View Full Version : Anyone else here just not down with Biden as the Dem 2020 Candidate?
gimmethesimplelife
1-1-20, 5:48pm
I've tried and tried and I just personally can not see Biden as a viable Democratic candidate against Trump. To me, I'm afraid of another Hillary/Trump type of election, with similar rhetoric minus certain issues (due to the fact that both Biden and Trump are male is what I am getting at here). Just nasty and I'm really not sure Biden is capable of holding his own against intense attacks of the caliber Trump will be dishing out (likely Trump will be the GOP candidate, can anyone realistically see the Senate impeaching him for real? I can't - the rule of law doesn't apply to individuals of Trump's status/net worth in America).
But I digress. Do any other DEMS or independents or shoot, even Conservatives hope it's NOT Biden that snags the Democratic Nomination? Rob
I hope it is someone else. Biden is dishonest and will do anything to win. In the past he plagiarized others' work to the point of even claiming his family worked in the coal mines when they did not. We need someone with integrity not Trump lite.
I agree. If Trump was able to beat up Hillary on the basis of Benghazi and the Email-gate, what would he do with Biden?? If Bush's campaign could make KERRY out to be the unpatriotic one with the Swift Boat thing, when BUSH was a draft-dodger and Kerry actually served, anything can and will happen to demonize Biden. Of course, all Dems are vulnerable, but Biden definitely has some baggage to be leveraged.
gimmethesimplelife
1-1-20, 6:20pm
I agree. If Trump was able to beat up Hillary on the basis of Benghazi and the Email-gate, what would he do with Biden?? If Bush's campaign could make KERRY out to be the unpatriotic one with the Swift Boat thing, when BUSH was a draft-dodger and Kerry actually served, anything can and will happen to demonize Biden. Of course, all Dems are vulnerable, but Biden definitely has some baggage to be leveraged.What amazes me, Catherine, is that Trump himself shares something with his former opponent Hillary Clinton: They both carry with them enough baggage to sink the Titanic. But somehow Trump is able to spin his baggage away, and enough American voters let him get away with this to their detriment. Sometimes I get riled up at American voters more than I do at Trump.....for being responsible to voting in this monster. Rob
What amazes me, Catherine, is that Trump himself shares something with his former opponent Hillary Clinton: They both carry with them enough baggage to sink the Titanic. But somehow Trump is able to spin his baggage away, and enough American voters let him get away with this to their detriment. Sometimes I get riled up at American voters more than I do at Trump.....for being responsible to voting in this monster. Rob
True, but Biden lacks the ability and the charisma to generate a cult following. That's the difference. My DH is going to vote for Trump again, probably (unless Bernie gets the Democratic nomination, which he won't but he should--he got 5 million individual donations in Q4, out-earning all the other Democratic candidates). DH believes that Trump is doing a great job, even though he admits he's a jerk. He believes you can be an a$$ and still be a good president. I think a lot of people feel that way.
I hope it is someone else. Biden is dishonest and will do anything to win. In the past he plagiarized others' work to the point of even claiming his family worked in the coal mines when they did not. We need someone with integrity not Trump lite.
Part of me would welcome a Trump/Biden contest. It would be a titanic battle between two of America’s most prodigious prevaricaters. Possibly just the emetic we need to purge our system of the worst excesses.
Teacher Terry
1-1-20, 6:53pm
I worry about any of the Democrats being able to beat Trump. I do think certain things work against candidates such as being female, gay, etc. Not everyone is open minded. The whole thing is incredibly depressing. When a Republican has won in the past that I didn’t like I stayed open to the possibility that I would change my mind. This thing inhabiting the White House doesn’t have one redeeming quality.
gimmethesimplelife
1-1-20, 7:41pm
I worry about any of the Democrats being able to beat Trump. I do think certain things work against candidates such as being female, gay, etc. Not everyone is open minded. The whole thing is incredibly depressing. When a Republican has won in the past that I didn’t like I stayed open to the possibility that I would change my mind. This thing inhabiting the White House doesn’t have one redeeming quality.He did sign the bill to make animal cruelty a Federal felony. I am grateful for that. But Hillary would have done the same ....and I agree with your referring to Trump as "this thing." Rob
This thing inhabiting the White House doesn’t have one redeeming quality.Sure he does, he brings out the very worst in Democrats and that's always entertaining. ;)
....and I agree with your referring to Trump as "this thing." Rob
See?
