View Full Version : Dental X-rays
Today I read, on both the American Cancer Society and Web MD websites, about increased risks of the most common type of brain tumor for people who get annual dental x rays, which have always been pushed on me. I am going to say no now.
Thank goodness for all the years I missed because I didn't have dental insurance.
If I have a problem like a toothache then I will get them.
It has seemed to me that most dentists use the x rays to sell fillings of increasingly minute cavities. It appears to be a profession with a lot of upselling. One dentists wouldn't go over my x rays with me because someone else at her practice took them and "I won't get the commission". There are also the chains like Aspen Dental that have jumped into the market now that it is lucrative enough.
Williamsmith
1-20-18, 11:20pm
The joke is that the dentist needs to see your insurance before he determines if you need an X-ray or not. Last time in, I declined and I felt like the technician cleaned my teeth with a pick axe. You can’t win.
It appears to be a profession with a lot of upselling.
I had posted earlier how a dentist I saw here said I needed a crown replaced immediately and quoted me a price of $1350 without any explanation other than possible decay. I decided to get a second opinion which apparently doesn't happen often in the dental world. The second opinion dentist had to take more X-rays to look at trouble spot. Not happy about that but didn't want to alert first dentist by asking for X-rays. New dentist's verdict was that there is possible decay. Yes, it needs to be replaced but no big hurry. Just some time within the next six months to be safe. The second opinion was completely free and the quoted price for the same porcelain crown was $999. Plus the new dentist spent fifteen minutes explaining and showing me exactly what was going on and what types of crown options there were.
boss mare
2-17-18, 10:57pm
30+ years of working in the dental field here. Unless an office is using an X-Ray machine that is so old it belongs in a museum, there is more radiation coming off from reading your computer, watching your TV for a few hours , compared to exposure from dental films. Even less if it's a state of the art digital X-Ray unit. Also going to corporate dental offices such as Aspen, Heartland, Gentle Dental, Bright Now, etc are notorious for treating their staff awful and problems of over/under treatment, depending what type of insurance you have. My husband signed up with one from his work without asking my opinion because other than a 10.00 co-pay everything is covered at 100%. It takes an act of Congress to get them to do anything except the absolute minimum because they get paid whether you go or not. I had to go with him at one point because he had a root canal done at another office a few years back before I met him and the tooth needed a crown ( teeth become brittle and can break off of not crowned. ) and they kept telling him that he didn't need one. I finally went in with DH when he went in for cleaning and the Dr was young enough to be my grandson. He was just following what the corporate office policies are. I was very respectful, but insisted that they needed to quit putting him off and do the correct treatment. A lot of insurances requite and X-Ray for work to be approved. That happens in private practice too. It is unethical to do diagnosis and treat with out on X-ray . There is no way is no way at to see if a decay has gone to the pulp.
Williamsmith
2-18-18, 4:52am
30+ years of working in the dental field here. Unless an office is using an X-Ray machine that is so old it belongs in a museum, there is more radiation coming off from reading your computer, watching your TV for a few hours , compared to exposure from dental films. Even less if it's a state of the art digital X-Ray unit. Also going to corporate dental offices such as Aspen, Heartland, Gentle Dental, Bright Now, etc are notorious for treating their staff awful and problems of over/under treatment, depending what type of insurance you have. My husband signed up with one from his work without asking my opinion because other than a 10.00 co-pay everything is covered at 100%. It takes an act of Congress to get them to do anything except the absolute minimum because they get paid whether you go or not. I had to go with him at one point because he had a root canal done at another office a few years back before I met him and the tooth needed a crown ( teeth become brittle and can break off of not crowned. ) and they kept telling him that he didn't need one. I finally went in with DH when he went in for cleaning and the Dr was young enough to be my grandson. He was just following what the corporate office policies are. I was very respectful, but insisted that they needed to quit putting him off and do the correct treatment. A lot of insurances requite and X-Ray for work to be approved. That happens in private practice too. It is unethical to do diagnosis and treat with out on X-ray . There is no way is no way at to see if a decay has gone to the pulp.
Thank you for posting this. Makes me feel better about the dental care I am receiving.
Regarding upselling by dentists: I'm very lucky because my dentist is the only dentist I know who discourages me from some dental procedures. I went in with a toothache on both my upper and lower left and was so worried that I had two root canals coming. He looked and said, "it's just a sinus infection. Take a Sudafed." Sure enough, it went away in a day or two.
