Trump's latest not going over well in my neighborhood.....

[gimmethesimplelife]

Apparently there is a huge caravan of 4,000 plus folks that have fled Honduras for the United States and have traveled through Guatemala and are approaching the Mexican border with Guatemala. Trump has tweeted this morning with a threat to send the military to the US Border to close the border with Mexico if Mexico does not intercede to stop the flow.

Where the issues arise is the number of US Citizen deaths that will take place with a sealed US/Mexico border....how many people desperately needing health care will die due to lack of access in the US and affordable health care not being available in Mexico if the border is indeed sealed. I consider a form of indirect murder on Trump's part, should he carry out his threat. How can one ever forgive America for this - people dying due to lack of access to affordable health care in the US, used as mere political pawns and denied access to affordable Mexican health care (should the threat be carried out, as of this writing it's a threat only). Why does Trump so horrendously care so little for the lower classes in America?

And those who have as of yet not lived in fear of America - this all will escape them until they lose their status/slot in the middle class or above......uggggggggggggghhhhhhh. All I can say is we can't close the border - people are not willing to play the role of victim to this country like they used to be. I'm really scared for what may happen if Trump carries out this threat. Stay tuned, this could be a real lesson as to the true nature of the United States and how little American citizen life means to American society. I watch with fear but yet with some interest, having learned that which I am posting about years ago. Rob

[bae]

Why does the caravan not stop in Guatemala and resettle? Or Mexico? Or perhaps they could go up to Canada?

Why does the US have to take them?

Is there something wrong with a country having borders?

[iris lilies]

Oh rob, really.

Yawn.

[LDAHL]

I may be wrong, but I don’t see stepped up border enforcement inconveniencing medical tourism as a pivotal moment in history.

[CathyA]

There are issues on one side that I agree with, and some on the other side (conserv vs dem).

But I do feel like we're not here to save everyone. We're not here to give less care to citizens who are already here, so that we can take care of the whole world.

I know it's hard being human, in that many of us have compassion for lots of different people. But seriously..........where does it stop, letting so many people come here?

Even though I feel this way, I do think Trump is an ass and I don't like wanting things he wants.....At least not in the way he carries them out.

Life can suck for many Rob. But at what point does a country decide to save everyone, while already neglecting the citizens who have been here a long time? (Poverty, health, education, etc., etc.)

If we let everyone in who wants in, what's in store for all of us in the future?

I feel it's pretty unrealistic for people to think we can endlesslessly let in everyone. Yes, it's all very sad. But we need to consider all those who are already here and have been here a long time. It's not an elitist notion. If you were in charge of the border and let everyone in, then trying to work everything out all over the country as to who gets what care, and what is fair and isn't, you might develop a different perspective.

I feel that it is very rational and reasonable to limit who comes in. Sad, yes. Tragic, yes. But life isn't always fair.

[gimmethesimplelife]

There are issues on one side that I agree with, and some on the other side (conserv vs dem).

But I do feel like we're not here to save everyone. We're not here to give less care to citizens who are already here, so that we can take care of the whole world.

I know it's hard being human, in that many of us have compassion for lots of different people. But seriously..........where does it stop, letting so many people come here?

Even though I feel this way, I do think Trump is an ass and I don't like wanting things he wants.....At least not in the way he carries them out.

Life can suck for many Rob. But at what point does a country decide to save everyone, while already neglecting the citizens who have been here a long time? (Poverty, health, education, etc., etc.)

If we let everyone in who wants in, what's in store for all of us in the future?

I feel it's pretty unrealistic for people to think we can endlesslessly let in everyone. Yes, it's all very sad. But we need to consider all those who are already here and have been here a long time. It's not an elitist notion. If you were in charge of the border and let everyone in, then trying to work everything out all over the country as to who gets what care, and what is fair and isn't, you might develop a different perspective.

I feel that it is very rational and reasonable to limit who comes in. Sad, yes. Tragic, yes. But life isn't always fair.Hi Cathy......I'm thinking maybe my OP was unclear. My issue is not with the fate of the Hondurans coming this way but of American citizens dying due to the US/Mexican border potentially being sealed - people dying due the nightmare lack of affordable health care in the US and due to affordable health care being sealed off in Mexico, were the border to be truly sealed. I am not posting here of the fate of the 4,000 migrants coming this way - I'm not entirely sure where I stand on this, anyway. Once again, I refer to US citizens dying due to lack of access to health care in the US - and entry to Mexico potentially being sealed off to save human life via Mexican health care.

