Where will the refugees go?

[flowerseverywhere]

It looks like there is going to be a revision of the travel ban coming. Probably if the original had been reviewed as it should have been it would not have caused so chaotic. Regardless, it looks likely immigrants and refugees being accepted to the US is going to be far less. it looks like Europe is scaling back, some countries may ban as well.

So so what is going to happen to all these people on the march? Certainly Syrians for example cannot returned to the bombed areas. Many other homelands are rife with gangs and so on. Where do you think this is all going?

[creaker]

Many will die.

[bae]

I found this article of interest:

http://www.vox.com/world/2017/1/30/14432650/global-refugee-crisis-refugee-ban-trump-9-questions

[razz]

I found this article of interest:


http://www.vox.com/world/2017/1/30/14432650/global-refugee-crisis-refugee-ban-trump-9-questions

That was interesting to read. Thanks

[flowerseverywhere]

Thank you Bae. One of my siblings works with refugees and says the ones she has helped are so thankful and hardworking. They also take the crappy jobs (picking crops, meat packing plants) no one wants.

I don't know why there is so much evil to create all these refugees. But the tweeter in chief continually notes people pouring in with no vetting. Sad.

[razz]

Flowers, don't underestimate the power of knowing what is true and holding tightly onto this. The Berlin Wall came down with a lot of faith that truth and goodness would govern the situation. I call it a 'consciousness raising'. Quietly and gently hold onto that, offering countering views when appropriate to the lies. Bae's link does that. Not confrontation which makes people defensive and protective of their position but holding onto what is true.
The support for reducing acceptance of drunk driving and smoking came with constantly holding to what is right and good. I have used this approach all my life and been amazed what has unfolded.

[Gardnr]

great article Bae! I've posted it to FB for all the Rightest haters.

[flowerseverywhere]

Thank you razz. I try not to let it overtake me. In a society where we are all have so much food, so much stuff, too many channels and so on, I sometimes get overwhelmed about the hate directed towards those who have nothing. Tragic.

[Teacher Terry]

I read that it can take between 2-10 years for someone to be admitted so I would consider that extreme vetting. No clue why the orange haired one does not.

[iris lilies]

During the last three years of Obama's Presidency the U.S. admitted .003% of refugees each year.

It was estimated that the Trump regime will cut that in half, to admit about .002%

By the numbers, aint much different. If we all were so concerned with where the refugees go, why werent ya'll asking this question in 2016? 2015? 2014? Trump policy hardly makes a blip in the problem.

[Alan]

By the numbers, aint much different. If we all were so concerned with where the refugees go, why werent ya'll asking this question in 2016? 2015? 2014? Trump policy hardly makes a blip in the problem.
Only racists criticized President Obama, now that he's gone, anyone can do it.

[Tybee]

Flowers, don't underestimate the power of knowing what is true and holding tightly onto this. The Berlin Wall came down with a lot of faith that truth and goodness would govern the situation. I call it a 'consciousness raising'. Quietly and gently hold onto that, offering countering views when appropriate to the lies. Bae's link does that. Not confrontation which makes people defensive and protective of their position but holding onto what is true.
The support for reducing acceptance of drunk driving and smoking came with constantly holding to what is right and good. I have used this approach all my life and been amazed what has unfolded.


what a great post, Razz. You are right, and I need to hold on to this approach. Thank you.

[nswef]

Patience is not just the ability to wait, it’s how we behave while we’re waiting.
Joyce Meyer
This was on my Gratefulness.org web site and I think it goes well today with Razz's above comments about patience and holding on to truth.

[flowerseverywhere]

During the last three years of Obama's Presidency the U.S. admitted .003% of refugees each year.

It was estimated that the Trump regime will cut that in half, to admit about .002%

By the numbers, aint much different. If we all were so concerned with where the refugees go, why werent ya'll asking this question in 2016? 2015? 2014? Trump policy hardly makes a blip in the problem.

