What would you do: Property/real estate version

[catherine]

So, things I have shared so far:

My son is renting our house with 2 years left to make a decision as to whether they want to move or buy.
My property has forsythia as property boundaries/privacy screens. The privacy screens really were mainly useful for privacy between our house and the house next door. The other two sides of our home are bound by a public park and provide a sense of spaciousness and a lovely view of a beautiful, treed park.
Two years ago I came home to our NJ home to find that our new neighbors (they bought the house that was previously my BIL/MIL's house) had literally chopped the forsythias in half because apparently they objected to the branches hanging over their property. However, they never expressed this to us.



So, now my son is just closing out Year #1 on the rental agreement. He advised us that the forsythias are basically dead and the landscaper suggested that we remove them. My son and DIL understandably want some privacy between these two homes, so they got a quote for removing the nearly dead forsythia and replacing with some type of evergreen, like arbor vitae, to provide privacy. The bill for that would be $3800. They would actually prefer a fence. A fence, for their purposes, really only needs to run along one side of the yard--the part between our house and the neighbors.

What would you do? Here are the issues at play:

I don't know how long my son will be there. Could be anywhere from about 3-4 months to forever.
I'm not sure if the fence would pay for itself if they move and we put the house on the market
If I got a fence, would the house be more marketable with a fence that surrounds the back yard? I hate to do that because the veiw of the park is beautiful.
What, if anything, do I communicate to the neighbors? I suspect nothing, because I said nothing when they originally hacked the bushes to pieces, but is there any benefit to letting them know what boundaries are? And their actions cost us a bundle?



What would you do?

[Teacher Terry]

I wouldn’t pay for a fence. It probably won’t do any good to tell your neighbors they are idiots. You don’t want them to ruin a sale.

[catherine]

I wouldn’t pay for a fence. It probably won’t do any good to tell your neighbors they are idiots. You don’t want them to ruin a sale.

Would you pay for anything? How would you handle the privacy issue?

[happystuff]

I would check, but some areas required that the installation of a fence requires notification to the effected/neighboring property owners and, possibly, a permit.

[Yppej]

When I had bad neighbors I planted false sunflowers. This perennial grows 10 feet tall and nothing kills it. They spread like crazy and I got some for free from someone trying to get rid of them. If you don't cut them down at the end of the season their ugly shriveled dead stalks will continue to provide a tall barrier that will send a very clear message to the neighbors that they should have accepted the forsythias. They are unsightly enough once done blooming in late summer/early fall that the neighbor might put up a fence.

[Tybee]

We had similar problem so we put privacy fence to screen our yard from neighbors, where they could see, and picket to back up to prairie, so we kept our prairie view:

3270

[iris lilies]

I wouldn’t put any more money into that property, I certainly wouldn’t fence the lovely vista going to the public park expanse.Your son is a renter, he rented it the way it is, I would not be putting that improvement in for a renter.

We just moved our big forsythia planting and divided it into a row so that three years down the road it’ll be a nice border at the edge of our property. But they do get thin and wispy, and during the winter they lose their leaves, so they’re not a perfect privacy barrier.

[Tybee]

Sorry about the upside down picture, don't know how to fix it.
I would not put anymore landscaping in; they might just cut those down, too.

If your son or you puts up a fence, that will improve the property in a way landscaping will not. If you fence in whole yard, it will improve property for buyers with kids or dogs.

Can your son put up a fence, maybe with your husband's help, or his brothers? We put up ours and it only took a couple of days. It wasn't that expensive; we got panels delivered from Lowes.

If he does not want to put up a whole fence, then yes, privacy fence between your house and the neighbor house is a great idea. A buyer would like this, too, as they would like the privacy it affords.

[catherine]

happystuff, having to speak to the neighbors would at least let me vent my grievance with them.. I suspect they wouldn't mind the fence, but I don't know...

Yppej: haha, that's one way to get back at them, but I don't know if I want to deal with overgrown perennials!

Tybee: That's what I was thinking! Some kind of stockade fence on the property boundaries between our two houses, but maybe a picket fence on the other two sides for the view and the ability to contain kids and pets. The only quirk with that option is that we actually appear to own up to the two large trees on each corner of "our" property, but our property line actually is about 6 feet shy of those trees. So then we have to decide: do we build the fence on Township property, but consistent with the yard that it looks like we own, or do we build the fence consistent with the survey, which will look weird and make the yard smaller?

So many questions...

[Tybee]

When we built a fence in town, we had to file survey with permit, and we had to do it on our property, so that decision might be made for you.

[catherine]

When we built a fence in town, we had to file survey with permit, and we had to do it on our property, so that decision might be made for you.

Bummer. That makes me think a one-sided fence for privacy might be best.

[Yppej]

Years ago I put up a fence with my dad using a post hole digger, no power tools of any kind. It was a small fence but an onerous job.

[JaneV2.0]

If I were going to live there, I'd put up a fence on either side with some kind of fancified chain link (epoxied, framed) or other open grid fencing in the back or where the view is. But I like fences. If your son buys it, he can worry about fencing.

