View Full Version : Trump! Trump! Trump!
It just keeps getting better!!!!!:devil:
iris lilies
3-9-16, 11:08am
It just keeps getting better!!!!!:devil:
At this very moment, DH is plotting his attendance at the Trump rally this
Friday a few blocks from here.
I won't be going, have previous plans, but I doubt that Id be gong anyway. dH isnt a Trump fan, but he always pullls the Republican lever, so he may be voting for the guy.
At this very moment, DH is plotting his attendance at the Trump rally this
Friday a few blocks from here.
I won't be going, have previous plans, but I doubt that Id be gong anyway. dH isnt a Trump fan, but he always pullls the Republican lever, so he may be voting for the guy.
If I had been even remotely intrigued by Trump in the beginning, by now that luster would have been severely tarnished. His long rambling speeches are compelling in their insanity. "They want me to act Presidential. I can act Presidential, but if someone's going to hit me, I'm going to hit 'em back!" ??
Ultralight
3-9-16, 11:39am
If I had been even remotely intrigued by Trump in the beginning, by now that luster would have been severely tarnished. His long rambling speeches are compelling in their insanity.
Three words for you:
Trump? Trump. Trump!
oh I would definitely go to a rally just to see this train wreck. So I wonder how many at the rally are there for curiosity factor.
It just keeps getting better!!!!!:devil:
What happened this time? I don't keep up with Twitter...
What happened this time? I don't keep up with Twitter...
MI, HI, and MS
Incredible, just incredible. (Those are my three words.)
Funnest election of my life!
ApatheticNoMore
3-9-16, 3:04pm
Oh I might go to a rally (do we really call them that? Trump Of The Will, eh?) just did to see it if it was free (heck no I wouldn't pay a penny). I also wouldn't mind seeing Sanders. But I'm probably non-ethnic looking enough to get away with going to a Drumpf event (but ethnic enough looking that I think about the matter for one second first).
But if I was Muslim or Mexican no I wouldn't go to a rally, you never know what those thugs that are his audience will do. But hey white America amuses itself, you could ask them to try empathy sometime (to imagine going to a Drumpf event in a hijab or to a much lesser degree while Mexican), but it would be a waste of time.
What happened this time? I don't keep up with Twitter...
honestly I don't know, but it might be that apparently Drumpf gave a rambling victory speech where he talked mostly about his Drumpf steaks, Drumpf water, and Drumpf properties he owns in various states rather than any other political concerns (whatever they might be) of states that voted for him.
gimmethesimplelife
3-9-16, 9:36pm
I really wonder two things. Should Trump win, how many US citizens would permanently flee? And how many countries would step up their immigration recruitment of the more skilled and moneyed of US citizens? This could be a bit of a windfall for other countries actually. Rob
I'm starting to wish Obama was back in the running.
you won't believe how many Canadians are watching the ins and outs of this whole thing. Wow.
IshbelRobertson
3-10-16, 5:08am
And the rest of the world, I suspect. Most of us in total disbelief that someone like him would be considered for the post!
goldensmom
3-10-16, 7:35am
I wonder what the reaction would be if 'President Trump' referred to Putin as 'Little Vladimir' and I can see that happening if Putin got on his bad side. Also, as Donald Trump says he is a uniter and that he can be presidential, I'd like to see some of that because so far I've only seen the opposite.
I really wonder two things. Should Trump win, how many US citizens would permanently flee? And how many countries would step up their immigration recruitment of the more skilled and moneyed of US citizens? This could be a bit of a windfall for other countries actually. Rob
Based on our long, proud history of hysterical bloviation on this topic, I'd say probably very few. Maybe an uptick in tax exiles if Bernie and a compliant congress were to implement a program of politically managed wealth redistribution.
Ultralight
3-10-16, 10:32am
Based on our long, proud history of hysterical bloviation on this topic, I'd say probably very few.
I tend to agree. It is harder than one thinks to emigrate to Canada even. And outside of Europe (where it is also hard to move to) and Australia/New Zealand (also pretty dang hard to move to) the other nations of the world are not great places to live for the most part. Think of all the third-world dumps.
catherine
3-10-16, 10:45am
I wonder what the reaction would be if 'President Trump' referred to Putin as 'Little Vladimir' and I can see that happening if Putin got on his bad side.
I was thinking the same thing.. But I really feel that his disparagement of Rubio in that way unfortunately hurt Rubio. Now I can't look at the guy without thinking "Little Marco." And look what happened to Chris Christie in that press conference--a big NJ blowhard brought down to size, simply by standing behind Trump at the podium.
And just how does he get away with all that hyperbole? I hear him and all I can think of is "give me a break!" But others seem to actually believe him.
Ultralight
3-10-16, 10:50am
I think Trump is just what America needs! The chickens are coming home to roost in the GOP!
catherine
3-10-16, 11:31am
I think Trump is just what America needs! The chickens are coming home to roost in the GOP!
Come on! This isn't the WWF we're talking about. The fate of the free world hangs in the balance!
I think Trump is just what America needs! The chickens are coming home to roost in the GOP!
I think that as with the current administration, our Constitutional system of checks and balances would serve to frustrate his more autocratic ambitions. That's why I'm not one of those who professes to be "terrified" of a Trump presidency.
I'd be more afraid of his setting back the GOP a generation or so. He could do to us what Jimmy Carter did to the Democrats back in the seventies.
rodeosweetheart
3-10-16, 12:12pm
Catherine, I think a lot of Trump supporters are actually in this camp, seeking his nomination and possible election as some kind of avenue to destroy a country that they feel disenfranchised from--it is a destructive impulse, and sad, to my way of thinking. I much prefer the positivism of Bernie's campaign--what you see is what you get, and it is civil, and the people on the campaign that I have worked with an observed have been civil and constructive. Very much in line with my Quaker values. It has been a good experience.
Louis CK had an interesting piece about people finding Trump funny, and it being time to stop laughing:
"Voting for Trump is a way of saying '**** it. **** them all'. I really get it," Louis C.K. writes. "The whole game feels rigged and it’s not going anywhere but down anymore. I feel that way sometimes."
and
"P.S. Please stop it with voting for Trump. It was funny for a little while. But the guy is Hitler. And by that I mean that we are being Germany in the 30s. Do you think they saw the shit coming? Hitler was just some hilarious and refreshing dude with a weird comb over who would say anything at all."
Here is an article on the piece he wrote:
http://www.vox.com/2016/3/7/11173384/louis-ck-donald-trump
I think it is well worth reading for anyone trying to figure out why people are making outrageous comments about wanting Trump to win, in order to somehow punish the American people.
Agreed. I fear Trump for one reason: He and Hitler have too many commonalities.
I saw a news clip this morning about all the protesters that have been showing up at Trump's tours. It's probably a bad place to protest, since so many of the followers are angry/obnoxious. They weren't treated very well. But then Trump started saying things like "I'd like to punch him in the face". Am I dreaming? Is all this ridiculous/embarrassing/depressing stuff really happening?
Ultralight
3-10-16, 1:39pm
I saw a news clip this morning about all the protesters that have been showing up at Trump's tours. It's probably a bad place to protest, since so many of the followers are angry/obnoxious. They weren't treated very well. But then Trump started saying things like "I'd like to punch him in the face". Am I dreaming? Is all this ridiculous/embarrassing/depressing stuff really happening?
It is not that bad.
My suggestion: Laugh at it!
If I was a US citizen I would not laugh at this Trump situation. Seen by the international community it is probably colouring what the world thinks about the people of the US. Those fanatical supporters are getting a lot of press.
I don't think this because I know all of you, but others.... well i would be worried.
Ultralight
3-10-16, 1:51pm
If I was a US citizen I would not laugh at this Trump situation. Seen by the international community it is probably colouring what the world thinks about the people of the US. Those fanatical supporters are getting a lot of press.
I don't think this because I know all of you, but others.... well i would be worried.
Sincerely, don't worry.
If the tide does not change on this upcoming Tuesday then Trumptler will get blocked at the GOP's convention. The GOP is very "establishment." They won't allow such a boat-rocker to take charge.
And if Trumptler gets elected then Americans get to go to the school of hard knocks and learn that willful, intentional stupidity has consequences.
rodeosweetheart
3-10-16, 1:51pm
I saw a news clip this morning about all the protesters that have been showing up at Trump's tours. It's probably a bad place to protest, since so many of the followers are angry/obnoxious. They weren't treated very well. But then Trump started saying things like "I'd like to punch him in the face". Am I dreaming? Is all this ridiculous/embarrassing/depressing stuff really happening?
Yes, it is absolutely happening. I heard of someone from Bernie campaign who went down to view Trump rally and was hassled and then was arrested when he did not immediately leave--it is a violent crowd.
I also heard Trump invite the football team to beat up hecklers in the crowd in Iowa, that he would "pay their legal fees." He used the big, young football players as threats against the hecklers, inviting them to hurt the hecklers.
Catherine, I think a lot of Trump supporters are actually in this camp, seeking his nomination and possible election as some kind of avenue to destroy a country that they feel disenfranchised from--it is a destructive impulse, and sad, to my way of thinking. I much prefer the positivism of Bernie's campaign--what you see is what you get, and it is civil, and the people on the campaign that I have worked with an observed have been civil and constructive. Very much in line with my Quaker values. It has been a good experience.
Louis CK had an interesting piece about people finding Trump funny, and it being time to stop laughing:
"Voting for Trump is a way of saying '**** it. **** them all'. I really get it," Louis C.K. writes. "The whole game feels rigged and it’s not going anywhere but down anymore. I feel that way sometimes."
and
"P.S. Please stop it with voting for Trump. It was funny for a little while. But the guy is Hitler. And by that I mean that we are being Germany in the 30s. Do you think they saw the shit coming? Hitler was just some hilarious and refreshing dude with a weird comb over who would say anything at all."
Here is an article on the piece he wrote:
http://www.vox.com/2016/3/7/11173384/louis-ck-donald-trump
I think it is well worth reading for anyone trying to figure out why people are making outrageous comments about wanting Trump to win, in order to somehow punish the American people.
Clive Crook at Bloomberg makes the interesting argument that people trying to brand Trump as a fascist are actually helping him:
“In any event, the problem with calling out Trump's supposed fascist tendencies isn't just that the charge is hysterical: What's more important is that it doesn't hurt him. It may very well help him. The accusation is a calculated insult not just to Trump but to his many supporters. Your views aren't just wrong, it says, they're vile and illegitimate: How evil or stupid must you be to support an American Hitler?
