View Full Version : One Would Think We Lived In A First World Country!
gimmethesimplelife
6-21-20, 7:41pm
At least in Colorado. This past Friday Colorado's Governor signed a bill STRIPPING POLICE OF QUALIFIED IMMUNITY. Can you believe that? Ir's like land in Denver and you've entered a safer and somewhat worthwhile country.
I am absolutely blown out to sea. Call me Nautical Rob. Whoever would have thought that anywhere in America in our lifetimes human rights could mean so much? Rob
gimmethesimplelife
6-21-20, 7:51pm
One caveat - this does not take effect until July 2023. I guess that gives time for the sociopaths to quit and for new blood who can comply to be hired. And it will embolden more people against the police - filming heinous acts and more lawsuits. All in all, something to be celebrated. And I thought it was only Minneapolis that was shaping up to be a Human Rights Mecca. Rob
Teacher Terry
6-21-20, 9:16pm
Rob, people of color have had enough and I think they finally have wider support. It’s about time!
gimmethesimplelife
6-21-20, 9:27pm
Rob, people of color have had enough and I think they finally have wider support. It’s about time!YES! I could not agree more. And is it EVER about time! Rob
Teacher Terry
6-21-20, 9:35pm
I think another good thing is that there are more people in interracial relationships and white people are worried about their mixed grandchildren. This is all good news!
frugal-one
6-21-20, 9:49pm
One caveat - this does not take effect until July 2023. I guess that gives time for the sociopaths to quit and for new blood who can comply to be hired. And it will embolden more people against the police - filming heinous acts and more lawsuits. All in all, something to be celebrated. And I thought it was only Minneapolis that was shaping up to be a Human Rights Mecca. Rob
Talked to my son in Minneapolis today and he said there were shootings and the police tried getting there. People threw rocks and prevented it. So, now the police will not even try to come to the area. Is this a good thing? I don't think so. Will the gangs and such start to take over?
Here's the text of Washington State's "qualified immunity" statute:
https://app.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=9.46.212
"When physical injury to a person or substantial damage to property occurs, or is about to occur, within the presence of an officer of the commission designated with police powers pursuant to RCW 9.46.210, the designated officer is authorized to take such action as is reasonably necessary to prevent physical injury to a person or substantial damage to property or prevent further injury to a person or further substantial damage to property. A designated officer shall be immune from civil liability for damages arising out of the action of the designated officer to prevent physical injury to a person or substantial damage to property or prevent further injury to a person or further substantial damage to property, unless it is shown that the designated officer acted with gross negligence or bad faith."
What in the text constitutes an offense to human rights?
It's not a free pass. And if you look at the use-of-force laws in this state, you'll perhaps notice that law enforcement officers are *more* restricted in use-of-force than civilians.
At least in Colorado. This past Friday Colorado's Governor signed a bill STRIPPING POLICE OF QUALIFIED IMMUNITY. Can you believe that? Ir's like land in Denver and you've entered a safer and somewhat worthwhile country.
I'm so disappointed to see people throughout this country doing things they'll soon regret, this is one of them.
It's hard enough being a police officer these days without making them liable for any damages alleged while protecting persons or property. It seems to me that when politicians do stupid things such as this in order to capitalize on dumbass voters emotions, they're trading the long term stability of their jurisdictions for their short term benefit.
And Rob, tell me, if God forbid someone were to beat you nearly to death while a policeman simply watched due to his fear that saving you would create financial ruin, possible legal charges and loss of job, would you then try to capitalize through lawsuits alleging malfeasance or dereliction of duty?
And Rob, tell me, if God forbid someone were to beat you nearly to death while a policeman simply watched due to his fear that saving you would create financial ruin, possible legal charges and loss of job, would you then try to capitalize through lawsuits alleging malfeasance or dereliction of duty?
Well, Rob wouldn't get very far with that, as it is a "fundamental principle of American law that a government and its agents are under no general duty to provide public services, such as police protection, to any individual citizen." Warren v. District of Columbia, 444 A.2d 1 (D.C. Ct. of Ap., 1981)
gimmethesimplelife
6-22-20, 7:47am
All I'm going to say is that for millions of Americans, current US policing is problemstic at best and for the most part, does not work well if at all. I am literally sick of living in fear of insufficiently vetted sociopaths that have managed to get through whatever wesk screening for such there may or may not be. If things don't keep changing, don't be surprised to see a Citizenship Buyout Movement start and sweep nationwide - many people are tealizing that they can do better elsewhere - and America's greatest nightmare? They are more and more willing to hold America accountable. I think the next few years may be a shock to conservative middle class and above law and order types - and a source of great joy for potential 24/7/365 victims of America such as myself. The order of things us changing as your system is crystal clear racist, evil, and abusive.
