"A Death in the Family For Dummies"???

[bae]

My dear mother-in-law will likely pass away quite shortly. Likely at home, quite peacefully and happily, with dignity, or as best as one can in those circumstances.

She's the first of either my wife or I's parents to die. So we're new to this.

I'm looking for basically "How to deal with a death" For Dummies - not the emotional support/mourning side of things, but something that focuses on logistics/procedure/paperwork/... I imagine there's a fair bit involved.

All pointers greatly appreciated.

[SteveinMN]

I'm sorry to hear that, bae.

Hopefully, DMiL has done her homework and has catalogued things like bank accounts, insurance policies, will, safe-deposit box location, funeral arrangements, etc. If not, is there any chance she can manage at least some of that now? Or that someone has access to where she lives to start gathering that information and asking questions about the inevitable holes? Check for beneficiaries listed to make sure they're current.

Is there an executor/executrix? Someone who is designated to get the death certificate and has sufficient power of attorney to notify Social Security/insurance companies/retirement-savings providers/employers? Someone to act as a focal point for any items DMiL said she wanted others in the family to have?

If she's not local, who will be coordinating funeral transportation, who will be coming and will need lodging, etc.?

Is there anyone in her household who will need special arrangements (for example, when my mom passes, my brother will need extra attention for the change in his living situation)? Pets?

I'm sure others will bring up additional points. I think it is very much a play-by-ear kind of thing, though, especially with the emotional component of it.

[Float On]

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/magazine/2012/10/what-to-do-when-a-loved-one-dies/index.htm

Something from consumer reports. Seems pretty straight forward. Sorry you'll have to deal with this. Does she have everything in order? A burial plan? A basic will?


Getting copies of the death certificate as quick as possible are very important, you can't do anything without those.

Adding a few as I go for further reference:
http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/family/death-plan
http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/12-simple-steps-estate-plan-29472.html
http://assets.aarp.org/www.aarp.org_/articles/foundation/aa66r2_care.pdf

[iris lilies]

In the death of my mother in law, there was a problem when her daughter went to do something or other that required access to MIL's medical records after she was dead. While I do not remember what business the daughter was completing, I do remember that due to HIPPA law the daughter could not access medical records. She had to go through a work around.

So the lesson is to have all family members properly recorded as those who can access the medical records.

Funeral homes are very useful for the odd and unusual. My mother in law died suddenly, out of state, and the home town funeral home made all of the arrangements to bring her body back. After she was cremated, DH and I took her ashes to Switzerland and in this the funeral home was helpful in issuing some kind of official certificate to get us through inspections and customs.

[bae]

This is all quite helpful!

[freshstart]

First of all, I am very sorry, hope she passes in peace.

I dealt with this all the time at a death because so many people do not pre-plan (that's fine) nor have they discussed the topic while the patient could still say what he wanted (less fine- those with no clue want the patient wanted are ripe for the picking for every funeral add on). She dies, unnecessary panic about the funeral home occurs. So just by asking the question now, you are helping you and your wife avoid unnecessary stress soon. Many families ask me who I would use, I can't answer that really, but if they throw out names, I've been known to say, "that's a good one". Sadly, a lot of them are not. They may be the nicest people, they come to your home in the middle of the night but when the family meets with them the next day, they have a beautiful plan, sure, but did they go in wanting all this and an over 10k (sometimes way over) bill? BTW, you can get a beautiful casket at a great price from Costco, this has the potential to save you thousands, even though the FH will be less than thrilled you already have your own and they may charge a few to use yours. No big deal, you are still way ahead just by doing this.

If you are religious and plan a church service, I would call the pastor with a heads up. Not religious, no problem, you can have a small service at the funeral home. But once you are a captive audience, IMO, in certain homes you will be pushed bordering on unethical. Things like saying to an indigent family, "don't worry about cost, that's why he had life insurance, we will take it from there." Oh really? How kind, probably the only money this person has to pass down, is now going to create a funeral akin to a circus, resting in the top of the line casket and vault (there goes more than 10k right there). Not all are like this, I've just seen it enough to be cautious. They will try to upsell you everything. Very hard to resist because they are so sympathetic and kind, you almost feel like you are a bad person if you do not want that they are offering.