This approach is unlikely to change their minds. As I've previously argued (http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2016-02-19/donald-trump-class-warrior), support for Trump, though misguided, is intelligible. And that isn't because his supporters are all racists, bigots or morons. The desire to send a message of protest to America's political elite is by no means unreasonable. There's plenty to protest about. If, instead of paying attention, America's political elite then calls you a would-be Nazi in return, you might be all the more determined to send the message.”
http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2016-03-10/don-t-help-trump-by-calling-him-a-fascist
Ultralight
3-10-16, 3:15pm
Clive Crook at Bloomberg makes the interesting argument that people trying to brand Trump as a fascist are actually helping him:
“In any event, the problem with calling out Trump's supposed fascist tendencies isn't just that the charge is hysterical: What's more important is that it doesn't hurt him. It may very well help him. The accusation is a calculated insult not just to Trump but to his many supporters. Your views aren't just wrong, it says, they're vile and illegitimate: How evil or stupid must you be to support an American Hitler?
This approach is unlikely to change their minds. As I've previously argued (http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2016-02-19/donald-trump-class-warrior), support for Trump, though misguided, is intelligible. And that isn't because his supporters are all racists, bigots or morons. The desire to send a message of protest to America's political elite is by no means unreasonable. There's plenty to protest about. If, instead of paying attention, America's political elite then calls you a would-be Nazi in return, you might be all the more determined to send the message.”
http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2016-03-10/don-t-help-trump-by-calling-him-a-fascist
Interesting line of reasoning.
rodeosweetheart
3-10-16, 3:30pm
Just in from the Washington Post:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/powerpost/paloma/daily-202/2016/03/10/daily-202-four-reasons-hillary-clinton-lost-the-democratic-debate/56e0a5cd981b92a22d7c29e7/
- Michelle Fields, the Breitbart news reporter, gives her own account of the physical altercation she had at Trump's Tuesday night press conference in Jupiter, Fla.: "Trump acknowledged the question, but before he could answer I was jolted backwards. Someone had grabbed me tightly by the arm and yanked me down. I almost fell to the ground, but was able to maintain my balance." Fields says that The Post's Ben Terris identified Trump campaign manager Corey Lewandowski as the culprit. "I quickly turned around and saw Lewandowski and Trump exiting the building together. No apology. No explanation for why he did this ... Even if Trump was done taking questions, Lewandowski would be out of line. Campaign managers aren’t supposed to try to forcefully throw reporters to the ground, no matter the circumstance. But what made this especially jarring is that there was no hint Trump was done taking questions. No one was pushing him to get away. He seemed to have been happily answering queries from my fellow reporters just a moment before."
I think that is the kind of incident that is making people think of Nazi Germany.
I think that is the kind of incident that is making people think of Nazi Germany.
Hereabouts, the Hillary supporters are complaining about being uncomfortable showing up at the caucus because of threats by the Sanders supporters.
Interesting line of reasoning.
I'm inclined toward your view that laughing at a buffoon like this is probably the most effective form of opposition.
rodeosweetheart
3-10-16, 3:42pm
I don't think that laughing at bullies who are physically violent towards others is very effective.
Ultralight
3-10-16, 3:44pm
Uh... be realistic folks. There is a lot of difference between Hitler and Trump.
But I will still call him Trumptler!
ApatheticNoMore
3-10-16, 4:01pm
I don't think that laughing at bullies who are physically violent towards others is very effective.
Charlie Chaplin thought otherwise, his target was ... the real Hitler. But I am skeptical that making fun of someone who is ALREADY a self-parody is really much use. Drumpf is a self-parody, Drumpf himself is a joke, but that joke might be on us ... I mean if you don't already think Drumpf being president has a hilarious element if it wasn't so disturbing, I'm not sure humor is going to help.
I may be a little skeptical of trusting what I hear happening at Drumpf rallies as one can never trust the media. But yes Drumpf has made statements himself defending violence and beating up protestors at his rallies, he is terrifically anti-journalist (yea most journalists may be pretty bad and deserve criticism, but to want to shut them down is still a threat to free speech). And if reports of the thuggish behavior of his followers is to be believed, they're fricken brownshirts (or blackshirts depending on which fascist regime one wants to refer to). Oh it's so horrible I call fricken brownshirts fascists. Well oh boo hoo, deal with it! That's what they are.
Now is every single person who supports Drumpf a fascists like a bunch of thugs beating up people at rallies? I doubt it, some are probably just confused (yes I have heard people support him for his positions. But truthfully this seems a misreading of the man to me, as whatever he says, I don't think Drumpf actually HAS any convictions when it comes down to it, beyond self-promotion).
Ultralight
3-10-16, 4:05pm
I will say it again:
Best and most hilarious election of my lifetime! LOL
rodeosweetheart
3-10-16, 4:15pm
If you have not yet seen it, Lt. Gen. Mark Hertling's article about Trump's comments on ordering US soldiers to commit war crimes is well worth reading:
http://www.cnn.com/2016/03/04/opinions/donald-trump-military-hertling/?iid=ob_lockedrail_bottomlist&iref=obnetwork
He writes:
"That's why, during a recent presidential debate, I had such a visceral reaction to one candidate who stated that the those who serve in the U.S. military would blindly ignore their oath, their training and their conscience to follow what were clearly illegal, unethical and immoral orders. When pressed, that same candidate implied that his personal and directive and leadership prowess would prevail.
It wouldn't.
Even though that same candidate has now tempered those words with a press release and several tweets, as a professional soldier I picked up the "intent" the first time I heard it. And it scared me."
I would trust the reaction of the general, who reports a visceral fear of the candidate and his intentions, over my own natural tendency to laugh at others who seem buffoonish or comic in their boorishness, violence, and lack of civility.
I kind of figure he knows better than I of the real dangers that this candidate presents.
ApatheticNoMore
3-10-16, 4:16pm
If the tide does not change on this upcoming Tuesday then Trumptler will get blocked at the GOP's convention. The GOP is very "establishment." They won't allow such a boat-rocker to take charge.
I don't know. Some say Reagan was considered anti-establishment at the time as well and was opposed by the Republican establishment at the time, but they let him become President. Of course he actually did have political experience (approve of the job he did or not - he actually had been governor of California etc.). Maybe it depends on how easily they think Trump can be worked with and his strings pulled. It's one thing to have a brokered convention if it's a close tie, it's less likely to happen if state after state Trump wins and that is what is happening. It would probably be a good thing to block Trump of course.
And if Trumptler gets elected then Americans get to go to the school of hard knocks and learn that willful, intentional stupidity has consequences.
I think those hard knocks will fall disproportionately on certain minorities in this country (oh I'm not saying the present situation is great, I'm just saying). And bad situations don't necessarily make people act with non-stupidity, there is such a thing as a vicious circle, where things getting worse just means they get worse. What would make people act better, ha probably if they all were Quakers and had that kind of practice. :)
Ultralight
3-10-16, 4:23pm
What would make people act better, ha probably if they all were Quakers and had that kind of practice. :)
Maybe... or maybe it is Trump's inner light moving him to speak at his rallies and telling him what to say.
Who are we to judge?
ApatheticNoMore
3-10-16, 4:50pm
I have my doubt if intellect is enough without an actual practice that focuses on doing good in the world. I think it's a matter of heart as much as mind. I do think Quakers have that, though I don't think they have a monopoly on it. All our intellect is supposed to save us, but while America may be a rather stupid culture, early 20th century Germany was the pinnacle of western intellect and civilization and that was the real Hitler.
If you think that Drumpf has that focus on doing good in the world, I really can't help you (but I don't think he's necessarily as evil as some say, he's just entirely self-absorbed, some of his thuggish followers are another story, and Drumpfs self-absorption can't even SEE the damage he does to other people, so it enables all that).
An elderly mossback like myself can remember similar hysteria directed at Ronald Reagan back in the day.
http://www.nysun.com/national/fears-of-trump-as-fascist-echo-similar-warnings/89476/
Personally, I think the American Left has overused accusations of fascism and racism to the point of losing their effectiveness to shock or dismay all but the tenderest of sensibilities; and perhaps they've even risen to the point of becoming a badge of honor in some circles grown weary of overweening political correctness.
I remember reading an essay George Orwell wrote about goose-stepping. It was something to the effect that you only saw it in places where people didn't laugh at it's practitioners.
Personally, I think the American Left has overused accusations of fascism and racism to the point of losing their effectiveness to shock or dismay all but the tenderest of sensibilities; and perhaps they've even risen to the point of becoming a badge of honor in some circles grown weary of overweening political correctness.
Agreed, I think it's possible the Trump phenomenon, and certainly the upswing of the conservative movement, is a logical reaction to run amuck leftism.
Ultralight
3-10-16, 5:11pm
Agreed, I think it's possible the Trump phenomenon, and certainly the upswing of the conservative movement, is a logical reaction to run amuck leftism.
Is there anything you would not blame us for? lol
ApatheticNoMore
3-10-16, 5:12pm
Personally, I think the American Left has overused accusations of fascism and racism to the point of losing their effectiveness to shock or dismay all but the tenderest of sensibilities
uh every two bit dictator the U.S. wants to wage war on is the next Hitler. Saddam is Hitler, Gadhafi is Hitler, Assad is Hitler. I believed none of it. I don't know if Putin etc. is Hitler today or not - better ask some D.C. powerbroker. But the universal modus operandi of the American empire is to forever be finding a supposed Hitler to fight. It's not some Left thing, it's an Empire thing.
But fascist movements do have a lot of similarity (I'm not sure why, maybe authoritarian personalities act that way) and it really does seem to be fascist behavior from some of Drumpfs followers.
Ultralight
3-10-16, 6:10pm
You know seriously when I think about this Trump thing I have to wonder how did so many people get so angry, so disenfranchised, so left out and worked up to support him.
This is America. That is just how we roll!
rodeosweetheart
3-10-16, 6:28pm
Wow, there are many disturbing incidents from these Trump rallies:
http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2016/03/02/a_list_of_violent_incidents_at_donald_trump_rallie s_and_events.html
The Storyteller
3-10-16, 6:33pm
I really wonder two things. Should Trump win, how many US citizens would permanently flee?
There is no way he is getting the nomination, no matter how many primaries he wins. The GOP is way too smart for that.
rodeosweetheart - those clips are very alarming.
The Storyteller
3-10-16, 6:37pm
I saw a news clip this morning about all the protesters that have been showing up at Trump's tours. It's probably a bad place to protest, since so many of the followers are angry/obnoxious. They weren't treated very well. But then Trump started saying things like "I'd like to punch him in the face". Am I dreaming? Is all this ridiculous/embarrassing/depressing stuff really happening?