Evil and abusive? You better believe it. Too many George Floyd's. I can't even begin to understand how Conservatives could be so hateful as to continue to support a system that allows George Floyd to be murdered in cold blood. But at least your way is on it's way out. Thank God.
Huge consession and attempt at an olive branch on my part? I don't know if that which is replacing your way will work. I really don't. It's rather new and shocking for America to have human rights FOR ALL have a place at the table. I'm willing to take the chance. I deserve better than to live on a country that claims to be wealthy but has third world policing on top of human life not being worth access to socialized meficine. America simply is too hypocritically abusive and over the top - it expects too much potential victimizaton out of me to be borne.
But at least people are fighting back against America and all that it truly stands for. What hope! What joy! What a wonderful time to live somewhere like the 85006 and be alive. Colorado won't be the last state to kick qualified immunity to the curb. Nor will the latest round of sociopathic thuggish police officers be the last to be charged, held accountable, and have their lives destroyed as they so richly deserve.
Remember when I posted not long ago that accountabilty was coming? It's knocking at door to pay a social call right now folks. Will you do as I and politely answer the door and let accountability in - or will it need to be like an illegal band of SWAT thugs breaking down your door and murdering pets and humans alike for no.legal reason (an everyday occurence in America)? Your choice. Point? Accountability has FINALLY arrived. I can deal. Can you? Rob
iris lilies
6-22-20, 8:15am
This all seems really good for gun sales. I think I will buy stocks in gun and ammo manufacture.
iris lilies
6-22-20, 8:53am
....Remember when I posted not long ago that accountabilty was coming? It's knocking at door to pay a social call right now folks. Will you do as I and politely answer the door and let accountability in - or will it need to be like an illegal band of SWAT thugs breaking down your door and murdering pets and humans alike for no.legal reason (an everyday occurence in America)? Your choice. Point? Accountability has FINALLY arrived. I can deal. Can you? Rob
I do think there will be changes in policing. How effective those changes will be is predictable IMO: not very. By this I mean the changes won’t satisfy you, Rob, and they won’t be especially pleasing to me, either.
gimmethesimplelife
6-22-20, 9:02am
I do think there will be changes in policing. How effective those changes will be is predictable IMO: not very. By this I mean the changes won’t satisfy you, Rob, and they won’t be especially pleasing to me, either.As a supporter of the police I can understand your not liking changes coming to policing. I don't agree with you - but given your stance I can grasp that you feel this way.
What has me intrigued is that you seem to believe I won't like these changes. Could you be more specific? (Snarky line but I don't mean snark, IL. I'm genuinely curious and trying to understand). Rob
Originally Posted by iris lilies
I do think there will be changes in policing. How effective those changes will be is predictable IMO: not very. By this I mean the changes won’t satisfy you, Rob, and they won’t be especially pleasing to me, either.
As a supporter of the police I can understand your not liking changes coming to policing. I don't agree with you - but given your stance I can grasp that you feel this way.
What has me intrigued is that you seem to believe I won't like these changes. Could you be more specific?
I'm not particularly a "supporter of the police". But I'm not against the idea of law enforcement, either. As in most things, I see things in shades of gray.
I see changes coming, some long overdue. But the political penchant for the quick fix, though often well-intentioned, is not going to be as transformative as people like you, Rob, would like to see. And it certainly will not occur as quickly as you would like. George Floyd will not be the last POC killed by a bad cop. Or, likely, the second-to-last. Just my hunch based on history. The needle has moved further with the Floyd murder than I expected, but it can move only o far.
As a gay man, Rob, you've seen how long it takes to transform culture. Even landmark Supreme Court decisions and riots and marches that marked the history of the gay-rights movement took decades to result in true behavioral change -- and I'm sure you would agree that the country is not yet 100% on board even now.