Another time I asked him if he could whiten my teeth and he said, "Ahh, just go to CVS and get the kit. They work just as good."
I've been with him for decades. He also cured me of my dentist-phobia.
As for the radiation in X-rays, boss mare, you bring up a good point. I was reading The Better Brain and Perlmutter said that you shouldn't sleep with your cell phone closer than 3 feet from your head. You also shouldn't carry your phone around with you on your person for a long time during the day. And if you talk on the phone for more than a few minutes you should always use earbuds. Does anyone here have any thoughts or concerns about our chronic use of cell phones?
Williamsmith
2-18-18, 9:39am
I am interested in the cumulative affect all exposure has. Microwave, cell phone, X-ray, mri, television and in my case I spent many years exposed to k band radar. I know an Ohio Trooper who sued for radar causing his testicular cancer. These considerations are just part of the nostalgia of looking back at simpler times not worrying about the negative side of technologies. But then, there were other things that got you earlier that we have abated.
For the reasons boss mare gave, I’m totally at ease with dental x-rays.
For years, we had a dreadful dentist. He was rough and rude. It would take days for my mouth to heal after a cleaning. I was so scared of him that I skipped routine cleanings. Our coverage is through my husband’s employer. After my last treatment by Dr. Dread, I came home determined never to see that man again. My husband had signed us up for the cheapest plan; I found that there were very few dentists in its network, and none of them had stellar reviews on Yelp. There were complaints of upselling and shoddy work.
I insisted that my husband get the options from HR, so we could change plans and get a better dentist. We had a six-month wait before we could change, so I took the time to thoroughly check the plans available, and the dentists in the networks. I used Yelp and the dentist council ratings.
I now have a dentist whose practice is 8 minutes’ walk from my house instead of 40 minutes away by streetcar, who explains everything to me, is gentle with my mouth, and always courteous. It costs us $28/month more, and is worth every cent. He and his partner are deeply committed to holistic health, as the mouth is not only an indicator of general health, but an active player.
Reverting to dental x-rays: I’m 58 and have some bone loss in my lower jaw. I want x-rays so we can track this, and see whether my increased attention to oral health is stabilizing it. Not only does bone loss lead to tooth loss, there are risks of infection and abscessing, and very unbecoming changes in face shape. The tiny amount of radiation just is not a concern to me.
rosarugosa
2-18-18, 11:12am
Thanks for the insight, Boss Mare.
SteveinMN
2-18-18, 11:13am
I was reading The Better Brain and Perlmutter said that you shouldn't sleep with your cell phone closer than 3 feet from your head. You also shouldn't carry your phone around with you on your person for a long time during the day. And if you talk on the phone for more than a few minutes you should always use earbuds. Does anyone here have any thoughts or concerns about our chronic use of cell phones?
My thought is that my cell-phone use is not chronic. DW and I live quite comfortably on 250 minutes of talk (generously rounded up each fraction of a minute we're off-hook) and several dozen texts a month for both of us. I do have my phone within arms' reach nearly all the time because it does a hundred other things for me besides place and receive phone calls. From that perspective, it enhances my life.
Maybe our cell phones are killing us. Or maybe the cell phones are OK and it was the radioactive material in the hands of our glow-in-the-dark watch dials that was doing us in. Or maybe those exposures are minor compared to breathing soap fumes from our bedding for 7-8 hours every night. My point is that a lot of the science is bad science and many of those reporting it have something to gain from it. I'll look for a preponderance of evidence before I ditch something that's a "significant health risk" today and "oh, well, never mind" tomorrow.
iris lilies
2-18-18, 11:18am
God, I love my dentist and his office staff. He is thorough but not alarmist. He gives us a 10% discount for cash payment. He is an ex military man who teaches both dentistry and firearms, he is an action man on a motorcycle. If we wish, we get a lecture about conservative politics, but that is only if we wish it. I opt for it since I like the infusion of conservative ideas into this city biosphere of blue, it cleans the air around here, haha.
ApatheticNoMore
2-18-18, 12:06pm
I think there has been some real research on cell phones and brain cancer and so it's not all bad science pointing to a possible link there. I don't know about the dental xrays, other than ugh $300 at least every time I do them.
iris lilies
2-18-18, 12:20pm
I think there has been some real research on cell phones and brain cancer and so it's not all bad science pointing to a possible link there. I don't know about the dental xrays, other than ugh $300 at least every time I do them.
