View Full Version : What Would Your Dream Outcome Be.....
gimmethesimplelife
5-27-16, 7:53pm
For Election 2016? For me it's a Sanders win. Carly Fiorina starts a new career singing creepy songs for horror movies.....Ted Cruz gives up politics
and returns to Canada. HIllary gives up politics and continues to make a killing on the speaker circut, and Donald Trump starts a new and very obnoxious cable network.
What would you like to see happen to all the players in Election 2016? Rob
Teacher Terry
5-28-16, 1:54pm
I love your ideal outcomes. Too funny! I would be for either democrat to win the nomination. A Trump presidency is really unthinkable.
iris lilies
5-28-16, 4:50pm
Donald Trump has an overnight conversion based on a dream where he meets up with the kingpins of conservative thought and they scold him soundly. He sees and understands the lIght of conservative political thought.
He dumps his waffle-y positions on big government and uses his brash narcissistic self to sell true conservatism to more of the populace, sidestepping most social issues unless they relate to big gubmnt funding or they are obnoxious politically correct victimology. (This latter stuff he can conttinue to skewer until the cows come home .:):):))
We are able to use The Donald for the talent he has providing provocative sound bites, and he leads the Republican party out of a morass of big gubmnt and payback with his used car salesman skills into a place where small government is desired and admired, and he wns the White House.
He gets Rand Paul in as VP, he serves for three years, cementing his popularity and promoting true conservative thought, and then he gets out of politics because he is annoyed with everyhing he is expected to do in that office and he basically wants to be around pretty women, a demographic lacking in national politics.
Rand Paul builds a government of grown ups who start to bring America's financial house to order.Rand announces he is gay, therefore being the first openly gay man in the white house. This does not decrease my love for him :~) And Rand fans all say to ourselves "so that's why he always insisted on cutting his own hair!"
Haha.Much of this is my true desire, though.
John McAfee bags the Libertarian nomination, and then sweeps the national election.
Civilization triumphs.
rosarugosa
5-28-16, 5:52pm
This:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10154152176159477&set=a.10150188604944477.325716.765844476&type=3
Weakened by an FBI report that characterizes her handling of State Department email as "redundantly stupid and morally aromatic", Clinton loses narrowly to Trump in November. Trump suffers a brain aneurism after he learns that he cannot fire the Speaker of the House for insubordination, and is succeeded in February by Vice President Walker. Barack Obama retires to his DC mansion, and receives a Clinton Foundation Grant to write his twelve-volume work on constitutional law, Where Madison Went Wrong. Bernie Sanders spends the remaining nine years of his life leading the Vermont Secessionist movement from a Bennington storefront.
And they all lived happily ever after.
gimmethesimplelife
5-29-16, 11:03am
Weakened by an FBI report that characterizes her handling of State Department email as "redundantly stupid and morally aromatic", Clinton loses narrowly to Trump in November. Trump suffers a brain aneurism after he learns that he cannot fire the Speaker of the House for insubordination, and is succeeded in February by Vice President Walker. Barack Obama retires to his DC mansion, and receives a Clinton Foundation Grant to write his twelve-volume work on constitutional law, Where Madison Went Wrong. Bernie Sanders spends the remaining nine years of his life leading the Vermont Secessionist movement from a Bennington storefront.
And they all lived happily ever after.I remember once back in 1988 I was sitting in a college dorm watching CNN. There was a sound bite about some politician in Vermont proposing to have Vermont secede from the Union and my first thought was.....how much are flights to Burlington? How would this new country handle health care/income inequality? Would this new country grant passports and citizenship to someone not long in it's borders? I was with some student activists in the dorm lobby - we had just returned from protesting a proposed Wal Mart in Flagstaff, and the conversation that ensued about Vermont was one of the more intetesting college conversations I've ever had. I could see Sanders trying to get Vermont to secede. Rob
I remember once back in 1988 I was sitting in a college dorm watching CNN. There was a sound bite about some politician in Vermont proposing to have Vermont secede from the Union and my first thought was.....how much are flights to Burlington? How would this new country handle health care/income inequality? Would this new country grant passports and citizenship to someone not long in it's borders? I was with some student activists in the dorm lobby - we had just returned from protesting a proposed Wal Mart in Flagstaff, and the conversation that ensued about Vermont was one of the more intetesting college conversations I've ever had. I could see Sanders trying to get Vermont to secede. Rob
Vermont made an attempt at implementing a single payer health care scheme a few years ago. It was an abject failure.