Teacher Terry
1-1-20, 8:11pm
Rob, you are correct the animal bill was good.
He's too old and tied into the structural problems with our government.
He did sign the bill to make animal cruelty a Federal felony. I am grateful for that. But Hillary would have done the same ....and I agree with your referring to Trump as "this thing." Rob
Why should animal cruelty be a federal matter?
iris lilies
1-2-20, 11:20am
Why should animal cruelty be a federal matter?
uh oh, you went and did it now Ollie.
Seriously, I wondered that myself. One answer is to provide uniform law across the land, but I dont know how state law varies.
Murder of humans is a State, not a Federal offense, with some exceptions. Why is animal abuse different?
Making a law against something doesnt make the bad thing go away. Making a law at the federal level doesn't make it more enforceable or even enforced at all. Law enforcement starts at the local level.
“A federal offense” sounds scary, but in actuality may be of little worry. Each day many federal offenses are committed in my neighborhood, mail theft. Not one thing is done about it.
ToomuchStuff
1-2-20, 11:25am
Murder of humans is a State, not a Federal offense, with some exceptions. Why is animal abuse different?
Making a law against something doesnt make the bad thing go away. Making a law at the federal level doesn't make it more enforceable or even enforced at all. Law enforcement starts at the local level.
Without seeing the actual law, I expect it is something so they can be charged at a federal level. (having other options)
For use against things such as interstate puppy mills, cock fighting rings, football players, etc. etc.
iris lilies
1-2-20, 11:28am
Without seeing the actual law, I expect it is something so they can be charged at a federal level. (having other options)
For use against things such as interstate puppy mills, cock fighting rings, football players, etc. etc. yes, maybe it is the “interstate” aspect that is key, I dont know.
”puppy mills” are entirely legal in our state. This law wont change that.
ApatheticNoMore
1-2-20, 11:32am
Biden excites noone, I have literally not seen a single Biden bumper sticker, lawn sign, t-shirt, seen a single Biden debate viewing party listed in local events, seen a single Biden group tabling anywhere (like the farmers market), nor met a single Biden supporter in real life. Should I count old Obama/Biden stickers from way back when, as those hidden but claimed to actually exist Biden supporters?
Yang has stickers and lawn signs out there (the lawn signs were in neighborhoods that can't possible need the 1k, the cars maybe could). I've even heard people volunteering for Tom Snyder though he has minimal chance having entered so late. High schoolers/college students are holding homemade signs on street corners for Bernie, noone doubts the enthusiasm is there. This is how much of a non-entity the "front runner" is, that noone seems to actually want him.
And he doesn't seem that sharp or sometimes even all there either (I'd blame age, but then maybe he never was).
Teacher Terry
1-2-20, 11:38am
I wish Biden had run last time. The last 4 years has not been kind to his mind and sharpness. I won’t even dignify the animal question with a answer. Until we shut down puppymills nationwide not a lot will change.
iris lilies
1-2-20, 11:53am
I wish Biden had run last time. The last 4 years has not been kind to his mind and sharpness. I won’t even dignify the animal question with a answer. Until we shut down puppymills nationwide not a lot will change.
Discussion of practical aspects of a law doesnt “dignify” either side of an issue. It is reasonable to discuss the pros and cons of a law. Rob brought it up, not me.
Teacher Terry
1-2-20, 11:55am
IL, actually I was responding to Ldahl.
iris lilies
1-2-20, 12:00pm
IL, actually I was responding to Ldahl.
Terry, I had the same question as Ldahl.