Our xrays are no more than $120, actual pay around $100 or $110 with discount for cash.
rosarugosa
2-18-18, 2:57pm
My dental insurance always covers the x-rays in full.
Dental x-rays are useful - comparisons of current and previous x-rays are the easiest way to see changes. When I've had x-rays done, it was like a full set for the initial visit, but usually they just take bitewings on the molars for follow-ups.
I think there has been some real research on cell phones and brain cancer and so it's not all bad science pointing to a possible link there.
The way I wrote my response implies that I believe all research around cell phones and brains (cancer, low-level RF, etc.) is bad science. I could have worded that better to say that, among the studies which can be trusted are many more which are sponsored or which go for the sensational headline or which would be far less sensational if the study's assumptions and limitations were publicized along with the eye- (or ear-) grabbing headline. IMHO this kind of labeling is right up there with the state of California wanting to label coffee a carcinogen or with the people who believed that green magic marker applied to the perimeter of a CD made it sound better.
iris lilies
2-18-18, 5:05pm
ANM, maybe your dental exrays are a full set, and our annual xrays are two images only. That could account for a price difference.
ApatheticNoMore
2-18-18, 5:21pm
It's more than two, probably 6-10 every 2 years they push it but I procrastinate it so it's usually more like every 3 years. And they always try to sell me even more xrays, as if I absolutely need 25 xrays of my mouth or something and I always say I can't afford it (I don't think it's worth it at any rate).
Regarding upselling by dentists: I'm very lucky because my dentist is the only dentist I know who discourages me from some dental procedures. I went in with a toothache on both my upper and lower left and was so worried that I had two root canals coming. He looked and said, "it's just a sinus infection. Take a Sudafed." Sure enough, it went away in a day or two.
Another time I asked him if he could whiten my teeth and he said, "Ahh, just go to CVS and get the kit. They work just as good."
I've been with him for decades. He also cured me of my dentist-phobia.
As for the radiation in X-rays, boss mare, you bring up a good point. I was reading The Better Brain and Perlmutter said that you shouldn't sleep with your cell phone closer than 3 feet from your head. You also shouldn't carry your phone around with you on your person for a long time during the day. And if you talk on the phone for more than a few minutes you should always use earbuds. Does anyone here have any thoughts or concerns about our chronic use of cell phones?
Along with being in the dental field forever, before that I was dating a equine veterinarian and I would come out and help him on occasions and that would mean sometimes helping with x-rays. So between that and my quasi addiction to my smart phone ( I do sleep with my cell phone as my parents are older and have needed help late at night) I should be glowing in the dark by now LOL ( I am nearly 57 )
There are several types of X-Rays : bite wings, those are two ( one on each side) or two ( two on each side ) depending on the type of view (horizontal or vertical). They will show bicuspid to molars. These are for detecting decay and pretty much just show the teeth themselves from the gum lime to the top of the chewing surfaces. These are recommended once a year.
Next are full mouth . these will be about 20 or so ( depending on the x ray unit ) they consist of the four bite wings and 16 or so periapicals. those show the roots of the teeth and are used for detecting/monitoring bone loss and to see if there is any abscesses. Those are recommended every 3 years, unless there is something that is being monitored. If you have a toothache, a singlar periapical is what they will probably take so they can see if there is an abscess or other issues ( like a sinus infection that can mimic a toothache, like another poster said)
Then there are panoramic films. this is one large film. The X ray film is outside of your mouth and the x ray machine goes around your face left to right while you bite in a small plastic stick. This is recommended every 5-8 years or as needed for oral surgery and is used more frequently in orthodontics, especially children to see the progression of adult teeth that may or may not be developing like wisdom teeth and the like)
These are just guide lines and of course, your mileage may vary
Thank you for posting this. Makes me feel better about the dental care I am receiving.
:+1:
Today I read, on both the American Cancer Society and Web MD websites, about increased risks of the most common type of brain tumor for people who get annual dental x rays, which have always been pushed on me. I am going to say no now.
Thank goodness for all the years I missed because I didn't have dental insurance.
If I have a problem like a toothache then I will get them.
It has seemed to me that most dentists use the x rays to sell fillings of increasingly minute cavities. It appears to be a profession with a lot of upselling. One dentists wouldn't go over my x rays with me because someone else at her practice took them and "I won't get the commission". There are also the chains like Aspen Dental that have jumped into the market now that it is lucrative enough.
When I lost dental insurance, I changed to cleanings once per year and x-rays every other year.
Not seeing any adverse results and it saves money.