https://www.bostonglobe.com/business/2015/01/25/costs-derail-vermont-single-payer-health-plan/VTAEZFGpWvTen0QFahW0pO/story.html
catherine
5-29-16, 11:18am
I remember once back in 1988 I was sitting in a college dorm watching CNN. There was a sound bite about some politician in Vermont proposing to have Vermont secede from the Union and my first thought was.....how much are flights to Burlington? How would this new country handle health care/income inequality? Would this new country grant passports and citizenship to someone not long in it's borders? I was with some student activists in the dorm lobby - we had just returned from protesting a proposed Wal Mart in Flagstaff, and the conversation that ensued about Vermont was one of the more intetesting college conversations I've ever had. I could see Sanders trying to get Vermont to secede. Rob
Vermont is a great state, and Bernie definitely helped to make Burlington the great city it is when he was mayor. He pioneered the housing trust, whereby the city shares equity in houses with people who don't have the money to come up with down payments. He opposed the development of the Lake Champlain waterfront, so that everyone in the city could enjoy it. Provided seed money for new businesses. Invested in food cooperatives. Had bipartisan support (after a short spell of skepticism by the conservatives). The people there LOVE him.
And I've been to his storefront office on Church Street. I hope it's there when I eventually move to Burlington.
gimmethesimplelife
5-29-16, 11:25am
Vermont made an attempt at implementing a single payer health care scheme a few years ago. It was an abject failure.
https://www.bostonglobe.com/business/2015/01/25/costs-derail-vermont-single-payer-health-plan/VTAEZFGpWvTen0QFahW0pO/story.htmlI remember reading this in the paper, yes. On the one hand it was very depressing.....on the other I felt all my beliefs about the United States were solidified and as always, I'm so grateful to live close to Mexico. Rob
iris lilies
5-29-16, 11:47am
Vermont made an attempt at implementing a single payer health care scheme a few years ago. It was an abject failure.
https://www.bostonglobe.com/business/2015/01/25/costs-derail-vermont-single-payer-health-plan/VTAEZFGpWvTen0QFahW0pO/story.html
This article says that the act creating single payer health care was voted in 4 years ago, but it was never funded. The governor pulled the plug on funding months ago because the state's budget would double.taxes would double.
So why can't father Bernie create thise funds in his home state? He is pretty optimistic about fndng funds for a similar matinwide program. I say let Bernie show us how it is done in a small scale before he turns it loose on the greater U.S.
This article says that the act creating single payer health care was voted in 4 years ago, but it was never funded. The governor pulled the plug on funding months ago because the state's budget would double.taxes would double.
So why can't father Bernie create thise funds in his home state? He is pretty optimistic about fndng funds for a similar matinwide program. I say let Bernie show us how it is done in a small scale before he turns it loose on the greater U.S.
Good point. In a well-functioning federal system, the states are supposed to be "laboratories of democracy", where new ideas can be tried. Unfortunately, we seem to be living in an era of centralized power.
catherine
5-29-16, 12:02pm
So why can't father Bernie create thise funds in his home state? He is pretty optimistic about fndng funds for a similar matinwide program. I say let Bernie show us how it is done in a small scale before he turns it loose on the greater U.S.
This was a valiant effort, but bad timing. Vermont is NOT representative of the whole of the US--there are very few affluent towns and a lot of poor ones. It's not the best state to use as a pilot for universal health care. You need the broad demographics and financial leverage to go up against the corporate powers-that-be that currently control health care.
I think we could consider universal healthcare very feasible if:
--We could get full transparency on medical costs
--We take away all the middlemen
--We make it national priority
--We focus on prevention
--We could make the public understand if we raise taxes a little we get back a lot in return by removing the ridiculously high bar on health insurance premiums today
Teacher Terry
5-29-16, 12:32pm
Isn't it Massachusetts that has it and Romney was governor when it happened? It has been a great success there.
iris lilies
5-29-16, 2:01pm
This was a valiant effort, but bad timing. Vermont is NOT representative of the whole of the US--there are very few affluent towns and a lot of poor ones. It's not the best state to use as a pilot for universal health care. You need the broad demographics and financial leverage to go up against the corporate powers-that-be that currently control health care.
No, Vermont is not representative of the whole of the U.S., it is whiter and richer. It is easily in the top half of per capita citizen income among states.
