fire safety?

[rodeosweetheart]

Bae, a recent post by you stated that common causes of fires are cheap coffeemakers, and I wanted to ask you two questions about fire safety. One is the question of the coffeemaker. We use a cheap coffeemaker which is on about half of the day, but we work at home in sight of coffeemaker. When we leave the house, I insist we unplug the thing.

Is a cheap Mr. Coffee more dangerous than a more expensive coffeemaker? Is there a safest brand? Is it the brand or because people leave them plugged in? I just buy my coffeemakers at the Goodwill. Is this a bad idea?

Question two is about the Christmas tree. I just bought a new, prelit tree from Lowes. A lady who was standing there talking to me said she leaves her tree on as a nightlight at night. We used to leave the tree on at night. This is new to me, artificial trees. Doing it because of allergies. The instructions said not to leave it on when we leave the house or go to bed.

Is this really right? Is it unsafe to leave brandnew tree on when we are not there/unconscious?

Thanks for any guidance you can offer!

[shadowmoss]

I have an add-on question. Has going to LED lights on the trees and other decorations cut down on the house fires caused by lights? The lower current draw and less heat generated I would think would help. I've been known to be wrong before, though.

[bae]

Is a cheap Mr. Coffee more dangerous than a more expensive coffeemaker? Is there a safest brand? Is it the brand or because people leave them plugged in? I just buy my coffeemakers at the Goodwill. Is this a bad idea?


The issue, as explained to me at the arson investigation class, is that Mr. Coffee had a purposeful design flaw in many of its models. Most coffeemakers, when a part fails, the coffeemaker fails and you repair it, or chuck it out. Mr. Coffee for years designed its products for "reliability", by which they meant "if a part fails, by Gum it will still make coffee", which often led to situations in which dangerous electrical faults brewed silently on your countertop, with the consumer unaware.... Based on the information presented, I personally would avoid that particular brand, though they've since changed their designs.

Any UL-Listed electrical appliance *should* be safe if used as instructed, and the cord and plug inspected for damage. (A common failure mode is corrosion on the prongs of the plug, leading to increased resistance and heat. Your wall plug installation if done to code should still prevent this from becoming a full-on fire, unless you are unlucky and the cord smolders and ignites something nearby.

Leaving things you aren't using unplugged is not *necessary*, but it does reduce phantom electrical loads, and it is obviously a bit safer in some edge conditions.

I wouldn't leave a Christmas tree plugged in, artificial or natural, if I weren't in the room. If you do, verify your smoke detector functions first, and keep other fuel away from the tree. It's *probably* not going to be a problem, but you don't want to be The Example.

On LEDs - all other things being equal, they produce less heat and use less current, so they are less likely to serve as ignition sources. They are also harder to break. That said, some LEDs are pretty intense and can produce high temperatures in a small area, so the devil is in the details. I have some high-output LED flashlights that I could probably start a fire with if I put my mind to it.

[rodeosweetheart]

The issue, as explained to me at the arson investigation class, is that Mr. Coffee had a purposeful design flaw in many of its models. Most coffeemakers, when a part fails, the coffeemaker fails and you repair it, or chuck it out. Mr. Coffee for years designed its products for "reliability", by which they meant "if a part fails, by Gum it will still make coffee", which often led to situations in which dangerous electrical faults brewed silently on your countertop, with the consumer unaware.... Based on the information presented, I personally would avoid that particular brand, though they've since changed their designs.

Any UL-Listed electrical appliance *should* be safe if used as instructed, and the cord and plug inspected for damage. (A common failure mode is corrosion on the prongs of the plug, leading to increased resistance and heat. Your wall plug installation if done to code should still prevent this from becoming a full-on fire, unless you are unlucky and the cord smolders and ignites something nearby.

Leaving things you aren't using unplugged is not *necessary*, but it does reduce phantom electrical loads, and it is obviously a bit safer in some edge conditions.

I wouldn't leave a Christmas tree plugged in, artificial or natural, if I weren't in the room. If you do, verify your smoke detector functions first, and keep other fuel away from the tree. It's *probably* not going to be a problem, but you don't want to be The Example.

On LEDs - all other things being equal, they produce less heat and use less current, so they are less likely to serve as ignition sources. They are also harder to break. That said, some LEDs are pretty intense and can produce high temperatures in a small area, so the devil is in the details. I have some high-output LED flashlights that I could probably start a fire with if I put my mind to it.


Thank you SO much. Guess I will be looking for a new coffeemaker, and I will not leave the tree on if not there admiring it!

Since our pets are home when we are out, I wanted to ask these questions. About 15 years ago, a house in our neighborhood burned down because a toaster had been left plugged in. The inhabitants were at work, but their doggie did not make it out.

[bae]

Think about how many wall warts, lights, and small appliances you have plugged in around the house. They are all pretty safe, if in good repair.