I wish this dude would show up at his rally and mouth off. Just a little.
http://cdn.onegreenplanet.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/10//2013/09/Vegan-strongman-David-Cooper-Toronto-Star.jpg
Is there anything you would not blame us for? lol
I wouldn't consider it blame any more than I would blame a hammer for it's transfer of force to a nail. But, you could call it other things such as cause & effect, yin and yang or maybe even Karma if you believed in that sort of thing. Blame is emotion driven where what we're seeing is more a force of nature.
frugal-one
3-10-16, 7:10pm
I will say it again:
Best and most hilarious election of my lifetime! LOL
Truly disgusting IMO.... where is the dignity?
http://www.vox.com/2016/3/1/11127424/trump-authoritarianism
This article presents an interesting view of Trump and also how to test people for authoritarian tendencies. For those who don't want to read it, basically the study found that people who have bought into all the stuff that they are told to be scared of are likely to want an authoritarian leader and therefore love trump. But also, people with authoritarian tendencies have been moving to the Republican Party for decades and now represent a big enough chunk of the party to create a problem for them going forward because they aren't likely to,just go away after whoever else wins the election in November.
freshstart
3-10-16, 8:47pm
Way earlier in the process than normal, I'm opting out of actively hearing one more word a candidate has to say, he is a clown at the least and an enormous disaster for this country at best, I never thought I would be hoping for Mitt Romney to do anything
Ultralight
3-10-16, 9:21pm
Truly disgusting IMO.... where is the dignity?
We lost our collective dignity as a nation decades ago. It is all over but the shouting now.
Teacher Terry
3-11-16, 3:42am
UL: not trying to be mean but I think you have many things that could best be worked out in therapy but you have to really apply your self and no just go through the motions.
rosarugosa
3-11-16, 7:30am
http://www.vox.com/2016/3/1/11127424/trump-authoritarianism
This article presents an interesting view of Trump and also how to test people for authoritarian tendencies. For those who don't want to read it, basically the study found that people who have bought into all the stuff that they are told to be scared of are likely to want an authoritarian leader and therefore love trump. But also, people with authoritarian tendencies have been moving to the Republican Party for decades and now represent a big enough chunk of the party to create a problem for them going forward because they aren't likely to,just go away after whoever else wins the election in November.
That was an interesting article and supports what I've observed of the people I know who like Trump. They seem to be primarily motivated by fear and perceive him as a strong figure and protector.
Ultralight
3-11-16, 8:21am
UL: not trying to be mean but I think you have many things that could best be worked out in therapy but you have to really apply your self and no just go through the motions.
Such as?
http://www.vox.com/2016/3/1/11127424/trump-authoritarianism
This article presents an interesting view of Trump and also how to test people for authoritarian tendencies. For those who don't want to read it, basically the study found that people who have bought into all the stuff that they are told to be scared of are likely to want an authoritarian leader and therefore love trump. But also, people with authoritarian tendencies have been moving to the Republican Party for decades and now represent a big enough chunk of the party to create a problem for them going forward because they aren't likely to,just go away after whoever else wins the election in November.
Great article--extremely interesting and makes a lot of sense to me. You can overlay the authoritarian profile on a lot of groups that responded to Trump-like political figures in the past with a good degree of consistency. For instance, the Hitler comparisons that are made shouldn't really compare Trump to Hitler--the more salient comparisons are with the types of things that drive the followers of each group.
Fear is a powerful motivator, and fear of loss of personal security, whether that's in the form of loss of property or identity or place in the status quo, can be a powerful reason to attach oneself to a comic-book-like "superhero" who simplistically promises to restore things back to where they used to be-- "Make America Great Again"
Plus I believe that Trump symbolizes aspirations on another level--the Man of Steel is also the Man of Gold--the opulence and wealth he represents I believe attracts a lot of the "have-nots" in a way that politicians can't. Who envies Cruz? Who envies Kasich? Trump is the one with the Towers, the gorgeous wife, the "unfettered" consumption. I think his lifestyle symbolizes what lot of people want.
Thanks for that article. I'm going to bookmark it.
iris lilies
3-11-16, 9:17am
That was an interesting article and supports what I've observed of the people I know who like Trump. They seem to be primarily motivated by fear and perceive him as a strong figure and protector.
The three people know who are strong supporters of Trump are all successful business women. They want him because they want him to apply busness principles to improve government.
Illegal immigrants are also high on their list, or at least with one of them. And yes I do think that strong defense is an issue with them.
I am unhappy that I will be casting a vote next week in a state where the primary matters. Usually, its over before Missouri votes. I will have to thnk more carefully about who to vote for, its not a slam dunk for me to vote for Rand Paul who is still on our ballot.
The three people know who are strong supporters of Trump are all successful business women. They want him because they want him to apply busness principles to improve government.
I can see that rationale--and interesting because business women would be a whole different demographic from the white Authoritarians in jp1's article. So it's true that he defies common wisdom in terms of political segmentation.
Ultralight
3-11-16, 9:27am
I drove through a solidly middle class white neighborhood yesterday on my way to a park/lake I walk my dog at and fish in.
I saw many Trump signs. And no other signs...
Ultralight
3-11-16, 9:28am
I can see that rationale--and interesting because business women would be a whole different demographic from the white Authoritarians in jp1's article. So it's true that he defies common wisdom in terms of political segmentation.
I think most business people are authoritarians, but not the downwardly-mobile white, formerly middle class ones of which Trump's supporters are.
I think most business people are authoritarians, but not the downwardly-mobile white, formerly middle class ones of which Trump's supporters are.
I'm sure there's some overlap, but I wouldn't say they necessarily are, if you go by the profile of the Authoritarian in the article jp1 posted.
From it's founding, America has always had a warm place in it's heart for the political insult. It is a cherished part of our heritage. Some of our political campaigns have risen to Shakespearean levels of invective.
It is perhaps a sign of our cultural decline that our insults have become so puerile and formulaic. The Trump phenomenon is a good example. He calls his detractors losers, or ugly or liars. His opposition calls him (and his supporters) a proto-nazi and a rascist, and employ the feeble tools of pop psychology to reduce his support to some kind of authoritarian syndrome. Where is the creativity? Where is the art?
Even aside from the Donald, we see the same thing. The Sanders campaign is based almost entirely on ritualistic denunciations of "Wall Street" that were tired in the era of Eugene Debs. Clinton takes the more passive-aggressive approach of hinting her opponents are anti-woman. Recent GOP debates have been beneath the standard of play of any elementary school playground.
I'm increasingly coming to think that this country doesn't need to become less divisive or more civil. To do that would be to turn our back on a glorious history of inventive calumny. We need to up our game. We need a Churchill. A man who can refer to a political opponent as a "sheep in sheep's clothing", or "a modest man with much to be modest about". A man who refused to stand next to a Labour MP in a restroom because he feared he'd try to nationalize a superior endowment. The man who gave us "in the morning, I will be sober but you will still be ugly".
If we are ever to be a truly great nation, we will need to raise our standard for expressing our mutual contempt. That will take courage. That will take wit. But I believe we are up to the challenge.
Ultralight
3-11-16, 10:40am
If we are ever to be a truly great nation, we will need to...
Make America Great Again!
Make America Great Again!
Exactly. But not by "returning" to some past-that-never-was. By recovering the time when a man like Jefferson could say "A cold-blooded, calculating, unprincipled usurper, without a virtue; no statesman, knowing nothing of commerce, political economy, or civil government, and supplying ignorance by bold presumption." Or Thomas Paine could say " . a hypocrite in public life, the world will be puzzled to decide whether you are an apostate or an impostor, whether you have abandoned good principles, or whether you ever had any? "
Ultralight
3-11-16, 10:56am
Exactly. But not by "returning" to some past-that-never-was. By recovering the time when a man like Jefferson could say "A cold-blooded, calculating, unprincipled usurper, without a virtue; no statesman, knowing nothing of commerce, political economy, or civil government, and supplying ignorance by bold presumption." Or Thomas Paine could say " . a hypocrite in public life, the world will be puzzled to decide whether you are an apostate or an impostor, whether you have abandoned good principles, or whether you ever had any? "
Dude! I love me some Tom Paine!
catherine
3-11-16, 11:04am
We need to up our game. We need a Churchill. A man who can refer to a political opponent as a "sheep in sheep's clothing", or "a modest man with much to be modest about". A man who refused to stand next to a Labour MP in a restroom because he feared he'd try to nationalize a superior endowment. The man who gave us "in the morning, I will be sober but you will still be ugly".
If we are ever to be a truly great nation, we will need to raise our standard for expressing our mutual contempt. That will take courage. That will take wit. But I believe we are up to the challenge.
We'd have to learn how to insult like the Brits, who can make the worst insult sound like a compliment. That's how they get away with it. Reference John Gielgud in the movie Arthur speaking to Liza Minelli's character: "Thank you for a memorable afternoon. Usually one must go to a bowling alley to meet a woman of your stature." That's the way to do it, but we're a LONG way from knowing how to insult with such finesse.
rodeosweetheart
3-11-16, 11:23am
I prefer plain speech, which attempts to speak the truth, and strives to treat others with respect.
Insulting people for sport is not something that I seek out or enjoy. I think as a species, if we could make it a point not to try to hurt others, we would come a long way.
ApatheticNoMore
3-11-16, 11:48am
I think most business people probably have a very skewed perception of how business is run at least. They no doubt think they run their businesses well, and maybe do, but if they haven't spent enough time as employees of others businesses they likely have no clue how downright badly many businesses are run, not just from an employee perspective but horrible waste and confusion in general that the poor employees have to see and stand in awe of ("yes it makes no sense, don't ask me, I just work here ..."), the larger the business the more room in which to hide wasteful procedures, but some small businesses are run horribly as well.
ApatheticNoMore
3-11-16, 12:06pm
From it's founding, America has always had a warm place in it's heart for the political insult. It is a cherished part of our heritage. Some of our political campaigns have risen to Shakespearean levels of invective.
It is perhaps a sign of our cultural decline that our insults have become so puerile and formulaic.
I prefer to use my mind trying to understand things.
Mass social behavior is a hard thing to ever get a hold on, I don't fully understand the Drumpf phenomena (I've heard a lot of "vote Drumpf for the sake of destroying the rotten system" arguments, but I just think that's a really ignorant position).
