't get the 10 grand. It sounded like a lot of money to me. I would trust your gut, especially in this economy and at this stage of your life.
I was 24 when I married, and it really was never an option that anyone other than us would pay for it. I'd been out of college for a couple of years, of course it was my responsbility to pay for it. And so we had something relatively small (50 people) because that was within our budget.
My brother reached out to my parents when he was in his late 30s, and he and his gf had been living together a number of years, and he went to my parents and expected them to pay for his wedding (he's the baby of the family, with a huge entitlement streak). When they replied they would give a generous gift, but not pay for the wedding, it turns out it really wasn't important enough to him to use his OWN money so they continue to live together without marriage. If it was important, they could have gone to a justice of the peace. My brother and his GF just wanted to have a lavish party on someone else's dime.
I certainly wouldn't provide an open ended arrangement, there's no incentive to be economical when you are using other people's money. I would offer what I would be comfortable giving, and either they work within their budget, or they work to afford the extras.
Miss Cellane
8-8-14, 6:33pm
I wouldn't ask what was reasonable. I'd look at my budget and DD's timeline for the wedding and figure out how much I *could* give and how much I *want* to give.
Also factor in things such as any travel to the wedding location and hotel stay if necessary, wedding and shower gifts, new clothes for you and other family members if you would need them, time off from work for the various events, the cost of a shower if you will be hosting one, etc.
Most of the couples I know that are getting married today finance the wedding with a combination of their own savings and some money from the parents. A few have paid for their weddings themselves. None of the weddings I've attended recently have been paid in full by the parents. (Not saying that still isn't done, but it is becoming increasingly rare.)
When you decide how much you want to give, tell your DD the amount and make it clear that is the extent of your contribution.
Another way to do this is pay for just one or two things. You might want to pay for her wedding dress, for example. Or the flowers. If you go this route, do give your DD a budget amount, so she doesn't start looking at $15,000 wedding dresses.
I second awakenedsoul. If DD is willing to take more from you than you can do, don't collude with her, as in your first priority is to take care of yourself.
iris lilies
8-8-14, 6:53pm
Have you not had any discussion about this financial issue? It's late in the game for this. Give only what you are comfortable giving. Given what you have shared about your daughter's lifestyle, this will not be a simple, economical wedding.
I personally wouldn't give a dime more than $5,000 since a simple, economical wedding can be had for that amount, that will finance a whole shindig.
My dad always told me while I was single "plan a wedding, then I'll give you the money and you can elope." I did elope, but didn't even plan a wedding, I was too bored by the concept. I was 35 and wouldn't have considered using their money, anyway.
Yes, Iris, we have had discussions but as I told her, tell me what you have in mind, and we'll figure the money part out. Thus far, I haven't gotten any details to consider like how many folks they intend to invite so it is has been hard to know. She seems to attend friend's weddings every month and they run the gamut. Some really get into being resourceful. It is also a weird situation because the in-laws are wealthy by our standards. In any case, this will be an interesting journey.
My son is getting married in late August and they are having 18 people, including themselves, for a wedding in a public park (there was a fee for that), they will host a dinner for immediate family the night before and a brunch for all of us the day of the wedding.
He told me that her family is not in a position to help, he and his fiancee have law school debt and that they would not ask us to foot the bill. We will give them a check that is an amount with which we are comfortable.
I know that they plan to have a party for their larger group of friends in the fall because, of course, their friends want to celebrate with them.
To me, it sounds like a perfectly lovely celebration!
Yes, Iris, we have had discussions but as I told her, tell me what you have in mind, and we'll figure the money part out. Thus far, I haven't gotten any details to consider like how many folks they intend to invite so it is has been hard to know. She seems to attend friend's weddings every month and they run the gamut. Some really get into being resourceful. It is also a weird situation because the in-laws are wealthy by our standards. In any case, this will be an interesting journey.
Perhaps she and fiancé plan to take care of it by themselves.
Have you not had any discussion about this financial issue? It's late in the game for this. Give only what you are comfortable giving. Given what you have shared about your daughter's lifestyle, this will not be a simple, economical wedding.
I personally wouldn't give a dime more than $5,000 since a simple, economical wedding can be had for that amount, that will finance a whole shindig.