I would first make sure she knows her wishes, she may want the big blow-out service. Probably she doesn't. And here is where it gets tricky. Most mom and pop places have retained their name but are actually part of a huge group, who all charge the same. So if you go to several mom and pop places, their menu of services may look very familiar. So how do you find the reasonable, trustworthy company? Ask around, look at reviews on Google, if she is on hospice, ask, we usually try to point you in the direction of someone who will do what you want. I don't have to do that here because we have one guy who believes in simple, meaningful ceremonies and he has never pushed add-ons. In fact, when asked what's the least expensive way to get the services you want, he helps you figure it out. He is the go to guy for cremation, $600, I think, and does not force you to rent a casket, unlike many. If someone clearly has nothing, IDK how he does it, they choose simple cremation, even when they said they would never choose that. He welcomes our chaplains to do the funeral. A wonderful man providing ethical service. Only problem is he probably a 20-30 min drive from most of our patients, so families cross him off the list. Which is not the best choice if you truly have nothing. So people go to the mom and pops (really a large money making company but they do not tell you that). Nothing wrong with this choice, just have one person willing to quash releasing 100 doves. The staff are usually wonderful, it must be horrible to want to comfort people and at the same time know you are pushing way more than they want or need.

I have seen beautiful cremation services, having the body of the person I loved there, but not in a casket, was totally fine for me. And that is a very inexpensive option, just don't fall for you have to rent the top of the line casket. Another thing unnecessary is the vault the casket is lowered into. You will be told the vault prevents your loved one from being eaten by animals. It is such a con, have you seen bears or even squirrels trying to get to that casket? They push emotional buttons as they push for the vault. Consumer Reports looked into this and found bodies decomposed faster in just a casket and were thus dry skeletons vs vaults dug up, casket opened and the person is turning into putrified liquid. I know that sounds harsh but I would want to know that before the upsell to an expensive, unnecessary vault.

Every home offers the take pictures and make a picture board of give them a CD of pictures and they will show that on a loop. I would not pay for them to do the board, they have no clue what was special. Same with CD, they'll sale give us the pictures, we'll do it and put it to song. Have the tech kid in your family do these for free and do a much better job.

I'm sure I'll think of more things. Oh, get like 10 copies of the death certificate, you will need them. If you choose a home ahead of time, get their (long) list of documents they require so you are not scrambling later. Make sure someone has their name on account so bank boxes can be opened, bank funds. Because I believe, but am not remembering, POA ends at death. Check this with someone who knows soon, because being unable to access her funds may be a problem and she may have important things in a safety deposit box. Write the obituary, if you can, have it in one of the local papers that has like a "page" for your MIL, people send condolences that way, tell old stories and share photos and it is usually free. I've seen some for my patients and was blown away, I had thought it would be disgusting, like FB for the dead.

if you MIL ends up on hospice, the team will help guide you because it is overwhelming at a time you are grieving hard. If she's not, that's fine, but I know with your background you'll ask for the meds most people need at some point during the dying process. Someone can be fine for weeks and all of a sudden not, so you want those in place.

I hope that helps. Thinking of you and your family. Oh, I thought of one thing, in the US, if someone is not on hospice, 911 needs to be called and handed the DNR so god forbid they don't start crisis care, I'm sure you've seen that a bunch of times. And at least in NY, the really crappy part is the body has to go to the hospital morgue before being released to the funeral home, with hospice, they go straight to the funeral home.

I'll try to think of more, I have seen some things handled in such a beautiful was that I would never have thought of.

