My zip code is less than pleased (Trump related post)

[gimmethesimplelife]

Yesterday's news that Trump wants to place the US military along the US/Mexico border did not go over well in the 85006. There are numerous takes on this but the dominant one (interestingly enough it's also my main objection) is US Military Culture (similar to US Cop Culture) and how it instills an US vs. THEM mentality - innocent Mexican nationals are going to end out killed due to US Military Culture.

Furthermore, having US Military on the border might put affordable medical and dental across the border at risk. I worry about domestic terrorism in the US in the event that this safety valve is brutally cut off to those who desperately need it.

I don't have the answers but from what I'm seeing? More and more people are going to see America in a less than flattering light as Donald Trump's proposals here may very well get innocent Mexican nationals killed and may also result in US deaths due to lack of access to affordable health care. Is the government really unable to grasp basic common sense at this level? Really a cause for concern here.

I'm hoping cooler heads prevail and human life is spared via NOT sending the US Military to the border. Rob

[dmc]

But wouldn’t deterring the illegals from crossing into the US be a good thing for them. They obviously don’t know how bad it is here and aren’t getting info from the 85006. They then wouldn’t have to get here and then find out they have to flee.

And I’m sure Mexico is not going to stop the flow of dollars coming from the US so your cheap dental care will be safe.

[Teacher Terry]

rob, after watching the news last night I think we are getting much closer to impeaching Trump which is a good thing. The military is only allowed to do certain tasks and can't arrest people, etc.

[Alan]

The military is only allowed to do certain tasks and can't arrest people, etc.That's not exactly true. Posse Comitatus applies only to Federal troops. The Army or Air National Guards can detain and arrest when under the control of the various states, nor is the Coast Guard forbidden to make arrests at any time.

[Teacher Terry]

Hopefully, the governors of those states will refuse to send in guard troops.

[bae]

Should the USA have borders?

[Alan]

Hopefully, the governors of those states will refuse to send in guard troops.I believe there may also be an exclusion enabling Federal troops to enforce Federal Law, which covers all Immigration law.

[LDAHL]

Yesterday's news that Trump wants to place the US military along the US/Mexico border did not go over well in the 85006. There are numerous takes on this but the dominant one (interestingly enough it's also my main objection) is US Military Culture (similar to US Cop Culture) and how it instills an US vs. THEM mentality - innocent Mexican nationals are going to end out killed due to US Military Culture.

Furthermore, having US Military on the border might put affordable medical and dental across the border at risk. I worry about domestic terrorism in the US in the event that this safety valve is brutally cut off to those who desperately need it.

I don't have the answers but from what I'm seeing? More and more people are going to see America in a less than flattering light as Donald Trump's proposals here may very well get innocent Mexican nationals killed and may also result in US deaths due to lack of access to affordable health care. Is the government really unable to grasp basic common sense at this level? Really a cause for concern here.

I'm hoping cooler heads prevail and human life is spared via NOT sending the US Military to the border. Rob

So you feel that a barrier to medical and dental tourism would result in a wave of domestic terrorism?

And that there is a "military culture" that can be counted on to slaughter innocents attempting to infiltrate our borders?

And that people who do not believe these things have a loose grasp on "basic common sense"?

[LDAHL]

I believe there may also be an exclusion enabling Federal troops to enforce Federal Law, which covers all Immigration law.

I think Eisenhower cited that when he deployed the 101st Airborne to Little Rock in the fifties.

[iris lilies]

But wouldn’t deterring the illegals from crossing into the US be a good thing for them. They obviously don’t know how bad it is here and aren’t getting info from the 85006. They then wouldn’t have to get here and then find out they have to flee.

And I’m sure Mexico is not going to stop the flow of dollars coming from the US so your cheap dental care will be safe.

That is an interesting perspective. I had not considered the OP’s lack of respect and empathy for
immigrants in coming to this country. One would think he would support lawful actions to keep those poor people out of this terrible country. I mean, not wanting them to experience the terror of this country is only right and just.

[flowerseverywhere]

Yesterday's news that Trump wants to place the US military along the US/Mexico border did not go over well in the 85006. There are numerous takes on this but the dominant one (interestingly enough it's also my main objection) is US Military Culture (similar to US Cop Culture) and how it instills an US vs. THEM mentality - innocent Mexican nationals are going to end out killed due to US Military Culture.

Furthermore, having US Military on the border might put affordable medical and dental across the border at risk. I worry about domestic terrorism in the US in the event that this safety valve is brutally cut off to those who desperately need it.