I see the same thing here. There are forces that law enforcement officers need to deal with in the U.S. that go well beyond anything a mayor or City Council can mandate as a response. Tying officers' figurative hands in responding to those issues will not move us toward the goal of better policing. Alan already has touched on a couple of these.
And my personal experience after 40 years in a workforce that was nowhere near as dangerous as police work is that, for every "one-minute manager" you will find several "59-second employees". That's not a threat; that's a human reaction to bureaucracy and a perceived lack of understanding of how things work at street level. Let me be clear: Derek Chauvin was flat out wrong to knee George Floyd the way he did. Based on a long documented history of issues he's had with black people (not all POC; just black ones) he should not have been still wearing the uniform. Ditto for the officers that literally executed the no-knock warrant on Breaonna Taylor's home. And those are just recent examples. Things need to change. But if the changes made for both sides fall victim to pandering and soundbites and quick political fixes, neither the beleagured public nor the law enforcement community will make any lasting progress. This is going to take time; probably a couple of generations. It's been a long battle and it isn't near over yet.
As long as there are cops, there will be bad cops. You can’t reform, abolish or protest your way to perfection. But we can always improve. And no one who isn’t selling some sort of nonsense thinks we can have law without law enforcement. The question in my mind is, if you screen out all the performance art, are we doing better or worse than twenty or fifty years ago?
Teacher Terry
6-22-20, 12:09pm
Camden NJ fired everyone in 2012. Then they hired the best 100 back. They had a huge crime rate and poverty problem. The rest of the money paid for social workers, mental health counselors, etc. Their crime rate went down, due to community policing the cops know and interact with the citizens and people aren’t getting murdered by the police. It’s definitely a win-win.
Camden added cops by breaking the union and reducing compensation costs. No more Woketopian than that.
SteveinMN
6-22-20, 12:39pm
As townships, cities, and counties deal with the economic devastation of the pandemic and ensuing recession/depression, not to mention the financial shenanigans that went on before in the name of "economic development", I'm thinking comprehensive initiatives like Camden's are going to be difficult to execute and, increasingly, be supported among taxpayers who were already strained.
Not that that is an excuse to do nothing. There are plenty of things that could be done to rachet down the tone considerably. Some of them will take a fair amount of time. But I would be happy to see people point at more models than Camden.
iris lilies
6-22-20, 12:48pm
As a supporter of the police I can understand your not liking changes coming to policing. I don't agree with you - but given your stance I can grasp that you feel this way.
What has me intrigued is that you seem to believe I won't like these changes. Could you be more specific? (Snarky line but I don't mean snark, IL. I'm genuinely curious and trying to understand). Rob
Steve’s post #14 covers it.
Rob much reform is needed but we are not experiencing Third Woirld policing. If you educate yourself on what has happened in places like Brazil and the Philippines you will see the difference.
At least in Colorado. This past Friday Colorado's Governor signed a bill STRIPPING POLICE OF QUALIFIED IMMUNITY.
I pointed you above at Washington State's legislation concerning "qualified immunity", and asked you what part of that text, the actual law, you are concerned with....
No answer?
I pointed you above at Washington State's legislation concerning "qualified immunity", and asked you what part of that text, the actual law, you are concerned with....
No answer?
Crickets.
I pointed you above at Washington State's legislation concerning "qualified immunity", and asked you what part of that text, the actual law, you are concerned with....
No answer?
Crickets.
Most of the "activism" we see here and elsewhere is based upon emotion rather than facts. In this case I believe the only thing Rob saw was the opportunity for someone to cash in on the perceived actions of someone else, he can't be expected to re-evaluate his dreams based upon reality.
Most of the "activism" we see here and elsewhere is based upon emotion rather than facts.
I think that’s true. Look at how our little Cultural Revolution has jumped the shark in the statue-smashing arena. I see the nitwit nihilists of Madison, WI have busted up a statue of Hans Christian Heg, an abolitionist who raised a regiment for the Union and died leading it. One of their spokesninnies said this was done for strategic reasons, explaining that, “Sometimes you have to talk to people in language only they can understand”.