Not an issue the liberal US media is willing to tackle, but it's my first thought after Trump's threat to seal off the border. How many Americans are going to die now as human life means so little in America as is evidenced by the lack of socialized medicine for all. That's my gist/point. But I also agree with you that we can't save the entire world, also...…..Rob

[gimmethesimplelife]

I may be wrong, but I don’t see stepped up border enforcement inconveniencing medical tourism as a pivotal moment in history.Were you sick and unable to access health care in the United States, you'd quickly be singing another tune. What is it with Americans being so unable to place themselves in the shoes of another? I'll never figure that out...…...Rob

[gimmethesimplelife]

Oh rob, really.

Yawn.Be grateful you are in a financial position to so cavalierly yawn, IL. I mean this with no snark but here's a newsflash....not all Americans can so cavalierly yawn.....to some scattered individuals out there this is a life and death issue clearly showing how little human life means in America. Want proof? US citizens deaths due to a sealed border denying desperate Americans access to Mexican health care suffices for me and the rest of my neighborhood - no need to once again state the zip code at this late date. Rob

[CathyA]

Thanks for clarifying that Rob. Sorry I misunderstood.
But......and maybe I'm just unaware.........does a "sealed border" mean that U.S. citizens can't go to Mexico either?

[gimmethesimplelife]

[QUOTE=bae;311786]Why does the caravan not stop in Guatemala and resettle? Or Mexico? Or perhaps they could go up to Canada?

Why does the US have to take them?

Is there something wrong with a country having borders?[/QUOTEI never said the US should take them, Bae. My post concerns only the potential for affordable health care across the border being sealed off to US citizens which of course will result in deaths of US citizens as America truly could care less if we live or die.....unless one has lots and lots of money. I don't, and I live in a border state, and I know this country for what it is so of course this is a huge issue to me, literally larger than life.

As to the fate of the Hondurans on the run, I am 50/50 on this and will need to think it over more before I post regarding such. Rob

[gimmethesimplelife]

Thanks for clarifying that Rob. Sorry I misunderstood.
But......and maybe I'm just unaware.........does a "sealed border" mean that U.S. citizens can't go to Mexico either?Thank You, Cathy. And from what I understand, the answer to your question would be a two way seal, meaning that we as US citizens would be auto-denied entry to Mexico, too....hence the reason why this issue is so large and compelling to yours truly. Rob

[dmc]

Better grab those bags and flee while you can.

[dmc]

And who are all these people with life threatening illness who are not on Obama care or Medicaid? But they have the money to pay for treatment in Mexico.

[Teacher Terry]

So I was curious and looked it up and many people go to Mexico for treatment because their deductibles are so high that it is much cheaper to do so. They said millions do so every year. Also some people have no providers in their local area on the ACA so have decided not to buy it.

[dmc]

So they are doing it to save money, I understand, but it’s not because they can’t get care here.

[dmc]

Also aren’t those who chose not to buy insurance breaking the rules. Arnt the poor getting subsidies to buy insurance?

[Teacher Terry]

If a family has a 6k deductible and the average family of 4 makes 50k/year they can’t afford to use their health insurance making it worthless.

[CathyA]

Back to my question........."Closing the border"........does that mean U.S. citizens can't go to Mexico either?

[Alan]

Back to my question........."Closing the border"........does that mean U.S. citizens can't go to Mexico either?Along with everyone else in the world, I don't know any details of this idea, but I would assume that existing ports of entry would be maintained, Rob's assumptions notwithstanding.

[CathyA]

Thanks Alan.

[Teacher Terry]

So I did some research and trump can close the border and not allow citizens to go to Mexico. 2 presidents have done it to get what they wanted from Mexico. However, most believe it is just a ploy to rile his base up before the election. Doing so would really hurt the US economy especially the 4 bordering states. Rob, worries about stuff that is unlikely to happen.

[JaneV2.0]

So I did some research and trump can close the border and not allow citizens to go to Mexico. 2 presidents have done it to get what they wanted from Mexico. However, most believe it is just a ploy to rile his base up before the election. Doing so would really hurt the US economy especially the 4 bordering states. Rob, worries about stuff that is unlikely to happen.

Yeah--but this president is a whole new phenomenon. He's testing boundaries all the time in his quest to be a "strongman" like his pals Putin, Kim, Duterte, Erdogan, Salman and any other dictator I may not have mentioned. I would put nothing, nothing past him.

[Teacher Terry]

That’s true Jane. I really miss having a president that knows how to speak among many things. It is painful and embarrassing to listen to him talk. He had people cheering him on when he spoke the other day praising the congressman that shoved a journalist. What is wrong with people?