I don't have the answers but from what I'm seeing? More and more people are going to see America in a less than flattering light as Donald Trump's proposals here may very well get innocent Mexican nationals killed and may also result in US deaths due to lack of access to affordable health care. Is the government really unable to grasp basic common sense at this level? Really a cause for concern here.

I'm hoping cooler heads prevail and human life is spared via NOT sending the US Military to the border. Rob

both Bush and Obama sent the national guard to defend the border. He ran and was partially elected on an anti-immigrant platform and he is fulfilling his campaign promises. He has done everything he can to build the wall, and is going to fulfill his promise one way or another. The plan is not to have soldiers sharpshooting and having a massacre.

Have you read any of the stories of people they have interviewed in the caravan? They seem amazed they are not going to be welcomed with open arms.

We have needed immigration reform for a long time. A patchwork of amnesty, deportations aggressive or lax ... it does not seem a very wise way to run a country.

[gimmethesimplelife]

My hat is truly off to Oregon Governor Kate Brown. Ms. Brown is not only against the militarization of the border but is point blank refusing to send ANY of Oregon's National Guard to the border. What a respectable woman! Though I don't know Ms. Brown's true motivations, the net effect is a high five for continued survival of innocent Mexican citizens (not murdered by undetected sociopaths in the US military) and the continued survival of American nationals unable to access affordable health care on the US side of the border (meaning that Ms. Brown's actions are a high five to continued ability of US Citizens to flee to Mexico for affordable health care so not as to be bankrupted in the US by insane US prices for such).

To me, Ms. Brown is not only a classy member of the Resistance but a true American hero that we as a society should be teaching our children to look up to. I'd go so far as to saying naming a street or two, a library or two, or perhaps an airport or two after her would be appropriate for her dedication to human rights and her respect for human rights as is evidenced by her refusal to knuckle under to the Unfit Orange One.

Just when you think there's no reason to hope, someone heroic like Ms. Brown comes along! Rob

[flowerseverywhere]

My hat is truly off to Oregon Governor Kate Brown. Ms. Brown is not only against the militarization of the border but is point blank refusing to send ANY of Oregon's National Guard to the border. What a respectable woman! Though I don't know Ms. Brown's true motivations, the net effect is a high five for continued survival of innocent Mexican citizens (not murdered by undetected sociopaths in the US military) and the continued survival of American nationals unable to access affordable health care on the US side of the border (meaning that Ms. Brown's actions are a high five to continued ability of US Citizens to flee to Mexico for affordable health care so not as to be bankrupted in the US by insane US prices for such).

To me, Ms. Brown is not only a classy member of the Resistance but a true American hero that we as a society should be teaching our children to look up to. I'd go so far as to saying naming a street or two, a library or two, or perhaps an airport or two after her would be appropriate for her dedication to human rights and her respect for human rights as is evidenced by her refusal to knuckle under to the Unfit Orange One.

Just when you think there's no reason to hope, someone heroic like Ms. Brown comes along! Rob

i think that the country you are looking for may be Utopia. Obviously there is a reason you are not living in Mexico with it’s cheap medical and dental care. Why not move there?
each country in Europe, Asia etc have excellent points, and even the most idyllic have bad ones. I honestly don’t think you are going to find what you are looking for on this planet.

[Teacher Terry]

I was hoping that the governors would refuse to send the Guard units. No I don't think the military is looking for civilians to slaughter but in a heightened state things can go bad fast. Looking back at some of the times the military ended up killing civilians during the 60's when large numbers of people were protesting. Even though Trump is being advised to not do the interview with Mueller his ego is so big that I am hoping he does it. If he does that will be his downfall because he lies so much I doubt he even knows when he is doing it. Mueller is much smarter then Trump.

[gimmethesimplelife]

I was hoping that the governors would refuse to send the Guard units. No I don't think the military is looking for civilians to slaughter but in a heightened state things can go bad fast. Looking back at some of the times the military ended up killing civilians during the 60's when large numbers of people were protesting. Even though Trump is being advised to not do the interview with Mueller his ego is so big that I am hoping he does it. If he does that will be his downfall because he lies so much I doubt he even knows when he is doing it. Mueller is much smarter then Trump.And I agree with you, TT. I also don't believe the military is looking for innocent civilians to slaughter per se - I believe it's much more Military Culture and how it doesn't work in the civilian world and more people willing to stand up to this often inappropriate and hostile culture and as you stated, TT, things can go wrong fast under these conditions......especially with the military perceiving a free pass to any of their actions, as American Police assume they will always have.