My dad always told me while I was single "plan a wedding, then I'll give you the money and you can elope." I did elope, but didn't even plan a wedding, I was too bored by the concept. I was 35 and wouldn't have considered using their money, anyway.
Totally agree with IL - $5000. You will find that as they go through life together, there will be moments when you may be able to assist financially like paying for the grandchildren's lessons or something which will be much more important than one day that is over the top in expense. Get both your DH and you talking the same message though as there may be manipulation to spend more.
We have two daughters and gave them a gift of somewhat under this amount and said, "it is yours to spend as you wish but that is it!" They adjusted their spending plans to suit their budget. We did not take any $$ out of savings for these gifts as I had told them when they were in their teens that we would gift a modest amount based on our income at the time. DH was retired and I was starting a business so cash flow was limited.
The conversation with them in their teens was triggered by being told by the mother of a family who had taken a mortgage to pay for one wedding and then a second mortgage for the second wedding shortly afterward in the family and then the primary breadwinner's job was lost offshore. With that example, both girls were very realistic in their expectations of what we could give.
Teacher Terry
8-8-14, 7:55pm
When my oldest got married I gave them an amount that I could afford especially in light of the fact that between hubby & I we will need to give the same amount to the 4 other kids when they get married. Then it is up to them how to spend the $ on the wedding. My son & wife did not want to have extra expenses so they were frugal and had a nice wedding with 30 people for $2,000. One way we cut costs was that we had a sit down dinner on our patio and paid for a company to put up a large tent over the patio in case it rained & we rented tables, chairs, tablecloths, china, etc so it was elegant without breaking the bank. We had some of the food catered & some we made ourselves. A friend of ours that makes wedding cakes to sell made a beautiful one for their gift. One of my friends was the bartender and made the drinks for everyone. Someone actually thought we had hired her she did such a good job & tried to tip her. We bought a big variety of alcoholic & non-alcoholic beverages. I found a great photographer that only did it as a sideline so the cost was so much cheaper. He just gave us a disc with all the pics & released the copyright to us. It took a lot of planning but it had everything a wedding should have without being too expensive. They got married in a beautiful rose garden & we had to pay a small amount for that because they set up all the chairs, etc.
You and your DD might find this website helpful:
http://apracticalwedding.com/
iris lilies
8-9-14, 1:44pm
You and your DD might find this website helpful:
http://apracticalwedding.com/
This website started out as an alternative to the Big White Dress industry, but it is now its own money making commercial entity. buyer beware. The website owner is regularly pilloried on GOMI and I personally think it has sunk to typical obsession with Pinterest-type content. But there are still some articles that might, just might, be useful.
Today I chose a "Real Wedding" from the tab on that site and saw a wedding where where pretty people traipsed about in the woods and handpicked zinnias formed the reception table centerpieces. While it might have been a simple, inexpensive wedding, I recognized the bride's dress as a Jenny Packham and those go for around $5,000. So not so simple or practical, most likely.
I would like to give my opinion here, but I better not.
The website was interesting in that there are some area weddings profiled so I know the venues, etc.
I kind of dodged the bullet last year - my daughter and her fiance were in the states for the summer (they are and have been living in France), his family is in Australia. Since basically neither family could afford the trip, they had their wedding in San Francisco without either family there. I gave them a larger present than I would have, but a full wedding would have been much more.
rodeosweetheart
8-10-14, 2:49pm
We went to a gorgeous Austin wedding at some downtown mansion--cannot remember the name but it was over in the capitol district, and had live oaks in backyard, a brick patio, and lots of lights in the oaks, and then we went in for drinks and they rearranged the space into tables to eat and a dance floor.
No idea what it cost.
When I was in Portland scouting for venues for my son, I stumbled across the Multnomah Falls CCC stone building with outdoor patio and all inclusive wedding packages-- gosh it was gorgeous, and very reasonably priced--you could have done the whole wedding very affordably, they did everything, down to Champagne, cake, and chamber music. They ended up getting married in PA, but Austin seems to have lots of all inclusive interesting spaces and you could price it out, then perhaps split it up amongst the wedding couple and the parents--or you could just give them a set amount of money.
They could get married at one of those outdoor barbecue places. Can't remember the name of the one we went to but it was awesome.
I got married in a church and had the reception there, which was tres cheap and very pretty. Son got married in the Pennsylvania state capitol building, which was beautiful and free.
