View Full Version : Can Progressives Revive The Democratic Party?
Williamsmith
2-16-18, 3:04am
Back when Trump was making a run for President, I started a thread which in essence just reported on the groundswell of resistance I saw to the Democratic Party in the Rust Belt. In a way it predicted Trumps unlikely occupation of the White House Oval Office. The story never was really about Trump. It was always about how the Democrats abandoned their constituents and paid the price.
They had the means to defeat Republicans in the form of another unlikely candidate.....Bernie Sanders. Bernie wasn’t carasmatic, young, good looking and well connected. Bernie was radical compared to the rest of the leading democratic corporately bought off DC insiders. But Bernie was just playing a bit part in a play that featured the demise of a once great party.
Today, that party truly is in disarray, with no leadership and no direction. But there is still a remnant of progressives who have attached themselves to the party in an effort to revive it and take back some turf. Not the corporate monied career politicians masquerading as progressives. No, these are young, motivated, determined real progressives who shun lobbyists in favor of Bernie Sanders like fund raising campaigns.
Are people really ready to jump into progressivism without waders on? Almost every single progressive issue has been left untouched by the current administration. Immigration, social justice, education, housing, healthcare, LGBTQIA issues, criminal justice reform, war on drugs, financial sector corruption, Union right to organize, social security, Medicare, infrastructure, renewable energy, military veterans treatment and of course....gun violence.
Meet the new face of the Democratic Party.
https://amy4thepeople.com/
Bernie's message was wonderfully simple - universal health care and free college. Hillary's was complex to avoid giving too much to ordinary people at the expense of health insurers and other special interests. But he was outsimplified by the guttural roar from the anti-Obama backlash spewing out of Trump's mouth. It's for us us us not the others - not the immigrants, not the minorities, not the cultural elites, not the Muslims. The country is just for us.
The Democrats' success will depend on their ability to craft a simple and compelling message.
As you know I was hoping for a Bernie Revolution at the last election cycle, but as you suggested in another post, WS, Debbie Wasserman Schultz sabotaged that in favor of her girl. I still love Bernie, and while there area lot of people who want him to run in 2020, he is no spring chicken, and I really think it's highly unlikely. So we need a Bernie-surrogate in the party. Elizabeth Warren seems to be close, and Cory Booker.
Yppej, you are exactly right about the messaging. PR101: One message. Hammer it out. Keep it simple. Hilary was completely unsuited for that kind of campaign. But Trump gets it in spades. So does Bernie. How many times did you hear "Billionaires running the country," or "Healthcare for all," spoken that simply and emphatically in every tweet, every appearance on Meet the Press, every debate.
Both parties are in the middle of an earthquake. It will be interesting to see how it shakes out. People like Amy in the link are rising up. I think what the Dems and GOP have in common are the regular folk are sick of feeling that they're not represented.
Williamsmith
2-16-18, 9:28am
“Elizabeth Warren seems to be close, and Cory Booker.”
Catherine, the above will be soundly rejected by the electorate. Think farther out of the box. There must be a cult of personality coupled with a strong personal story , unconnected to the Democratic machine in DC..... can you imagine a candidate like John Kennedy reincarnate pushing a progressive agenda? I can but that person remains to be revealed.
“Elizabeth Warren seems to be close, and Cory Booker.”
can you imagine a candidate like John Kennedy reincarnate pushing a progressive agenda? I can but that person remains to be revealed.
Cool! Are you running, Williamsmith? ;)
I think it's about even odds that a progressive insurgency of some sort within the Democratic Party could be the salvation of the Republicans.
We could see a doubling down on the class war/identity politics thing with a Kamala Harris or Cory Booker type candidate, which hasn't sold all that well over the recent past, and may even have helped spawn the odd Trumpian ethno-nationalism we're seeing right now. I don't think most of the country is all that interested at this point.
We could also see a wonderfully simple barrage of promises of soaking the rich and free stuff through a Sanders-style cargo cult campaign. That has worked at some points in the past. But we live in a more cynical age than when FDR pulled it off, and there's no guarantee that people won't be looking for the catch.