I've been meaning to ask you - what did you see on the news the other night that led you to believe Trump would soon be impeached? I can use some hope in my day! Rob

[Alan]

I also don't believe the military is looking for innocent civilians to slaughter per se - I believe it's much more Military Culture and how it doesn't work in the civilian world and more people willing to stand up to this often inappropriate and hostile culture and as you stated, TT, things can go wrong fast under these conditions......especially with the military perceiving a free pass to any of their actions, as American Police assume they will always have.

Having a lifelong background in both of the "cultures" you hate so much, I find your frequent mis-characterizations insulting. Just thought you should know.

[gimmethesimplelife]

Having a lifelong background in both of the "cultures" you hate so much, I find your frequent mis-characterizations insulting. Just thought you should know.Alan, my take is that we live in very different countries - I find it amazing that technically we could enter each other's country without having to produce a passport and deal with border agents - the differences between your country and my country are that pronounced and in-your-face obvious. I won't disrespect your country per se but I will say - imagine if you held citizenship in my country and not yours - and imagine if you had the experiences with US police and military that characterize what citizens of my country have typically endured. You'd be singing a very different tune. I suppose the opposite holds true, too, though - though I won't be appearing in your country very often and only for short periods of time.

At any rate, my characterizations of both the US police and the US military hold true in my country if not yours.....a fact you can't discuss away and a fact that is not going to go away. I guess the good here, the silver lining? More and more people in my country are standing up to the police and to a lesser extent the military - another trend I don't see abating any time soon - and a good thing, too. Rob

[Alan]

'In your head' and 'Reality' are not two different countries. They may be states, but they're states of mind.

[Teacher Terry]

All of my husbands have served in the military and 1 in Vietnam during the war. I had a few good friends die there. My step-son is career military and I am very proud of him. I believe that many cops are honorable. However, incidents of unarmed black men being killed can't be ignored. Being a cop has gotten increasingly dangerous due to a more violent society. So in response some are becoming more trigger happy. Too bad that the ones who are afraid all the time do not find a different job. I also think both the military and police have always attracted some psychopaths that like to have control over others. Hence this is why the police use psychological tests to try to screen out these people before hiring. As a society we must not turn a blind eye but work towards a solution.

[flowerseverywhere]

And I agree with you, TT. I also don't believe the military is looking for innocent civilians to slaughter per se - I believe it's much more Military Culture and how it doesn't work in the civilian world and more people willing to stand up to this often inappropriate and hostile culture and as you stated, TT, things can go wrong fast under these conditions......especially with the military perceiving a free pass to any of their actions, as American Police assume they will always have.

I've been meaning to ask you - what did you see on the news the other night that led you to believe Trump would soon be impeached? I can use some hope in my day! Rob

Perhaps you could ask not to have police come near your neighborhood and see how that works out. Would you feel safer? Everyone would police themselves, there would be no drugs, rape, assault or theft? Good luck with that.

you are not correct that American Military and police perceive they have a free pass to their actions. You can have a bad waiter, doctor, policeman, or soldier but that does not make all of them bad.

For Trump to be impeached there has to be an impeachable offense. If there was a truly impeachable offense it would be plastered all over the media and Internet. I really hate is name calling and ridiculous tweets, as well as some of his policies. Especially environmental. But not liking someone’s idiotic behavior is not going to impeach a president.

[Teacher Terry]

Rob, that Trump is considering doing an interview with Mueller against advice. He is not the target but a subject of the investigation. Of course that could change fast once he incriminates himself during an interview.

[gimmethesimplelife]

Rob, that Trump is considering doing an interview with Mueller against advice. He is not the target but a subject of the investigation. Of course that could change fast once he incriminates himself during an interview.Ay Carumba, on the one hand I'm glad he's handing himself rope with which to hang himself, on the other I'm absolutely amazed that his ego is so big that he can't see that this is an unwise path for him to walk down....did America truly vote in a 70-ish man lacking the common sense to see something this obvious and this relevant to political survival? It's like Trump expects an automatic free pass, too - and I'm not liking myself very much at the moment as with all my Resistance Activities I have not seen how much he expects an automatic free pass until this very moment.........I can't blame others for not seeing this if it's taken me this long to see it as someone absolutely repulsed by the man. Rob

[Teacher Terry]

It has been all over the news the past 2 nights. I have my hopes up:))

[gimmethesimplelife]

It has been all over the news the past 2 nights. I have my hopes up:))Me too! I'd so like to see the joyous day of the man being kicked out of office and kicked to the curb unceremoniously as a (wealthy)has-been. Rob

[LDAHL]

Having a lifelong background in both of the "cultures" you hate so much, I find your frequent mis-characterizations insulting. Just thought you should know.