You could not be more right. I think that the last few years in Europe has really brought the refugee crisis front and center. I don't think there is anyone here who in the back of their mind doesn't know that there is sex trafficking, ethnic cleansing, bombing of innocent civilians and so on. A lot of it is hidden from us, because we are too busy sitting in our comfy homes and we are not confronted by it. We have so much fear as a society. If someone does not look like us it is like an alarm bell goes off. Much of that is instilled by the twenty four hour news cycle hysteria, the lack of class by so many reporters that feel perfectly justified in saying whatever pops into their head instead of thinking it out, and the replaying over and over of one bad word, one misspelled name, and so on. We get bogged down in little facts and don't look at the whole picture.

I know now I for one am ashamed at how little I have paid attention to what was going on. I think all,this tweeting and hateful talk (from both sides of the aisle) has caused an awakening. Like you just saying, wait a minute, here are the facts.i think for too long we have fallen into the trap of thinking If _______ is for that proposal it must automatically be bad.

[flowerseverywhere]

Another thing I find really interesting is the illegal immigrant deportations and roundups. People are up in arms, yet Obama was known as the deportee in chief. He deported more people than any other president. Some are up in arms and trying to sensationalize the ice roundups, when they have been going on all along. I think this is another thing that would have quietly ticked along if we did not have all the wall building, tweeting, blustering.

It it makes me wonder what we,are being distracted from with such an uproar over such small changes that really were not talked about much before.

[ApatheticNoMore]

Another thing I find really interesting is the illegal immigrant deportations and roundups. People are up in arms, yet Obama was known as the deportee in chief. He deported more people than any other president. Some are up in arms and trying to sensationalize the ice roundups, when they have been going on all along. I think this is another thing that would have quietly ticked along if we did not have all the wall building, tweeting, blustering.

that actually seems accurate, Trump does not yet seem to be deporting at a faster rate than Obama in fact he seems (so far) to be deporting LESS people than Obama. Past performance is no guarantee of future results I know, but that's the state of things now.

That (deportation count) is an actual count of people though. As for percentages of refugees though that number by itself is meaningless as even a small percentage could be tens or even hundreds of thousands of people for all I know, it's not like I know off the top of my head what the total number of refugees are, so a percentage of an unknown number by itself doesn't say much.


It it makes me wonder what we,are being distracted from with such an uproar over such small changes that really were not talked about much before.

I think that's probably too conspiratorial, I guess one could say we are being distracted from real obvious things, such as, we should pay attention to the makeup of Trump's cabinet, but it's not like that's top secret information, even if a normal deportation (Obama era normal anyway) makes more splashy news.

Really I think it's partisan politics, but it's gotten really really bad. I have no problem with having a point of view and even a strong one, but at this point news reporting itself is getting entirely distorted by politics (to determine which set of plutocrats rule us pretty much is the whole of the prize, for which they have thrown out not only unachievable "objectivity", but basic context and rationality). And no mainstream news distortion was not always this bad, it wasn't even this bad a couple years ago!

[iris lilies]

that actually seems accurate, Trump does not yet seem to be deporting at a faster rate than Obama in fact he seems (so far) to be deporting LESS people than Obama. Past performance is no guarantee of future results I know, but that's the state of things now.

That (deportation count) is an actual count of people though. As for percentages of refugees though that number by itself is meaningless as even a small percentage could be tens or even hundreds of thousands of people for all I know, it's not like I know off the top of my head what the total number of refugees are, so a percentage of an unknown number by itself doesn't say much.


I think that's probably too conspiratorial, I guess one could say we are being distracted from real obvious things, such as, we should pay attention to the makeup of Trump's cabinet, but it's not like that's top secret information, even if a normal deportation (Obama era normal anyway) makes more splashy news.