But for all that most people are NOT voting Drumpf, even most Republicans and not voting Drumpf. But the non-Drumpf vote is being split. And talk about a guy with a 3rd grade vocabulary - Drumpf - to read his debates is constant non-sequitur, as questions don't get answered but pivoted to a focus on himself of course. But the Drumpf thing has an ugly side without any doubt.
* ordinarily I think making fun of politician's names is kind of silly, I never got the Barry for Obama thing, but when a guys chosen name means "to win" and you don't want that guy winning, I'm going to use his real family name. If he had a name like most people do that wasn't a word (like Obama or Rubio or etc.) or a name that meant a small tree or something, I wouldn't bother.
Ultralight
3-11-16, 12:09pm
"yes it makes no sense, don't ask me, I just work here ...")
Our modern life in a nutshell. hahaha
frugal-one
3-11-16, 12:42pm
We lost our collective dignity as a nation decades ago. It is all over but the shouting now.
I was not referring to our dignity as a nation but as to the candidate(s) who have no dignity!
Ultralight
3-11-16, 12:43pm
I was not referring to our dignity as a nation but as to the candidate(s) who have no dignity!
Same difference.
frugal-one
3-11-16, 12:46pm
Make America Great Again!
It is great now. You, obviously, have not traveled to other countries. Why do we have an immigration problem? Because many try to come HERE because we have it so good!
frugal-one
3-11-16, 12:51pm
Same difference.
I don't believe so. Trump is not an "average" American.
It is great now. You, obviously, have not traveled to other countries. Why do we have an immigration problem? Because many try to come HERE because we have it so good!
I find it interesting you never hear "when" the America was that we supposedly want to go back to to be great again.
I prefer plain speech, which attempts to speak the truth, and strives to treat others with respect.
"If you can fake that, you've got it made."
- G. Marx
rodeosweetheart
3-11-16, 1:22pm
"If you can fake that, you've got it made."
- G. Marx
I don't quite understand your comment, LDAHL.
Bring back Atticus Finch.
Ultralight
3-11-16, 1:29pm
I find it interesting you never hear "when" the America was that we supposedly want to go back to to be great again.
Listen closely. It is the 1950s.
The three people know who are strong supporters of Trump are all successful business women. They want him because they want him to apply busness principles to improve government.
Illegal immigrants are also high on their list, or at least with one of them. And yes I do think that strong defense is an issue with them.
I am unhappy that I will be casting a vote next week in a state where the primary matters. Usually, its over before Missouri votes. I will have to thnk more carefully about who to vote for, its not a slam dunk for me to vote for Rand Paul who is still on our ballot.
It would be interesting (although certainly an odd conversation...) to ask the 4 child related questions to these women to see if they have authoritarian tendancies. Since authoritarianism is not exclusively something that only the downtrodden want or feel they need I'd bet that these women might "pass" the test with flying colors.
The one thing in the article that was a bit chilling came at the end when they went into further detail about the fact that supposedly there are lots of people who are potential authoritarians but need sufficiently bad circumstances to trigger it. In other words if something really goes wrong between now and the election the current assumption that trump can't get more than 30-40% of the vote in the general election may prove false.
I find it interesting you never hear "when" the America was that we supposedly want to go back to to be great again.
Exactly. For lots of people who aren't in Trump's base that mythical time when America was greater was not necessarily so great. As a gay man there's no other time in our history that I would want to live in compared to today. Not being treated equal and having to hide such an essential component of my being would make any other period of our history less great for living in than today. I imagine many other people who aren't straight white men would agree.
I imagine many other people who aren't straight white men would agree.
Yup.
Exactly. For lots of people who aren't in Trump's base that mythical time when America was greater was not necessarily so great. As a gay man there's no other time in our history that I would want to live in compared to today. Not being treated equal and having to hide such an essential component of my being would make any other period of our history less great for living in than today. I imagine many other people who aren't straight white men would agree.
It wasn't all that great for women, either, white, black or "other"
Bring back Atticus Finch.
They did last year. Apparently, a lot of people were disappointed.
I don't quite understand your comment, LDAHL.
It's what Groucho said about sincerity.
Almost everybody says they're being truthful. We apparently (at least with respect to politics) seem to have an infinite variety of the stuff.
It could be that truth is such a valuable commodity we conserve it wherever we can.
rodeosweetheart
3-11-16, 3:45pm
It's what Groucho said about sincerity.
Almost everybody says they're being truthful. We apparently (at least with respect to politics) seem to have an infinite variety of the stuff.
It could be that truth is such a valuable commodity we conserve it wherever we can.
thanks for the clarification
We'd have to learn how to insult like the Brits, who can make the worst insult sound like a compliment. That's how they get away with it. Reference John Gielgud in the movie Arthur speaking to Liza Minelli's character: "Thank you for a memorable afternoon. Usually one must go to a bowling alley to meet a woman of your stature." That's the way to do it, but we're a LONG way from knowing how to insult with such finesse.
George Bernard Shaw once sent Winston Churchill two tickets for the first night of one of his plays, with a note saying "Bring a friend, if you have one."
Churchill responded with a note that said, "Can't make the first night. Will come to the second, if you have one."
They did last year. Apparently, a lot of people were disappointed.
ha ha ha.
What's this business about Trump's rallies/speeches getting cancelled because of protesters/threats of violence?
iris lilies
3-13-16, 4:15pm
What's this business about Trump's rallies/speeches getting cancelled because of protesters/threats of violence?
I can't speak for those who are shuttIng down Trump & co's 1st amendment free speech rights, but here in St Louis there were a couple hundred Trump protestors and many thousands who stood in line for hours to see him.
Guess which group was covered on the news.
Supporters included a group "Muslims for Trump" who passed out donuts. Who knew!!???
Supporters included a group "Muslims for Trump" who passed out donuts. Who knew!!???
This must be a very trying time for comedians and writers of political satire.
rodeosweetheart
3-13-16, 4:44pm
Bae, here's a letter I got today from MoveOn explaining what happened at the UIC Rally in Chicago. I have deleted the fundraising appeals:
Last night, without consulting local police, Donald Trump abruptly cancelled a rally in Chicago in the face of massive and overwhelmingly peaceful student-led protests.1
Then he blamed MoveOn members for his decision, telling Fox News we must have "staged" the protests and that MoveOn is "not a good group of people."2 Fox News's coverage and other right-wing media have followed his lead—denouncing MoveOn "agitators" for ruining Trump's event. This morning, he called protestors "thugs."3
We're being flooded with aggressive emails and social media posts from Trump supporters. Some of them are threatening.
We refuse to be intimidated by Donald Trump, Fox News, or anyone else. We need to make sure the public at large understands what Trump is up to here—encouraging violence, looking for scapegoats, and then, perversely, trying to paint himself as the victim. . .
Let's be clear. Trump has been encouraging attacks on peaceful demonstrators for months.4 On stage at a rally in St. Louis yesterday morning, he called for "consequences" rather than "politically correct" handling of protesters.5
As Rachel Maddow pointed out, and as even the other Republican presidential candidates now seem to understand, Trump is deliberately inciting violence at his rallies.6
Now he's trying to pin the blame on MoveOn for the toxic atmosphere he's fueling. . .
. . .
It's become increasingly clear in recent weeks that Donald Trump's rising fascist rhetoric poses a new and dangerous threat to our inclusive democracy. And now, MoveOn members are on the receiving end of his megaphone.
We're not backing down from our work to stand up against Trump, Fox, and the broader right wing that's seeking to divide our country. Not now. Not ever.
We must decisively reject Trump's fascist rhetoric and this rising tide of hatred.
We are committed to nonviolence, but we will not be silent. We will not be invisible.
So here's the plan: We'll support MoveOn members to call out and nonviolently protest Trump's racist, bigoted, misogynistic, xenophobic, and violent behavior—and show the world that America rejects Trump's hate. . .
We've been ramping up our efforts for months—from the "We Are Better Than This" ad we helped organize in The New York Times in December, to our collective advocacy for refugees under attack from the GOP, to the support we provided students in Chicago last night by printing signs and a banner and recruiting MoveOn members to join their peaceful protest. We need to double-down in the face of direct attacks on our community.
Thanks for all you do.
–Victoria, Robert, Josh, Anna, and the rest of the team
Sources:
1. "Trump cancels Chicago rally amid safety concerns; police say they weren't consulted," Los Angeles Times, March 11, 2016
http://act.moveon.org/go/2088?t=17&akid=163017.33738361.2oa9ec
2. "Fox News," Twitter, March 11, 2016
https://act.moveon.org/go/2083?t=19&akid=163017.33738361.2oa9ec
3. "Donald J. Trump," Twitter, March 12, 2016
https://act.moveon.org/go/2084?t=21&akid=163017.33738361.2oa9ec
4. "Could Donald Trump be held legally responsible for inciting violence at his rallies?," Washington Post, March 11, 2016
https://act.moveon.org/go/2085?t=23&akid=163017.33738361.2oa9ec
5. "Donald Trump rallies in Chicago, St. Louis erupt in violence; GOP front-runner says he’s not responsible," Daily News, March 12, 2016
http://act.moveon.org/go/2082?t=25&akid=163017.33738361.2oa9ec
6. "Maddow: Trump 'Deliberately Tried To Incite Violence,'" Real Clear Politics, March 11, 2016
http://act.moveon.org/go/2086?t=27&akid=163017.33738361.2oa9ec
I can't speak for those who are shuttIng down Trump & co's 1st amendment free speech rights, but here in St Louis there were a couple hundred Trump protestors and many thousands who stood in line for hours to see him.
Guess which group was covered on the news.
Supporters included a group "Muslims for Trump" who passed out donuts. Who knew!!???
And apparently at the Fayetteville rally a few days ago a protester who was leaving got punched in the face and the police, who were escorting him out, put HIM, (the protestor) in handcuffs but did nothing about the guy that had just punched him. The puncher didn't get arrested until the next day. And now Trump is looking into paying the puncher's legal bills. The man claiming to have a huge dick may not have a big one but he certain is a one.
http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2016/03/10/3758520/trump-protester-punched-in-face/
This isn't going to end well.
This isn't going to end well.
You have to wonder at this point how many false flag operations, outside agitators, and other such classic tricks are going on, on the part of all the various factions.
Disgusting.
I can't imagine 10 to 12,000 conservatives showing up at a Bernie Sanders rally with the intention of disrupting the event, but I'm sure that if they did, everyone would agree that it's Bernie's fault.
I can't imagine 10 to 12,000 conservatives showing up at a Bernie Sanders rally with the intention of disrupting the event, but I'm sure that if they did, everyone would agree that it's Bernie's fault.