“A gentleman will not insult me, and no man not a gentleman can insult me.”

Some of the best people I ever knew I met during my military service. I formed friendships I cherish to this day. It was in many ways my finest hour.

It is a source of pride for me that I spent several years preserving the right for my countrymen to hold any opinion, however poorly informed or malicious.

[Alan]

“A gentleman will not insult me, and no man not a gentleman can insult me.”
Rob shouldn't expect everyone he mis-characterizes to be as polite as you or I, some of them may be liberals. ;)

[bae]

did America truly vote in a 70-ish man...

You might find this helpful in your new managerial role....

https://img.yumpu.com/47862203/1/358x507/tackling-age-discrimination-in-the-workplace.jpg?quality=85

[gimmethesimplelife]

You might find this helpful in your new managerial role....

https://img.yumpu.com/47862203/1/358x507/tackling-age-discrimination-in-the-workplace.jpg?quality=85The point? At his age and with his level of life experience, he should know better. Hillary would have known better had she been elected......Rob

[gimmethesimplelife]

Rob shouldn't expect everyone he mis-characterizes to be as polite as you or I, some of them may be liberals. ;)Once again, Alan, we truly do not live in the same country even if it is legally and geographically so. In my country, my characterizations are dead on and common knowledge and over 90% universally held. Rob

[LDAHL]

The point? At his age and with his level of life experience, he should know better. Hillary would have known better had she been elected......Rob

That’s true. Nobody could dodge a question like Hillary.

[LDAHL]

Once again, Alan, we truly do not live in the same country even if it is legally and geographically so. In my country, my characterizations are dead on and common knowledge and over 90% universally held. Rob

If it’s your country, why not make it 100%?

[flowerseverywhere]

Once again, Alan, we truly do not live in the same country even if it is legally and geographically so. In my country, my characterizations are dead on and common knowledge and over 90% universally held. Rob

so no one in your zip code joins or served in the military or police department? If you had representation in both Maybe changes could be changed more to your liking. My ultra conservative pro Trump neighbor was drafted into Vietnam and slogged through the swamps. Another very liberal neighbor was drafted into Vietnam and was support for air strikes. I respect both tremendously. Hard working good people. I know several retired police who are good, honest people but I do not know their views.

Maybe you you need to move.

[jp1]

Maybe everyone needs to read a book I recently read. American nations: the history of the eleven rival regional cultures of north america. https://www.amazon.com/American-Nations-History-Regional-Cultures/dp/0670022969/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1522987226&sr=8-1&keywords=american+nations

It provides a lot of insight into why we all view people from other parts of the US to be from a different planet. One of the key points of the book, none of us are going to change our perspective. But maybe understanding why others have such a different perspective would be a good start towards figuring out how to work together for the benefit of all. Or maybe we could just keep shouting past each other...

[ToomuchStuff]

My hat is truly off to Oregon Governor Kate Brown. Ms. Brown is not only against the militarization of the border but is point blank refusing to send ANY of Oregon's National Guard to the border. Rob

Since I haven't seen this bill, and all I have seen is Trump said he was going to use the military to defend our boarder. A boarder goes all around this country and loosely two sides are water. So wouldn't Oregon's national guard be guarding the part of the border it is closest to; Canada?

[Alan]

So wouldn't Oregon's national guard be guarding the part of the border it is closest to; Canada?
As far as I know it's a moot point as no one has asked Oregon to provide National Guard troops. Virtue signaling is a 24x7 job for politicians.

I'm surprised by the short memory people have, were they complaining when Clinton sent National Guard troops to the border in the 90's, or when Obama did the same in 2010? Maybe, but I don't recall it.

[LDAHL]

Maybe everyone needs to read a book I recently read. American nations: the history of the eleven rival regional cultures of north america. https://www.amazon.com/American-Nations-History-Regional-Cultures/dp/0670022969/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1522987226&sr=8-1&keywords=american+nations

It provides a lot of insight into why we all view people from other parts of the US to be from a different planet. One of the key points of the book, none of us are going to change our perspective. But maybe understanding why others have such a different perspective would be a good start towards figuring out how to work together for the benefit of all. Or maybe we could just keep shouting past each other...

I thought that was a pretty good book, when the author got out of the way of his East Coast Liberal biases.

Also appropriate to this conversation might be Hard America Soft America, which contrasts the differences between our more competitive, no-excuse subcultures with our everyone-gets-a-trophy subcultures.

https://www.amazon.com/Hard-America-Soft-Competition-Coddling/dp/1400053064