Again, my condolences

[bae]

We put her in in-home hospice last week, which is a godsend for all. She has modest funeral desires - cremation and a party at her university. She'd be happy with a sky ceremony out on the plains :-) She's already got most of her finance stuff lined up, as of a couple of years back. We were all going to get this organized this Thanksgiving when we had our family feast and so on, but events moved faster than expected :-(

My wife, the attorney in the family, is normally able to deal with much of this sort of thing for *other* people, but she's terribly close with her Mom, and this will hit her like a ton of bricks, so I'm trying to be Mr. Engineer Guy and get as much of the grunt work lined up and done for her.

[freshstart]

You are doing a great job and performing such a kindness. I'm glad she is in hospice, don't forget you can call them 24 hrs a day, you're not bothering anyone. I'm sorry you and your wife are going through this, but MIL is fortunate to have 2 caring people. Afterwards, most hospices have a Daughters' Group, a group that meets for so many weeks and I have seen remarkable friendships made there between the young and the old, some groups get so close, they all travel together. It doesn't matter if you are 24 or 64, losing a parent is a huge blow. And these diverse women have one thing in common and thus they can help each other.

[Miss Cellane]

Agree about the death certificates. You will need one for just about every bank account, investment and piece of property your MIL owned. My dad was so stunned by the number he needed when my mom died, that when he planned his own funeral, he made arrangements for the executor to get 20 copies of the certificate, and all his children got 3, just to make sure they would have what they needed.

Another practical tip--make sure the immediate family takes care of themselves in the days following the death. Routines get disrupted, people are quite literally grief-stricken. They don't eat, or they eat weird food at odd times, they don't sleep, or they sleep too much. Have healthy, easy to prep food on hand and make sure people eat it. I usually send a basket with fruit, crackers and cheese to the family, because it is relatively healthy and something they can just grab and eat without prep work, when they might not feel like sitting down to a meal. It is way too easy for some people to start eating junk food, or not enough food, and I swear that starts to affect their decision making, at a time when they really need to make good decisions.

My sympathies to you and your family during this time.

[IshbelRobertson]

I am sorry to hear your sad news.
I cannot give any advice relevant to your situation in the USA.

[JaneV2.0]

Everything about the death of a loved one is difficult. I second what Miss Cellane said about taking care of yourselves. At one point in the middle of the chaos, SO and I found ourselves driving aimlessly around singing along with oldies at the top of our lungs. We really needed the stress relief.

I'm so sorry; it seems the ones we love most can never stay long enough.

[Simplemind]

From personal experience I can tell you that it easier to make funeral arrangements beforehand. In my mom's last month I made some phone calls and visited three places. Even though I knew what I wanted (which was simple cremation after a family only viewing) the cost and package options were vastly different in price. Price wasn't really an issue but geez Louise, just because you can doesn't mean you should. One place was pretty shameless in services and options. I can see how if you waited until after that you could be talked into a lot of unnecessary things just to get through it. I wouldn't have been thinking properly if I waited.
If you will be doing the memorial at another place I would highly recommend a company that does simple cremations. Here those are around $400-$600 dollars. Ditto on extra copies of the death certificates. I have gone through eight already.
After my mom died I started volunteering for an organization that helps with these matters. As we say, you can spend a years thinking about and planning a wedding but nobody prepares for this. When it happens things are always thrown into turmoil. Hospice was very good to us in terms of what to expect and leaving us with some resources. The resource guide my organization uses is very helpful as far as who needs to be contacted the first day and thereafter. So many calls that you wouldn't initially think to make. It also goes over things to expect emotionally, how to plan a memorial, information you will need for the death certificate and contacting Social Security etc.
I don't know how it is up in your neck of the woods but in the Portland area there are many funeral homes but very few of them do their own work. You can call a funeral home to come transport your loved one but it is rarely the funeral home that is doing the transport. A larger company behind the scenes comes and takes your loved one to their facility. Communication occurs between you and the funeral home but they are more like a storefront and have the facility for a service but don't do the embalming or cremations. That is why it is so important to call a few places because the prices are vastly different but only one place is doing the work behind the scenes.

