View Full Version : Bad things
Maybe my old age kicking in, but what has happened to society? Now there's a big question. This has been on my mind as I read the paper from my Hometown where I grew up and Dad still lives. The daily murders, parents abusing kids or worse this week starving kids to death, drug related crimes, on and on. I guess the children suffering that have been in the news bother me most. This week my thought was, it takes a village, where was the village???
Did terrible things happen years ago, Of course. Not on the same level and as often.
Maybe my old age kicking in, but what has happened to society? Now there's a big question. This has been on my mind as I read the paper from my Hometown where I grew up and Dad still lives. The daily murders, parents abusing kids or worse this week starving kids to death, drug related crimes, on and on. I guess the children suffering that have been in the news bother me most. This week my thought was, it takes a village, where was the village???
Did terrible things happen years ago, Of course. Not on the same level and as often.
I recently found out that over half the kids in my old high school are on free lunch -- meaning the government pays for their lunches because their parents are poor. Also: There are frequently dirty needles being found all over the place in my hometown and the other little towns around it -- like in the grocery store parking lot or in parks. Junkies are overdosing to death there often! Everybody and their brother is hooked on pills.
When I was growing up in the 90s maybe 5% of kids were on free lunch. Needle drugs were totally unheard of. Pill addiction was quite the rare phenomenon. Times have changed -- and for the worse.
I am totally convinced that for many reasons -- more than the things you or I list above -- we live in a decaying and dystopian society.
Yes, the FRL rates (free and reduced lunch) are way too high for this country. So many of the families I know work, even often 2 parents, and still don't earn enough to pay for lunch and reasonably make their bills. About 50% of my families are on some type of assistance or scholarship for childcare and the school is 67% FRL, which is not bad in a district that overall is somewhere in the 80's. We are one of the fastest growing cities in the US, and we can't pay people enough to live on.
The place at which we find ourselves has a million feeder roads.
The "village" largely has dispersed as opportunities take people places other than where they grew up. It's rare to see adult children living on the same block or in the same neighborhood as their parents. Sometimes it's exposure to a new place that sponsors the move. Sometimes it's poor health. Sometimes it's just following one's work. Whatever; how many of us live near our parents and/or adult children now?
Greater economic equality for women and the vanishing stigma of divorce meant wives who were stuck in abusive marriages -- because they could not support themselves and their families without the spouse's income -- could leave those marriages. But that changed the old form of nuclear family with two parents and the kids. Much the same could be said of faith communities; it has become much more acceptable to not be a member of a church or to minimize one's affiliation. But that, too, diminishes community.
Free-trade agreements made things less expensive to buy -- including employees. This has led to wage stagnation It hasn't helped that about 35 years of political lies have resulted in groups of people pitting themselves against other groups because they've been led to believe that they can gain nothing unless some other group loses something.
We're continually pushing the boundaries of culture. One can look back at the 1964 Beatles, with their suits and styled (long) hair and their sappy lyrics and, through today's lens, be unable to understand the shockwaves they sent through America then. Nowadays I routinely hear language on broadcast TV that I never thought I'd hear. But, then, every generation has thought culture is going to he** in a handbasket compared to theirs. It just reaches new levels.
All of this is amplified, for better or worse, by multiple channels on TV and by many Web sites and periodicals devoting themselves to the salacious for days or weeks at a time without the perspective of a few hours of printing time.
There are a million other reasons. But since so often the bad result has a flip-side good result, it's hard to predict just how much different life will be for the next generation or two.
These kinds of things seem so much more prevalent now because we talk about them!
Families never used to talk about the wife abuse, child abuse, the pedophilia, the drug/alcohol abuses. It was considered shameful.
We know there is a better way to live now and while we still fail in so many ways, there are so many more options for victims than before.
How much news do you think lynchings got? Probably not much. Now we are finally starting to see with our own eyes through video the true happenings,
and not just relying on what an officer said.
It's always been a crappy world, but it is getting better.
I'm not sure it's getting better, unfortunately.
Yes, the media/social media has a lot to do with telling us all the bad things that are happening everywhere, instead of just our area. But I think a big problem is that we don't expect much from people any more. We don't want to violate anyone's rights, and we don't want to seem inhumane.........so we let lots of stuff go that should be stopped.
I think we just need to get a lot tougher on people who are causing problems, or not contributing to the good of the whole society.