I think we could consider universal healthcare very feasible if:
--We could get full transparency on medical costs
I would like that, but not sure how single payer makes that happen
--We make it national priority
--We could make the public understand if we raise taxes a little we get back a lot in return by removing the ridiculously high bar on health insurance premiums today
Kind of like the unmitigated success of the ACA in making it a joint national priority.
and to the last point, didnt the Prez "try to make the public understand" that if they follow the ACA mandate, the healthy and the young subsidize the sick and the old? Yet, thats not happening, people are failing to pay for health insurance by the hundreds of thousands.
where is their collective sense of responsbibility for others? Why do they not believe that they should pay for health insurance at a level that The Prez has determined to be affordable for them (it IS the AFFORDABLE Care Act, ya know.)
Just sayin.
iris lilies
5-29-16, 2:11pm
Isn't it Massachusetts that has it and Romney was governor when it happened? It has been a great success there.
No. Mass. has mandated health insurance coverage, a system that foreshadowed the ACA.
If Mass. actually had single payer health care coverage its populatin would have grown exponentially to include every sick person who could scrape together bus fare there. Even I might skip off to Mass. for a few years to avoid $13,000 in annual premiums. I could squeeze into a pretty small apartment to establish residency along with other health care carpetbaggers. I would want the coverage to essentially protect my assets.
other states have flirted with universal health care, Oregon comes to mind, but its not tenable.
No, Vermont is not representative of the whole of the U.S., it is whiter and richer. It is easily in the top half of per capita citizen income among states.
I would like that, but not sure how single payer makes that happen
Kind of like the unmitigated success of the ACA in making it a joint national priority.
and to the last point, didnt the Prez "try to make the public understand" that if they follow the ACA mandate, the healthy and the young subsidize the sick and the old? Yet, thats not happening, people are failing to pay for health insurance by the hundreds of thousands.
where is their collective sense of responsbibility for others? Why do they not believe that they should pay for health insurance at a level that The Prez has determined to be affordable for them (it IS the AFFORDABLE Care Act, ya know.)
Just sayin.
You have me on the first point
But on the last point--some have not taken advantage of the ACA and but many others have. But it least it's THEIR choice. Two cases in point: My 52-year old BIL has health insurance (Obamacare) for the first time in decades. He never had a job that offered health insurance. If he had had a heart attack, he'd have to claim bankruptcy to deal with the medical bills. That's what one of our other friends had to do before Obamacare came along--full time seasonal worker, no employer-granted healthcare, Had a heart attack and won't up with tens of thousands of dollars in debt.
Then there's my own son who works in food service. He hasn't opted for Obamacare because it still costs more than he would like. He's 31 and taking his chances. If he gets sick, he'd rather negotiate with the hospital/doctor and pay off his medical bills over time.
Those are two choices these two people have made, but at least they had a choice.
I really don't understand what the people against single payer insurance are afraid of. It works in Canada. It works in the UK. It works in Scandinavia. This is not tooth fairy economics. How would you feel if you did not have a job and therefor did not have insurance? You live every day on a tightrope.
frugal-one
5-29-16, 2:42pm
I remember reading this in the paper, yes. On the one hand it was very depressing.....on the other I felt all my beliefs about the United States were solidified and as always, I'm so grateful to live close to Mexico. Rob
Comments such as these make me wish you would move to Mexico!
freshstart
5-29-16, 2:46pm
I love your ideal outcomes. Too funny! I would be for either democrat to win the nomination. A Trump presidency is really unthinkable.
exactly this. I prefer Bernie but accept it's not realistic.
freshstart
5-29-16, 2:50pm
So why can't father Bernie create thise funds in his home state? He is pretty optimistic about fndng funds for a similar matinwide program. I say let Bernie show us how it is done in a small scale before he turns it loose on the greater U.S.
so if we wait for Bernie to practice on a small scale, what do we do in the meantime if a nut job like Trump actually wins? By the next presidential election, Bernie will be too old to clean up the messes left behind.
freshstart
5-29-16, 2:58pm
Vermont is a great state, and Bernie definitely helped to make Burlington the great city it is when he was mayor. He pioneered the housing trust, whereby the city shares equity in houses with people who don't have the money to come up with down payments. He opposed the development of the Lake Champlain waterfront, so that everyone in the city could enjoy it. Provided seed money for new businesses. Invested in food cooperatives. Had bipartisan support (after a short spell of skepticism by the conservatives). The people there LOVE him.
And I've been to his storefront office on Church Street. I hope it's there when I eventually move to Burlington.