[razz]

My sympathy on going through all this.

When DH passed away, I discovered that my cell phone had lost its charge so had to go home to make phone calls. Have all the contact numbers needed on a list and even a list of those who are willing to pass along messages.
One thing that I was glad to have arranged was a kennel for my dog who took him with minimal notice for as long as I needed that care and those dear people continued to be available when life got crazy. Two and half years later, life is much more structured and I, once again, choose to set up appointments so as not to abuse my friendship with them.

[iris lilies]

My sympathy on going through all this.

When DH passed away, I discovered that my cell phone had lost its charge so had to go home to make phone calls. Have all the contact numbers needed on a list and even a list of those who are willing to pass along messages.
One thing that I was glad to have arranged was a kennel for my dog who took him with minimal notice for as long as I needed that care and those dear people continued to be available when life got crazy. Two and half years later, life is much more structured and I, once again, choose to set up appointments so as not to abuse my friendship with them.

yes, I agree that having pets out of the way and well cared for can be a huge help. I hear of situations where one of the humans in the home becomes sick and has a long illness leading to death, and care of the animals is on auto pilot. If pets develop illness during that time no one notices.

[frugal-one]

Bae... my condolences to you and your wife.

A few years ago, when my MIL, went to assisted living I read a book called Final Rights... here is a synopsis. I thought it very interesting and enlightening.

Final Rights is the definitive book for consumers on the modern funeral industry and how to navigate it. Part investigative report and part practical guide, the book explains in detail the tricks of the funeral trade, and how to avoid being victimized. And for those who wish to take charge of the funeral themselves without using a funeral home Final Rights will show you how, with a chapter on each state's requirements written in plain English.

https://www.linkcat.info/cgi-bin/koha/opac-detail.pl?biblionumber=835501#


In March of this year my husband lost his mother. I had everything already prepared, and have to say, thankfully I did this. Earlier I asked my MIL to write her obituary. I wanted to know how she wanted to be remembered. Obviously, the thing for you to do now is ask your MIL how she would like to be remembered. Then write the obit now, contact the newspapers and edit what they put in. I was thankful I did this since it was just a matter then of contacting the newspapers. I already knew the cost. The funeral home will also do this for you but they will add multiple unnecessary lines for their advertisement. I also contacted a few funeral homes in the area and asked for services provided and prices, as well as caskets. I actually checked the prices and found one funeral home was padding the costs. The funeral home selected, prices and services etc was put into the file. Also, some states have a cremation society where the costs are less. You may want to check it out???

Earlier, I had asked MIL for a copy of all her bills. I put them in the folder and knew exactly who to call, phone numbers, account numbers etc. Sure made things easier.

All paperwork, such as paid on death beneficiary (bank accounts) and transfer on death beneficiary (stocks and bonds), living will, power of attorney for healthcare and for finances, health insurance cards, life insurance policies, cemetery plot info that was purchased earlier, gravestone marker and engraver, who to contact at social security, who to call at time of death (relatives, etc) ... were all put in the folder. Social security numbers, birth dates, marriage info/certificate for both MIL and husband was also needed. I contacted the minister and asked she write a few words about MIL and put into her church file so when the time came, if she was no longer there, the person presiding would be able to talk about the deceased. I also asked about cost. I contacted the florist and decided what type of flowers (standing or for casket) would be used. I got estimates for all and put in the file. I contacted restaurants in the area to see if they could accommodate and prices. We did do this after the service and it worked very well.

MIL passed away in March. All paperwork done eliminated probate so everything was closed and settled by June. Having prepared all this in advance caused much less stress and anxiety at this very emotional time.

I hope this is of some help to you. frugal-one

[catherine]

I can't give advice, even though my MIL passed away only 5 years ago.. I still feel like I don't know what you SHOULD do.