Really I think it's partisan politics, but it's gotten really really bad. I have no problem with having a point of view and even a strong one, but at this point news reporting itself is getting entirely distorted by politics (to determine which set of plutocrats rule us pretty much is the whole of the prize, for which they have thrown out not only unachievable "objectivity", but basic context and rationality). And no mainstream news distortion was not always this bad, it wasn't even this bad a couple years ago!
see bolded above

dang it you are going to make me show my math like my 6th grade teacher.

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2016/10/05/u-s-admits-record-number-of-muslim-refugees-in-2016/

I used the 85,000 number from the article above that covers refugees admitted into the U.S. during 12 months in fy 2016. Similar numbers (though fewer) were admitted in previous years.

I thought I used the number of worldwide refugees from the vox article bae posted, 65 million, but that doesnt replicate the numbers I posted earlier. Sorry!

So using 65,000,000 displaced persons, of which 85,000 enter the U.S. the math show 1% of refugees admitted to the U.S. annually in recent years during Obama's tenure. Sure, that is better than the number I posted earlier. Margnally. DJ Trump suggests admitting less than that 1%.

Actually, I think a percentage (when it is accurate!) means a lot. The U.S.' admittance of refugees into our country barely registers when you look at the entire package of need, that is what percentages show.

Now ANM, you could invoke the starfish story* and you would be right, too.

*starfish story: A man and a woman were walking on a beach where thousands of starfish were beached by the low tide. The woman started throwing starfish back into the ocean. The man said "what are you doing? you can't get all the starfish back in the ocean!" She said "no but I am making a difference to the ones I CAN save."

[flowerseverywhere]

Really I think it's partisan politics, but it's gotten really really bad. I have no problem with having a point of view and even a strong one, but at this point news reporting itself is getting entirely distorted by politics (to determine which set of plutocrats rule us pretty much is the whole of the prize, for which they have thrown out not only unachievable "objectivity", but basic context and rationality). And no mainstream news distortion was not always this bad, it wasn't even this bad a couple years ago!

there have been multiple times on Facebook a story has been shared millions of times that was false. Emails are shared and forwarded containing half truths. In the race to be first, journalists publish things without checking. Don't see a bust of MLK, it must have been removed because the Pres is racist and so on.

People hear what they want to hear and see what they want to see. For close to eight years now we have been hearing repeal and replace Obamacare. Suddenly the repeal is imminent but where is the replacement? There have been countless interviews of poor residents in depressed areas who have said we didn't really think they were serious about Obamacare repeal or thought there was something way better in the wings just waiting to be unveiled to save us all.

And the whole deportation thing. Deportations continue as under Obama. Nothing new to see here folks. And the recent Muslim ban was so poorly handled. Having an executive order reviewed by legal staff could have made it successful and while it still might have been questioned as a Muslim ban due to statements made on the campaign trail, legal experts could have counseled.

Now real changes, like ramping up Gitmo, cutting taxes for the wealthy, cozier US - Russia relations could make for big changes.

Suppressing the media is a big concern of mine. Saying everything that does not agree with you is fake news is just wrong. Promoting your family business interests could violate laws. Criticizing judges because they don't agree with you is another bad move. Numerous gaffes that could have been avoided if everyone wasn't so ill informed and paranoid at the top. There are really smart people in this country who have spent their lives studying constitutional law who would be happy to provide guidance.

[LDAHL]

Flowers, don't underestimate the power of knowing what is true and holding tightly onto this. The Berlin Wall came down with a lot of faith that truth and goodness would govern the situation. I call it a 'consciousness raising'. Quietly and gently hold onto that, offering countering views when appropriate to the lies. Bae's link does that. Not confrontation which makes people defensive and protective of their position but holding onto what is true.
The support for reducing acceptance of drunk driving and smoking came with constantly holding to what is right and good. I have used this approach all my life and been amazed what has unfolded.

I think there was a bit more to the wall coming down than lighting candles and singing kumbayah. There was a long strategy of containment backed by the capability and will to use military power. Without further conquests the brutish idiocy of communism fell apart on its own.