Elsewhere, imbecilic iconoclasts have attacked images of Lincoln, Grant, Gandhi, John Greenleaf Whittier, and Teddy Roosevelt (although in fairness, they may have confused their Roosevelts). It’s hard to see how many of these attacks contribute to the cause of racial justice rather than a childish urge to destroy.
frugal-one
6-25-20, 3:10pm
I think that’s true. Look at how our little Cultural Revolution has jumped the shark in the statue-smashing arena. I see the nitwit nihilists of Madison, WI have busted up a statue of Hans Christian Heg, an abolitionist who raised a regiment for the Union and died leading it. One of their spokesninnies said this was done for strategic reasons, explaining that, “Sometimes you have to talk to people in language only they can understand”.
Elsewhere, imbecilic iconoclasts have attacked images of Lincoln, Grant, Gandhi, John Greenleaf Whittier, and Teddy Roosevelt (although in fairness, they may have confused their Roosevelts). It’s hard to see how many of these attacks contribute to the cause of racial justice rather than a childish urge to destroy.
Getting totally out of hand....
gimmethesimplelife
6-29-20, 10:39am
I'm back after getting off.my butt and engaging in activism once again. Gotta say something - the climate out there is different now and more people are rightly blaming America as they should have all along.
I truly am starting to believe Civil War in the US is coming. I'd pack two bags if you haven't already and stock.up on canned goods. Just in case. In my case I'm fortunate as Mexico seems possible depending on how Covid-19 plays out. I truly don't see a lot of hope going forward without a dramatic reset. But I will continue to stand uo against America and what it has become regardless. Rob
iris lilies
6-29-20, 12:12pm
I'm back after getting off.my butt and engaging in activism once again. Gotta say something - the climate out there is different now and more people are rightly blaming America as they should have all along.
I truly am starting to believe Civil War in the US is coming. I'd pack two bags if you haven't already and stock.up on canned goods. Just in case. In my case I'm fortunate as Mexico seems possible depending on how Covid-19 plays out. I truly don't see a lot of hope going forward without a dramatic reset. But I will continue to stand uo against America and what it has become regardless. Rob
so, when the Civil War comes, I have so many questions about your role in it.
But first of all, so will that event cause you to abandon your mother? Because you said she is the reason why you’ve not moved out of the country already.
But I don’t understand if there is a Civil War (and I’m vague about what all that means and don’t really want to explore it) why wouldn’t you stick around to be an activist for your side, whatever that might be?
I'm back after getting off.my butt and engaging in activism once again. Gotta say something - the climate out there is different now and more people are rightly blaming America as they should have all along.
I truly am starting to believe Civil War in the US is coming. I'd pack two bags if you haven't already and stock.up on canned goods. Just in case. In my case I'm fortunate as Mexico seems possible depending on how Covid-19 plays out. I truly don't see a lot of hope going forward without a dramatic reset. But I will continue to stand uo against America and what it has become regardless. Rob
I think, or at least hope, that you are being misled by an unfavorable signal to noise ratio. I don’t think, or at least I hope not, that the great majority of Americans are ready to go to war based on the frenzied shrieking of a relative few but extremely loud zealots.
I think there is more courage and good sense out there than you are willing to credit us with.
I'm back after getting off.my butt and engaging in activism once again. Gotta say something - the climate out there is different now and more people are rightly blaming America as they should have all along.
I think you're throwing blame where it doesn't belong. I'm assuming your activism is focused on making things better for minorities, although you haven't said, and if that's the case you should lay the blame squarely on the one institution which has worked for centuries to keep minorities "in their place", that being the Democratic Party.
If you're not addressing the root cause of virtually all prejudice and simply engaging in street theater ending in disruption and property damage you're not really engaging in activisim, that's something else entirely.
I truly am starting to believe Civil War in the US is coming. I'd pack two bags if you haven't already and stock.up on canned goods. Just in case.
I'm confused about this advice.
Pack two bags for presumable "bugging out"?
Or piles of canned goods, for "bugging in"?
Is there some sort of handy guide for this Civil War thing?
What sort of Civil War are you imagining? Old School 1860s' US Civil War, Blue vs. Grey, battle lines and artillery? Bosnian 1990s civil war, with neighbor killing neighbor, snipers at the supermarket, and all that fun? Rwanda 1990s, Hutu vs. Tutsi, Bernie Bros killing off Biden supporters who themselves are hunting down the Warrenite defectors?
happystuff
6-29-20, 3:10pm
Things are changing all over. The Simple Living Forum is definitely not as nice or as fun as it used to be. But, like everything everywhere, things always continue to change and, there is hope.
frugal-one
6-29-20, 3:54pm
I think you're throwing blame where it doesn't belong. I'm assuming your activism is focused on making things better for minorities, although you haven't said, and if that's the case you should lay the blame squarely on the one institution which has worked for centuries to keep minorities "in their place", that being the Democratic Party.