I can't imagine conservatives showing up to disrupt a Bernie event either, since Bernie isn't trying to incite anger and hatred of conservatives. Now if 10 to 12,000 Wall Street banksters showed up to protest a Bernie event that might be a different story...
I can't imagine 10 to 12,000 conservatives showing up at a Bernie Sanders rally with the intention of disrupting the event, but I'm sure that if they did, everyone would agree that it's Bernie's fault.
Of course Bernie has also never said things even remotely like that he longed for a day when a guy like that would've "been punched and carried out on a stretcher."
rodeosweetheart
3-13-16, 9:00pm
Of course Bernie has also never said things even remotely like that he longed for a day when a guy like that would've "been punched and carried out on a stretcher."
Well, I have heard Bernie speak in person, and he has a rather gentle demeanor.
yeah, Bernie was the one who had Black Lives Matters protesters jump on his stage and his response was 'let's talk'.
I watched the Rachel Maddow 10 minute show on how Trump is escalating and purposefully inciting violence. Chilling. I think it was clear and truthful. I take all the things I hear on FB and other places with a grain of salt, however I felt that things were much worse when I saw her show.
What really really scared me was how he said that protesters were a problem and that America was weak to let someone raise a hand or a finger and not hurt them. That we are weak because we are afraid to hurt people, and he would pay legal bills of people who wanted to make us great again by being willing to hurt people.
Dudes, This has NOTHING to do with politics. There is no party that has this as a platform on an issue. There are no issues he is talking about!
What I want to do truly is to have a place to gather as Buddhists and chant the metta sutta together as a peaceful alternative. I am actually a little scared and I have never been scared before like this.
Exactly. For lots of people who aren't in Trump's base that mythical time when America was greater was not necessarily so great. As a gay man there's no other time in our history that I would want to live in compared to today. Not being treated equal and having to hide such an essential component of my being would make any other period of our history less great for living in than today. I imagine many other people who aren't straight white men would agree.
Yes, for my reasons of being a woman and being non-Christian. But I will say that it would cause deep pain to see my close friends and family close down any part of their lives that are joyful and productive and connected and loving. I am not going back.
I can't imagine 10 to 12,000 conservatives showing up at a Bernie Sanders rally with the intention of disrupting the event, but I'm sure that if they did, everyone would agree that it's Bernie's fault.
That's a good point. Try picturing 'safe zones' to protect young minds from the trauma of hearing Bernie blaming innocent billionaires for all our problems, or requiring trigger warnings about violence to the First Amendment.
I'm not sure which spectacle I found uglier: the mob chanting "We stopped Trump", or Trump playing the martyr.
Ultralight
3-14-16, 9:06am
That's a good point. Try picturing 'safe zones' to protect young minds from the trauma of hearing Bernie blaming innocent billionaires for all our problems, or requiring trigger warnings about violence to the First Amendment.
I'm not sure which spectacle I found uglier: the mob chanting "We stopped Trump", or Trump playing the martyr.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBKAHRYkGVQ
You right-wingers are angels! ;)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBKAHRYkGVQ
You right-wingers are angels! ;)
Of course not. It's rude to interrupt the President while he's lying.
But to Alan's point, I don't think you see the same urge to suppress opposing viewpoints on the Right that you see on the Left. Like that twit who rushed the podium to "take away Trump's microphone", or Hillary's pledge to redact uncongenial portions of the First Amendment, or the struggle at many institutions of higher learning to protect students from unsettling ideas.
I suppose you can call stirring up fear and hatred a viewpoint. Not one that seems particularly useful, but a viewpoint nonetheless.
I suppose you can call stirring up fear and hatred a viewpoint. Not one that seems particularly useful, but a viewpoint nonetheless.
Exactly. Neither you nor I nor moveon.org nor the Supreme Court get to decide who's views are permissible to express. That's why people who want to shut down Trump's rallies are no better than Trump himself.
Exactly. Neither you nor I nor moveon.org nor the Supreme Court get to decide who's views are permissible to express. That's why people who want to shut down Trump's rallies are no better than Trump himself.
Exactly! You can't abhor one while celebrating the other.
In September, I read a New York Times article about a meeting of the GOP leadership. This must have been an open meeting as it has been reported elsewhere. I mean it is not leaked information by the GOP but was open knowledge. At that time, the leadership said they would not endorse Trump if he made it to the Convention. He would not get the endorsement as he was not representative of the party. And, they thought he lacked the leadership skills and knowledge to even attempt to manage something as complex as our government. There was a plan in place to discredit Trump by the Republican party.
I believe that is what Romney was doing recently when he denounced Trump. He is one of the few people who can stand up and talk like that without fear of political or business consequences.
However, as he keeps doing well in the primaries, how can the party discredit him but not alienate all the voters that selected his name? It's a tricky problem for the party. If the party is changing and mixed up in it's leadership as it seems to me, they don't want to lose all those votes on election day.
Trump scares the heck out of me. I am very afraid some poor soul is going to suffer serious injury at one of these rallies. It's not a game and all lives matter. If he knows what he is doing, he cannot lead this country. IMHO
Exactly. Neither you nor I nor moveon.org nor the Supreme Court get to decide who's views are permissible to express. That's why people who want to shut down Trump's rallies are no better than Trump himself.
Indeed. But at what point do Trump's words cross the point of being a message of shared ideology to a threat of intimidation, which is not protected by the first amendment. The protester that got punched in Fayetteville would probably argue that that point was crossed on that day.
iris lilies
3-14-16, 10:37am
There will be more incidents with Trump supporters simply because the numbers of Trump supporters who show up at rallies are huge, and dwarf the number of protestors.
Here in St. Louis DH reports that there was a contingent of protestors who chanted "Mexico! mexico! Mexico" and Trump supporters chanted "U.S.A! U.S.A! U.S.A!" The logic of chanting "mexico!" escapes me, but if the Mexico supporters wish to engage in friendly rivalry, so be it.
One benefit of this sorry election cycle may be the demythologizing of “the establishment”. You kind of get the picture (Hollywood is partly to blame) that the “Republican Leadership” is a dozen old white guys in club chairs smoking Camachos and directing the activities of the party. Clearly, recent events have given the lie to that. Political parties are loose coalitions of interests and philosophies trying to work together to obtain enough power to achieve common goals. The Trump situation shows what happens when one group of voters deviates from the Party’s ideological mainstream. I think the Sanders situation is another example of the same thing.
rodeosweetheart
3-14-16, 10:44am
I was glad to read that criminal charges have been brought against the campaign manager for assaulting the reporter.
I doubt it will do anything to modify Trump's inciting people to violence and offering to pay their legal fees for assaulting others. He did this before at a rally right before the Iowa Caucus; I saw the video of him threatening people with one of the athletic teams.
It seems that his position is more like that of the Mafia--might and money makes muscle, and I will use that muscle to intimidate others. Just yesterday he tweeted that he intended to send his supporters to disrupt Bernie rallies, which I think is pretty much a direct threat, and actually one to me personally, as I attend Bernie rallies, and never felt unsafe there until now.
He is thumbing his nose at the mainstream media now, as well.
There will be more incidents with Trump supporters simply because the numbers of Trump supporters who show up at rallies are huge, and dwarf the number of protestors. And also as long as Trump continues to incite them to violence.
Fixed that for you. As long as Trump continues to make statements encouraging violence and offering to pay legal bills of his thug supporters the violence will continue.
catherine
3-14-16, 11:01am
It seems that his position is more like that of the Mafia--might and money makes muscle, and I will use that muscle to intimidate others.
I get that feeling as well. Also, his extremely paternalistic attitude toward his followers hearkens Brando in The Godfather
rodeosweetheart
3-14-16, 11:02am
So he would pay the legal fees of one of his supporters who comes to a Bernie rally, and while I am chanting "Ber-nee"--because that'a about all we do, that and cheer for him, when he outlines his platforms, and punches me in the face, a 60 year old woman.
Never, in America, would I have thought I would feel this way, and it was considered okay.
I have ten ancestors who fought in the Revolution and my grandfather founded Rhode Island. My heart is breaking for our country.
Just yesterday he tweeted that he intended to send his supporters to disrupt Bernie rallies, which I think is pretty much a direct threat, and actually one to me personally, as I attend Bernie rallies, and never felt unsafe there until now.
I believe that was a direct response to MoveOn.Org (who has endorsed and is currently working alongside the Sanders campaign) directing over 10,000 protesters to the Chicago rally. I wonder how safe Trump supporters felt as they tried to get into the venue? I can't rationalize one being more complicit than the other.
For the record I think Trump is a disaster, but there are lots of us who remember what happened in Chicago during the 1968 Democratic convention and believe he did the right thing in cancelling the event.
So he would pay the legal fees of one of his supporters who comes to a Bernie rally, and while I am chanting "Ber-nee"--because that'a about all we do, that and cheer for him, when he outlines his platforms, and punches me in the face, a 60 year old woman.
Never, in America, would I have thought I would feel this way, and it was considered okay.
I have ten ancestors who fought in the Revolution and my grandfather founded Rhode Island. My heart is breaking for our country.
I think it's a matter of perspective. Comparing political demonstrations in Chicago 1968 versus Chicago 2016 would seem to indicate things have gotten tamer.
There was a time when politicians fought duels and beat one another senseless on the Senate floor. Today, they just taunt one another on television.
So he would pay the legal fees of one of his supporters who comes to a Bernie rally, and while I am chanting "Ber-nee"--because that'a about all we do, that and cheer for him, when he outlines his platforms, and punches me in the face, a 60 year old woman.
Truthfully I don't think you have much to worry about. Bullies only do their thing when they are fairly confident of a win. Trump's thugs don't have the balls to show up at a Bernie rally and pick fights. The odds of losing are simply too great.
rodeosweetheart
3-14-16, 11:15am
Alan, he was doing this prior to anything related to the UIC rally--here's a clip from February 1, from the Iowa caucus days:
By DAVID MARTOSKO, US POLITICAL EDITOR FOR DAILYMAIL.COM IN CEDAR RAPIDS, IOWA
PUBLISHED: 16:22 EST, 1 February 2016 | UPDATED: 14:16 EST, 2 February 2016
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Donald Trump found his signature voice Monday afternoon in Iowa's second largest city, urging rally attendees on Iowa's presidential caucus day to 'knock the c**p out of' any anti-Trump activists who try to hit him with vine-ripened produce.
And then he said he'd pay to defend his loyal fans in court.
'So I got a little notice, in case you see it,' he said after former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin introduced him in a packed hotel ballroom in Cedar Rapids.