ITA about how great Burlington and VT are. And boy, Vermonters are proud of their state. Just before we had kids, we looked seriously into moving there, housing was higher but so was pay for medical staff. Now I could never afford it, plus have two elderly folks to take care of. I'm glad we didn't do it in some ways (kids connection with grandparents) but I would be in a much different position had we done it. But I also became ill and needed help for almost 2 yrs and sometimes still do so this thread is nonsensical. It would, however, be the perfect place to live if I had a choice.
iris lilies
5-29-16, 3:09pm
You have me on the first point
But on the last point--some have not taken advantage of the ACA and but many others have. But it least it's THEIR choice. Two cases in point: My 52-year old BIL has health insurance (Obamacare) for the first time in decades. He never had a job that offered health insurance. If he had had a heart attack, he'd have to claim bankruptcy to deal with the medical bills. That's what one of our other friends had to do before Obamacare came along--full time seasonal worker, no employer-granted healthcare, Had a heart attack and won't up with tens of thousands of dollars in debt.
Then there's my own son who works in food service. He hasn't opted for Obamacare because it still costs more than he would like. He's 31 and taking his chances. If he gets sick, he'd rather negotiate with the hospital/doctor and pay off his medical bills over time.
Those are two choices these two people have made, but at least they had a choice.
I really don't understand what the people against single payer insurance are afraid of. It works in Canada. It works in the UK. It works in Scandinavia. This is not tooth fairy economics. How would you feel if you did not have a job and therefor did not have insurance? You live every day on a tightrope.
The bolded point: then you havent been paying attention.
We cannot afford it, another social program is not tenable, our deficit spending is already horrifically out of control. And finally, you and Bernie's funding proposals ARE in fact tooth fairy econ.
Soon, Canadians will not be able to afford it either. But it is working fine for them now, and I would be content with Canadian health care although I dislike the lack of choice (that you have referenced above) in tiered service. Thats why I prefer the British system where private paying patients may choose their own route through a private pay system.
In America everything must be bigger and better, so cost comparisons to other countries are only somewhat logical. And then when you compare our large population of urban poor to those tiny populations of highly educated and responsible people in Denmark, its obvious that costs here would be higher than Denmark. It is well documented that health services to the poor ate more expensive because so many additional services have to be provided. What is taken for gramted in a middle class hme may not be present in the urban core.
That's why I am anxious for Vermont to try single payer system. The
Vermont population is more like Denmark than is my state of Missouri. And the sweet part is that Vermont likely has the same spending restriction that most other states have* and the state must balance its budget every year. Deficit spending not allowed, no printing money it doesnt have like the federal government.
the last point, how I would feel? Feelng bad isnt a rational argument pont so
I dont participate in those knds of questins because doh. I would feel bad. And so what?
*most states have balanced budget requirements. I dont know if
vermont does. I would not want want to contract work to
vermnt, though, if it doesnt have that.
the last point, how I would feel? Feelng bad isnt a rational argument pont so
I dont participate in those knds of questins because doh. I would feel bad. And so what?
Yes, I knew that wasn't a good argument, especially for you :)
But my point is, my bias is for the people who wind up in circumstances through no fault of their own in which a healthcare catastrophe changes the trajectory of their lives. And my bias is against a system in which the profit-motive extorts and inflates the price of healthcare because people who are sick are, in effect, hostages to the system unless they like being sick.
So perhaps we can revamp the system to make it more efficient and just. According to Physicians for a Single Payer system:
The program would be funded by the savings obtained from replacing today’s inefficient, profit-oriented, multiple insurance payers with a single streamlined, nonprofit, public payer, and by modest new taxes based on ability to pay. Premiums would disappear; 95 percent of all households would save money. Patients would no longer face financial barriers to care such as co-pays and deductibles, and would regain free choice of doctor and hospital. Doctors would regain autonomy over patient care.
Somehow that doesn't sound bad to me.
I am not for increasing the federal deficit, but I am for opening our minds and exploring the possibilities that we aren't in 1950 anymore, where medical treatment was an aspirin. The costs are horrendous, and create huge injustices between those who can afford it and those who cannot.