I don't believe that the voters are primed to worship in yet another style of personality cult. I think it very likely they are sickening of that sort of drama-based politics after the past twenty years or so. I suspect that a dull, colorless manager-style candidate could do very well against a charismatic aspiring messiah of any political stripe. Maybe a Mitt Romney.
I think there will be a reaction against Trump in 2018 and possibly 2020; although his poll numbers have been strangely improving lately. But I don't think that will necessarily mean the time is right for a lurch to the left. If the Democrats promise Utopia, people may fear they'll get Venezuela.
Of course, I've been wrong before. I thought Rubio had a shot.
iris lilies
2-16-18, 10:58am
I think it's about even odds that a progressive insurgency of some sort within the Democratic Party could be the salvation of the Republicans.....
I am loving the mainstream media’s absolute obsession with the Rob Porter story. They are so good at driving Trump supporters further into the fold. Really, they are their own worst enemy for pumping up Trump.
Dear Rachal Maddow and Co.: no one CARES what Porter did, what the President knew about what he did, and what You all think of it. While it is juicy that The Prez may have had a “date” with Stormy Weather or whatever her name is, no one puts importance on the matter. Didnt we lean with horndog Bill that it really does not matter what he does with his p.e.n.i.s., Hillary showed us that.
Williamsmith, you are wrong about one thing--Bernie is extremely charismatic. I base that on seeing him in person and hearing him speak. I can think of no more charismatic candidate, certainly not Elizabeth Warren. He is genuine, smart, and cares deeply about people--he is also quite magnetic.
I was surprised by this, when I saw him in person.
I am loving the mainstream media’s absolute obsession with the Rob Porter story. They are so good at driving Trump supporters further into the fold. Really, they are their own worst enemy for pumping up Trump.
Dear Rachal Maddow and Co.: no one CARES what Porter did, what the President knew about what he did, and what You all think of it. While it is juicy that The Prez may have had a “date” with Stormy Weather or whatever her name is, no one puts importance on the matter. Didnt we lean with horndog Bill that it really does not matter what he does with his p.e.n.i.s., Hillary showed us that.
I agree that Trumps sexual exploits are no one's business but the people's involved, but I heartily disagree about Porter and the ragtag bunch of misanthropes, incompetents, and white supremacists he's installed in the White House. A security clearance is no small thing, and serial wife beaters don't deserve a place in the highest circles of government.
A security clearance is no small thing....
It was just a few years ago when Hillary's maid was routinely printing off classified documents and delivering them. Of course I jest, it really was a big deal for lots of us, but I find solace in the difference between an interim clearance and a cursory pre-employment background check.
It was just a few years ago when Hillary's maid was routinely printing off classified documents and delivering them. Of course I jest, it really was a big deal for lots of us, but I find solace in the difference between an interim clearance and a cursory pre-employment background check.
Bradley Manning, Edward Snowden and Mrs. Clinton pretty much destroyed my faith in security clearances.
I did some research, and found no evidence of Clinton or her aide disseminating classified emails. I saw a Breitbart headline during my search, so I assume that's where this comes from. I also found that among some levels of classification, rules were elastic, and often the subject of debate. From the Huffington Post:
"Media sometimes erroneously refer to Clinton as having shared classified documents. This is not something she is accused of. It is extremely difficult to share a classified document electronically over email. Most government agencies, including the State Department, maintain separate systems precisely to make it all but impossible to electronically pass information between classified and unclassified systems."