Ultralight
2-2-16, 12:45pm
It's always been a crappy world, but it is getting better.
Evidence please? I am dubious.
Ultralight
2-2-16, 12:45pm
I'm not sure it's getting better, unfortunately.
+1
ApatheticNoMore
2-2-16, 12:48pm
I'm not sure violence etc. is getting worse although poverty may be for some subset. If you doubt there was poverty before you just have to look at the deep poverty Bobby Kennedy was campaigning to reduce way back when (and that LBJ tried to address etc.). There has always been deep poverty in this country. But the middle class could be quite sure it wouldn't effect them then, not so much now. And yes there were lots of paid lunches when I grew up. Course I didn't' grow in Richistan (and though the neighborhood was fine, much of the middle class and up didn't send their kids to those lousy public schools, so it wasn't a representative sample), and there may be even more now, but I'm positive there was way more than 5% then.
Teacher Terry
2-2-16, 1:34pm
When I graduated from HS in 1972 if you didn't want to go to college you could get a good job at the auto plant and support a family in a middle class lifestyle. Now all that is gone. That is one reason why we have so many poor people. Service jobs can't support people like manufacturing jobs did.
When I graduated from HS in 1972...
Perfect timing! I am envious.
Teacher Terry
2-2-16, 1:40pm
UA: so you want to be old?
UA: so you want to be old?
If I would have graduated in 1972 it would have been a little too late to get drafted and I'd have had plenty of time to enjoy life before the AIDS epidemic ruined fun.
Also: DISCO!!!!!!!!!!!!
Teacher Terry
2-2-16, 1:49pm
On the flip side not everyone lives to be 61 so you could be dead:|(
When I graduated from HS in 1972 if you didn't want to go to college you could get a good job at the auto plant and support a family in a middle class lifestyle. Now all that is gone. That is one reason why we have so many poor people. Service jobs can't support people like manufacturing jobs did.
+1...I also graduated in '72, btw.
Plus, even a college degree cannot guarantee you a good job these days. A huge debt, yes.
It's funny I just read this thread for the first time this morning and yesterday a gentleman brought in to our office an old scrapbook his sister kept old news clippings in. They are 100 years old exactly beginning in Jan. 1916. I only perused the first few pages, but there are clippings about a deranged individual who went on a crime spree and killed his brother and possibly one other, a professor who was convicted of forgery, a number of robberies and kidnappings, a rabbi arrested for selling liquor and wine out of the synagogue. All in one month's time in the PDX-SW WA area. It's a remarkable collection which at first glance, makes it seem a lot worse than now. There were many references to the death penalty, including a 16-year-old who went to the electric chair for murdering his mother and aunt.
...I also graduated in '72, btw.
Me too!
If I would have graduated in 1972 it would have been a little too late to get drafted....You think so? My draft number was 107 and I enlisted in the Air Force after graduation in order to assume a little control over the situation. President Nixon announced that no new troops would be sent to Vietnam, although anyone with current orders to report would still do so, while I was in Basic Training during the early spring of 1973. The final pull-out didn't happen until 1975.
Me too!
You think so? My draft number was 107 and I enlisted in the Air Force after graduation in order to assume a little control over the situation. President Nixon announced that no new troops would be sent to Vietnam, although anyone with current orders to report would still do so, while I was in Basic Training during the early spring of 1973. The final pull-out didn't happen until 1975.
Valid point.
ToomuchStuff
2-2-16, 2:41pm
Did terrible things happen years ago, Of course. Not on the same level and as often.
I would have to disagree with your last sentence. Just because we didn't have the same number of channels/media organizations fighting for/to report stories, doesn't equate to not as often. Some things have changed, others not, and yet others just shifted (example, the alcohol to meth ratio, or having children at home longer, rather then out in the workforce getting injured, etc.)
Then you also have the aspects of values that change. What might have been acceptable at one point, wouldn't be today, and looking back, we are judging it with our eyes.
For examples there, look at some old laws where you couldn't beat your wife with a stick bigger then you pinky, or scenes like the animal house talking about going ahead with a passed out gal (now you might see it on something about Cosby), or in some of the things people like Bob Hope said, etc.
As I reach the point where my life could be described as “mostly over”, I’m inclined to think that things are better, on balance, than when I was a kid In the late sixties and seventies. We were a much more violent society back then, sometimes casually so. I’m sure gun deaths in that era were much more prevalent than today. I don’t know how drug abuse would compare, but it doesn’t seem to me to be any worse now than in my teen years. They certainly weren’t as good at treating addiction then. Acceptable discipline then would often be considered child abuse today; although they seem much better today at reporting and stopping it than in the past.
