View Full Version : That Old Nighttime Beast, Insomnia
Been going through a long bad bout of it lately. I finally slept about two hours last night, after attempting to go to sleep for five hours. Then I worked all day. I tried everything I could think of last night ~ putting my pillow at the opposite end of the bed, getting up and reading for a while (tried that twice), tried meditating, tried self massage on my limbs, took Benadryl, tried to empty my mind, etc, etc....here is what happens, the thing my brain does to me over and over again. As soon as I feel myself drifting off, I get this conscious thought of "oh finally, I am drifting off" and that is enough to bolt me right back into the awake cycle. How weird is THAT, my brain is stopping me from drifting off to sleep!
I am trying to stay awake as long as I can tonight, so I get tired enough to crash out. I'm in such a mental fog at this point from days of not sleeping right that I can't really get myself together to do something useful this evening, though after work I went and got a bunch of plants and planted the rest of my garden. So tonight I am going to take a full dose of Ambien because I don't have to work tomorrow (I generally save the Ambien for extreme situations). I HAVE to get my sleep cycle back on track; I have too much to do before I go traveling!
oh dear, i have some issues but my kids really have issues. my oldest was on sleep meds at 14. they simply don't do that but she was gray by the time we got to that point. never any of the simple caffeine, thinking, electronics, etc. just a totally struggle to sleep. sometimes an antidepressant would help but as an adult she has refused any medications for 5 years, even though she didn't have side effect issues.
i wish i had something that would help, it is brutal. and i know that a list of advice is not the most helpful thing. by chance are you in the perimenopause time frame? i have had that odd thought about falling asleep and then stayed awake. i only fall asleep when i am not aware but that awareness or non-awareness does not seem to be under my control. at this point between weight and sleep i want a pill to turn this off
Oh yes, age 53 and I am in menopause..trouble is, there are many factors that contribute to my sleep problem like my shifting work schedule, the vicious circle of relying n caffeine to get me going at 5am, a new house mate that keeps very irregular hours, a cat that wants to go in and out of my room, noises in the neighborhood, my brain racing with eight separate trains of thought at the same time, etc, etc. I am a very, very light sleeper most of the time, I hear EVERYTHING . Some of it I think is left over from when my daughter lived with me during her mental illness and drug abuse stage. I was forever sleeping with one ear open, the phone on (I would get scary middle-of-the-night emergency calls). Even though that stuff doesn't happen now, the lingering effect of having to be awake right away to deal with an emergency hasn't left me completely.
But the thing that baffles me, like I said before, is that when I realize I am actually drifting off I apparently just don't relax into it and melt away. Why does my brain have to announce to me that it is drifting off now, only to bolt me wide awake with the thought???????? I realize whatever it was I was thinking about as I drifted away didn't make any sense, which tells me that I must have been drifting off but then I am wide awake once I realize it. What a mind bender. I wish my brain would behave properly!
i know the sleeping with an ear awake, although i didn't have as serious of issues with my kids. mostly it was the shooting. i can't imagine sleeping without my phone next to me. my long hours affects me, over school breaks just sleeping past 5 am on a regular basis makes such a difference. i don't always need to be at work at 6 but in case a staff is sick i need to be awake and functioning. being on-call all the time affects my sleep.
i wonder about that thinking thing, i am going to experiment a little with that and see what happens. i notice it only happens on nights before i work, and the more i am expecting to do the next day the more it happens. it doesn't matter if i have everything handled, just a very full day.
I read this article just the other day and sent the link to my daughter who suffers sleeplessness from stress.
How to get to sleep in 60-seconds. Be sure to watch the video.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3067526/Can-t-sleep-4-7-8-breathing-technique-claims-help-nod-60-SECONDS.html
Well, the Ambien sure works, but it is like waking up with a hangover (that is why I never use it on the mornings I have to be at work by 6am). I got NINE hours of sleep last night! Thanks, Lessisbest, I will watch that video right now.