gimmethesimplelife
5-29-16, 3:31pm
Comments such as these make me wish you would move to Mexico!It was so nice that we recently agreed here on this very forum...This time, though I support your right to make this comment, I find your comment very depressing. Mind suggestion? Instead of judging my gratitude that affordable high quality health care is available three hours south of me...mmmmmm.....why not look at the reasons that cause this gratitude to exist and this need to offshore to exist in the first place? Please don't expect any loyalty out of me towards any society in which access to affordable health care is part of the package. I'm not capable of loyalty to such a society......and I, along with everyone else I know, deserve better. Although we have never met, and although we often disagree, I believe you deserve better, too. Rob
Teacher Terry
5-29-16, 3:33pm
All the middlemen make a ton of $ off of our healthcare system. Many poor people can't afford to use the services so they wait until really sick before going to ER, etc. If they had access to affordable healthcare they wouldn't wait so long to use it. So perhaps could prevent small problems from turning into big ones. We can afford it. We need to get our priorities straight and stop funding the military at such huge amounts and wasting $-all those government studies about shit no one cares about, etc. Then we could built tiny house communities for our homeless and provide everyone healthcare.
gimmethesimplelife
5-29-16, 3:40pm
All the middlemen make a ton of $ off of our healthcare system. Many poor people can't afford to use the services so they wait until really sick before going to ER, etc. If they had access to affordable healthcare they wouldn't wait so long to use it. So perhaps could prevent small problems from turning into big ones. We can afford it. We need to get our priorities straight and stop funding the military at such huge amounts and wasting $-all those government studies about shit no one cares about, etc. Then we could built tiny house communities for our homeless and provide everyone healthcare.Thank You. Very beautifully put and I could not agree more. Rob
Yes, I knew that wasn't a good argument, especially for you :)
But my point is, my bias is for the people who wind up in circumstances through no fault of their own in which a healthcare catastrophe changes the trajectory of their lives. And my bias is against a system in which the profit-motive extorts and inflates the price of healthcare because people who are sick are, in effect, hostages to the system unless they like being sick.
So perhaps we can revamp the system to make it more efficient and just. According to Physicians for a Single Payer system:
Somehow that doesn't sound bad to me.
I am not for increasing the federal deficit, but I am for opening our minds and exploring the possibilities that we aren't in 1950 anymore, where medical treatment was an aspirin. The costs are horrendous, and create huge injustices between those who can afford it and those who cannot.
Maybe we would be better off if our medical care was an aspirin, considering the unnecessary morbidity, mortality, and impoverishment occasioned by our current system. A friend of mine had a complicated operation in the fifties, time in the hospital, many physician consults, etc, and her middle-class family simply paid the reasonable bill. And aspirin didn't cost $30 a pop, either. We are way over-medicalized now--everything requires tests and more tests, drugs and more drugs, and endless appointments. And the outcome is only marginally better than it was in the fifties--probably a result of fewer people smoking. Don't get me started. :devil:
iris lilies
5-29-16, 3:42pm
Yes, I knew that wasn't a good argument, especially for you :)
But my point is, my bias is for the people who wind up in circumstances through no fault of their own in which a healthcare catastrophe changes the trajectory of their lives. And my bias is against a system in which the profit-motive extorts and inflates the price of healthcare because people who are sick are, in effect, hostages to the system unless they like being sick.
So perhaps we can revamp the system to make it more efficient and just. According to Physicians for a Single Payer system:
Somehow that doesn't sound bad to me.
I am not for increasing the federal deficit, but I am for opening our minds and exploring the possibilities that we aren't in 1950 anymore, where medical treatment was an aspirin. The costs are horrendous, and create huge injustices between those who can afford it and those who cannot.
I am vague about who,exactly loses their jobs and income, where the billions of dollars come from how that plays out in the economy and trading onWall Street and etc and also will my stock portfolio go down?
But I am not opposed to compressing health care industry costs as long as a for-profit sector is allowed to remain for those who wish to pay for it.
And I continue to wonder why someone is devestated by a health issue now that the
pres has put into place the ACA? The Prez says its affordable. Did he lie?
iris lilies
5-29-16, 3:44pm
Maybe we would be better off if our medical care was an aspirin, considering the unnecessary morbidity, mortality, and impoverishment occasioned by our current system. A friend of mine had a complicated operation in the fifties, time in the hospital, many physician consults, etc, and her middle-class family simply paid the reasonable bill. And aspirin didn't cost $30 a pop, either. We are way over-medicalized now--everything requires tests and more tests, drugs and more drugs, and endless appointments. And the outcome is only marginally better than it was in the fifties--probably a result of fewer people smoking. Don't get me started. :devil:
While greatly oversimplified as you well know,
I agree with the sense of it.
I am vague about who,exactly loses their jobs and income, where the billions to f dollars could me feom, how that plays out in the economy and trade n Wall Street.
But I am not opposed to compressing health vare industry costs as long as a for-profit sector is allowed to remain dor those who,wish to pay for it.