'We have wonderful security guys. They said, "Mr. Trump, there may be somebody with tomatoes in the audience." So if you see somebody getting ready to throw a tomato, knock the c**p out of 'em, would you? Seriously. Okay?'
'Just knock the hell – I promise you, I will pay for the legal fees,' he pledged. 'I promise. I promise. There won't be so much, because the courts agree with us too. What's going on in this country?'
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3427111/Trump-warns-audience-final-pre-caucus-rally-TOMATO-throwing-protesters-interrupt-speech-says-fans-knock-c-p-em.html#ixzz42tHTquvz
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
Alan, he was doing this prior to anything related to the UIC rally--here's a clip from February 1, from the Iowa caucus days:
You don't have to convince me, I agree he's a bully who somehow resonates with a subset of Republicans, Democrats and Independents. But the adult in me thinks his opposition is doing the country a dis-service by refusing to ignore his foolishness, choosing instead to highlight his profile. Those protesters gave him power at a time when their interests would have been better served by actively promoting their preferred candidate.
Ultralight
3-14-16, 11:31am
Tomorrow is Ohio's vote! You ready!?
Trump needs to win something like 60% of the remaining delegates in play to clinch the nomination for himself and the general election for Hillary. There is still hope.
Tomorrow is Ohio's vote! You ready!?
Yep. The results in Ohio will have a huge impact on the direction this campaign turns. I'll be casting a Republican ballot. You can thank me later.
It's getting frightening......if he wins, and if he doesn't. His followers are mad and fired up. Can you spell anarchy?
Ultralight
3-14-16, 11:39am
Yep. The results in Ohio will have a huge impact on the direction this campaign turns. I'll be casting a Republican ballot. You can thank me later.
I am voting for The Bern. I expect no thanks! haha
Ultralight
3-14-16, 11:40am
America needs Bernie but deserves Trump.
It's getting frightening......if he wins, and if he doesn't. His followers are mad and fired up. Can you spell anarchy?
What kind of anarchy are you expecting? Baltimore style riots? A write-in campaign?
America needs Bernie but deserves Trump.
Either outcome would have doleful consequences.
Ultralight
3-14-16, 11:51am
What kind of anarchy are you expecting? Baltimore style riots? A write-in campaign?
The vast, vast majority of Americans are a very passive people.
Ultralight
3-14-16, 11:51am
Either outcome would have doleful consequences.
Put me on the dole!
catherine
3-14-16, 11:54am
Yep. The results in Ohio will have a huge impact on the direction this campaign turns. I'll be casting a Republican ballot. You can thank me later.
I'll thank you now--from your ballot to God's ears.
I'll thank you now--from your ballot to God's ears.
I like to think God is a Republican, but I also believe he hold's us responsible for our own foolishness. At present, I'm hoping more for mercy than for justice.
Ultralight
3-14-16, 12:18pm
I like to think God is a Republican, but I also believe he hold's us responsible for our own foolishness. At present, I'm hoping more for mercy than for justice.
I think God is more like Ayn Rand.
I think God is more like Ayn Rand.
I can't see that. Clearly the creator has a more of a sense of humor and less of a desire for worship than Rand.
Ultralight
3-14-16, 12:34pm
I can't see that. Clearly the creator has a more of a sense of humor and less of a desire for worship than Rand.
Touche on the sense of humor part. But Ayn wanted us to worship John Galt-type guys, and probably her and her philosophy.
What kind of anarchy are you expecting? Baltimore style riots? A write-in campaign?
Sort of like a recent Trump campaign, coast to coast. Yes, people have all sorts of reasons to be really pissed off.......at lots of things. The intelligence level of this country is sinking. People resort to more physical ways of expressing their frustrations/hatred. I think people have been allowed to do irresponsible things and not be held accountable. And of course, there have been some decisions made by present and past officials that have caused many people a lot of problems.
It just all seems to be coming to a head. But Trump.........he's sick. Like I've said, if he had brought up some of the same issues in a reasonable manner, I might have agreed with him. But he's just a loudmouthed obnoxious bully. Unfortunately, this is the type of person he's attracting.
Yes, the elections tomorrow should be very interesting.........hopeful versus downright scary.
I can't see that. Clearly the creator has a more of a sense of humor and less of a desire for worship than Rand.
Some of believe we're in this alone..........which is even more scary.
I like to think God is a Republican, but I also believe he hold's us responsible for our own foolishness. At present, I'm hoping more for mercy than for justice.
Oh definitely--the mean, smitey God, for whom every misstep is a sin. You nailed it.
Ultralight
3-14-16, 12:41pm
Some of believe we're in this alone..........which is even more scary.
What do you mean "in this alone?" Sincere question...
Oh definitely--the mean, smitey God, for whom every misstep is a sin. You nailed it.That was the Old Testament God. He turned the business over to his son in the sequel.
Ultralight
3-14-16, 12:43pm
That was the Old Testament God. He turned the business over to his son in the sequel.
I thought the father was the son and the son was the father.
rodeosweetheart
3-14-16, 12:46pm
That was the Old Testament God. He turned the business over to his son in the sequel.
Thank you, Alan, both for the vote and for the reminder of incarnational theology. Blessings on you and your house for getting out the vote!
I thought the father was the son and the son was the father.Yeah, that's what they say, although the Old Testament version seems to rule through intimidation and the New Testament version seems a lot more forgiving. Maybe they're the same but signed on with a better PR person.
catherine
3-14-16, 12:51pm
I like to think God is a Republican, but I also believe he hold's us responsible for our own foolishness. At present, I'm hoping more for mercy than for justice.
My husband's running joke is that God is Presbyterian. In any case, I agree with you on the mercy thing. But it's not as if we haven't seen the need for a Flood or toppling of the Golden Calf. We might be ripe for a little auto-correct.
Ultralight
3-14-16, 12:53pm
Yeah, that's what they say, although the Old Testament version seems to rule through intimidation and the New Testament version seems a lot more forgiving. Maybe they're the same but signed on with a better PR person.
Good point!
ApatheticNoMore
3-14-16, 12:56pm
I think to the extent those who protest Trump are legit and don't just campaign for one of his opponents (Kasich, Hillary, Sanders or whomever one thinks they want), is probably because it's not just (and perhaps not really at all) about getting say Bernie Sanders or whomever elected to them, it's about direct opposition to racial, religious, ethnic hatred as such.
They are not wrong. It's a thing worth opposing in itself regardless of one's preferred candidate. But does it need so much opposing in the year 2016? Well yes, apparently it does, with an openly hateful candidate like Trump around. Whether or not people vote for him for hateful reasons (it's very hard to tell), there's no doubt if not really Mussolini, he likes to play him on "reality t.v.", that is on the campaign trail, and the distinction blurs. Anyway protesters didn't make Trump big, the media did. By incessant coverage of him 24/7.
That was the Old Testament God. He turned the business over to his son in the sequel.
And we're better for it, IMO.
rodeosweetheart
3-14-16, 1:00pm
I think to the extent those who protest Trump are legit and don't just campaign for one of his opponents (Kasich, Hillary, Sanders or whomever one thinks they want), is probably because it's not just (and perhaps not really at all) about getting say Bernie Sanders or whomever elected to them, it's about direct opposition to racial, religious, ethnic hatred as such.
They are not wrong. It's a thing worth opposing in itself regardless of one's preferred candidate. But does it need so much opposing in the year 2016? Well yes apparently it does, with an openly hateful candidate like Trump around. Whether or not people vote for him for hateful reasons (it's very hard to tell), there's no doubt if not really Mussolini, he likes to play him on "reality t.v.", that is on the campaign trail, and the distinction blurs. Anyway protesters didn't make Trump big, the media did. By incessant coverage of him 24/7.
+1000
.... But it's not as if we haven't seen the need for a Flood or toppling of the Golden Calf. We might be ripe for a little auto-correct.
How true, catherine!
What do you mean "in this alone?" Sincere question...
I'm an atheist.
Ultralight
3-14-16, 1:16pm
I'm an athiest.
Mind blown.
Being "civilized" versus being (naturally) animalistic is a fine line to walk. Sometimes "civil"ization can't keep up. It's a hard thing to constantly fight one's inner urges. And some people get tired of fighting them. Yes, in some areas civilization seems to work out just fine. In others, not so much.
I see trump as just encouraging people to try other tactics to maybe get what they want. It's a very "natural" thing to do........but highly "uncivilized". It's hard being human...........
Mind blown.
Why so mind-blowing? Lots of people are atheists. Funny thing.......when my kids were in school, some teachers thought I must be very religious because of some of my values/morals/ethics and the things I questioned of them. It irks me when people think you have to be "religious" to be moral/ethical. One lady said to me "It's easy to see you're a good Christian, just by looking at your kids." :(
Ultralight
3-14-16, 1:27pm
Why so mind-blowing? Lots of people are atheists. Funny thing.......when my kids were in school, some teachers thought I must be very religious because of some of my values/morals/ethics and the things I questioned of them. It irks me when people think you have to be "religious" to be moral/ethical. One lady said to me "It's easy to see you're a good Christian, just by looking at your kids." :(
Well, I am not sure why I was so shocked.
I am an atheist too, but I did not pick up any atheist vibes from you on here.
The thing I most fear is somebody seriously seriously gets hurt at a rally. And, Trump is up there saying, take him out, take him out inciting angry people to stomp and do angry things. A local former county sheriff, a Clinton supporter, mentioned this the other day. She actually thinks somebody might get killed because the man knows how to raise energy, negative angry energy, that's what he attracts. Personally, I am distressed to the see the lack of civility being used in this campaign. He seems to meaningfully want a fight. He wants to see a fight and than claim, it's their fault. This is not how to lead a nation as diverse as ours.
I just feel the worst has to happen for the guy to get taken out of the campaign. I also fear for his life too. Somebody ran at the podium the other day? I have no idea his position on hand guns, but if a shot is fired at him from his own crowd, I won't be surprised. I cannot stand the slide into the ugly American the tone is taking.
iris lilies
3-14-16, 1:47pm
Mind blown.
You know, it's not the special club that you seem to think it is.
That's why some of us, well, me for one, wonder why you need an actual club.
I started out thinking he was our Berlusconi, but maybe Mussolini's closer to it...
Ultralight
3-14-16, 1:53pm
You know, it's not the special club that you seem to think it is.
I disagree.
That's why some of us, well, me for one, wonder why you need an actual club.
Shall we go through this again? haha
That's why some of us, well, me for one, wonder why you need an actual club.
To pick up chicks.