If you're not addressing the root cause of virtually all prejudice and simply engaging in street theater ending in disruption and property damage you're not really engaging in activisim, that's something else entirely.
You got that backwards. Republicans are for big business. Hey, trump just posted a video of a guy saying "white power." Democrats are for the average, little guy.
https://www.enkivillage.org/differences-between-democrats-and-republicans.html
Teacher Terry
6-29-20, 4:02pm
Mexico is the last place I would go. Talk about unsafe. If the cartels don’t kill you the corrupt cops will.
The Simple Living Forum is definitely not as nice or as fun as it used to be.
Agreed. A number of the nicer folks have been run off or left on their own. I notice a number of newbies don't tend to hang around for long. Makes me sad. I miss a number of old posters like Stella and Mrs M, but yes things always change and perhaps we will get some new folks who will stick around.
You got that backwards. Republicans are for big business. Hey, trump just posted a video of a guy saying "white power." Democrats are for the average, little guy.It seems odd to me that the more liberal among us, mainly Democrats, are in the midst of an all out effort to erase history, change names and impose sanctions on those deemed heretical while simultaneously ignoring the largest and most influential organization ever to impose its destructive will on minorities, the Democratic Party.
I guess it shows the value of re-branding such as convincing it's members that their Planned Parenthood eugenics efforts are actually helpful to women and that the unborn are just tissue, that trapping minorities into a lifetime of poverty on the government dole is helping them since they're incapable of helping themselves, that all police are murderers and all Republicans are racist and that the violent destruction of cities and neighborhoods is a natural reaction to something other than the subjugation those liberal policies have created.
I think that if Rob is serious about his "activism" he should direct it to the source of the problem, but I'll not hold my breath.
Things are changing all over. The Simple Living Forum is definitely not as nice or as fun as it used to be. But, like everything everywhere, things always continue to change and, there is hope.
We’ve got members who are on the left fervently hoping those on the right get the stupid plague. Cheering for it.
ApatheticNoMore
6-29-20, 6:07pm
And if you think hoping changes things you might be in the wishful thinking community. And if you think wearing or not wearing a mask changes things you may be in the reality based community.
happystuff
6-29-20, 6:12pm
We’ve got members who are on the left fervently hoping those on the right get the stupid plague. Cheering for it.
And vice versa, I would hazard a guess.
But the plague doesn't care one side from the other; it simply infects. And hate doesn't care either; it simply blinds and deafens.
No one here who is on the right has come out and actually posted that, not that I’ve seen.
We’ve got members who are on the left fervently hoping those on the right get the stupid plague. Cheering for it.
Having seen the current plague first hand, I wouldn't wish it upon anyone.
happystuff
6-29-20, 6:26pm
No one here who is on the right has come out and actually posted that, not that I’ve seen.
Not posting it doesn't necessarily mean that the "fervently hoping" isn't there - lol.
happystuff
6-29-20, 6:27pm
Having seen the current plague first hand, I wouldn't wish it upon anyone.
+1
Teacher Terry
6-29-20, 7:05pm
First of all PP provides birth control to women that need it and may not be able to afford it. The rich have always had abortions. It’s only the middle class and poor that have been denied. My mom always said if men got pregnant abortions would be a god given right. Alan, you want to decide for women what rights they should have. Women get raped and do end up pregnant. Women suffer a lifetime for a man’s crime. I don’t think we should be erasing history and it would certainly be better to work together on issues around the statutes. Perhaps a museum for them. My mom remembered a time when there were no safety nets and said it wasn’t pretty.
happystuff
6-29-20, 7:18pm
First of all PP provides birth control to women that need it and may not be able to afford it. The rich have always had abortions. It’s only the middle class and poor that have been denied. My mom always said if men got pregnant abortions would be a god given right. Alan, you want to decide for women what rights they should have. Women get raped and do end up pregnant. Women suffer a lifetime for a man’s crime. I don’t think we should be erasing history and it would certainly be better to work together on issues around the statutes. Perhaps a museum for them. My mom remembered a time when there were no safety nets and said it wasn’t pretty.