I would compare dentists to time share salesmen but I don't want to insult time share salesmen.
Unfortunately, my teeth are in pretty bad shape because I cannot find a decent, HONEST dentist that isn't hell bent on selling me 50 procedures that I do not want nor need, extensive x-rays being one of them. "But today's x-rays are only a fraction in strength what they used to be", etc., "We have to do a full examination and x-rays of your mouth before we can decide on a treatment plan".
Oh please.
I'm so fed up with it. I call and ask what the "consultation fee" is and the receptionist/office manager acts like I am speaking Martian.
I think X-rays and exam before treatment plan are good medical practice.
I don't like the term treatment plan. It assumes everyone has something to be treated and no one on the world has good teeth.
I would compare dentists to time share salesmen but I don't want to insult time share salesmen.
Unfortunately, my teeth are in pretty bad shape because I cannot find a decent, HONEST dentist that isn't hell bent on selling me 50 procedures that I do not want nor need, extensive x-rays being one of them. "But today's x-rays are only a fraction in strength what they used to be", etc., "We have to do a full examination and x-rays of your mouth before we can decide on a treatment plan".
Oh please.
I'm so fed up with it. I call and ask what the "consultation fee" is and the receptionist/office manager acts like I am speaking Martian.
r
I am sorry that you feel that way...you are contradicting yourself. first you say that that your teeth are in bad shape. Then you say that you say that they try to help you, but then you state that you don't need their help and you know more than the dentist and staff.
my suggestion is go into your tool box and get the rusty pliers and extract your teeth yourself. There. Problem solved !Splat!
I don't like the term treatment plan. It assumes everyone has something to be treated and no one on the world has good teeth.
Ok how about a Comprehensive Examination ? There are terms that are used in all professions .
But you need a treatment plan because your teeth are bad by your own admission. Don’t worry about everybody else and whether they need one. Just take care of yourself.
I personally have good teeth. My original dentist told me they would last me until I'm 100. Then he retired and an upseller bought the practice.
Sorry - I confused you with someone else ...
Back on the subject of teeth...I am bummed. Finally had my one and only crown replaced after finding a second opinion dentist I thought I liked and who charged $400 less than the first one I saw. A week later and I still can't chew on that side without extreme tenderness. I don't know why but if I go back to have him look at it, I believe he will say I now need a root canal. The first dentist said the chances of a root canal in my case were slim to none - I believe he was probably more ethical. The dentist who did the work seemed rushed and was kind of rough. The good news is I have lost five pounds in a week because I can't eat anything but mushy stuff. What to do...??
Pinkytoe, I am sorry you are having such trouble. You might need a root canal. Sometimes trauma to the tooth- crowns and replacing them- can hurt the root. At least that's what I was told after having a huge cavity filled, then crowned and then needing a root canal. The original dentist was my brother in law and I trusted him, then he died, the periodontist found the need for the root canal and the kid who did it was great, his brother is now our dentist and he explained the trauma part to me as I was upset it happened.
I am reading a book now about toxic substances in food that notes upper limits for these are sometimes set by the government without any research proving these exposure levels are actually safe. I wonder if this is the case with radiation/x-rays. Years ago no one questioned that it was safe to x-ray your foot to find shoes that fit, or have radium on clocks. How do we know that the people who want to sell us x-rays are giving us complete and accurate information, or that they even possess such knowledge, or that anyone does?
Edited to add: I am further into the book and the author notes that upper limits go down with time, as further research shows dangers not previously recognized.
Back on the subject of teeth...I am bummed. Finally had my one and only crown replaced after finding a second opinion dentist I thought I liked and who charged $400 less than the first one I saw. A week later and I still can't chew on that side without extreme tenderness. I don't know why but if I go back to have him look at it, I believe he will say I now need a root canal. The first dentist said the chances of a root canal in my case were slim to none - I believe he was probably more ethical. The dentist who did the work seemed rushed and was kind of rough. The good news is I have lost five pounds in a week because I can't eat anything but mushy stuff. What to do...??
It could be that the crown is too high and you bite on the high spot first instead of having a balanced bite. Extremely common
I am going back in to see if it needs adjusting. Hope that's all it is. Thanks all!!
r
I am sorry that you feel that way...you are contradicting yourself. first you say that that your teeth are in bad shape. Then you say that you say that they try to help you, but then you state that you don't need their help and you know more than the dentist and staff.
my suggestion is go into your tool box and get the rusty pliers and extract your teeth yourself. There. Problem solved !Splat!