Ultralight
3-14-16, 1:57pm
To pick up chicks.
LOL! If only!
iris lilies
3-14-16, 1:57pm
I disagree.
Shall we go through this again? haha
I am old, I forget. Tell me what you get from your aethiest club.
iris lilies
3-14-16, 1:58pm
LOL! If only!
Naw, thats Harlan's job.
Ultralight
3-14-16, 1:59pm
Naw, thats Harlan's job.
Again, if only! lol
No matter how many clubs I am in or how many sweaters I make Harlan wear, my personality negates them!
And we're better for it, IMO.
Right. With this version, we can hope to plead damnation down to Purgatory.
Iris Lily makes a good point. I've mentioned before that few people in the PNW care about religious affiliation (or none). I would probably qualify as an atheist--someone without a god--but i wouldn't join an atheist organization (though I might send money to the Freedom From Religion Foundation). First, I'm not particularly socially-inclined, and second, I find a lot of self-proclaimed atheists unnecessarily aggressive and unpleasantly abrasive. I guess if I lived in the Bible Belt, I might feel more threatened.
Ultralight
3-14-16, 2:06pm
I am old, I forget. Tell me what you get from your aethiest club.
Good question. What do I get?
Friendship, mostly. But also some moral support and a general sense of community.
I lead three or four canoe trips in the summer in my atheist club. Anywhere between 10 and 15 people attend each of them. We also have a book club where we read atheist-themed books and discuss them. We have family game nights, cook outs, hikes, discussion groups, mental health support groups, charity and volunteer outings, communal dinners, a happy hour group, etc. We also travel to conferences from time to time. Occasionally we'll do something political.
What ties us all together is our atheism. It is one of the primary lenses through which we see and navigate the world.
Some people form clubs around their love of bulldogs. Others form clubs around playing the bongos. Some folks form clubs to study mollusks.
Our club is about atheism.
My atheist club, above all else, helps me to form a purpose for my life and to manufacture meaning for my existence.
I hear Purgatory is nice this time of year.
Ultralight
3-14-16, 2:09pm
...i wouldn't join an atheist organization
I won't hold that against you. :)
(though I might send money to the Freedom From Religion Foundation).
Excellent organization!
First, I'm not particularly socially-inclined, and second, I find a lot of self-proclaimed atheists unnecessarily aggressive and unpleasantly abrasive. I guess if I lived in the Bible Belt, I might feel more threatened.
Not a proper sample for such a blanket statement.
We have our firebrands and our diplomats. You hear more from firebrands and less from diplomats though.
Most in our community believe we need both.
I hear Purgatory is nice this time of year.
It is when you consider the alternative. Would you want Hitler and Stalin in your Homeowners' Association?
I think to the extent those who protest Trump are legit and don't just campaign for one of his opponents (Kasich, Hillary, Sanders or whomever one thinks they want), is probably because it's not just (and perhaps not really at all) about getting say Bernie Sanders or whomever elected to them, it's about direct opposition to racial, religious, ethnic hatred as such.
They are not wrong. It's a thing worth opposing in itself regardless of one's preferred candidate. But does it need so much opposing in the year 2016? Well yes, apparently it does, with an openly hateful candidate like Trump around. Whether or not people vote for him for hateful reasons (it's very hard to tell), there's no doubt if not really Mussolini, he likes to play him on "reality t.v.", that is on the campaign trail, and the distinction blurs. Anyway protesters didn't make Trump big, the media did. By incessant coverage of him 24/7.
I would protest, not for any candidate necessarily but against going into cities with racially charged histories and inciting violence. There is free speech and then there is yelling fire in a theater. Of course my type of protest is meditation,
My atheist club, above all else, helps me to form a purpose for my life and to manufacture meaning for my existence.
You don't get enough meaning out of life by counting your things and scoring like golf while most people (at least in the US) use more of a basketball-type scoring system? /snark
Ultralight
3-14-16, 2:23pm
You don't get enough meaning out of life by counting your things and scoring like golf while most people (at least in the US) use more of a basketball-type scoring system? /snark
Community and nature give me what little purpose and meaning I have.
I am very involved in the atheist community and in the simple living community.
I would protest, not for any candidate necessarily but against going into cities with racially charged histories and inciting violence. There is free speech and then there is yelling fire in a theater. Of course my type of protest is meditation,
You can meditate in a crowded theater as long as you don't chant. I myself sometimes pray for the performance to end quickly.
Ultralight
3-14-16, 2:31pm
You can meditate in a crowded theater as long as you don't chant. I myself sometimes pray for the performance to end quickly.
You can throw a brick through an open window, but that does not mean you are rioting. :)
You can throw a brick through an open window, but that does not mean you are rioting. :)
When I was a kid someone threw a walnut through an open car window and hit me in the jaw. Other than being a lone event, I'm not sure what separates that action from a riot.
When I was a kid someone threw a walnut through an open car window and hit me in the jaw. Other than being a lone event, I'm not sure what separates that action from a riot.
Excellent marksmanship?
Excellent marksmanship?
Maybe, but most likely pure luck. The car was moving at probably 40 to 50 miles an hour past a kid throwing walnuts at passing cars. I'll bet he couldn't make that shot twice.
Maybe, but most likely pure luck. The car was moving at probably 40 to 50 miles an hour past a kid throwing walnuts at passing cars. I'll bet he couldn't make that shot twice.
Who needs skill when you've got luck on your side? As the despair of my weapons instructors, I can relate.
iris lilies
3-14-16, 3:18pm
I would protest, not for any candidate necessarily but against going into cities with racially charged histories and inciting violence. There is free speech and then there is yelling fire in a theater. Of course my type of protest is meditation,
"...going into cities with racially charged histories and inciting violence..."
ummm, what? I immediately read that as keeping the black folks down, taking away their right to protest, removing them from the streets. I doubt that's what you mean.
I guess you don't understand that here in my city with its racially charged current life and historical life, it is the "Black Lives Matter" folks who were protesting at the Trump rally. Thousands of people who wanted to see Trump. A few hundred who wanted to stop that. Or maybe you do understand and relate to that POV.
Ultralight
3-14-16, 3:24pm
"...going into cities with racially charged histories and inciting violence..."
Our whole nation has a racially charged history.
And meditation as protest...? I think the oligarchs would love to have nations of people who meditate -- just as long as they remain tractable workers, mindless consumers, and mentally dull.
Aren't you the very definition of a "tractable worker?" Just asking...:~)
Ultralight
3-14-16, 3:50pm
Aren't you the very definition of a "tractable worker?" Just asking...:~)
Yes, I am a loan drone. And it is a huge reason why I meditate. Some folks drink wine to get through their miserable lives. Others stare at the idiot box. I meditate.
frugal-one
3-14-16, 8:29pm
America needs Bernie but deserves Trump.
Ridiculous!
Ultralight
3-14-16, 8:31pm
Ridiculous!
But true!
Ultralight
3-14-16, 8:33pm
Tomorrow is going to be amaze-balls!
ApatheticNoMore
3-14-16, 10:11pm
Bernie Sander's probably has more total votes than Trump so far, Hillary does for sure, and that's even considering it's mostly Republican states that have the early vote.
Ultralight
3-15-16, 7:33am
O-H?
I-O!
Let's get this party started!
freshstart
3-15-16, 8:38am
But true!
not all of America deserves Trump, but yes, some do
Ultralight
3-15-16, 8:49am
I voted for Trump!
Bernie Sander's probably has more total votes than Trump so far, Hillary does for sure, and that's even considering it's mostly Republican states that have the early vote.
According to RealClearPolitics, the popular vote totals prior to today's skirmish are:
Clinton 4,940,095
Trunp 4,340,362
Cruz 3,576,997
Sanders 3,290,824
Rubio 2,400,514
It is true that Republican turnout has generally been higher thus far, with some traditional Democratic fiefdoms yet to weigh in. It is also true that Cruz and Rubio have been polling quite favorably against Clinton one-on-one.
freshstart
3-15-16, 9:12am
I voted for Trump!
I can never tell when you are BSing
I voted for Trump!
That's the problem with open primaries in a nutshell.
Ultralight
3-15-16, 9:16am
I tease. I voted for The Bern!
My sis, a staunch but moderate Dem, voted for Kasich. She wants to block Trump. She'll vote Billary in November though.
freshstart
3-15-16, 9:24am
I tease. I voted for The Bern!
My sis, a staunch but moderate Dem, voted for Kasich. She wants to block Trump. She'll vote Billary in November though.
thank God!
I tease. I voted for The Bern!
That's harmless enough.
Ultralight
3-15-16, 9:35am
That's harmless enough.
You know me, mostly harmless!
Ultralight
3-15-16, 11:30am
I haven't felt this clean coming out of a voting booth since I voted for Nader in 2000!
I haven't felt this clean coming out of a voting booth since I voted for Nader in 2000!
Hopefully you'll achieve the same result.
Ultralight
3-15-16, 11:44am
Hopefully you'll achieve the same result.
:treadmill:
catherine
3-15-16, 12:40pm
I haven't felt this clean coming out of a voting booth since I voted for Nader in 2000!
That's great! Great that you voted for Bernie, of course, but great that you voted. And I'm glad you felt clean about it.
I tease. I voted for The Bern!
Last month you were pretty adamant about not voting in the primaries. What changed your mind?
Ultralight
3-15-16, 12:53pm
Last month you were pretty adamant about not voting in the primaries. What changed your mind?
Bernie's commie-pinko socialist message changed my mind. haha
I left all the other votes blank, the senators of whatever and such.
rodeosweetheart
3-15-16, 12:59pm
Sending out lots of prayers for a Kasich victory in Ohio.
Ultralight
3-15-16, 1:11pm
I am going to be glued to the election results tonight! Trump! Trump! Trump!
iris lilies
3-15-16, 2:38pm
I urged my Trump voting friend and neighbor to run up to a nearby polling place (not hers) to get her multiple Trump votes in today when I read this messgae from our neighborhood chat site:
https://d19rpgkrjeba2z.cloudfront.net/9eac694/static/nextdoorv2/images/avatars/avatar-default-80.png (https://lafayettesquare.nextdoor.com/profile/8705349)
K (https://lafayettesquare.nextdoor.com/profile/8705349).....W...from Lafayette Square1h ago
Anyone else notice an utter lack of identity check or confirmation of registration when voting at Peabody School? I walked in, and they said their machines were down. They handed me a paper ballot, and I voted. They didn't ask for my name, didn't check my ID, and didn't ask me to sign anything. I didn't want to complain to anyone official for fear that none of the votes there will be counted.