So first, I am sorry you and your family are going through this--not easy. And second, I'm assuming your DD is still at home and not back at school yet? My MIL died on vacation and the blessing of it was, all the kids were there for closure. If you can be together as a whole family at this time, you'll never regret it.

frugal-one touched on the only thing I can back up from experience, which is if you are going to run an obituary, I'm assuming that where you live it won't cost much to run it in the local paper, but in some newspapers it's a lot. When I sent the copy for MIL's obit to the paper, they told me it was 7.50, and I said, great, run it for two days. But I got a bill for $1500.. never even considering the cost of the space was going to be $750! I know that my MIL, the frugal Scotswoman, was frowning at me and shaking her head from above..

[Tradd]

Bae, I'm so sorry to hear this.

Something a friend of mine said helped her family a great deal: sit down with your wife and make a list of family members/friends/clubs, and so on, that must be notified of your MIL's death. Gather phone numbers/email addresses in one list, as so many of us have contacts scattered between cell phones, computers, and on paper. You might consider having another member of the family/very close friend do the notifying if that would free you up to support your wife and make arrangements.

[freshstart]

. But I got a bill for $1500.. never even considering the cost of the space was going to be $750! I know that my MIL, the frugal Scotswoman, was frowning at me and shaking her head from above..

that is just absurd, who can afford that? disgusting, you could've had a plane write it in sky writing for that price

[merince]

One of the hardest things to do is notifying friends and relatives. Make a list with the phone numbers of those that will need a call the day of and then offer to do the calling.

[gimmethesimplelife]

Bae, i'm sorry you are dealing with this. Death is never easy to deal with. It's been three years since the loss of the friend of our family that left some money behind that made our lives less stressful (made debt go away for which I will be forever grateful) and I still can't believe he's no longer with us. I've lost high school friends, too - people who were so young and energetic and vibrant back then and who have fallen to cancer and such - just unbelievable, it really is. Hang in there is the best I have to offer you - this seems to be something that most of us have to deal with and it is sure humbling and puts you in your place as to your importance in the grand scheme of things - or at least this has been my take on dealing with death. Rob

[peggy]

bae, i am so sorry for this loss. It is never easy, even if expected. My mother passed just last month so this is all very fresh in my mind. Some we are still dealing with. Not troublesome dealings, just extended. I suppose that is what you will find the hardest. You won't be able to deal with this and move on quickly. Everything takes longer than you think. If you go into this knowing it, it won't weigh so heavy on you. I think the thing is, take on as much of the dealings as you can to free your wife to grieve. But involve her when she is ready to be involved.
Is she an only child? If she has siblings they can be a great comfort to her and each other. Even though she wants to be cremated, as my parents were, the funeral home will help you and walk you through everything, including placement of an obituary. They really were a huge help, and the small fee they charged was more than worth it.

We didn't have much time to prepare, although my mom has been in poor health for 6 months or so. She was in the hospital and was actually improving when she lapsed and called my closest sister to get her authority to put her on a vent. This is what has bothered her the most, knowing my mom would not want that if she had the choice, but my sister was taken by surprise. Preparing for this type of thing might help your wife when the time comes and things are moving very fast and blurry. When push comes to shove, knowing without a doubt what you will say/do helps. Thankfully my mom was only on the vent for less than 24 hours, but it's 24 hours that haunt my sister. In the end all three of us girls were there to support each other and mom in her passing.

In the end one thing that helped us was to not rush to make decisions that evening, but to gather with the family who could come and talk and share each other's grief. If you know what to do and are prepared, there is no reason for your wife to make any decisions right away. Basically if you know ahead where she will go (which funeral home) that's all you need to do that day. Again, i cannot stress how helpful they were for my mom, and my dad who passed last fall. Also merince is right about notifying family. That is probably the hardest thing of all. We notified several who were simply too far away to make it in time before she passed. I think now it might have been better to just wait until she had passed to tell them as some had their grief compounded by their feeling of helplessness in not being there. You can go through your list of relatives and maybe find a few that for them it would be better to wait until she passes.