For all the talk of “divisiveness” today, the politics were much more vicious, with real riots, tear gas, bombings and arson, not just the campus and Occupy Whatever whine-a-thons of today. Comparing the racism of that time to the “microaggression” and “white privilege” talk of today seems almost silly.
I’m not sure how the average economic situation would compare, but I wouldn’t recommend living in the Rust Belt during a period of double-digit inflation to anyone who hasn’t experienced it. Same for energy shortages.
Is ISIS worse than the Khmer Rouge? Is Darfur worse than Biafra? I don’t know. I do know I elected to spend several years of my life in an unflattering uniform out of concern over the USSR and the “People’s Republic”. Those were some serious socialists. We don’t have anything like that level of threat today. The good guys won.
I do think there seem to be fewer kids benefiting from intact families now than in the past, which is a great tragedy. But personally, unless I or she screws something up, my daughter should be materially better off than me. I don’t believe, as some do, that hard work and sacrifice are pointless.
Are there difficulties? Yes. Are we doomed to a dystopian hell? Only in bad Young Adult fiction.
So stop the whining and get off my lawn.
Pornography was still hidden and innocent of long-term harm, rampant child abuse and spousal abuse were considered 'private' issues so never reported. Rape was barely noted and women were told to simply enjoy it!
i love todays' world. It is like a mucky stream that is being stirred to bring the 'yucks of life' to the surface to be exposed and dealt with albeit with varying success. We are going in the right direction though.
Some things are better and some are worse. History repeats itself. There is nothing new under the sun where human nature is concerned.
There are more people now and wall to wall coverage. I guess that's new.
I guess it is just my old age as I mentioned. However today as I drive through Flint on the way to PoHo:( I absorbed How terribly bad everything looked in Flint. And we all know the situation there. Entering into Port Huron, I tried to remember the areas I drove through. I remembered riding my 12 year old self around on my bike, today in that area I would not:( Oh I am sure newer areas sprung up forgetting about the older areas, like everywhere.
Along this post line. We are considering yet another temp move to an new city down south, Spartanburg SC. I joined every forum out there about Cities, SC and the South,News papers and TV stations to find out as much as I can since I did not do that when we attempted TN a few years ago. I went to Spartanburg two weekends ago to drive the city, no vacation spots, but how and where to live.
Fill you reading with news and such on a city and WOW the bad just pops out at you. I found one article that rated the crime # 5 under 3 areas in Detroit and Chicago. I never once saw any location with in Spartanburg that even vaguely resembled the D! We found a small home seems nice and quite for a year or two. The realtor did everything but scream NO Not there! Now I am more confused then before. I am now on a path to find only positive writings on the area and not the crime articles.
One thing that stuck out to a "girl from the north country" was the confederate flags, several I saw. We looked at home and two doors down the flag was flying. I was offended and thought did they forget it was removed from the capital building here months ago? Not even thinking how long ago the flag was replaced with the red white and blue.
rodeosweetheart
3-20-16, 9:18am
CTG492, have you rented the house yet? I was born in Georgia, and there are places in the South that I would find a lot more in keeping with my personal lifestyle and progressive beliefs--I don't know if my beliefs are progressive but I am a Bernie volunteer, for example. I can think of other places in the South that I would fit in a lot better than Spartanburg. Is there job there, or something--why Spartanburg in particular?
Gardenarian
3-20-16, 10:04pm
Violent crime has gone down dramatically in the past 30 years. When I was in college (in the '80s) women would not go out alone after dark in Boston (or any other big city.) Drugs were everywhere; lots of cocaine, I had friends whose minds were permanently bent by acid.
I live a much more cloistered life now; maybe it is worse. Unemployment is worse. I meet a lot of young people and, on the whole, they seem far more mature, wholesome, and realistic than I was.
What depresses me is climate change. Well, the way we are ignoring climate change. I've thought of starting a scrapbook myself; every single day there is an article about weird weather events, record-breaking temps, plant and animal extinctions. And it seems like everyone believes it will somehow be okay.
