Coronavirus/meat production and eating

[flowerseverywhere]

I am seeing very little connection between modern ways of animal production and pandemics in media and society. Swine flu. AIDS making the jump from primates to people. Covid-19 connections from wet markets and bats. Smallpox and bubonic plague from rats. The outbreaks at our modern meat processing plants.

wouldn't a lot of our current problems be avoided if processing and eating animal products was eliminated or changed? With all the debate about shutdowns and mask wearing, I have seen almost no mention or discussions of this simple fact. Do you think you will change your eating habits at all?

[Yppej]

I am already a vegetarian. I do see a connection, except with bubonic plague I don't know that people were eating rats.

[Gardnr]

I am seeing very little connection between modern ways of animal production and pandemics in media and society. Swine flu. AIDS making the jump from primates to people. Covid-19 connections from wet markets and bats. Smallpox and bubonic plague from rats. The outbreaks at our modern meat processing plants.

wouldn't a lot of our current problems be avoided if processing and eating animal products was eliminated or changed? With all the debate about shutdowns and mask wearing, I have seen almost no mention or discussions of this simple fact. Do you think you will change your eating habits at all?

I buy local grassfed as much as possible. I would estimate 20% or less corporate "meat" enters our kitchen.

[catherine]

Nobody's going to let anyone mess with meat. If not being able to go to bars and churches isn't hard enough for Americans to accept, tell them that they can't or shouldn't eat meat and a civil war will break out. I was vegetarian for 10 years and had a lot of conversations with meat-eaters and non-meat-eaters and I did a lot of reading and learned in the process that people's opinions are often more grounded in emotion than facts.

[JaneV2.0]

I've thought about getting a subscription to grass fed and finished meats. But that would probably require buying a new freezer.
I've done my penance as a vegetarian already. :devil: Bite me.
Left to my own devices, I often go days without eating meat, but that's only because I'm a lazy cook.

[Teacher Terry]

I eat meat most days and don’t like many veggies.

[bae]

I get almost all of my meat from small-scale local sources.

I think the vegan/vegetarian community is being a bit precious trying to meat-shame and advance their agenda on the back of Covid-19.

[flowerseverywhere]

I haven’t seen anyone trying to advance the agenda of shaming and decreasing meat eating. I see a lot of China blaming, but no calls for the American meat industry to protect workers and the public. How does Covid get into the packing plants?

[catherine]

I haven’t seen anyone trying to advance the agenda of shaming and decreasing meat eating. I see a lot of China blaming, but no calls for the American meat industry to protect workers and the public. How does Covid get into the packing plants?

I haven't seen a lot of it, either, but I did see a NYT op ed by Jonathan Foer. (https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/21/opinion/coronavirus-meat-vegetarianism.html?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage)

[SteveinMN]

How does Covid get into the packing plants?
Same way it gets everywhere else: asymptomatic spread. Could have come from some kid returning home from college and picking up fast food at the Subway. Or from the driver bringing the cattle. Or from the driver picking up the cut meat. Or the corporate bigwig out on a photo op. Or....

Add a bunch of people (typically with work-or-you-don't-get-paid kinds of jobs and/or minimal health benefits) working in close quarters and there it is.

[Gardnr]

How does Covid get into the packing plants?

Um, the employees carry it in? Just like it spreads anywhere. The incubation period is up to 14 days before any symptoms show up. During that time (and longer if people ignore that they are ill), it can spread like wildfire.

[ApatheticNoMore]

I haven’t seen anyone trying to advance the agenda of shaming and decreasing meat eating. I see a lot of China blaming, but no calls for the American meat industry to protect workers and the public.

I want them protected, but due to the politicians in place in this country they won't be. I'm not sure what my calls would do. Believe me that's not who I vote for, completely opposite.

The thing is American meat processing and production is not even necessarily for Americans, Americans eat meat of course,l but I believe that a lot of these meat processing plants that were opened much of the meat was shipped elsewhere. That's why I can and might boycott but it might make no difference if any of us did (you'd need a boycott movement of course, but also if the meat is just going to be shipped to other countries an American boycott might not be enough).

[Yppej]

I think if people can do without toilet paper they can do without meat. There are substitutes.

[bae]

I haven’t seen anyone trying to advance the agenda of shaming and decreasing meat eating.

My community has a fair number of quite militant vegetarians and vegans, and our local newspapers and discussion groups are full of opinion pieces on the matter, saying "meat eating causes pandemics, meat bad, you are bad, save humanity, eat plants".

Mind you, agriculture here on the island relies on clever diversified use of the land to be remotely profitable or sustainable, and part of that involves small-scale livestock production - some of the land is best suited for that most of the time, and/or the livestock fulfills other important roles on the farm.

Then again, by my observation, most of the militant vegans here don't farm, they buy expensive food imported from the mainland.

[Tiam]

Eliminate? In what way? I'm a 3/4 vegetarian myself. But my goodness, on other groups that I am in, the people are wailing and moaning about the shortage and prices of meat like it's the end of the world, but I don't see anyone really looking at it as perhaps the nexxus of a life changing paradigm shift.

[ApatheticNoMore]

Eliminate? In what way? I'm a 3/4 vegetarian myself. But my goodness, on other groups that I am in, the people are wailing and moaning about the shortage and prices of meat like it's the end of the world, but I don't see anyone really looking at it as perhaps the nexxus of a life changing paradigm shift.

and early in the pandemic you couldn't get beans or rice to save your life, and it would have served one well to eat meats and produce then, and now maybe less meats (that early situation seemed in many ways an absurd situation, when poverty foods were what couldn't be had, beans, rice, pasta etc., it was like: "ok this is ridiculous you can get chicken and steak, but beans or eggs don't even hope ..."). So the practical if maybe not the moral win goes to flexibility.

[flowerseverywhere]

Lots of good input on a subject I’ve been thinking about a lot. I don’t think much will change right now. With so many people worried and/or out of work, major changes in our food chain are unlikely. I guess we all just have to do out best, if we care and can afford to, to support local farmers and humanely raised food.

[JaneV2.0]

I would willingly forego meat products until packing plants have time to test their employees, re-design their lines, allow the infected plenty of time to recover...I'd be fine with them shutting down entirely for as long as it takes. But corporate America thrives on the backs of its workers, er "human capital stock" as Kevin Hassett would put it, and they're clearly expendable.

[Teacher Terry]

I don’t grocery shop but my husband was out of town and we were getting low on food. My son and I went to do the monthly shopping and I couldn’t believe how expensive things were especially meat.