Civility

[ctg492]

Civility: civility |səˈvilətē| noun (pl. civilities) formal politeness and courtesy in behavior or speech: I hope we can treat each other with civility and respect.

Is this gone from our culture?

I am amazed each day reading the assorted articles be it in the Local or National press. Today as I skimmed the local news I saw as usual, a 20 something "lady" was sentenced for beating antother "lady" with a pvc pipe, over a man. She ofcourse was so remorseful at sentencing, saying she was raised correctly and such. It is daily there are assorted crimes that make me wonder what is happening. Today I thought back to the Wizard of OZ, when Auntie Em said to Almira Gulch: I've been dying to tell you what I thought of you! And now being a Christian woman, I can't say it. Now beating someone is not the same as biting your tongue, but I imagine that "lady" never bit her tongue?

[creaker]

It seems the concept of respectfully disagreeing with someone has kind left the building. And respecting the sanctity of another's personal space.

It also seems to me that when I was younger incivility was a quality most people would hide as something not fit to display in public. Now so many people wave it like a flag.

[Lainey]

I also agree something has been lost. This year we had the experience of inviting a professional to use a local company's conference space. He showed up and his behavior to the staff was so rude and overbearing - and I'm sure I didn't hear the half of it - that our local professional had to have a talk with him to stop or they would not be able to utilize this space again. His response? At their next meeting -which was on his turf - he bragged about having been "thrown out" of the first office.

Sadly, I think Americans don't realize about how this cult of the individual can bleed over into aggressive boors who think this behavior is their right.

[Rogar]

I agree with all that has been said. Sometimes I look around at how people are dressed with t-shirts and dirty baggy pants or sweats out in decent public places and shake my head. Heck when I was hippie back in the pre-cambrian era we at least had colorful paisley fabrics and embroidered jean jacks. Now it seems like there is no dress pride. Towards the end of my working years my company had trouble finding people to do hard manual work. It paid reasonably well, but the common perception was that fast food work almost paid as well and was far easier. And there is a story I've heard from different people and places about how construction companies have trouble finding people who will pass drug testing.

My local paper occasionally publishes police blotters from a hundred years ago. I don't know what the statistics say, but violent crimes are nothing new. They may have a different shade. I actually think that alcohol related violence and alcoholism may be down. There was a lot of hard liquor that went down gullets fifty or more years ago.

[LDAHL]

I sometimes think all the “O Tempora, O Mores” commentary is a bit overblown in the broader historical context. With a past so rich in riot, lynching, civil war, cabinet officers fighting duels, Senators being bludgeoned senseless on the chamber floor, scurrilous journalism and ad hominem politics, it’s hard to view the present age in an especially harsh light.

Statistically, we are a demonstrably less violent society than we were a few generations ago. But what violence we do have the media (“social” and otherwise) makes the most of. Likewise, there have always been nasty people saying nasty things. They just have more options to broadcast their nastiness. There also seems to be a broader class of professional takers-of-offense in operation pushing a sort of victim-based ideology. We hear about a “war on women” from the Left or a “war on Christmas” from the Right. Modern day witch-hunters sniff out “microaggression” the way their ancestors detected the mark of Satan.

I’m not so much convinced we live in a time of incivility as a time of hypersensitivity.

[iris lilies]

Recently I was reminded of how the gentlemen and ladies in the House of Commons behave sometimes. While one Member makes a speech there are rude mutterings from others, even open jeering. During debates of the Members strident, insulting tones are common.

If we in the U.S. are uncivil, well, look from where we came.

Everyone wants to be part of the Political Theatre.

[creaker]

I’m not so much convinced we live in a time of incivility as a time of hypersensitivity.

I think it's a bit on both sides - civility and incivility is all about boundaries. When the boundaries from two parties don't touch, you have civility - when they push on each other or overlap, you have incivility.

I think a lot more people are willing to overlap boundaries - but that may be just because we have so much more opportunity to do it and be presented with it. And incivility seems to be deemed much more newsworthy.

[Rogar]

I’m not so much convinced we live in a time of incivility as a time of hypersensitivity. I don't know if hypo-sensitivity is the opposite of hyper sensitivity, but I would tend to subscribe to it. Compared to not so long ago there has been a trend to urbanization and anonymity that has decreased our dependence upon each other at a personal level and has lent to more callous behavior. I could also be easily convinced that the decline inactive church participation might play a role in be less civil, even though I'm not a church person.

I'd tend to think that civility and violent crimes share certain properties, but are two separate issues.

[Sad Eyed Lady]

I don't know how to even address this subject; it just leaves me shaking my head at times. In fact, this very thing, (along with the decline in dress that Rogar mentioned), has been on my mind this week and I started to post something here, but words failed me. I wonder if children are being taught politeness and respect at home? I know some are, but not on the scale of say the 1950's kind of respect and being polite to others and especially to adults and elders. I don't see much of that at all even in the small town I live in. As far as the dress thing, that has been on my mind this week too since I made a trip to the mall, (not something I do often). A woman and child, (I assume mother and daughter), came out of the restroom near the food court where I was having lunch. The child was maybe 6-8 years old, not a little little girl anyway, and she was dressed in pj's and a robe. I didn't notice her feet - maybe bedroom slippers? And I thought of times when it was exciting to dress up and go with your mother to grown up stores and maybe have lunch out, or whatever. And now it is just roll out of bed and come on. Like Rogar said, being a hippie back in the '60's, we weren't into conventional dress but at least we were dressed in expressive and creative ways - not the old fleece robe with the egg stains on the front! Maybe because of the times I lived in I find myself looking back and longing (somewhat) for the times just before mine when there was a code of acting and dressing decently, being respectful to others and having a smile, (oh yeah, we hippies did a lot that!), instead of a smirk on our face. Not saying that everything was better back then, because obviously some things weren't, including racial issues, women's issues, etc. But the overall tone of pride in ourselves and being civil in our dealings with others is sorely lacking today. IMO.