But if I were arranging/paying/doing it over (heaven forbid) I would head out to something like the Multnomah falls deal. You just count the number of guests, get a dress, and write a check.
We went to a gorgeous Austin wedding at some downtown mansion--cannot remember the name but it was over in the capitol district, and had live oaks in backyard, a brick patio, and lots of lights in the oaks, and then we went in for drinks and they rearranged the space into tables to eat and a dance floor.
No idea what it cost.
When I was in Portland scouting for venues for my son, I stumbled across the Multnomah Falls CCC stone building with outdoor patio and all inclusive wedding packages-- gosh it was gorgeous, and very reasonably priced--you could have done the whole wedding very affordably, they did everything, down to Champagne, cake, and chamber music. They ended up getting married in PA, but Austin seems to have lots of all inclusive interesting spaces and you could price it out, then perhaps split it up amongst the wedding couple and the parents--or you could just give them a set amount of money.
They could get married at one of those outdoor barbecue places. Can't remember the name of the one we went to but it was awesome.
I got married in a church and had the reception there, which was tres cheap and very pretty. Son got married in the Pennsylvania state capitol building, which was beautiful and free.
But if I were arranging/paying/doing it over (heaven forbid) I would head out to something like the Multnomah falls deal. You just count the number of guests, get a dress, and write a check.
I am always struck by the gorgeous places around my own city where one can host a party, but the thing is, the guest list can't be 250 people.
In my mind a really pretty, classy, and intimate party of 50 people, at a beautiful venue, is the best. Maybe push it up to 75 if absolutely required. There are so many fabulous old buildings and historic houses that will fit in this number.
But if one has in mind a Big Show of drinking and dancing where everyone must be invited and showered with favors and entertained, that limits the venues usually to characterless halls, hotel ballrooms, or pretty but incredibly pricey large venues and pushes up all costs tremendously. And if it has to be a Saturday night event, add more $$$.
I have a funny memory of taking dd to grad school in St Louis and seeing all these wedding party groups having their photos taken in the big park there - Forest something? It was surreal to see so many brides in one place. I suggested that we just rent an old Texas dance hall and hire a western swing band and have a big party. Knowing dd she will want something off the wall in any case - no sterile hotel banquet hall for her. I'm actually starting to get excited about it all.One of life's big moments...
We got married last year and our parents offered to split the catering bill between themselves (£350 each). We wouldn't have wanted them to contribute any more than that! However, my sister-in-law just got married and I think DH's parents dropped a couple grand for that... his dad was having to work much more than usual.
I hope your daughter doesn't *expect* you to make a contribution if they're able to foot the bill themselves.
This website started out as an alternative to the Big White Dress industry, but it is now its own money making commercial entity. buyer beware. The website owner is regularly pilloried on GOMI and I personally think it has sunk to typical obsession with Pinterest-type content. But there are still some articles that might, just might, be useful.
Today I chose a "Real Wedding" from the tab on that site and saw a wedding where where pretty people traipsed about in the woods and handpicked zinnias formed the reception table centerpieces. While it might have been a simple, inexpensive wedding, I recognized the bride's dress as a Jenny Packham and those go for around $5,000. So not so simple or practical, most likely.
I agree that there's a lot of Pinterest-style/aspirational content on there, but if you skip the "real weddings" articles and just focus on the advice/social commentary articles, it's a good resource. I would highly recommended the book though; it helped me keep a realistic perspective and not feel awful about wanting to go with my simple & frugal-minded gut instincts.
Are you set for your retirement? I would make that my first priority.
I agree.
A terrific source for lovely frugal weddings is this book: The Simply Organized Bride
http//www.thesimplyorganizedbride.com/PageID/142/default.aspx
Well worth the 15 bucks price tag.
I know the authoress and she practices what she preaches. She used the tips when planning her own wedding (she was around 40 at the time).
DSD is getting married this fall. When she and STBSiL told us, we surprised them by telling her that DW had been saving up money for years for a wedding. The understanding is 1) we can afford to do it (we've never counted this money as an asset); 2) we have put no strings on its use; and 3) when it's gone, we are done financially. Since DSD and fiancé are doing well financially for people in their late 20s, they were planning to pay for the wedding themselves. To date, she hasn't touched the money. I suspect they might, because not all the bills are paid yet and they could use the money for a non-wedding purpose (like setting up a nursery, which we expect in the not-too-distant future). But we're all on the same page and it's made things much more enjoyable.