I go through periods of poor sleep, so thanks Lessisbest, I'm going to give the breathing technique a try. Fortunately, I also have long stretches where I sleep just fine.
SiouzQ: I've had the same experience of being jolted into total wakefulness by the thought "great, I'm finally drifting off."
does anyone wake up because they didn't eat enough? i figured that one out from a friend who had diabetes when she was pregnant. she woke up with a nightmare only to find out her blood sugar was dangerously low. i had stretches of time waking at night and can see that was when i really wasn't eating enough. So now i generally eat a boiled egg or some cheese and am asleep pretty quick. i can have a carb snack before bed but if i wake up then protein is the best.
now if my weight reflected this that would be great but i am still middle aged chubby
does anyone wake up because they didn't eat enough? i figured that one out from a friend who had diabetes when she was pregnant. she woke up with a nightmare only to find out her blood sugar was dangerously low. i had stretches of time waking at night and can see that was when i really wasn't eating enough. So now i generally eat a boiled egg or some cheese and am asleep pretty quick. i can have a carb snack before bed but if i wake up then protein is the best.
now if my weight reflected this that would be great but i am still middle aged chubby
I've read where eating green beans right before going to bed is a way to keep your liver from dumping glucose into your bloodstream at night. Do a little research on it and see if it benefits you.
Low blood sugar can cause wakefulness mid-sleep. The jolt of counter-regulatory hormones your body provides to keep glucose steady will wake you right up. I believe that's the cause of the notorious "dawn phenomenon" (high blood sugars on waking) as well.
I had lifelong unmanageable insomnia since 9 years old until I did the following things together. Eat at least 8 oz good protein for lunch and dinner. Eat lots of green and orange veggies at dinner. Take 2 calms forte (homeopathic) and 1 3- mg time-release melatonin when I turn in. Eat no sugar or much salt. I fail on that too often, but when it does I am reminded I can sleep if I don't eat them. Take dogs on at least one-hour hike per day. When I turn in I think of 3 things I'm glad happened today, then say a Lakota prayer that involves addressing Father Sky, Mother Earth and all my relatives (which is every living thing). Then I address each of the 4 directions, west (bison), north (elk), east (black-tail deer), south (owl) and west again (bison). At each of those, I say, all my relatives. Or when the idea of relatives bothers me more than usual, I say, all that is. I picture the people and animals and trees etc. I love in each of those directions and those I know need help. I end by saying Father Sky, Mother Earth, Godfather (in between those two) and all my relatives. When I wake up in the middle of the night, I do those things again or listen to a tape a friend made hypnotizing me. If those don't calm me down I sometimes read something I like.
An essential thing for me is to keep my pH alkaline. If it's acid I can't go to sleep for hours.
thank you guys, even though this is Siouxq' topic. i looked up some of the info you shared, i have low blood sugar, not diabetes, and it has been dangerously low other times in my life. i know how to manage it now but often forget the nighttime protein snack. i went to sprouts and made eggs for lunch with squash, peppers, and spinach plus got cheese snacks for dinner. Plus some blueberries because they are tasty.
Okay folks, wish me luck. It is time for me to wind down from a very awesome and productive day (because I got nine hours of sleep last night). Tomorrow at 5am I start a six day-in-a-row work stint. Trouble is, I am not the least bit tired right now but I need to go to bed so I can get up at 5am.
I am going to try the breathing thing tonight that a previous poster told me about. One thing good is that the house mate is not around this weekend so I don't have to worry about him coming in later and I can leave the bedroom door open so the cat can come and go as she pleases. Sweet dreams to me (please Universe?)
super good sleepy vibes !!
I've had sleep issues since my early 50s. Now I'm 68 and it's impossible. Most times I don't get to sleep until 6 a.m. Then get up at 9. No naps during the day as I don't feel tired. Once, maybe twice a week I smoke pot. Puts me to sleep every time for at least 8 hours. There are no side effects or hangovers. Works for me!