Thank Flag
I just want to make the Rev UL happy. Trump! trump! Trump! Let's vote early and often today for him!
Ultralight
3-15-16, 2:45pm
...early and often today for him!
Yeah!
Ultralight
3-15-16, 8:35pm
And Rubot is out!
Hopefully you'll achieve the same result.
Acck no! Two W terms did enough damage.
Ultralight
3-15-16, 8:57pm
Wow... Ohio... Really let me down tonight.
freshstart
3-15-16, 9:03pm
I urged my Trump voting friend and neighbor to run up to a nearby polling place (not hers) to get her multiple Trump votes in today when I read this messgae from our neighborhood chat site:
https://d19rpgkrjeba2z.cloudfront.net/9eac694/static/nextdoorv2/images/avatars/avatar-default-80.png (https://lafayettesquare.nextdoor.com/profile/8705349)
K (https://lafayettesquare.nextdoor.com/profile/8705349).....W...from Lafayette Square1h ago
Anyone else notice an utter lack of identity check or confirmation of registration when voting at Peabody School? I walked in, and they said their machines were down. They handed me a paper ballot, and I voted. They didn't ask for my name, didn't check my ID, and didn't ask me to sign anything. I didn't want to complain to anyone official for fear that none of the votes there will be counted.
Thank Flag
I just want to make the Rev UL happy. Trump! trump! Trump! Let's vote early and often today for him!
you have got to be kidding me! Trump voters voting 3 times! why not, no one stopped them so it must be ok!
Chicken lady
3-15-16, 9:32pm
Wow, Ultraliteangler voted! My worldview is rocked!
(in my township the democratic ballot was basically a page of "no petition filed" so if you voted democrat, you gave up your chance to have any voice at all in local government.)
iris lilies
3-15-16, 9:34pm
you have got to be kidding me! Trump voters voting 3 times! why not, no one stopped them so it must be ok!
Thanks for playing. I do so enjoy some rock and roll around here.
Now the real story: that is a Hillary precinct. If anyone is going to get multiple votes it will be Hil. I do not doubt that she DID get unauthorized votes there, Im sure it is happening all over this city. This particular suspect precinct is situated in the Projects two blocks from me.
Funny how that same voting precinct turned away eligible voters last fall when we had a special tax election for my neighborhood. They f$$ked it up then, too.
I just talked to my Trump voting friend on the phone. Actually she was uite angry at the thought that anyone who walked in got a ballot. I was only Kidding when I suggested she run over there and vote Trump again.
Today I was forced to vote for the Cuban Canadian. I did not like him enough to vote more than once.
Today I was forced to vote for the Cuban Canadian. I did not like him enough to vote more than once.
He does seem to be the remaining viable alternative to Trump or the lady who claims "We didn't lose a single person in Libya" now that Rubio has thrown in the towel. Or maybe it will get thrown to the convention and they'll draft Paul Ryan.
Ultralight
3-16-16, 8:59am
Still... this is the best dang election ever!
rodeosweetheart
3-16-16, 9:03am
Maybe they will draft Mitt Romney! Honestly, I wish he had come off that well when he was running.
Still... this is the best dang election ever!
Ever? That's a long time.
Maybe they will draft Mitt Romney! Honestly, I wish he had come off that well when he was running.
I had that same thought. People claimed he was challenged in the charisma department, but compared to Mrs. Clinton he'd look incredibly lifelike.
Ultralight
3-16-16, 9:21am
Ever? That's a long time.
True!
How about "so far?"
True!
How about "so far?"
It kind of looks like 1912 to me. You had the establishment Republican (Bill Taft) against a Bull Moose insurgency (Teddy R.). You had the unprincipled Democratic hack in Woodrow Wilson. You even had a zany Socialist in Eugene Debs. The upshot was the hack got elected and sent my grandfather to fight the Kaiser.
Ultralight
3-16-16, 9:38am
Eugene Debs.
Great American!
Maybe they will draft Mitt Romney! Honestly, I wish he had come off that well when he was running.
I think that just shows you how poor all the current ones are. But I have to agree, it'd be pretty cool to watch him not become president for a third time!
I think that just shows you how poor all the current ones are. But I have to agree, it'd be pretty cool to watch him not become president for a third time!
Even if that happened, given the two party's current frontrunners, it would show the world America hasn't entirely abandoned the concept of integrity.
Ultralight
3-16-16, 12:27pm
Integrity = When the person you are on the inside is the same as the person you are on the outside.
The Storyteller
3-16-16, 1:20pm
I'm curious...
For you who tend to vote reliably Republican, what will you do in November if Trump is the GOP candidate? And he is running against, say, Hilary.
Teacher Terry
3-16-16, 1:22pm
I am not Republican but my hubby is. He says he will not vote for him but will for Clinton. I was shocked.
Ultralight
3-16-16, 1:27pm
Clinton
She is fairly conservative in my book.
I'm curious...
For you who tend to vote reliably Republican, what will you do in November if Trump is the GOP candidate? And he is running against, say, Hilary.
What I always do, as a good conservative - I'll vote Libertarian.
I'm curious...
For you who tend to vote reliably Republican, what will you do in November if Trump is the GOP candidate? And he is running against, say, Hilary.
Since I find the two equally objectionable, I would vote for either the Libertarian or Constitution Party candidate.
I think Dems are between a rock and a hard place, too. It doesn't look like Bernie has a snowball's chance in hell of getting the nomination at this point--although it's amazing he's come as far as he has. Yes, he is the "message candidate" and in many ways I would hate to see him President. He's done a wonderful job teaching Hillary how to campaign, energizing the young (and UltraLite Angler) and sparking a political revolution, and at this point, job well done-- I'd like to see him back in Burlington browsing the independent book stores like he used to.
In ANY OTHER YEAR I would write him in before voting for Hillary. But now, I can't vote on principle. I have to vote strategically. Hillary is a shady politician, and untrustworthy, but in the land of the blind the one-eyed man is king.
Arghhh.. yes, it will probably come down to an anti-Trump vote for Hillary.
Ultralight
3-16-16, 2:10pm
I already cast my vote. I am done now.
Arghhh.. yes, it will probably come down to an anti-Trump vote for Hillary.
As a Republican, I'd probably vote for Sanders over Trump if the Democrats managed to run him. At least he's a man of principle, and I respect that, even though I disagree with most of his positions.
It would be hard for me to choose between a man of principle if I despised his principles, and an unprincipled scoundrel in the tradition of Aaron Burr, Dan Sickles or Huey Long. At least with the scoundrel, there'd at least be a chance he might occasionally do the right thing for self-interested reasons the way Bill Clinton used to.
Curious what people think about the financial ethics angle of a Trump win?
http://money.cnn.com/2016/03/16/news/companies/donald-trump-ethics/index.html?iid=hp-stack-dom
I mean, the guy sells everything from bad steaks to bad wine to bad hotel rooms to bad beauty contests, and has his reality-tv-shows.
Ultralight
3-16-16, 3:55pm
I mean, the guy sells everything from bad steaks to bad wine to bad hotel rooms to bad beauty contests, and has his reality-tv-shows.
Perfect for America!
Curious what people think about the financial ethics angle of a Trump win?
http://money.cnn.com/2016/03/16/news/companies/donald-trump-ethics/index.html?iid=hp-stack-dom
I mean, the guy sells everything from bad steaks to bad wine to bad hotel rooms to bad beauty contests, and has his reality-tv-shows.
Hard to put that in a blind trust.
Perfect for America!
Not really.
I hold a relatively minor local elected position, which has significant power over spending and policy in my community.
I am required by law to disclose my financial holdings - real estate, stocks, bonds, my relationships (board positions, affiliations, close family members' affiliations) in frequent filings with the state, and it all becomes public information.
My actions are audited by the county, the state auditor, and because of the nature of this position, the federal government. They are constantly looking for any self-dealing or actions that divert any benefit to myself or my family. (For instance, if I remove nuisance wildlife from one of the facilities I am in charge of, I cannot use the meat myself, has to go to the Food Bank or some other destination.)
This level of accountability is demanded and expected by the citizens of my state of even this minor office.
So explain to me about Trump...
Ultralight
3-16-16, 4:10pm
So explain to me about Trump...
Trump is a proven business man who will make America great again!
frugal-one
3-16-16, 4:25pm
Trump is a proven business man who will make America great again!
duh... thought we had this discussion already. America is great now.
Ultralight
3-16-16, 4:26pm
duh... thought we had this discussion already. America is great now.
Well, it is getting greater because of Trump.
Well, it is getting greater because of Trump.
If he's elected I'm sure America will grate on a lot of people's nerves around the world. Perhaps he's saying "Make America Grate!"
If he's elected I'm sure America will grate on a lot of people's nerves around the world. Perhaps he's saying "Make America Grate!"
:D Perfect.
Or I was thinking............"Make America (Gr)hate". (I don't know how to cross out the Gr on my computer).
Yeah, that strikeout feature is useful for situations like this.
This upswelling of support for such a vulgar, bloviating megalomaniac is almost more than I can stand.
Back to avoiding the news...
freshstart
3-16-16, 5:37pm
I think that just shows you how poor all the current ones are. But I have to agree, it'd be pretty cool to watch him not become president for a third time!
exactly!
freshstart
3-16-16, 5:41pm
I am amazed at some of my women friends going all out for Trump on FB. It is seriously making me reconsider these friendships because we share none of the same beliefs. I am embarrassed by their racist memes and I am questioning their character. Trump, the great divider. Some are close to minimum wage former co-workers, WTH does Trump plan to offer them? Goose egg and yet they buy this "make America Great again" hype.
Freshstart, that must be SO disconcerting and disheartening, even hurtful.
freshstart
3-16-16, 5:52pm
especially when they say things like I'm a commie disgrace to my country, lol. It has really opened up my eyes to realize I have quite a few friends who are really sheeple. I'm culling my FB friends list, if they're not important to me from the past or current, out they go.
freshstart
3-16-16, 6:02pm
I like this one:
"who told you that Trump is a racist or a fear monger? You seem to be so well versed on Bernie, but, you've totally missed the boat on Mr.Trump, who by the way is not a fear monger, instead he is a well informed and straight forward individual who has probably forgotten more
than you and I will ever know. Why do you think both parties are so afraid of him? Mr. Trump, in my opinion and tens of thousands of others is the only candidate who can bring financial recovery to our great country, not to mention, secure our borders (no one even mentioned the borders until he did"
I cannot imagine being willing to make a comment even this gentle in public on FB. She goes on to call me a moron and a few other choice words.
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