One time I bit into an incredibly hard apple and damaged my tooth. It was loose. I went to a "dentist" (well respected, highly recommended). After a BATTERY of xrays (not ONE OF WHICH HE EVEN GLANCED AT), he said. "We'll have to remove it".
I said. UM.....no......I'd like to save the tooth.
He said. "It's not worth saving".
(thinking to myelf) Excuse me? Isn't this MY TOOTH we're talking about? I'd like to at least TRY to save it you bombastic bastard.
The correct answer would have been.
"Yes, I understand that you would like to save your tooth. I'm sure there are several things that we can try. I certainly cannot guarantee the outcome, but I am happy to do what I can".
Or perhaps
"There ares many different options to choose from. Some are more expensive than others. Let me get some information together for you".
NOT "THE TOOTH ISN'T WORTH SAVING".
The correct answer would have been.
"Yes, I understand that you would like to save your tooth. I'm sure there are several things that we can try. I certainly cannot guarantee the outcome, but I am happy to do what I can".
Or perhaps
"There ares many different options to choose from. Some are more expensive than others. Let me get some information together for you".
NOT "THE TOOTH ISN'T WORTH SAVING".
I could even see declaring that the tooth "cannot be saved" for various technical reasons and clearly explaining the reasons why. It does not sound like that happened, though.
One time I bit into an incredibly hard apple and damaged my tooth. It was loose. I went to a "dentist" (well respected, highly recommended). After a BATTERY of xrays (not ONE OF WHICH HE EVEN GLANCED AT), he said. "We'll have to remove it".
I said. UM.....no......I'd like to save the tooth.
He said. "It's not worth saving".
(thinking to myelf) Excuse me? Isn't this MY TOOTH we're talking about? I'd like to at least TRY to save it you bombastic bastard.
The correct answer would have been.
"Yes, I understand that you would like to save your tooth. I'm sure there are several things that we can try. I certainly cannot guarantee the outcome, but I am happy to do what I can".
Or perhaps
"There ares many different options to choose from. Some are more expensive than others. Let me get some information together for you".
NOT "THE TOOTH ISN'T WORTH SAVING".
Since I was not there, I can only make an educated guess. If biting into an apple damaged your tooth and made it loose, It sounds like it had some periodontal issues and if that was the case, the right thing to do was have the tooth extracted. And depending on what your bone level is, getting an implant may or may not have been an option.
But you seem to know more than the Dentist, so carry on ....
Dentist took off some high spots and it is about half as sensitive. One more visit should do the trick. I am so happy:)
Dentist took off some high spots and it is about half as sensitive. One more visit should do the trick. I am so happy:)
That's great ... It may take some time to settle down
One time I bit into an incredibly hard apple and damaged my tooth. It was loose. I went to a "dentist" (well respected, highly recommended). After a BATTERY of xrays (not ONE OF WHICH HE EVEN GLANCED AT), he said. "We'll have to remove it".
I said. UM.....no......I'd like to save the tooth.
He said. "It's not worth saving".
(thinking to myelf) Excuse me? Isn't this MY TOOTH we're talking about? I'd like to at least TRY to save it you bombastic bastard.
The correct answer would have been.
"Yes, I understand that you would like to save your tooth. I'm sure there are several things that we can try. I certainly cannot guarantee the outcome, but I am happy to do what I can".
Or perhaps
"There ares many different options to choose from. Some are more expensive than others. Let me get some information together for you".
NOT "THE TOOTH ISN'T WORTH SAVING".
Now that I have back tracked and looked at your other posts..... You are becoming your husband .... As my horse trainer of 28 years has said " you become what you are around" Dump the Chump and look past your life of the last 20 years and you will see things much more clearly .... Please trust those who are there to help you. If this tooth was peridontally involved, it's not worth saving it . Dump The Chump and you will find your life amazing
Actually, it was a dental assistant who did the adjusting and it still doesn't feel right but better at least. Wondering if the dentist could do a better job. Oddly, the opposing tooth is what hurts.
Actually, it was a dental assistant who did the adjusting and it still doesn't feel right but better at least. Wondering if the dentist could do a better job. Oddly, the opposing tooth is what hurts.
That's 'cuz it's taking a beating! :D I had a tooth filled once, and it had to be filed down for the same reason.
I've had that, too. They might need to file down the hurting tooth as the crown can only be filed down so much. Keep going and nagging and telling them it hurts.
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