If you're interested in herbal remedies hare are 2 which I found very effective in sleeping problems.
Herbal Help for Insomnia:
Kava root is primarily used as a natural sedative and sleep enhancement. Herbalists have traditionally used it as a remedy for nervousness and insomnia. Kava kava is an effective relaxant able to induce a feeling of relaxation, peace and contentment, along with a sharpening of the senses. As a sleep aid it promotes deep and restful sleep. It is also a muscle relaxant that can help relieve cramping due to spasms.
NOTE: Do not use if pregnant, nursing, or being treated for depression.
Valerian • Passionflower Compound is a gentle but effective herbal sedative, nervine and sleep tonic. This compound is soothing and quieting to the nervous system without any narcotic effect. It is ideal in excited nervous states, agitation, nervous headache and insomnia. It’s usefulness in sleep extends to shortening the time to fall asleep, curbing restless sleep and waking feeling well rested. This compound carries the structure function statement: "Promotes Relaxation & Restful Sleep."
Now here are some general tips, remedies and practices that I leaned during my sleep therapy, hopefully these will be helpful for you.
1. Let's start with naps. NO naps except one, and that is ONLY to be for a maximum of 20-30 minutes! That's ALL you need for refreshment, and that's ALL you should ever take. Any longer, or any more than that disrupts your nightly sleep pattern.
2. Watch the caffeine intake, you would be surprised just how much you are getting every day. Coffee, tea, sodas energy drinks especially. Trim the caffeine intake back. NO caffeine four hours before bedtime! Also, excess caffeine can contribute to anxiety.
3. Nothing exciting, or strenuous before bedtime, like exercise, games, playing, no discussion that will stir emotion, etc., no video games, computer, or TV ,no telephone. Really, the only thing you should do before bedtime, is light reading in a quiet, comfortable spot with a good reading light.
4. No heavy eating before bed. You may have a light snack. There's something that you can take, that's natural, it's produced by your body, and will help you get to sleep, and stay asleep. It's melatonin. You get it in the vitamins section. I recommend Walgreens, Kroger, or Walmart, as they're least in cost, have a good selection, and are pretty much everywhere. The store, or less expensive brands work just as well as the expensive stuff. 3 to 5 mg is a good starting point. 10 mg is maximum dose. These are taken once per night 20-30 minutes before bedtime. Don't start with the maximum dose! It will take a few nights for the melatonin to start fully working. After a week, or so, if you're not falling asleep faster, then, up your dose to the next dosage, like from 3 to 5 mg. This is one of the best home remedies for insomnia (http://olwomen.com/home-remedies-for-insomnia/) that you can try.
5. It's important that You get a full nights sleep according to what YOU NEED. NOT what's average, or what someone else needs, but what you need to function well, feel rested, and not get sleepy, and drowsy during the day. So, figure out how many hours of sleep per night that YOU need, and set your alarm to wake you up at the time you have to get up by for work, or school. Get up at this time EVERY DAY including weekends, holidays, etc. Then count back the number of required hours of sleep, and you have you're bedtime. You must be in bed at this time EVERY NIGHT, including weekends, holidays, etc.
6. Start getting ready for bed about 30 minutes before your set bedtime. Washing up, brushing your teeth, going to the toilet, taking your melatonin, setting your alarm, and such. Get in bed with EVERYTHING off, like lights, television, radio. Door shut. Get comfortable. Do the breathing exercises for a few minutes. You should fall fast asleep rather quickly. Follow a rigid sleep schedule. You'll find that it becomes habit fairly quickly. Remember one more thing, bed is for the three S's. Sleep, sex sickness. That's ALL! NO TV, computer, phone, reading, homework, work, play, anything but those three things! If you continue to have sleep problems, you should see a Sleep Specialist Doctor, and get some sleep therapy. That's where I learned these things that I told you. Good luck, and God bless!
