Recent statement of Trump's viewed as potential murder in the 85006 AND the 85016

[gimmethesimplelife]

In regards to the Migrant Caravan, Trump has stated that any migrant throwing rocks at the US military assembled at the border should be shot at as if they had shot a rifle and not thrown a rock. Yowsa, here's living proof how impossible the bridge is in America to cross. This was seen by many of my neighbors as inciting murder(s) of desperate people. Now for my part I don't know that we should accept the migrants - I'm very ambivalent on this one but if a migrant throws a rock at the military.....I say arrest, detain, and deport - NOT MURDER. To me this truly shows what America is all about (something I've known the very basics of at the age of 8, it's not hard to see and grasp these basics, at least it was not for me) and what it stands for and how little human life truly means in America.

Luckily for America, most Americans can't see this and lucky for the human race, most people not in America can see this for what it is as I can. What do you think? Free pass for inciting murder, was it inciting murder to begin with, and what should be done about this? In my perfect world I'd be for exiling him, with no possibility of return to the US as I see his words as treason to humanity. I realize this isn't going to happen - but what can happen and why is there no consequence for inciting murder? Is this what Americans truly want their country to be and what's in it for any American to be this way/accept this/believe like this? Once again, America defies any understanding, at least for me and for my friends, family, and neighbors, and get this, even some people I've spoken to in a neighboring higher income zip code (my straight male friends that I meet once a month - some guys I've kept in touch with that I met up with at my 30th high school reunion in 2014). Rob

[bae]

Throwing rocks can be viewed as the use of lethal force. I suppose it depends on the context.

[gimmethesimplelife]

Throwing rocks can be viewed as the use of lethal force. I suppose it depends on the context.I'll grant you that context does come into play a bit, bae, but I stand by my post. I don't believe throwing rocks justifies lethal force. And furthermore, should such transpire when and if the migrant caravan present itself at the border, there will be political and economic consequences for the US. Let us hope that the Dems taking the House thwart Trump enough that no one is murdered by the US military. Rob

[Alan]

I'll grant you that context does come into play a bit, bae, but I stand by my post. I don't believe throwing rocks justifies lethal force. It's not the act of throwing a rock that justifies the use of force, it's stopping an action that can result in serious bodily injury or death, which a well thrown rock or brick can definitely do.

[Tybee]

Rob, my understanding of what Bae was saying (correct me if I am wrong) is that throwing rocks is itself lethal force.
People get stoned to death still in many parts of the world.
Thus throwing rocks is using lethal force against someone else, in this case, the police and military.

[gimmethesimplelife]

Rob, my understanding of what Bae was saying (correct me if I am wrong) is that throwing rocks is itself lethal force.
People get stoned to death still in many parts of the world.
Thus throwing rocks is using lethal force against someone else, in this case, the police and military.Fair enough Tybee. I don't agree with rocks equating with lethal force. We could debate that for hours here but what really matters is the consequences if the US military truly is foolish enough to equate rocks with lethal force. I'm glad that there are numerous people around me who agree with me (I mean in my infamous zip code, no need to state it yet again lol) and that I've run across a few people - male even - that agree with me that live in a more upscale area and who one might guess were Conservatives. Matter of fact, two of them are Conservatives and they agree with me on this issue.....for one of them it was the Joe Arpaio fiasco that led him to see the military and police this way.

At any rate, I digress. I just hope the Dems taking back the House thwarts the US military by saving migrant lives from the US military - I find it hard to believe that on some level, Trump does not grasp that allowing the military to murder migrants will work against him as the Democrats will ruthlessly and relentlessly use such against him and the GOP and with much public support in doing so. Remains to be seen if Trump can handle reality at this level, I'll grant that much. Rob

[Alan]

I find it hard to believe that on some level, Trump does not grasp that allowing the military to murder migrants will work against him as the Democrats will ruthlessly and relentlessly use such against him and the GOP and with much public support in doing so. I think you spelled 'self defense' wrong.

[Teacher Terry]

Trump is a thug and wants to murder innocent people. Thankfully Nevada finally turned blue. First time in 22 years. But our population is becoming more educated with technology jobs coming and a educated work force with it. College educated people more likely to vote democrat and white people with a HS diploma or less likely to vote republican. Just read those stats and not surprised.

[gimmethesimplelife]

I think you spelled 'self defense' wrong.No snark here, Alan, ok? This is going to sound snarky but I really don't mean it, honest. My point after that? Murder in the English language is spelled M U R D E R and not S E L F D E F E N S E. Just sayin'. And there's a big difference between throwing a rock - nowhere near a guaranteed instrument of murder or even of injury - and a gun of some kind, which is a much more likely instrument of murder and/or injury. Trump can't see this, the US military can't see this, and many Americans can't see this. I am lucky to know many people who can grasp this and for this I am fortunate. I should go make a gratitude list with this at the top - that most of the people I know get this. Interesting how gratitude can spring forth from the most unlikely places, no? Rob

[gimmethesimplelife]

Trump is a thug and wants to murder innocent people. Thankfully Nevada finally turned blue. First time in 22 years. But our population is becoming more educated with technology jobs coming and a educated work force with it. College educated people more likely to vote democrat and white people with a HS diploma or less likely to vote republican. Just read those stats and not surprised.Given that I live in a purple state bordering Nevada, I'm glad to hear of Nevada turning blue. Rob

[Tybee]

Fair enough Tybee. I don't agree with rocks equating with lethal force. We could debate that for hours here but what really matters is the consequences if the US military truly is foolish enough to equate rocks with lethal force.



I think the US military has been many more places in the world than I have, and have witnessed folks being killed by having rocks thrown at them. How can you say it is foolish to know that throwing rocks at someone can result in the death of the victim--victim = person at whom rocks are thrown. Perp = rock thrower.

What is foolish about knowing that throwing rocks at someone is a time honored way to kill them?

[Alan]

Trump is a thug and wants to murder innocent people.Thank you! I was just pondering an accurate example of hyperbole. This fits nicely.

[Teacher Terry]

More than one person in the military has said that they would not fire on people throwing rocks. It would be a unlawful order and they would have to answer for their actions later. We are not Israel.

[Tybee]

Rob-- see article on how stoning people to death is used around the world:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stoning

[bae]

I think, Rob, once you educate yourself on the use of force, and mechanisms of trauma, perhaps you could have an informed discussion.

In the state I live in, WA, (and again depending on context), if someone were to throw a rock at me seriously, that would be the sort of attack that our laws would allow me to respond with lethal force to stop.

[LDAHL]

I guess one lurid fantasy deserves another.

[Yppej]

I don't believe throwing rocks justifies lethal force.

The nearest Israeli consulate for you is in Los Angeles. Scout out nearby hotels, because the Israeli military regularly shoots at rock throwers in places like the Gaza Strip and you need to get there often and protest. Look for a chain with a rewards program.

[Rogar]

I tend to think of the Kent State shootings as an example of unnecessary deaths by military forces that were egged on by politicians. There may have been a few rocks thrown. It's a bad idea to bring rocks to a gun fight.

[Tybee]

I tend to think of the Kent State shootings as an example of unnecessary deaths by military forces that were egged on by politicians. There may have been a few rocks thrown. It's a bad idea to bring rocks to a gun fight.

True.