I am so sorry for your family bae. Peace to you and your wife, and your mother in law.

[iris lilies]

With the caveat that people grieve differently yadda yadda, I will mention something about logistics and grief even though bae isn't looking for advice about grief.

As an introvert, I find interactions with humans to be exhausting when stressed. Assuming that bae's wife, or anyone reading here, may have a similar reaction, it's important to head off all of the completely unnecessary responsibilities that people will pile onto you, the griever. Or at least someone like bae can take care of them.

When my father died, one of my friends decided she wanted to have a tree planted in his memory in our public park. But instead of going forward and making that happen, she asked me to "contact so-so to get the ball rolling, and let [her] know how much it was and she would send a check. ". Ugh, I found this idea tiring because there were multiple steps I had to take. I resented it. I begged DH to relieve me of any obligation in this deal.

In another incident, a well meaning person sent us a rose bush to be planted in memory of DH's mother. She died in February and the bush arrived a few days later. Ummm, our ground is frozen in February, so that was an obligation that had legs. We had to keep the damned thing alive until the ground could be worked.it did not live a real long time because we didn't care much about it.

I guess we we get these offers because we are plant people and those we know are trying to personalize their offerings of sympathy. Nice idea, not so great execution.

there were other, tiny things that showed up as, to me, stupid obligations that interfered with my peace of mind. These death events provide an inherent number of NECESSARY obligations so adding more is not a kind and thoughtful action.

so the lesson here for all of us is: don't give the grieving family work to do, don't add to their "to do" list.

[Simplemind]

Excellent advise Iris Lillies. I know people are very sincere when they say "let us know if there is anything we can do" but that also is too much effort. Let somebody know you are going to drop off a bag of groceries but don't knock and expect to talk. I had a hard time talking for awhile. People who knew me understood and the biggest lesson I learned from them is you don't ask and wait to be told what to do, you just grab a burden and take care of it. I loved the people who figured out what we would need and said "I'll take care of this" before I could think to ask and probably wouldn't have. I loved the snail mail letters and still have many of them.

[lhamo]

Sorry your family is dealing with this, bae. My mom recently got a diagnosis of congestive heart failure, so we are starting to think about/work on similar issues. She's not in hospice yet and hopefully won't be for awhile, so we also need to look into assisted living options, etc.

The hospice team has probably already gone over it with you, but one thing you might want to get in place if you haven't already is the green Physicians Orders for Life-Sustaining Treatment (POLST) form. This is a form that translates the legal language of a "living will" into actual actionable orders for medical staff. Helps to ensure that if 911 is called they will follow the DNR request, keeps the hospital from putting someone on a ventilator or on liquid nutrition, etc. Basically helps to keep things from being drug out unnecessarily when the patient is ready to go.

Hope her days in hospice are as peaceful and pain free as possible, and that your wife has ample time with her. I'm treasuring the time I'm able to spend with my mom.

[freshstart]

How is she doing? How are you and your wife doing?

[bae]

How is she doing? How are you and your wife doing?

Now that we have her back in her home with decent hospice care, she's rebounded and doing great - aware, alert, oriented most of the time. Nothing to be done about the eventual outcome, but it looks like we have weeks-to-months instead of days-to-weeks, and she is now mentally around enough to engage in the process.

Thanks ever so much for all the pointers.

Lhamo - on the living-will/DNR/... situation - a very good tip for everyone in this circumstance. There's a great fire/rescue station just a couple of blocks away from Mom's house (with a real firepole and everything) and I've made the acquaintance of the folks who work there over the past 5-6 years, and they are keenly aware of the situation. They even stop in once a week or so to "check out the smoke detectors" to see that all is well, nice people.

[Tradd]

Bae, thanks for the update.

[freshstart]

That is so sweet of them. You guys sound like you are doing well.