Ultralight
3-21-16, 7:22am
What depresses me is climate change. Well, the way we are ignoring climate change. I've thought of starting a scrapbook myself; every single day there is an article about weird weather events, record-breaking temps, plant and animal extinctions. And it seems like everyone believes it will somehow be okay.
Uh... I don't. But I also don't think humans will do anything about it. The environmental situation will just get worse and worse and more people will suffer. So try to get your kicks while you can!
Rodeosweetheart, No we have not rented yet. It got more confusing everyday looking online, then the trip there. Husband as an office in Spartanburg for a while, hence the reason.
I was in Clarksville TN for a while, it advertised it's self as "The New South", I think Spartanburg is the "old South". IS that fair to say??? I guess the vibe I got. I don't know how to phrase it other then that way. If you have any thoughts on Spartanburg, please let me know.
rodeosweetheart
3-22-16, 4:24am
Rodeosweetheart, No we have not rented yet. It got more confusing everyday looking online, then the trip there. Husband as an office in Spartanburg for a while, hence the reason.
I was in Clarksville TN for a while, it advertised it's self as "The New South", I think Spartanburg is the "old South". IS that fair to say??? I guess the vibe I got. I don't know how to phrase it other then that way. If you have any thoughts on Spartanburg, please let me know.
Well, a bit of background on my opinions--I was born in coastal Georgia, and both my parents were from coastal Georgia. My dad grew up in Savannah, which is actually a pretty diverse city, in a weird sort of way. I think coastal places are always more diverse and well, fluid. Coastal Georgians and South Carolinians tend to be a little prejudiced against the interior of these states, seeing them as more well, redneck-ish, more fundamentalist? That;s a terrible stereotype but that is always how coastal Georgians and South Carolinians tend to see the interiors, unless you are talking about Athens, lol!
My grandmother was from Tennessee and I will admit to feeling pretty uncomfortable there, but she was from a very fundamental religious sect and it was pretty awful. I know lots of people who like Sewanee.
My grandfather was from the Macon area, and Macon and Atlanta in the summer--oh my gosh, you could die just standing there it's so hot.
BTW, Athens would be on my list of what you would like.
I will admit to not knowing a whole lot about Spartanburg, but isn't Converse there? There is a pretty good vibe there educationally speaking, and you could probably buy lovely house very reasonably. But if you are going to freak if you see a Confederate flag flying, I would stay away from much of the upland interiors, and all of Alabama and Mississippi. You might have to develop a selective eye, a live and let live kind of eye. I see Confederate flags flying up here where I live in rural Michigan, and I just try to stay away from those folks.
Sorry, not very encouraging, I guess, and you have to consider my own upbringing, which was pretty prejudiced against what Flannery O'Connor, a good Savannah girl, would consider "good country people."
As to the old south/new south thing, I think Atlanta is a good example of the new south. I don't know anything about Clarksville, but honestly, if you lived there and didn't like it, I would consider a short term rental anywhere I went, and I would seek out likeminded people whereever you go, which should not be that hard.
If you like horses, for example, Spartanburg would be a great place to live! And I know you bike--there are probably like minded people who get together to bike. It's quite beautiful there. If you are connected with an educational institution or medical institution and you like to be outdoors, Spartanburg might turn out really well for you. It probably has very active dog rescue stuff, that kind of thing. Garden clubs.
Thanks what informative response. I know the flags are everywhere. I am in lower MI and have one about a mile from me, but for some reason here they just seem more redneck then perhaps the meaning in the south? Yes Converse is there and Converse Heights seems to be the best spot in the city according to all the forums I have visited on SC. One poster told me it was old money there. I think that summed it up. Maybe we are not looking in side the city now after all the investigating. Oh I am so scare of making a mistake:|(.
Renting a nice home is probably not an option as I have four big dogs. We decided to look at lower priced homes to use it as a temp home and when we sell it will have costs the same as renting honestly. The issue was in that price range it seemed to have put us in areas that were not what I was comfortable in, which ended up giving me a bad feeling for the city. I think I will go back for a weekend again and look at other areas outside the city.
It is pretty interesting to live long enough to see the changes we 72ers have. I wonder about younger folk today that have in essence led a very privileged life. Their expectations are very high which isn't a bad thing but sometimes white isn't white without black.
If you want a lib city in the south, what about Asheville, NC?
rodeosweetheart
3-22-16, 1:45pm
If you want a lib city in the south, what about Asheville, NC?
Lexington or Chapel Hill also come to mind.
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