Agree.
How about women wouldn't be faced with unplanned pregnancies if men kept it in their pants! Men seem to forget that it takes TWO to create, but the woman is the one that must deal with a pregnancy - wanted or not. Until it is YOU (a male) up on that examination table with YOUR legs spread in the stirrups, faced with all the uncertainty, why don't you let the woman who ends up there do what SHE thinks is best for herself!
Edited to add: And wasn't there a male birth control pill developed? I thought there had been many years ago, but men just didn't want to "deal" with remembering to take it, or with side-effects, etc.
Alan, you want to decide for women what rights they should have. Not really, that's well above my pay grade. I was simply pointing out the hypocrisy of groups whose goal seems to be cancelling any and all suspected of historical insensitivity while ignoring their favorites, Planned Parenthood being one of them.
Margaret Sanger was a racist who believed in advancing the custom of eugenics and the offspring of her efforts, PP, continues much of her work today under the guise of women's health.
If anyone else has written the following, they would not be canonized the way Margaret Sanger has been.
In the early history of the race….The weak died early or were killed. Today, however, civilization has brought sympathy, pity, tenderness and other lofty and worthy sentiments, which interfere with the law of natural selection. We are now in a state where our charities, our compensation acts, our pensions, hospitals and even our drainage and sanitary equipment all tend to keep alive the sickly and weak, who are allowed to propagate and in turn produce a race of degenerates (Margaret Sanger. “Birth Control and Women’s Health.” Birth Control Review, Volume I, Number 12 [December 1917], page 7.)
Until it is YOU (a male) up on that examination table with YOUR legs spread in the stirrups, faced with all the uncertainty, why don't you let the woman who ends up there do what SHE thinks is best for herself!She always should, but we shouldn't forget there's another life involved. It seems we have.
Edited to add: And wasn't there a male birth control pill developed? I thought there had been many years ago, but men just didn't want to "deal" with remembering to take it, or with side-effects, etc.I have no knowledge of that, although I did have a vasectomy about 35 years ago. I'm pretty sure I'm not the only man who's done so.
happystuff
6-29-20, 7:49pm
I was simply pointing out the hypocrisy of groups whose goal seems to be cancelling any and all suspected of historical insensitivity while ignoring their favorites, Planned Parenthood being one of them.
I, personally, don't see the hypocrisy. The "history" can go into museums - halls of history. Planned Parenthood of TODAY is not the historical beast you seem to be making it out to be. Have you ever gone to PP? Have you ever looked into and/or used the services they offer? I have. (And, not that it is any of your business - it had nothing to do with abortion whatsoever!)
happystuff
6-29-20, 7:54pm
She always should, but we shouldn't forget there's another life involved. It seems we have.
I have no knowledge of that, although I did have a vasectomy about 35 years ago. I'm pretty sure I'm not the only man who's done so.
Yes, some folks have forgotten, but thank goodness DNA tests are now more reliable and available making it easier to make the folks who want to forget actually remember their responsibilities.
As for the vasectomy, it stands right beside the many women who have had their tubes tied.
frugal-one
6-29-20, 9:20pm
It seems odd to me that the more liberal among us, mainly Democrats, are in the midst of an all out effort to erase history, change names and impose sanctions on those deemed heretical while simultaneously ignoring the largest and most influential organization ever to impose its destructive will on minorities, the Democratic Party.
I guess it shows the value of re-branding such as convincing it's members that their Planned Parenthood eugenics efforts are actually helpful to women and that the unborn are just tissue, that trapping minorities into a lifetime of poverty on the government dole is helping them since they're incapable of helping themselves, that all police are murderers and all Republicans are racist and that the violent destruction of cities and neighborhoods is a natural reaction to something other than the subjugation those liberal policies have created.
I think that if Rob is serious about his "activism" he should direct it to the source of the problem, but I'll not hold my breath.
Alan.. previous post.... "one institution which has worked for centuries to keep minorities "in their place" ==== trump and immigrants at the border is a good example today of an institution keeping minorities "in their place." How many are still in cells?