And I continue to wnder why someone is devestated by health issue now that the
pres has put into place the ACA? The Prez says its affordable. Did he lie?
If I have to see a doctor again, I would be inclined to search out a concierge or fee for service plan--if only to obviate the reams of paperwork, inevitable duplicate charges, and mother-may-I tedium of an insurance funded medical set-up.
I'll take any Dem or Libertarian over Trump! He scares the jeepers out of me :help:
gimmethesimplelife
5-29-16, 3:58pm
I'll take any Dem or Libertarian over Trump! He scares the jeepers out of me :help:I wholeheartedly concur. Rob
As I noted early in the game, he's our very own Berlusconi. And that's not a Good Thing.
iris lilies
5-29-16, 4:16pm
If I have to see a doctor again, I would be inclined to search out a concierge or fee for service plan--if only to obviate the reams of paperwork, inevitable duplicate charges, and mother-may-I tedium of an insurance funded medical set-up.
we've talked about this before and
I like the idea f concierge. I just cannot figure out what I really get afor $1,000 to $2,000 a year besides the doc's attention and knowledge. Do I get simple in-office tests like ekgs? a basic blood panel? How does insurance come into play for these tests?
I was hoping I could get away from the dreaded insurance scourge. I'm perfectly willing to pay for doctor's visits and basic tests out of pocket. I imagine you could negotiate and that your doctor would charge you less than the wildly inflated charges normally cited. You go first..:thankyou:
Teacher Terry
5-29-16, 4:30pm
I know in Europe you can choose to private pay the doc of your choice and some people do that versus waiting for their turn for certain surgeries that aren't urgent.
And I continue to wnder why someone is devestated by health issue now that the
pres has put into place the ACA? The Prez says its affordable. Did he lie?
The ACA is far from perfect. But as someone once said, "Perfect is the enemy of good"--so I'm happy that we have taken the mess out of the closet. Now the mess is all over the floor and there's a lot more work to be done to get it in order.
Obama promised a way in for people who couldn't afford insurance and for people denied healthcare because of pre-existing conditions, and he delivered on that, but the trade-off was the deals he had to make with insurance companies to get it to pass. And he couldn't get rid of the middlemen. That's Phase II Baby steps.
gimmethesimplelife
5-29-16, 4:45pm
The ACA is far from perfect. But as someone once said, "Perfect is the enemy of good"--so I'm happy that we have taken the mess out of the closet. Now the mess is all over the floor and there's a lot more work to be done to get it in order.
Obama promised a way in for people who couldn't afford insurance and for people denied healthcare because of pre-existing conditions, and he delivered on that, but the trade-off was the deals he had to make with insurance companies to get it to pass. And he couldn't get rid of the middlemen. That's Phase II Baby steps.I like your opimistic take, Catherine. I just wish I had faith that the mess on the floor as you put it could be fashioned into something more workable. Rob
freshstart
5-29-16, 6:27pm
The ACA is far from perfect. But as someone once said, "Perfect is the enemy of good"--so I'm happy that we have taken the mess out of the closet. Now the mess is all over the floor and there's a lot more work to be done to get it in order.
Obama promised a way in for people who couldn't afford insurance and for people denied healthcare because of pre-existing conditions, and he delivered on that, but the trade-off was the deals he had to make with insurance companies to get it to pass. And he couldn't get rid of the middlemen. That's Phase II Baby steps.
it's funny, in my nursing career, "perfect is the enemy of good" was one of our standard comments and it is as true ABOUT healthcare as you can get
I trust things to be better over time if Bernie or Hillary get in.
If it wasn't for the ACA, someone like me, a disabled former nurse of 23 yrs, would have no insurance while waiting 2 yrs to get Medicare. I'm over income for Medicaid. So when my Cobra ends Jan 1, I know I will have something, it will probably be prohibitively costly but I'm saving for that now. Something is better than self pay, those people end up paying more for procedures than insurance companies pay, that's fair.
DocHolliday
5-29-16, 9:17pm
John McAfee bags the Libertarian nomination, and then sweeps the national election.
Civilization triumphs.
Looks like McAfee finished third. Gary Johnson won again, with a choice of William Weld as VP.
William Weld...what on earth were they smoking?
Williamsmith
5-29-16, 9:43pm
Well, nobody wants to nominate a homicide suspect. A murderer....sure but not a suspect.