I did some research, and found no evidence of Clinton or her aide disseminating classified emails. I saw a Breitbart headline during my search, so I assume that's where this comes from. I also found that among some levels of classification, rules were elastic, and often the subject of debate. From the Huffington Post:
"Media sometimes erroneously refer to Clinton as having shared classified documents. This is not something she is accused of. It is extremely difficult to share a classified document electronically over email. Most government agencies, including the State Department, maintain separate systems precisely to make it all but impossible to electronically pass information between classified and unclassified systems."
https://nypost.com/2016/11/06/clinton-directed-her-maid-to-print-out-classified-materials/
As secretary of state, Hillary Clinton routinely asked her maid to print out sensitive government emails and documents — including ones containing classified information — from her house in Washington, DC, emails and FBI memos show. But the housekeeper lacked the security clearance to handle such material......
Santos also had access to a highly secure room called an SCIF (sensitive compartmented information facility) that diplomatic security agents set up at Whitehaven, according to FBI notes from an interview with Abedin.From within the SCIF, Santos — who had no clearance — “collected documents from the secure facsimile machine for Clinton,” the FBI notes revealed.
Just how sensitive were the papers Santos presumably handled? The FBI noted Clinton periodically received the Presidential Daily Brief — a top-secret document prepared by the CIA and other US intelligence agencies — via the secure fax....
https://nypost.com/2016/11/06/clinton-directed-her-maid-to-print-out-classified-materials/
As secretary of state, Hillary Clinton routinely asked her maid to print out sensitive government emails and documents — including ones containing classified information — from her house in Washington, DC, emails and FBI memos show. But the housekeeper lacked the security clearance to handle such material......
Santos also had access to a highly secure room called an SCIF (sensitive compartmented information facility) that diplomatic security agents set up at Whitehaven, according to FBI notes from an interview with Abedin.From within the SCIF, Santos — who had no clearance — “collected documents from the secure facsimile machine for Clinton,” the FBI notes revealed.
Just how sensitive were the papers Santos presumably handled? The FBI noted Clinton periodically received the Presidential Daily Brief — a top-secret document prepared by the CIA and other US intelligence agencies — via the secure fax....
And now, Trump gets a severely dumbed-down PDF that any one of a number of people without a security clearance (Jared Kushner, et al) can peruse.
And now, Trump gets a severely dumbed-down PDF that any one of a number of people without a security clearance (Jared Kushner, et al) can peruse.
The President has the ability to use discretion and de-classify just about anything to suit his purpose. Otherwise how would he share information with the Vice President or Speaker of The House or any other elected official as they are not required to obtain a security clearance.
If we examine all the media's hot takes designed for outrage in a critical light, we'd likely be disappointed that our biases aren't adequately confirmed.
Also, the idea that Clinton was having her "maid" do clerical work is laughable to me--even if she had a "maid," which I doubt. Snopes didn't find much evidence to support this tale https://www.snopes.com/hillary-clinton-regularly-had-her-maid-print-classified-documents/
After all the fables surrounding Clinton (She murdered Vince Foster! She was running a child sex-slave ring out of a pizza parlor! Benghazi was all her fault!), forgive me if I don't rise to Wikileaks' (pro-Russian) bait. To hear the Right tell it, she probably kidnapped the Lindbergh baby and was instrumental in the Manson family killings. In reality, she was likely just a seasoned politician who made the mistake of being a woman and a Democrat.
But we live in a more cynical age than when FDR pulled it off, and there's no guarantee that people won't be looking for the catch.
Well the recent tax cut got through despite the catch that our kids will pay killer interest on a huge deficit, even if they even get to keep the lower rates when they expire.
Please not Cory Booker who rose by gutting public schools to enrich charter school companies.
Gardenarian
2-17-18, 2:20am
I sincerely wish that progressives would revive the Democratic party!
After all the mysogyny and nonsense of the last election, I think their best chance is to but in a white guy with a military background and a subtly socialist message. Oregon Senator Jeff Merkley would make a great candidate, IMHO.
Could we please stop talking about Clinton? She lost, she's not coming back ...just friggin drop it already.
Could we please stop talking about Clinton? She lost, she's not coming back ...just friggin drop it already.
We can't. She's like the monster in a slasher film franchise. She keeps coming back. I wouldn't be surprised to hear she was stalking super delegates or corrupting innocent investment bankers even now.
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