PP has it's place. I, personally, could never have had an abortion BUT I do not think I have a right to tell another woman what to do with her life or her body. Republicans don't want abortions but do not want to help women who keep their children... you call it being on the government dole. This is, in effect, keeping them in poverty. As far as the destruction going on now in cities... I don't think any one political party is to blame. Damage has been done by both parties. I also think the destruction is way overboard and not necessarily about the cause. And, I believe, as you do, that we need police. As with any occupation, there are bad actors and racists. The assumption that all police are bad is not realistic IMO.
Margaret Sanger was a racist who believed in advancing the custom of eugenics and the offspring of her efforts, PP, continues much of her work today under the guise of women's health.
Is Planned Parenthood involved in a program of eugenics today? What are they up to?
Is Planned Parenthood involved in a program of eugenics today? What are they up to?
As I mentioned earlier I believe they've re-branded themselves in hopes of eliminating the stain of their earliest goals of preventing the poor and "unfit" from procreating, but the result remains the same.
iris lilies
6-29-20, 11:28pm
[QUOTE=bae;356586]Is Planned Parenthood involved in a program of eugenics today? What are they up to?[/
https://www.guttmacher.org/gpr/2008/08/abortion-and-women-color-bigger-picture (https://www.guttmacher.org/gpr/2008/08/abortion-and-women-color-bigger-picture)
This is an interesting article that touches on black eugenics.
Teacher Terry
6-30-20, 12:05am
I could never have a abortion but I cannot tell others what to do. Not everyone has a awesome family to help with a unwanted pregnancy.
happystuff
6-30-20, 9:14am
Personally, I think boys/men should be taught and held responsible for their own sperm. After all, if they don't put it into a woman who didn't want to be pregnant in the first place, there would be no unwanted pregnancies. Unprotected sex? Men have a responsibility to just say "no" and/or do their part to prevent a pregnancy when one is not wanted, be that by the use of male birth control or abstinence.
I, personally, don't see the hypocrisy.
The hypocrisy is that the protests and cancel culture focus will pass over those institutions and leave them unscathed. That also shows that the protests and "activism" we're seeing is simply street theater that should not be condoned by rational people.
happystuff
6-30-20, 11:00am
The hypocrisy is that the protests and cancel culture focus will pass over those institutions and leave them unscathed. That also shows that the protests and "activism" we're seeing is simply street theater that should not be condoned by rational people.
And I disagree. I think the institutions will not be totally passed over and left unscathed. The removal of some statues - regardless of how - has already shown that. Simply with the removal of the symbols, the institutions are not being "passed over" nor have they remain unscathed. It may be a slow process, but it has started. And, while you may view it as street theater, there are plenty of rational people who do not view it as such.
I don’t think this period will be remembered as a period of profound change. It will be remembered as a silly period at the start of a long secular decline. Seattle’s “Escape from New York” experiment in civic irresponsibility will provide images for the textbooks; as will the various soi-disant revolutionaries vandalizing anything in a frock coat.
A marriage of the politics of disdain with cancel culture into Soviet-style denunciations seems to be destroying innocent lives at whim, which is a little darker than the normal scandal-mongering. And of course Trump.
But at most, institutions will be fine-tuned in their public relations efforts.
Teacher Terry
7-1-20, 12:03am
I hope this is a period of profound change for our country. I really hope that racism and income inequality gets addressed.
I hope this is a period of profound change for our country. I really hope that racism and income inequality gets addressed.
I agree. It's in the hands of younger generations.
Yeah, Margaret Sanger believed in Eugenics. And the Republican party used to be progressive. Things change.
gimmethesimplelife
7-1-20, 11:50am
I agree. It's in the hands of younger generations.
Yeah, Margaret Sanger believed in Eugenics. And the Republican party used to be progressive. Things change.It really looks as if Arizona of all places is flipping blue. What a wonderful time to live in the 85006 and be alive! Rob
gimmethesimplelife
7-1-20, 11:52am
Things are changing all over. The Simple Living Forum is definitely not as nice or as fun as it used to be. But, like everything everywhere, things always continue to change and, there is hope.This forum used to have a much lighter tone. I do miss that. Rob
gimmethesimplelife
7-1-20, 11:56am
so, when the Civil War comes, I have so many questions about your role in it.
But first of all, so will that event cause you to abandon your mother? Because you said she is the reason why you’ve not moved out of the country already.