Now ask yourself - when is the last time I looked at the cords and prongs of all those little devils? Do any of my appliances have switches that are a bit squirrely? Any of them acting funny?

It is when the cords become worn or switches break/short out and so on that they begin to become much more dangerous. But that toaster that's been sitting on your counter happily making toast for 20 years that now makes a little sparking noise when you turn it on can't possibly hurt anyone, right?....

[Tradd]

I remember hearing years ago that the timers on coffee makers were the source of many fires. There are also lots of fires from dishwashers and clothes dryers. I can't believe how many people run their dishwashers and clothes dryers when they are not home.

[nswef]

When we had the new dishwasher installed we had them put a surge protector plug in outlet and I unplug it when we go away,unplug the computer and tv, along with turning off the water at the pump in the basement. Small appliances are always unplugged unless in use. Just makes me feel safer.

[bae]

When we had the new dishwasher installed we had them put a surge protector plug in outlet and I unplug it when we go away,unplug the computer and tv, along with turning off the water at the pump in the basement. Small appliances are always unplugged unless in use. Just makes me feel safer.

Water damage. OMG. That's a horrible horrible thing. I respond to a fair number of flooding/water damage emergency calls. Quite often to a home where the residents are gone, and a neighbor noticed water pouring out.

Inspect those washer hoses before you leave on vacation, consider shutting off the water to the whole house if appropriate, or particular parts of it.

What a mess that is!

We lost a good chunk of the elementary school here last year, when over a weekend a box of files in a maintenance closet fell off a shelf above a utility sink, bumped the faucet on the way down, and landed in the sink blocking the drain. Two floors of the building pretty much wrecked. A passerby called the fire department when they saw water flowing out a door, and we managed to save about half the building. Yick.

http://orcasissues.com/orcas-elementary-water-water-everywhere

[rodeosweetheart]

. But that toaster that's been sitting on your counter happily making toast for 20 years that now makes a little sparking noise when you turn it on can't possibly hurt anyone, right?....

HOLY SMOKES, I just plugged and unplugged the Mr. Coffee and it does a little sparking thing when I unplug it.

YIKES!!!!

.Okay, am now really glad I asked you.

Mr. Coffee now inhabitant of trash can
Thanks you.

[bae]

To be fair, when plugging or unplugging almost anything from a wall socket, you will have a wee spark as the connection is made/broken.

[rodeosweetheart]

To be fair, when plugging or unplugging almost anything from a wall socket, you will have a wee spark as the connection is made/broken.

Oh! Maybe I overreacted. It doesn't make a popping sound, just the "wee spark" as you say. I can reclaim him from trash. Hhm.

[bae]

The "wee spark" is nearly unavoidable. Any sort of sustained sparking, crackling noises, excessive warmth in the cord are bad. Always make sure the prongs are clean and shiny, when they tarnish electrical resistance goes up, and heat is produced as the current flows....

[catherine]

Speaking of wee sparks, my DS just called me to tell me that when he pulled into the parking garage this morning, he smelled an electrical fire, and it was coming from his car door, and then it started smoking. He was due in court to meet his client, so he couldn't address it then, but he just called us to say that he had pulled out the fuses for the electrical stuff on the door, he had called Honda (this was a defect with a recall which he never addressed), but he's on the Jersey turnpike anyway hoping his car doesn't catch fire on the way to the shore… DH told him to stop at 7 Eleven and pick up some water in case the smoke returns.

Needless to say, I'll be worried until he texts me that he's gotten home safely. Should I be worried?

[bae]

Should I be worried?

Yes. :-) :-(

He, and everyone else, should probably carry a small Class A/B/C fire extinguisher in their car and know how to use it. Water on an electrical fire probably isn't going to go so well. When he makes it home safely, encourage him to disconnect the battery to the vehicle before parking it anywhere near anything he likes/cares about.

[catherine]

Yes. :-) :-(

He, and everyone else, should probably carry a small Class A/B/C fire extinguisher in their car and know how to use it. Water on an electrical fire probably isn't going to go so well. When he makes it home safely, encourage him to disconnect the battery to the vehicle before parking it anywhere near anything he likes/cares about.

Thank you! (for the extra worry :-/ ) He (and his father) felt that breaking the connection by removing the fuse would do the trick in order to get home.. I'm about to call him, but don't want to call when he's driving. I'll give him your advice!

[catherine]

He got home safely.. whew!

Fire extinguisher on the list for Santa!

[mschrisgo2]

Another question... I have a friend who is a hair stylist, and she insists that Lots of home hair dryers catch fire, and they should never be left plugged in. She scared me into unplugging mine for years, then I got lazy, but have recently gone back to unplugging because I have a mostly grown but still Puppy in behavior... I don't want her to chew the cord, and get electrocuted or ruin it... but what about the fire hazard of said item?