ETA: pinkytoe, congratulations on the upcoming wedding!
rodeosweetheart
8-11-14, 8:11pm
STEVE--yeah, you are back!! We have all missed you!
iris lilies
8-11-14, 8:52pm
I have a funny memory of taking dd to grad school in St Louis and seeing all these wedding party groups having their photos taken in the big park there - Forest something? It was surreal to see so many brides in one place. I suggested that we just rent an old Texas dance hall and hire a western swing band and have a big party. Knowing dd she will want something off the wall in any case - no sterile hotel banquet hall for her. I'm actually starting to get excited about it all.One of life's big moments...
Our neighborhood park is Bride Central in May and June, after 3pm on Saturdays. They stand in line to be photographed in the grotto, in the gazebo, and etc. They tramp down flowers my friends plant and it makes my friends furious.
That Texas dance hall experience would be fun!
rodeosweetheart
8-17-14, 4:28pm
This looks cool:
http://www.alberttexas.com/weddings.htm
Never heard of Albert but not too far from here. Will check it out, thanks!!
rodeosweetheart
8-17-14, 8:43pm
Finally remembered, HERE's where we went for an all day party day after wedding, but they do weddings, too, and it was close by Austin and really nice:
http://www.saltlickbbq.com/pages/Events.html
(You've probably been there!)
Yep. The Salt Lick is legendary around here.
To update, a venue has been selected and dd is coming by this weekend to discuss our budget. I know what my limit is financially but from the looks of it, this wedding will cost a fair amount more. It just amazes me what is seen as necessary these days. Wedding coordinators - really?? If you don't know what that is, I have been informed it is an experienced person who makes sure everything goes as planned, directs guests, keeps food and drink flowing, etc... so that bride and parents don't have to worry about it.
sweetana3
10-10-14, 5:59am
Weddings seem to be more about a business opportunity than a family celebration these days. Cost is just like building a house: plan on it costing a huge amount more unless a budget is established and meaningful.
Miss Cellane
10-10-14, 7:57am
I think the wedding coordinator business has sprung up because of a shift in who hosts the wedding these days. It used to be the bride's parents were the hosts of the wedding--they did most of the planning and acted as hosts, while the bride and groom were the guests of honor. That meant that the parents of the bride dealt with the vendors, kept things on schedule the day of the wedding, and handled any little problems that cropped up on the day.
Realistically, the bride got to choose a lot of the details of her own wedding. But in reality, the mother of the bride was setting the budget and giving the options and making sure that all the details were addressed. And since the mother of the bride usually had a lot more experience being a host, she was able to make sure that nothing was missed for the guests' comfort.
But things have changed, and these days, the Happy Couple themselves tend to be the hosts--the ones planning and putting on the ceremony and reception. Even if they are getting funds from both sets of parents, the HC are the hosts. And the guests of honor.
Which causes problems when the caterer is trying to get them to answer a question, the photographer is trying to take pictures, and the manager of the venue is trying to tell them their guests are too noisy. And they are trying to enjoy their wedding.
So instead of letting the mother or father of the bride or groom take over and handle the hosting responsibilities on the wedding day, they hire a wedding coordinator who fills that role.
And the wedding coordinator knows about things the Happy Couple might forget about and reminds them of these things during the planning stages, if they hire one early in the process.
Not saying I think a wedding coordinator is necessary, but I can see how they fill a gap that has been created by changes in who hosts the wedding.
SteveinMN
10-10-14, 1:38pm
Not saying I think a wedding coordinator is necessary, but I can see how they fill a gap that has been created by changes in who hosts the wedding.
As an impartial person, the coordinator also avoids the agenda that so often creeps into parent/child relationships. My daughter has been dealing with her bio-dad on one request after another (even after she set the ground rules for him and the rest of us). It would be much easier for a wedding coordinator to handle the uninvited guests and the messing around with seating arrangements and the like rather than rely on her mom or me or the groom's parents (who are facing their own mostly-non-wedding issues right now).
If you can't afford it, don't over extend yourself.
I have an amount in mind and have just about decided to write a check and leave it at that. Will require a few extra months of working before I retire - no big deal if it makes her happy. Still, I remain stunned at what weddings have become. Not about a marriage really, but about a production for the guests.