But I don’t understand if there is a Civil War (and I’m vague about what all that means and don’t really want to explore it) why wouldn’t you stick around to be an activist for your side, whatever that might be?IL, I don't know that Civil War is coming. I do believe it's possible based on rampant inequality and government incompetence/abuse. There is a marked increase in anger out there and for once, a fairer share of said anger is being directed towatds America. 'Bout time. Rob
happystuff
7-1-20, 11:57am
This forum used to have a much lighter tone. I do miss that. Rob
I can't remember if it was on the original forum or here, that the Public Policy forum was started just to sort of "contain" the - shall we say, less friendly(?) - types of discussions that are now all over the place. It was easy to avoid a specific forum, now the discussions are not always what the titles may imply - LOL. Again, things change all the time.
That's so true, Happystuff. You can't just stay off Public Policy and avoid the unfriendly posts anymore, like the old days.
That's so true, Happystuff. You can't just stay off Public Policy and avoid the unfriendly posts anymore, like the old days.
It is the trump-era. Things were more genteel prior to his rhetoric. Now anything goes whether true or not.
It is the trump-era. Things were more genteel prior to his rhetoric. Now anything goes whether true or not.
Things - AND PEOPLE - were more genteel and definitely seemed less hate-filled/hateful. I miss the days of simple kindness and politeness.
ApatheticNoMore
7-1-20, 2:24pm
It's perceived (and this is not entirely wrong) as life and death for many people now. And even if that's always true for some, or some people living half a world away, it's now true for many.
Especially with a pandemic raging and out of control in the U.S., which causes as pandemics tend to do: Death. So life and death for oneself and people one loves. One can argue the degree this is true of the pandemic, and that's arguing the probable death and disability rate, ultimately in the end an empirical matter but we don't have all the info and anyway statistics say nothing about individuals. So those are what can be seen as the stakes.
I can remember some pretty heated exchanges in years past. Remember Billy Bare Butt? Half the time I couldn’t figure out why he was so outraged.
And I forget the name of the lady who was so angry at the ASSCLOWN REPUBLICANS that she pretty much lived with the caps-lock key down.
But I do think it’s true that the political has seemed to become personal for many of us lately; perhaps to an extent that is both sad and a little funny.
I can remember some pretty heated exchanges in years past. Remember Billy Bare Butt? Half the time I couldn’t figure out why he was so outraged.
And I forget the name of the lady who was so angry at the ASSCLOWN REPUBLICANS that she pretty much lived with the caps-lock key down.
But I do think it’s true that the political has seemed to become personal for many of us lately; perhaps to an extent that is both sad and a little funny.
I see nothing funny. I would appreciate a laugh... enlighten me!
iris lilies
7-1-20, 4:52pm
I can remember some pretty heated exchanges in years past. Remember Billy Bare Butt? Half the time I couldn’t figure out why he was so outraged.
He was angry in sympathy for the boobies of the world! Boobies should be free! They should not be contained in bras or other binding pieces of clothing.
He was angry in sympathy for the boobies of the world! Boobies should be free! They should not be contained in bras or other binding pieces of clothing.He went away and then came back with another name which escapes me now. In his second identity nudism was more of a sideline but hating Republicans was a full time vocation.
Edited to add: Just remembered his second name, ELADP
I can remember some pretty heated exchanges in years past. Remember Billy Bare Butt? Half the time I couldn’t figure out why he was so outraged.
And I forget the name of the lady who was so angry at the ASSCLOWN REPUBLICANS that she pretty much lived with the caps-lock key down.
But I do think it’s true that the political has seemed to become personal for many of us lately; perhaps to an extent that is both sad and a little funny.
Yes, but didn't he stay mainly in the Politics forum? I remember he was easily ignored by avoiding specific forums.
iris lilies
7-2-20, 8:44am
He went away and then came back with another name which escapes me now. In his second identity nudism was more of a sideline but hating Republicans was a full time vocation.
Edited to add: Just remembered his second name, ELADP
i remember, and you convinced me he was BB.
BB v.1 was a happier fellow.
I would imagine BB has died of apoplexy due to Donald Trump’s shenanigans.
I see nothing funny. I would appreciate a laugh... enlighten me!
Humor is subjective, but I have always found dudgeon to be funny. And there is something in me that enjoys watching people pour all their energy into an attempt at withering scorn.
Yes, but didn't he stay mainly in the Politics forum? I remember he was easily ignored by avoiding specific forums.
I remember he had an great reverence for land grant universities.
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