I was hoping I could get away from the dreaded insurance scourge. I'm perfectly willing to pay for doctor's visits and basic tests out of pocket. I imagine you could negotiate and that your doctor would charge you less than the wildly inflated charges normally cited. You go first..:thankyou:
No in fact, they cannot do this if you have insurance. It is fraud. I used to do insurance contracting for facility fees. The best rate we could give self pay was the highest contracted price.
Sucks doesn't it?
iris lilies
5-29-16, 11:22pm
No in fact, they cannot do this if you have insurance. It is fraud. I used to do insurance contracting for facility fees. The best rate we could give self pay was the highest contracted price.
Sucks doesn't it?
I've heard that but didn't know exactly what was operating. Is this a state by state law (where they all seem the same) or is it a federal law?
Williamsmith
5-30-16, 9:35am
Donald Trump wins the election by taking Florida, Ohio and Pennsylvania. Clinton berates the American voters as imbeciles in her concession speech. Barks like a dog.
Trump restores pride in the American middleclass. We become truly energy independent, invest in our schools and infrastructure, actual global free trade is established, good Healthcare is more universally affordable and after four years things are going so well, Trump is re elected in a landslide.
I am 63, my IRA has doubled in the last four years, I have three new grand children, all three of my kids are independent and visit on the holidays. My wife and I vacation on the Carolina Coast in a modest condo during the winter months and we live in Pennsylvania Spring Summer and Fall. My pension fund is doing so well they pay out a cost of living adjustment.
As a result, I give more to charity in one year than I have in my entire lifetime.
frugal-one
5-30-16, 6:53pm
Donald Trump wins the election by taking Florida, Ohio and Pennsylvania. Clinton berates the American voters as imbeciles in her concession speech. Barks like a dog.
Trump restores pride in the American middleclass. We become truly energy independent, invest in our schools and infrastructure, actual global free trade is established, good Healthcare is more universally affordable and after four years things are going so well, Trump is re elected in a landslide.
I am 63, my IRA has doubled in the last four years, I have three new grand children, all three of my kids are independent and visit on the holidays. My wife and I vacation on the Carolina Coast in a modest condo during the winter months and we live in Pennsylvania Spring Summer and Fall. My pension fund is doing so well they pay out a cost of living adjustment.
As a result, I give more to charity in one year than I have in my entire lifetime.
Sounds like you have a lot of pride and a good life. Can't see how Trump would improve it! Just read Trump believes climate change is a hoax and plans on changing a lot of climate related initiatives. Also heard he backed down on the debate with Sanders. He is the first candidate I have ever heard of who had to be tutored by his party. The party probably decided he would look like a buffoon if he actually tried to debate the issues and that is why they backed down. Also heard that Trump's ... university fiasco will be coming to court sooner than expected. Trump's comments were that the judge hates him and the judge is even a Mexican! Supposedly the judge could say Trump is in contempt for that comment! Also, in today's paper, told how Trump had a competition between two of his hotel managers (one being his wife Ivanka at the time) and he commented that it was no big deal since Ivanka was only a woman..... The stupidity just goes on and on. My wish is that we could start over and get a decent candidate! The choice now is who is the lesser of two evils.
Williamsmith
5-30-16, 7:18pm
Sounds like you have a lot of pride and a good life. Can't see how Trump would improve it! Just read Trump believes climate change is a hoax and plans on changing a lot of climate related initiatives. Also heard he backed down on the debate with Sanders. He is the first candidate I have ever heard of who had to be tutored by his party. The party probably decided he would look like a buffoon if he actually tried to debate the issues and that is why they backed down. Also heard that Trump's ... university fiasco will be coming to court sooner than expected. Trump's comments were that the judge hates him and the judge is even a Mexican! Supposedly the judge could say Trump is in contempt for that comment! Also, in today's paper, told how Trump had a competition between two of his hotel managers (one being his wife Ivanka at the time) and he commented that it was no big deal since Ivanka was only a woman..... The stupidity just goes on and on. My wish is that we could start over and get a decent candidate! The choice now is who is the lesser of two evils.
That was all futuristic thinking.....before you get all jealous, I will never get a cost of living adjustment, I will never get social security, I had to reduce my charitable giving, I spend my winters huddled around a fireplace enduring lake effect blizzards, my kids have pride but they need all the support I can afford them, my IRA reads about the same numbers as they did this time last year, the local schools are crumbling, my roads have pot holes in the pot holes, and I feel guilty about paying extra for the MLB channel on my cable subscription.