I have just spent the whole summer working with a sleep specialist and did sleep reduction therapy. It has made a huge difference to my sleeping. Please message me if you want to know more. I have had sleep issues pretty much all my life and now I can sleep fairly well for me, not every night, but most nights.
But the biggest issue is that my fear of not being able to sleep is diminishing.
Hope you got a good night. :)
This won't help racing thoughts, hot flashes or chemical issues, but I do find that wearing foam ear plugs keeps me from waking up at every little sound, so at least when my body's cooperating I'm not being disturbed by the cats or the traffic.
And contrary to some advice I've read, I find that getting up, turning on the light, having a drink of water and using the bathroom, reapplying some scented lip balm I always use at bedtime, rebrushing my teeth etc. can be like a "reset" button. It's frustrating to have to really wake up and then fall asleep all over again, but sometimes, at least for me, it's easier to do that than be in the "twilight zone" all night long.
My cure-alls for insomnia are a) go with the flow and b) meditate
a) go with the flow: I just accept my body's lead. I admit that with a work-at-home job I can do that, but the more I fight sleep with thoughts of "I SHOULD be asleep now" the worse off I am. So I just get up and read or watch TV, or mess around on the computer, and enjoy the quiet time.
b) if I really want to get to sleep I meditate, and more specifically I say the rosary. The rosary is so structured and rote that it really helps me to empty my mind and eliminate pesky thoughts--and replace them with peaceful, serene thoughts. I keep a rosary in my nightstand, and if I do pull them out, I'm usually asleep before I finish it. I actually now say the rosary at bedtime, as part of my evening prayer routine, but again, I save it for last, because I barely make it through one decade (the there are 5 decades of 10 prayers each). The secular version of this would be "counting sheep"--so any tool you can use along these lines will help. Find a mantra, practice deep breathing, get trained in mindfulness meditation during the day, so you can do it at night.
As soon as I started back to work last week (just part time for now, day time shift) AND got a new house mate, my sleeping problems have come back. This after being off work all summer and enjoying unfettered sleep and wake times. Two months of sleep bliss :) but now my real life is foisted upon me, once again, and my daily schedule is kind of weird right now, not bad, but way different than not working all summer.
There are a lot of things I do wrong that I need to take responsibility for, such as: coffee intake ( a lot), watching Netflix in bed before I go to sleep, having a crappy old futon mattress that is literally in the torture stage. I finally sucked it up and spent the money on Sunday to purchase a new mattress that I will sleep on tomorrow night when it gets delivered. I really, really hope it helps alleviate that all-over achy body pain I wake up with EVERY morning. It literally takes several hours to feel "warmed-up" enough to go about my day.
The new housemate is very quiet, but it still the fact of getting used to having another presence in the house. Coffee, however, is something I just CANNOT fathom giving up, not going to happen. At least what I make at home is half decaf, half regular, and I quit drinking it by noon.
Hope the new mattress does the trick!
I made a frugal discovery, a little too late. We'd just moved to Tucson and gotten a new mattress and bed I'm not in love with, it wasn't cheap but it's still very ... wiggly. Like sleeping in a rowboat. A friend came to town to buy a mattress for a window seat he was building and decided to go really, really cheap with a "mattress" that's basically foam covered in some sort of cloth, you could use it as a couch cushion, they're sold rolled up and maybe for use with folding beds? Found at one of those super cheap mattress outlets where all the real mattresses are complete crap. This thing was $100. It's sort of like memory foam, quite heavy, but not so squishy. I decided that might make a good extra 'bed' when my nephew is here so I got one too. This is now rolled out on the floor next to our bed, and almost every night I wind up down there. ... not exactly like the movies! This $100 pad, about 6" thick, is the most comfortable thing I've ever slept on and I Never wake up with a sore back or neck. If we ever redo this I will put in two of these side by side on a wooden platform and be done with it. I now have a hard time sleeping on anything else.