Teacher Terry
1-2-20, 12:44pm
I would think it’s easier to prosecute crimes federally when you have people doing illegal activities with animals and transporting them across state lines. Otherwise each state would have a different law for the same crimes.
I wish Biden had run last time. The last 4 years has not been kind to his mind and sharpness. I won’t even dignify the animal question with a answer. Until we shut down puppymills nationwide not a lot will change.
I’ll dignify your response with an answer. That’s the kind of guy I am.
I once read that in the beginning the only federal crimes were treason, counterfeiting and piracy. Basic sovereignty resided with the states for most purposes. I think it’s an intelligent practice to question any new encroachment of federal power over local governance.
I don’t think you need to be pro-cruelty to question the role of the federal government in that particular area.
I don’t think you need to be pro-cruelty to question the role of the federal government in that particular area.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wickard_v._Filburn
I would think it’s easier to prosecute crimes federally when you have people doing illegal activities with animals and transporting them across state lines. Otherwise each state would have a different law for the same crimes.Well then don't you think we should just do away with states and give the federal government total rule? Shouldn't the feds decide how much an hour of worker time in Pascagoula MS is worth and then force all employers everywhere to match it? Shouldn't they decide the property tax rates in every little burg to ensure everyone is paying enough? Shouldn't the Dept of Education replace school boards everywhere to ensure proper indoctrination during our children's crucial and most influential years? Shouldn't HUD replace zoning boards across the land to make sure no one has too much house?
We're already getting pretty close to letting the feds control every aspect of our health care so it's not much of a leap to grant them total authority over the means of production and output as well as what markets are allowed to exist and which must be banned (for the public good of course). I guess the question is, do you really think it's a good idea to allow all that?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wickard_v._Filburn
I understand that at the time someone said something to the effect that freedom can be lost one grain at a time.
I understand that at the time someone said something to the effect that freedom can be lost one grain at a time.
By the reasoning in that case, I could be interfering with interstate commerce if I sing my kid a lullaby, instead of letting Disney do it. And thus my off-key efforts subject to federal regulation (which, considering, might be a blessing for all concerned...).
Freedom!
Biden excites noone, I have literally not seen a single Biden bumper sticker, lawn sign, t-shirt, seen a single Biden debate viewing party listed in local events, seen a single Biden group tabling anywhere (like the farmers market), nor met a single Biden supporter in real life. Should I count old Obama/Biden stickers from way back when, as those hidden but claimed to actually exist Biden supporters?
Yang has stickers and lawn signs out there (the lawn signs were in neighborhoods that can't possible need the 1k, the cars maybe could). I've even heard people volunteering for Tom Snyder though he has minimal chance having entered so late. High schoolers/college students are holding homemade signs on street corners for Bernie, noone doubts the enthusiasm is there. This is how much of a non-entity the "front runner" is, that noone seems to actually want him.
And he doesn't seem that sharp or sometimes even all there either (I'd blame age, but then maybe he never was).
Who is Snyder?
I have been traveling through New Hampshire and seen signs for Yang, Buttigieg, Gabbard, Warren, Sanders, Biden and Trump, not listed in any particular order. There is a Steyer but I have not seen signs for him.
ApatheticNoMore
1-2-20, 8:21pm
Yea Steyer, not a ton of interest but I know someone campaigning for him, which is more than I've heard for Biden. Noone here seems to be supporting Gabbard, only Biden is a "front runner" and also seems to have no real support. Like literally not a single bumper sticker.
ApatheticNoMore
1-2-20, 8:29pm
Well then don't you think we should just do away with states and give the federal government total rule?
if you want that vote for Trump. Remember it's Trump who fights CA on it's clean air standards written into the Clean Air Act.
if you want that vote for Trump.
Actually, the correct answer would be "I"ll take vote Democratic for the whole enchilada Alex".
gimmethesimplelife
1-2-20, 9:18pm
Who is Snyder?