Teacher Terry
5-30-16, 7:37pm
WS: I knew you were just dreaming:~)
Teacher Terry
5-30-16, 7:37pm
BTW: after 4 years I got my first COL raise on my monthly pension-a whole 23.00:|(
Williamsmith
5-30-16, 8:04pm
BTW: after 4 years I got my first COL raise on my monthly pension-a whole 23.00:|(
:cool:
No in fact, they cannot do this if you have insurance. It is fraud. I used to do insurance contracting for facility fees. The best rate we could give self pay was the highest contracted price.
Sucks doesn't it?
Maybe if trump becomes president he'll get congress to pass a law making it illegal for insurance companies to negotiate prices for transactions they are not involved in since "Capitalism!". I won't hold my breath for this, but if the republicans actually cared about free markets this would seem like a no brainer.
Williamsmith
5-30-16, 9:37pm
Maybe if trump becomes president he'll get congress to pass a law making it illegal for insurance companies to negotiate prices for transactions they are not involved in since "Capitalism!". I won't hold my breath for this, but if the republicans actually cared about free markets this would seem like a no brainer.
Republicans and Democrats are fair weather capitalists, they believe they should enjoy all the profits from their ventures but the other side of capitalism is that those who aren't efficient, are unproductive and lack innovation are supposed to become uncompetetive and extinct. No, they expect to be bailed out and given another chance,
frugal-one
5-31-16, 11:39am
That was all futuristic thinking.....before you get all jealous, I will never get a cost of living adjustment, I will never get social security, I had to reduce my charitable giving, I spend my winters huddled around a fireplace enduring lake effect blizzards, my kids have pride but they need all the support I can afford them, my IRA reads about the same numbers as they did this time last year, the local schools are crumbling, my roads have pot holes in the pot holes, and I feel guilty about paying extra for the MLB channel on my cable subscription.
Sorry... I forgot we were all dreaming! Still reality sounds better than others have it in other countries! You won't get social security but, perhaps, a pension? If not, you still have your savings. You have a cable subscription! We Americans expect so much more than most people have in the world! The sad thing is we think it is our right.
catherine
5-31-16, 11:49am
I'm having such a hard time coming up with a dream. In spite of being optimistic in general, I have a hard time being a dreamer this election cycle. I can't imagine a bright future at this point. Gee, I'm disappointed in myself. :(
I'm having such a hard time coming up with a dream. In spite of being optimistic in general, I have a hard time being a dreamer this election cycle. I can't imagine a bright future at this point. Gee, I'm disappointed in myself. :(
Perhaps it's optimistic to think that our system of checks and balances will continue to protect us from the worst excesses of an incompetent or mendacious chief executive.
Perhaps dreams are best pursued individually rather than through politics.
Ultralight
5-31-16, 12:21pm
Perhaps dreams are best pursued individually rather than through politics. I half agree. I think that politics can hinder or facilitate one's dreams.
ApatheticNoMore
5-31-16, 12:26pm
we're supposed to believe checks and balances will limit and president and we're supposed to believe the president can declare nuclear war. but one can only believe one (or neither, neither is fairly rational) while still making any sense.
iris lilies
5-31-16, 12:43pm
Looks like McAfee finished third. Gary Johnson won again, with a choice of William Weld as VP.
William Weld...what on earth were they smoking?
I skimmed the Libertarian platform. Hmmm, they advocate getting rid of income tax and keep only the governmental functions outlined in the constitution, from mdont those with ?I understand this is pure Libertarian theory but it is pretty far feom reality.
I still have to swallow hard before voting Libertarian. At least the flat taxers recognize that some taxes must be collected and by an agency. Or maybe not, maybe hve a chance msumpti N tax the pay foe the military?
Williamsmith
6-1-16, 8:53am
Sorry... I forgot we were all dreaming! Still reality sounds better than others have it in other countries! You won't get social security but, perhaps, a pension? If not, you still have your savings. You have a cable subscription! We Americans expect so much more than most people have in the world! The sad thing is we think it is our right.
When you think about it, we have no real identity other than we are a nation of immigrants. Now many of those immigrants were abused in their homeland, or saw that there was limited opportunity and something in their DNA leaned toward risk taking. With so much having been achieved, we identify with our accomplishments and our consumption. We are not giving back hard won ground. There is a latent pride in this country that ebbs and flows because I think of our diversity. It was a great experiment that turned out to be quite a ride. All of that continues with the right choices. But the timeframe for those choices are narrowing. There is a sense in my mind that we haven't been given anything, we have earned it with blood, sweat and tears. Maybe we dropped the ball in educating our children to these facts.
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