[SteveinMN]

I don't think I'd do anything with the house at this point.

When I bought the house we're in now, I liked that it came with a (chain-link) fence (though one side of it was loose enough to act like a trebuchet; since fixed on my dime). I didn't have kids or a dog, but it was nice to have a boundary around the property. I wouldn't have paid extra for a fence, and it would not have been a showstopper for me if it wasn't there. I don't think this is one of those "home improvements" that pays back 100%.

Your son is renting. If he moves out, I don't believe prospective buyers will know enough about the neighbors to decide if a fence is necessary. They can decide for themselves after they move in. They, too, might prefer the wide open look. Or maybe your neighbors will move out.

If your son chooses to stay in the house, he can buy a fence if he still feels one is needed. Or you and DH can be the nice parents and pay for a fence for them. In the meantime, if he wants some privacy, there are all kinds of temporary things he could put up which are much less expensive (and permanent) than a fence.

ETA when I replaced the fence that was bad, I did not have to notify the neighbor (I did because I wanted them to make sure their dogs were OK without that boundary but it was not a legal requirement). And it had to be on the property line, not just where I wanted it.

[Teacher Terry]

No I wouldn’t do anything.

[Tammy]

I would remove the dead plants and do nothing else. If your son doesn’t like it, that’s good actually. He can then speed up his decision to move or buy it,

[pinkytoe]

If anything, I might put up a privacy screen (s) in those areas where you want it so not necessarily the whole length. Our neighbor knows that our kitchen window looks into their patio area so they put up a screen of lattice with vines that hides that area - about 9 ft). I would not bother with the expense of a hedge of plants.

[rosarugosa]

I would definitely not pay for a fence. That sounds like a poor use of your money.

[sweetana3]

I am with Tammy.

[Tybee]

If your son chooses to stay in the house, he can buy a fence if he still feels one is needed. Or you and DH can be the nice parents and pay for a fence for them. In the meantime, if he wants some privacy, there are all kinds of temporary things he could put up which are much less expensive (and permanent) than a fence.



What kind of temporary things can you think of? Are there pictures of them on Pinterest, or can you describe them? I can't think of anything temporary that would provide privacy.

[Tybee]

Okay, googled it, were you thinking something like this netting?

https://www.overstock.com/Home-Garden/Boen-Privacy-Netting-Green-10-x-150/29740602/product.html?refccid=S3ZF5W2FK6KIQMKC4GZNJJS5RI&searchidx=4&option=52968668&kwds=&rfmt=

Not sure how it goes up, maybe like a volleyball net or something?

$269 for 150 feet, that's not bad.

[JaneV2.0]

I designed and helped build a 7 foot folding screen with rip-stop nylon panels to put in the patio area of my condo; I was so tired of being peered at by the neighbors, but that kind of thing is probably too small for your situation.

That roll-out fencing is what Fences for Fido uses to build enclosures for chained dogs up here. It seems to work.

Whatever the solution, your son should be the one to pay for it, IMO.

[ToomuchStuff]

While the neighbors have the right to cut off limbs that grow over their property, they can not do so much that they kill it (they did). So your left with the legal options (are they worth it?).
Now fencing requires permits, typically. So I am with Pinkytoe on option three. Make a flower bed, and put up some stakes where you mount 4x8' sheets of lattice work on, to the height you want, and plant vine type of plants on it. It is NOT a fence, but provides the same features.
That, or leave the fence/bush replacement for the next buyer, whoever that is.

[Geila]

If you wait long enough, the neighbor might put up the fence himself. After all, he's the one who destroyed the hedge. They might realize what that cost them. If your son wants something, I would think they can put simple curtains with outdoor fabric or shade cloth exactly there they want them. Easy and cheap. I'm surprised he asking you guys to pay for the fencing. Didn't they tell you they were moving just recently, and that you should prepare to put the house on the market?

[catherine]

So, DS did not ask us to pay for fencing... the landscaper provided a bid and he simply passed it along to us as information. However, yes, they DO need more privacy. Interestingly, my DIL already bought something very similar to Tybee's suggestion, but it had a defective part, and they have to return it. That may be the way to go moving forward.

Apparently my son has spoken frequently with the neighbors and it turns out that their son is autistic. He's the one who comes over uninvited to hang out with my grandkids, and our neighbor said she's never known him to reach out to socialize with other people. So my son actually feels bad now about shutting him out.

Anyway, my convo with my son included sharing with him all your great suggestions about lattice and plantings on my side, and the link to Overstock, etc., so he has tons of options, and he doesn't expect us to pay. He just wanted to share information and get our advice.

Also, DS let it slip that his MIL has been pushing them to buy our house.. and Quicken Loans recently offered me a much lower interest rate as long as we stay in the house for 12 months, so we'll let this all unfold and see what happens. As long as we don't get caught in ANOTHER RECESSION!!!!

Thanks for all your ideas... DS, DIL, DH and I really appreciate it!