I have been traveling through New Hampshire and seen signs for Yang, Buttigieg, Gabbard, Warren, Sanders, Biden and Trump, not listed in any particular order. There is a Steyer but I have not seen signs for him.This is way way way off topic, please forgive me. Did you by any chance pass through Sandown, NH? That is where I started out in life and I've been thinking about Sandown recently. Rob
gimmethesimplelife
1-2-20, 9:27pm
True, but Biden lacks the ability and the charisma to generate a cult following. That's the difference. My DH is going to vote for Trump again, probably (unless Bernie gets the Democratic nomination, which he won't but he should--he got 5 million individual donations in Q4, out-earning all the other Democratic candidates). DH believes that Trump is doing a great job, even though he admits he's a jerk. He believes you can be an a$$ and still be a good president. I think a lot of people feel that way.Catherine, Thank You for your explanation. I believe you are right - Biden is not capable of generating a cult following nor stirring up such a high level of interest. Trump, regardless of what I think of him, does have die hard fanatical suppporters. Who would not question any move he made. Scary. But to the point - Biden is not going to inspire support anywhere near that level. I as an uberliberal on thus board would rather that the nomination went elsewhere. Rob
Biden sent us some lovely stickers. Not sure where we'll put them, perhaps on the inside of one of our kitchen cabinet doors or some other semi-secluded place so that someone will discover them years from now and be curious...
Apologies that they're upside down. Apparently the forum software feels similar to me in regards to his campaign.
3066
iris lilies
1-2-20, 10:35pm
Biden sent us some lovely stickers. Not sure where we'll put them, perhaps on the inside of one of our kitchen cabinet doors or some other semi-secluded place so that someone will discover them years from now and be curious...
Apologies that they're upside down. Apparently the forum software feels similar to me in regards to his campaign.
3066
It is good to know one Biden supporter, they are not all unaccounted for ghosts. Dis you send him money Jp?
It is good to know one Biden supporter, they are not all unaccounted for ghosts. Dis you send him money Jp?
I didn't but SO did. Early on in this election cycle he was a big supporter of "vote blue, no matter who" and gave all the candidates $25 apiece. He has since narrowed his funding down to the three candidates remaining that he would actually be excited about. Joe didn't make the cut. But he likes the "joe cool" sticker (the one with joe in his sunglasses) enough to take it to work and put up in his office somewhere. The rest will become hidden time capsules in random places in our apartment.
ToomuchStuff
1-3-20, 2:54am
yes, maybe it is the “interstate” aspect that is key, I dont know.
”puppy mills” are entirely legal in our state. This law wont change that.
Not entirely:
"Puppy breeder, kennel shut down by St. Charles County for unsafe conditions, 170 dogs removed"
https://www.stltoday.com/news/local/stcharles/puppy-breeder-kennel-shut-down-by-st-charles-county-for/article_ccdabb39-e57d-5ce1-9ba0-fd92b6e0c1d2.html
Not entirely:
"Puppy breeder, kennel shut down by St. Charles County for unsafe conditions, 170 dogs removed"
https://www.stltoday.com/news/local/stcharles/puppy-breeder-kennel-shut-down-by-st-charles-county-for/article_ccdabb39-e57d-5ce1-9ba0-fd92b6e0c1d2.html
That’s like saying restaurants are not entirely legal because one got shut down for health code violations.
ToomuchStuff
1-4-20, 4:07am
That’s like saying restaurants are not entirely legal because one got shut down for health code violations.
And....
What is not following laws called? (health codes are written into them, here)
And....
What is not following laws called? (health codes are written into them, here)
IL’s point was that puppy mills are legal in her state. Trying to say that isn’t the case by pointing out one instance of law violation is like saying public education isn’t entirely legitimate due to the actions of a few abusive teachers.
The fact remains that puppy mills are legal in that state, the people and their elected representatives having assented to their (regulated) existence. We can hand the central government the power to override a greater range of local decisions because we don’t like what they decided in any particular instance, but if we do it enough we may as well give up on the idea of federalism.
ToomuchStuff
1-4-20, 1:32pm
IL’s point was that puppy mills are legal in her state.
I am in the same state.
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