[Gardenarian]

I'm really impressed by the style and manners of the students at the college where I work. They look great in their skinny jeans and fedoras, or leggings and boots and berets, or even in their flashy running shoes and low cut sweatpants. There is a lot of creativity and personal expression in their fashion - maybe it comes from living in San Francisco.

The young people are, as a whole, very self-possessed and polite. Of course there the exceptions, but when I was in college we all went around in flannel shirts, work boots, and jeans, and had very little respect for our teachers. Or parents.

I think people who are bringing up kids (in the past couple of decades) are a lot more aware of their needs, and families seem a lot closer and healthier than when I was growing up in the 60s and 70s. In the past, dysfunction, sexism, abuse, and neglect were common - families I knew were very secretive. Most people had a lot of kids and seemed to expect the schools to raise them, not the parents. They may have dressed well and kept the yard tidy, but there wasn't a whole lot of love, honesty, and sharing going on.

[awakenedsoul]

I don't think civility is gone, but I think you have to seek it. I've noticed a lot of the same things that the above posters have mentioned. It's amazing what good grooming can do. This morning I got up, showered, washed my hair, and put on make-up and a nice sweater. While waiting for the bus, a young neighbor (in his twenties,) came up and gave me a hug. A lot of these young boys do that when they see me on the bus. It's fascinating. I just smile and say "hi" to them, and they light up. I think that they don't have the home life that many of us did. My mom cooked a delicious dinner every night and kept the house really clean and organized. There was plenty of food, and we always had clean clothes. That's not happening anymore in most homes. It seems like a lot of these young people respond to kind of a "mom" energy with me. I ask them how things are going and encourage them. I tell them what talents that I see in them. I also think that many many people are addicted to alcohol and/or drugs now. That usually makes people antagonistic and difficult. Exercise is a great mood enhancer, but many people don't do that anymore, either. They're so plugged into their electronics.
What I've done is to make a conscious effort to be friendly, happy, and kind to each person I see each day. It's really working. I had a 23 year old guy on the bus today offer to lift my bike off the rack for me. He was really sweet. He was reading a book at the bus stop, and we had a nice conversation. I told him I didn't know people his age read books anymore. The bus driver smiled and laughed with me as I got off the bus. He was very easy going and well mannered. To me it feels like people want the old fashioned interactions, but not everyone is initiating them anymore. Our society is kind of aloof. I took a train trip downtown a couple of days ago. Several people at Union Station offered to help me as I was lugging my bike up the stairs. It really made me feel good. I also chatted with several bicyclists on the subway. We all had our bikes crammed into the bike car. They were real friendly and open. It's giving me hope.

But yes, I see what you're saying. It's out there.

[Gardenarian]

I think society is in a transitional period where we are trying to figure out what "home" means when mom is out at work all day, dad may live in another state, there is usually only one, maybe two kids, 2/3 of parents are divorced...

We are not going to go back to the 50s, when women quietly lost their minds stuck in the house. I think we will end up somewhere better, in the long run.

As for civility, I do think a lot of the rudeness comes from my particular generation - the tail end of the baby boomers, born in the late 50s and 60s. We never got the chance to be hippies; our earliest memories are of assassinations and cold war and Watergate and recession. We are the former yuppies and dinks. We had few heroes or mentors. We had no sense of bonding with others of our generation; we've always been at each others' throats. We were told the establishment is bad but money is good. These things go in cycles; I think my generation eschews personal responsibility and civic engagement, and even responsibility for the planet. (Of course these are sweeping generalizations.)

I have great hope for the future (while simutaneously believing civilization has little future at all.)

I think el dia de los muertos is affecting me :)

[ApatheticNoMore]

We are not going to go back to the 50s, when women quietly lost their minds stuck in the house.

though it seems to me that you can just as quietly lose your mind stuck at a workplace, in fact far more so since it's a far more deadening and lifeless environment (raising kids at home at least has some real human elements, it might be lonely for adult company, but it's less totally alienating). I await the day when women and men no longer quietly lose their minds stuck at jobs. That would be a real change.


I think we will end up somewhere better, in the long run.

In the long run we're all dead! Yea maybe in the long run, the thing is I doubt I'll Live Long Enough to to see it get better, it's gonna have to get worse first (I may not like that but everything is so messed up that it's probably the case...). To live now is to plant trees in whose shade you will NEVER sit. It's just the age we live in.

I do consider it quite possible that the way people raise kids may be improving, psychological knowledge had to seep into the culture eventually (too bad not in time for us). Of course the external world people nowdays must raise kids in, in many ways grows more hostile by the minute, so against whatever advancements there are, there is also that.


think my generation eschews personal responsibility and civic engagement, and even responsibility for the planet. (Of course these are sweeping generalizations.)

probably what they say about Gen X. I think Gen X people are mostly careerists by nature though, which is a narrow focus, but the real greed and stuff, uh the big money was mostly though not entirely gone by that time for most, left the building, left the country, left the middle class, I don't know.