[gimmethesimplelife]

That’s true Jane. I really miss having a president that knows how to speak among many things. It is painful and embarrassing to listen to him talk. He had people cheering him on when he spoke the other day praising the congressman that shoved a journalist. What is wrong with people?Thank You for posting this, TT. On a purely humanitarian level strictly beyond mere politics I find Trumps praising the Congressman that shoved the journalist absolutely repulsive. I am so embarrassed to be an American - not only due to this unparralled (sp?) behavior from Trump, but also due to the fact that enough Americans voted this man in to make him President. Beyond the serious deficiencies with this citizenship given America's status as a "wealthy" (sarcasm intended due to hugely inequal wealth distribution) - what does this say about the American people overall for voting him in? Very scary. Just very very very scary. Rob

[gimmethesimplelife]

Yeah--but this president is a whole new phenomenon. He's testing boundaries all the time in his quest to be a "strongman" like his pals Putin, Kim, Duterte, Erdogan, Salman and any other dictator I may not have mentioned. I would put nothing, nothing past him.Jane, I agree here 100 percent and then some. I too would put nothing past the man. Rob

[gimmethesimplelife]

So I did some research and trump can close the border and not allow citizens to go to Mexico. 2 presidents have done it to get what they wanted from Mexico. However, most believe it is just a ploy to rile his base up before the election. Doing so would really hurt the US economy especially the 4 bordering states. Rob, worries about stuff that is unlikely to happen.TT, I hope you are right, I very much hope so. Something else beyond preventable US Citizen deaths were the border to be sealed and access to affordable, life-preserving health care in Mexico to be brutally cut off - what about our produce prices given that so much of our produce comes from Mexico these days? When those prices rise, who is going to give American workers a complimentary raise to make up for rising produce prices? Why do so few Americans realize/think about this?

I've never seen America in all my life to be as scary as it is now. Rob

[iris lilies]

H
TT, I hope you are right, I very much hope so. Something else beyond preventable US Citizen deaths were the border to be sealed and access to affordable, life-preserving health care in Mexico to be brutally cut off - what about our produce prices given that so much of our produce comes from Mexico these days? When those prices rise, who is going to give American workers a complimentary raise to make up for rising produce prices? Why do so few Americans realize/think about this?

I've never seen America in all my life to be as scary as it is now. Rob

As usual, I would like to know what constitutes the environment that will cause you to pick up your packed bags and flee?

Has it occurred to you that you are already the frog in the boiling pot?

[Teacher Terry]

I really hope that the Democrats find someone new to run against him. Not the same old people. We need new blood. As I have said before people couldn’t bring themselves to vote for a woman. People believed his lies. Although, some of those people are now sorry. I saw some farmers be interviewed about this.

[Teacher Terry]

Also in another WTF moment a congressman is speaking to inmates in treatment for substance abuse and starts telling them all his problems and how rough his life is. Republican of course. Can’t even pretend to care.

[Alan]

I really hope that the Democrats find someone new to run against him. Not the same old people. We need new blood. As I have said before people couldn’t bring themselves to vote for a woman. People believed his lies. What do the Democrats have against women?

[JaneV2.0]

I agree with the idea of new blood, even though I have the utmost respect for Warren, Sanders, Brown, and others, we need young people involved. I'd like to see O'Roarke, Harris, Merkley, Gabbard, and some of the many, many other solid potential candidates step up.

[LDAHL]

As I have said before people couldn’t bring themselves to vote for a woman.

They couldn’t bring themselves to vote for that woman, not a woman. I considered it in light of Trump’s loutishness, but in the end could not get past her many negatives.

[Alan]

As I have said before people couldn’t bring themselves to vote for a woman.


They couldn’t bring themselves to vote for that woman, not a woman. That's the line that got me too. I think we are being led to believe that gender trumps everything. There is no room in some peoples mind for non-gender/race based ideology or principles, which leads to the erroneous conclusion that anyone who did not vote for the female candidate did so for sexist reasons.

[LDAHL]

I agree with the idea of new blood, even though I have the utmost respect for Warren, Sanders, Brown, and others, we need young people involved. I'd like to see O'Roarke, Harris, Merkley, Gabbard, and some of the many, many other solid potential candidates step up.

The Democrats would certainly seem to have a wide variety of ideological and demographic choices this time around. It will be interesting to see what kind of party they want to be.

I read recently that Joe Biden was leading the pack in the polls with Bernie a fairly distant second. The rest were in single digit territory.

[Teacher Terry]

If you don’t think there is race and gender discrimination you are living in a cave. Harry Reid said good thing Obama was light skinned or he couldn’t have gotten elected. A lot of older people both men and women won’t vote for a woman . It’s also insulting to think that people don’t vote across party lines as you insinuate. I voted for our governor who is a Republican.

[LDAHL]

If you don’t think there is race and gender discrimination you are living in a cave.

The view from my cave was that Mrs. Clinton lost because she was a spectacularly awful campaigner, she alienated a sizable section of her own party during the primaries, she virtually ignored some states she needed to win, she superciliously insulted large numbers of the electorate and seemed to confuse fundraising with electioneering. She earned that loss in her own right.

