Question about Security Advisor Flynn

[CathyA]

Can someone, in a nutshell, explain to me what he did and why it was so bad? I know he spoke to the Russian ambassador before Trump was elected, but I'm not sure why that was so bad. Was the problem that he appeared to lie about it, or was it more of the substance of the conversation?
Thanks!

[razz]

From:http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/michael-flynn-nsa-resigns-trump-1.3981476

U.S. President Donald Trump's embattled national security adviser Michael Flynn resigned late Monday night, following reports that he had misled Vice-President Mike Pence and other officials about his contacts with Russia. His departure upends Trump's senior team after less than one month in office.

In a resignation letter, Flynn said he held numerous calls with the Russian ambassador to the U.S. during the transition and gave "incomplete information" about those discussions to Vice-President Mike Pence. The vice-president, apparently relying on information from Flynn, initially said the national security adviser had not discussed sanctions with the Russian envoy, though Flynn later conceded the issue may have come up...
"I may have been careless in some of my discussions and I accept full responsibility," Flynn said Monday night via Twitter, though he later said he was being treated unfairly, and as a "scapegoat."...
Trump, who comments on a steady stream of issues on his Twitter feed, has been conspicuously silent about the matter since The Washington Post reported last week that Flynn had discussed sanctions with the Russian envoy. A U.S. official told The Associated Press that Flynn was in frequent contact with Ambassador Sergey Kislyak on the day the Obama administration slapped sanctions on Russia for election-related hacking, as well as at other times during the transition.

[herbgeek]

It's illegal to be dealing with foreign countries as a private citizen. Which he was when these conversations happened.

[creaker]

It's illegal to be dealing with foreign countries as a private citizen. Which he was when these conversations happened.

The question here is who he interfaced with before, during, after doing this. And what he exactly was trying to do. But I don't expect the administration or the majority party in Congress is going to want to go there.

Although there might be enough anti-Russian Republicans in Congress to make things very uncomfortable for the administration.

[CathyA]

Thanks everyone. Do any of you think that maybe Pence was in on the cover-up too, but it was just Flynn who was thrown under the bus?

[Tybee]

I think someone was thrown under the bus, but it is not Trump doing the throwing.
I'd be curious to hear what Bae thinks on this one.

[creaker]

Thanks everyone. Do any of you think that maybe Pence was in on the cover-up too, but it was just Flynn who was thrown under the bus?

It seems to be a lot to have taken on as a self-inspired solo operation. And then not actually sharing. I also can't imagine anyone in this administration stepping down for the mere appearance of impropriety.

[bae]

I think someone was thrown under the bus, but it is not Trump doing the throwing.
I'd be curious to hear what Bae thinks on this one.

I have no reliable data at present, and so hesitate to form an opinion. There's a whole range here from Flynn (a loose cannon and previous Director of the DIA under Obama) simply acting out of school on his own all the way to a full-blown conspiracy-with-Putin that runs all the way up to the Illuminati :-)

(That's not the *whole* range of course, and given the lack of reliable facts and reporting these days, well...)

[Tybee]

I have no reliable data at present, and so hesitate to form an opinion. There's a whole range here from Flynn (a loose cannon and previous Director of the DIA under Obama) simply acting out of school on his own all the way to a full-blown conspiracy-with-Putin that runs all the way up to the Illuminati :-)

(That's not the *whole* range of course, and given the lack of reliable facts and reporting these days, well...)

Thanks, Bae! A range indeed. . .

[Rogar]

Mother Jones had an interesting piece around how maybe it isn't the crime, but it's the cover-up that will get you. At this point I don't know how much of it is investigative journalism or other motivations from the press, but it's giving the impression of a White House crisis. http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2017/02/donald-trump-cant-come-clean-on-russia-michael-flynn

[creaker]

Mother Jones had an interesting piece around how maybe it isn't the crime, but it's the cover-up that will get you. At this point I don't know how much of it is investigative journalism or other motivations from the press, but it's giving the impression of a White House crisis. http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2017/02/donald-trump-cant-come-clean-on-russia-michael-flynn

This has the potential of being bigger than Watergate depending on what flushes out. How much of what's being done in the White House was coordinated with Russia? Who's gotten what and who is supposed to get what?

[JaneV2.0]

But remember--there was a certain sense of cooperation for the good of the nation during the Watergate era. I'm sure that won't be the case here and now in Trumpistan.

[Alan]

What if it turns out the only impropriety is in not advising the boss?

[Rogar]

What if it turns out the only impropriety is in not advising the boss?

Other that the improprieties that we know of with Flynn, that could be that is the end of it. The fact that the Ruskies hacked the election apparently to favor Trump's victory, his public invitation for the Russian's to hack Hillary's emails, his slowness in disclosing what he knew of Flynn, the possibility of multiple staff members having contact with higher ups in Russian intelligence, and his outwardly friendly attitude toward Putin are a gathering cloud of circumstance. I don't have much faith in Trump's veracity and rectitude, but he seems to have also made some enemies with national security agencies. There is a small niche of conspiracy theory in me that says this could be their way of getting rid of him or teaching a lesson and he's worked the media into a frothing frenzy.

Ultimately there is a place where the buck stops. Trump selected his staff and maybe could be forgiven for a bad apple or two but if it is more widespread, technically I think he has some responsibility in their actions. Legally, I don't know. There's probably not enough information to go with right now but It's certainly the gathering of a dark cloud.

[bae]

What if it turns out the only impropriety is in not advising the boss?

Something shiny and interesting will pop up in the next week to distract us from this anyways. It's all part of the show :-)

[jp1]

What if it turns out the only impropriety is in not advising the boss?

http://washingtonmonthly.com/2017/02/14/the-blackmail-story-doesnt-add-up/

This guy's opinion is that that probably isn't the case. I said it a few weeks ago and I'll say it again. Trump really shouldn't have picked a fight with the intelligence community. If there's anything happening that can be brought to light to take him down they will undoubtedly figure it out and make sure that it becomes public.