[iris lilies]

I am not sure why you think we would be getting another recession?!!! What economic indicators could possibly be showing that as near term outcome?

/sarcasm ( meant in a friendly spirit)

[SteveinMN]

were you thinking something like this netting?
That was the prime candidate in my mind, yes. There also are items sold as room dividers which can be placed outside. Then there are window coverings. It really depends on how much privacy people believe they need.

But I say that as a guy whose house is maybe 10-15 feet away from one of the neighbor's houses. We have curtains along some of the windows on that side. That's enough for us.

[JaneV2.0]

I am not sure why you think we would be getting another recession?!!! What economic indicators could possibly be showing that as near term outcome?

/sarcasm ( meant in a friendly spirit)

Housing prices here have taken a big jump recently. Supposedly, Seattle's in the top 10 markets for appreciation. It will be interesting to see how that is affected by recent events.

[iris lilies]

Housing prices here have taken a big jump recently. Supposedly, Seattle's in the top 10 markets for appreciation. It will be interesting to see how that is affected by recent events.

This bag lady says about this current real estate market BS “Weird unexplainable market optimism especially as we are seeing in the insane stock market feels very 2007-ish.”

Here anyway fairly strong real estate prices for most market segments has to do with low inventory.

I do not pretend to predict any economic reality in the future and no one can do it. I own two houses now and can easily afford them they are both paid for and are a small part of our net worth. I would not be sinking money into real estate right now in any way other than a primary place to live.

[JaneV2.0]

This bag lady says about this current real estate market BS “Weird unexplainable market optimism especially as we are seeing in the insane stock market feels very 2007-ish.”

Here anyway fairly strong real estate prices for most market segments has to do with low inventory.

I do not pretend to predict any economic reality in the future and no one can do it. I own two houses now and can easily afford them they are both paid for and are a small part of our net worth. I would not be sinking money into real estate right now in any way other than a primary place to live.

I figure the housing market will tank just as I put my house up for sale (which is a purely apocryphal scenario). The taxes here, as I've whined about before, are outrageous, IMO.

[catherine]

One of my favorite landscape books is this: https://www.amazon.com/Landscaping-Small-Spaces-Sunset/dp/B000FFJSNA We have a tiny lot, just over 5k sq ft. and one of the best advice I got from the book was to figure out exactly what kind of privacy you need and where you need it. And to only block that, and with the lightest barrier needed to preserve the sense of space. We often think we need more privacy than we actually do. It was good advice.

I like lots of privacy because I often go outside in my underwear when taking the dogs out or changing out of dirty clothes after gardening. But I only need tall screening from my 2-story neighbor's bathroom window so I planted a clumping bamboo in that spot. Works great and the garden still feels spacious. My friend lives on a golf course, no kids, no pets, no fences at all, just the occasional flying golf ball. She got boinged on the head while sitting on her patio when she first moved in. And she rents, so she put up on of these: https://www.amazon.com/Z-UP-SR9104BL-Sierra-10-Feet/dp/B000T9QSDK?th=1

She attached curtains that she can close when she wants privacy. It makes it look like a cute little pergola/arbor. It's super easy to put up, move, take down, store, etc. And it's nice if she's entertaining and doesn't want her guests to feel like they're on display. Which I can attest it does feel like that when you're sitting there having lunch and a bunch of guys walk by lugging their golf gear and looking at you.

Great advice! That book looks great. I think I kind of have that way of thinking in my head--that's why I like the idea of a 6 ft fence and then decreasing it to a smaller size where we don't care as much.

[catherine]

I figure the housing market will tank just as I put my house up for sale (which is a purely apocryphal scenario). The taxes here, as I've whined about before, are outrageous, IMO.

I KNOW that's what's going to happen to me, Jane. I never acquired the genes the paternal side of my family--the ones who made millions in real estate over the past 3 generations. Somebody along the line must have done something wrong and I got their Karma.

[Yppej]

Wow, it would never occur to me to outside in my underwear, but I do go out in my pajamas.

[catherine]

Wow, it would never occur to me to outside in my underwear, but I do go out in my pajamas.

We just put in an outdoor shower because I don't want to give up the clawfoot tub inside just yet. So now we have a walk-in shower, but it's outdoors. I did make sure it was tall enough for total privacy for the person inside, but one design flaw a didn't count on is that if you walk out on the side porch, which is three steps higher than the base of the shower stall, you can peer over and look inside.

Now, I know that that is very unlikely to happen up here, but to be honest, it still intimidates me. DH or DS are fine with it, but I'm now thinking of putting up some kind of railing planter with tall plants for extra protection--although God knows no one wants to accidentally see a 68-year old woman taking a shower buck naked.

So, I'm with you--I don't think I'd be stepping outside in my underwear either, fence or no fence. My modesty is hard wired from 12 years of Catholic school.

[JaneV2.0]

I KNOW that's what's going to happen to me, Jane. I never acquired the genes the paternal side of my family--the ones who made millions in real estate over the past 3 generations. Somebody along the line must have done something wrong and I got their Karma.

:D