My base mattress is 6" neatly covered foam. It came all rolled up, and slowly expanded on the bed. I have no box springs.
I cover it with a variety of toppers--3" memory foam, fluffy wool, cotton in the summer. It's more comfortable than springs, IMO--and it was dirt cheap. I mostly sleep like the dead.
My base mattress is 6" neatly covered foam. It came all rolled up, and slowly expanded on the bed. I have no box springs.
I cover it with a variety of toppers--3" memory foam, fluffy wool, cotton in the summer. It's more comfortable than springs, IMO--and it was dirt cheap. I mostly sleep like the dead. I think we're talking about the same thing. As much support as sleeping on the floor, but no hard spots!
I think so, too. It may not be necessary to spend 2K on a mattress. I bet you could get a perfectly good one at Ikea.
freshstart
9-15-15, 1:20pm
when I am depressed, insomnia is usually the first cue, it's been on and off for years, so we have tried many med combos, plus the list of normal good sleep rules. All my life, I have had to read to fall asleep so I do break that rule. What we're doing now sometimes works, but often I am still awake at 3am but I am not in a bad depression. I think this brain thing is messing me up. No matter where I am or what I am doing, sometime in the late afternoon or early evening, it's like I'm knocked unconscious. I fall asleep at the table with my fork in hand, in MD waiting rooms (which is bad because it is so hard to come out of this sleep, I barely remember the appt, I have no idea if I made sense, and am back out as soon as I am in the car). I know I need to not be napping if I want to fall asleep before 3 am but I really can't stop it. I get up, walk around, but because my body wants that stupid comatose nap, I sway and stagger so that doesn't help. I go sit with someone and talk, and find myself there a few hours later covered by a blanket. I have no clue anymore how to fix this but falling asleep for 2 hrs at 6p, is not conducive to a good night's sleep. By process of elimination, the only thing I take in the morning that is sedative are anti-seizure meds. But I would think they would be out of my system by the time the nap happens. It is so freaking weird. I did tell all this to neuro yesterday since it was happening before her very eyes, but I don't remember what she said, lol, it was a good call to bring my dad in. Like a ten yr old. oh, I do remember she increased the seizure med so I am guessing my comas are going to continue, grrr.
there's that new med, Belsomra, that is supposedly so much better than other meds, works in an unique fashion and is very expensive (the company has grants that will make it just your co-pay for a little while). Did nothing for me.
there's an IPhone app that I use off and on, it helps, called pzizz
Update: I got the new mattress last night and while it is quite a bit better, I still had trouble sleeping all night due to other things going on. My anxiety level has ramped up quite high this week (see new post).
Radicchio
9-16-15, 12:01pm
SiouzQ, I am a coffee lover, too, but I managed to gradually switch to all decaffeinated. I occasionally make an exception for a single cup, but never late in the afternoon or in the evening. Do antihistamines make you drowsy? An occasional Benadryl (diphenydramine) may help---although sometimes, for a small minority of people, it has a paradoxyl effect and makes you agitated. So be careful, if you decide to try that, to do so when you don't have to go to work the next day. You can also take a different type of antihistamine, such as chlorpheniramine maleate. This can be found in various cold medicines, but I would suggest getting this by itself, as you don't need the other medications for sleep and you don't want/need to take extra meds you don't need. It can be found under the name Aller-chlor, often kept behind the pharmacy counter so you have to ask for it, even though it is OTC. Remember that anything you might take to help you sleep can lose effectiveness over time if you take it every night. So only take it a few times a week, or alternate different herbs/meds that prove helpful so that you don't develop a tolerance.
Finally, good sleep hygiene is very important. To the extent possible, go to bed and get up at about the same time every day. If you've had a bad night, getting up in the morning at the regular time can be a challenge, but it's really important to do so.
There is no one size fits all solution and usually not a solution that works every night, but hopefully if you keep trying you will come up with something that will work for you most of the time.
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