[JaneV2.0]

The view from my cave was that Mrs. Clinton lost because she was a spectacularly awful campaigner, she alienated a sizable section of her own party during the primaries, she virtually ignored some states she needed to win, she superciliously insulted large numbers of the electorate and seemed to confuse fundraising with electioneering. She earned that loss in her own right.

I tend to agree with you about her lackluster campaigning--she's definitely not a natural flesh presser. But even with that, and the ever-present "anything but a woman" sentiment abroad, she still won the popular vote. Joe Biden was a good vice president, but I think his appeal comes from nostalgia for the Obama days. He's an old dog who has had his day.

[LDAHL]

I tend to agree with you about her lackluster campaigning--she's definitely not a natural flesh presser. But even with that, and the ever-present "anything but a woman" sentiment abroad, she still won the popular vote. Joe Biden was a good vice president, but I think his appeal comes from nostalgia for the Obama days. He's an old dog who has had his day.

She got more hits but fewer runs, so she lost. I personally don’t think that makes the loss illegitimate. I’d be curious as to why “anything but a woman” applies when “anything but a black” manifestly does not.

I agree the Democrats could do better than Mr. Biden from an electoral standpoint. Of course any number of weird and wonderful things could happen over the next couple of years.

[Teacher Terry]

Obama was a fabulous speaker and really connected with people. Note what Harry Reid said abut him in a previous post. Also he is a MAN! McCain picked a female moron for his running mate.

[Alan]

Harry Reid said good thing Obama was light skinned or he couldn’t have gotten elected.


Obama was a fabulous speaker and really connected with people. Note what Harry Reid said abut him in a previous post.
Harry Reid, like others of his ilk, never embraced the idea of judging people by their character rather than the color of their skin. Bill Clinton also famously told Ted Kennedy that just a few years ago, he (Obama) would be serving them coffee.

It's always bothered me that the popular leaders of a party calling themselves liberal could be so illiberal, but I guess it works for them, you can tell by the actions of their followers.

[Teacher Terry]

Glad to hear you men are getting some news in the cave:))

[gimmethesimplelife]

I'm just for basic human rights with socialized medicine.....America really doesn't have this offer it's citizens, and due to Internet, it's vulnerable to it's young bailing due to discovering these cold blooded facts and acting in their best interests....no BS or smoke and mirrors from EITHER side of the aisle is going to change this cold blooded reality.....something that schoolchildren in the 85006 (and I rather suspect other low income zip codes) know from a young age. No way to dance around this one....it's just cold blooded citizenship reality. Are you up to dealing with it? That's up to each of us on our own. Rob

[bae]

ROFL

[gimmethesimplelife]

ROFLI'd wager if your asset base were not so high, you would not be laughing and would understand...…..no biggie, millions of other Americans get this and the future is going to be interesting in this country to say the least....I've already got bailing plans and bags packed....can you say this, honestly? Rob

[bae]

I believe I have mentioned several times, Rob, honestly, that I have several exit plans, and have been working on them for years. I almost just moved to Norway 3 months ago, and almost took a job in Iceland a few months earlier. I understand the immigration process and requirements there, and have made efforts to learn the necessary languages, and to find employment.

But not because I'm afraid tanks will line the Mexican or Canadian borders and keep me from travelling there.

[gimmethesimplelife]

I believe I have mentioned several times, Rob, honestly, that I have several exit plans, and have been working on them for years. I almost just moved to Norway 3 months ago, and almost took a job in Iceland a few months earlier. I understand the immigration process and requirements there, and have made efforts to learn the necessary languages, and to find employment.

But not because I'm afraid tanks will line the Mexican or Canadian borders and keep me from travelling there.For what it's worth, Bae, I'm glad you have plans to get out. There truly is no hope nor future in America...…...the sound of the ticking debt clock should prove that to any non-believers, coupled with the priorities of the American government for spending. Truly there is no hope nor future here, but personally? I've known this since 1975 when I first say police brutality right in front of me (long before I ever set foot in the 85006 or ever heard of it)…..to me such knowledge is akin to knowing how many miles it is to Tucson or Flagstaff or the Mexican border......everyday basic fact and knowledge. No one had to tell me this - I am able to connect the dots on my own and figure this out for myself. Rob

[Alan]

I've known this since 1975 No one had to tell me this.....
…..I am able to connect the dots on my own and figure this out for myself. Rob
I think it much more likely that you were indoctrinated as a child and have never been able to overcome your training. Consider it.

[Teacher Terry]

Alan, we never agree but I think you are right. While much is wrong with our country there is no utopia but people will do anything to get here . We are a international family with my DIL from Poland and my SIL from Russia. There is much social injustice everywhere but I am grateful to be a American.