A friend can serve as a day of the wedding go-to for the sorts of things a wedding consultant might do. I've done it myself at a couple of weddings.
iris lilies
10-10-14, 8:39pm
OP, I'll bet that your daughter will appreciate your monetary gift, but won't expect you to foot the entire bill. If she does, you didn't raise her right! But I think you raised her right! ;)
Tradd's point is a good one, a reliable friend could probably carry off many of the tasks of a wedding coordinator. That's the service provided by some church ladies in my home town and my aunt was one of them.
I think Miss Cellane's analysis has much truth. But also, Wedding Extravaganzas are so much more elaborate now than they were a couple of generations ago. Truly, in my neck of the woods in small town Iowa, people just did not have a big deal reception. The wedding was held in the afternoon. sometimes late afternoon and in the church fellowship hall was cake and punch and possibly a light buffet supper (salads and sandwiches.) For those who insisted on a dance (very few) they rented the town's Legion Hall. We are pretty much a group of non-dancing, non-drinking tight-asses when we "party" and hence, our events were over after 2 hours, haha!.
I think that big hoopla weddings were common on the East coast with ethnic families, and probably back then (in the days of which Miss Cellane speaks) everyone used the same bands playing the same music with an MC who knew the traditions of that social group and he knew when to cue this or that tradition. Families used the same caterers having the same food, and there wasn't a whole lot of decisions or "day of" coordinating to take place--everyone knew the drill so the Mother and Father of the bride didn't have work to do on that day.
Now there is such pressure on brides to plan a Pinterest worthy wedding full of unique things and it's a very silly suck of energy and money, unless one is deeply thrilled by this stuff and certainly many women ARE thrilled by it.
rodeosweetheart
10-11-14, 9:11am
Pinkytoe, I think your idea of writing a check and calling it a day is an excellent one. I would think hard about what amount you are willing to contribute, and I would be leery of anything that required me to change too much about my life, as I suspect working longer before retirement would do, but that is just me, and you will know what you are comfortable doing.
The wedding coordinators I have encountered as both a wedding guest and the wife of a wedding musician have been fairly awful. I would not pay for one, but if you are trying to put on what IL calls a Pinterest-worthy wedding, then I guess it's a wise investment. But geesh, the whole thing gets so commercial, and it's a family party, that's what I don't get. The church lady coordinators are usually better but not always.
It sounds like your daughter is putting on the wedding, and hopefully you can figure out a number you are comfortable with and give it to her as your contribution, and then let her handle things like the wedding coordinator, if that is what she wants. . .
And I just want to say that I think you are a wonderful mother, and I think she is entitled to get whatever wedding she dreams of (that she can afford) and there is nothing wrong with her wanting a different kind of wedding than what I would want, I've had two and one was at home and maybe 12 people were there, and one was in a church and maybe 40 people, tops, and we had the reception in the church library, which was lovely.
But the shindig at the Texas dancehall does sound absolutely terrific, a real blast! If I had been young and in Texas and getting married for the first time, I would have loved that.
SteveinMN
10-11-14, 9:28pm
Now there is such pressure on brides to plan a Pinterest worthy wedding full of unique things and it's a very silly suck of energy and money, unless one is deeply thrilled by this stuff and certainly many women ARE thrilled by it.
Our daughter's wedding was last night. It was a joyous occasion surrounded by lots of friends (our friends whom DD knows and likes and wanted there and her friends who most of the parents knew and liked from over the years of school, softball, etc.).
It was, however, ridiculously expensive (IMHO) and I believe entire countries have been invaded with less planning and scheduling. :|( Our financial contribution to it was limited to funds saved since DD was young(er) and to a few incidentals (my suit rental, an added case of wine at the reception, etc.). But bridal magazines and Pinterest and the like have fueled a world of imagination for brides-to-be (maybe grooms-to-be, too, though I have yet to met one who cared that much) and vendors only too willing to outdo each other in the services they provide. And apparently it's now A Thing that you don't use the same venues and bakeries and DJs/bands which your friends have used -- even if you liked them. It sometimes does seem more like "entertainment" rather than ceremony.
Steve's point is why so many are opting for destination weddings these days. It limits the cost and dynamics. A party afterwards works well.
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