"You missed your calling!"

[catherine]

The title of this thread is sometimes what we tell people jokingly if they present you some ability that they haven't shown before. Usually it's said tongue-in-cheek.

Sometimes missing your calling be a cause for grief. My MIL, who became a retail worker's union leader in. her mid-sixties loved it with a passion, and after she retired 7 years later, she told me, "I had a wasted life" meaning, she could have pursued her passion earlier, but she repressed her ambitions because she thought it would have hurt her family life.

I remember an incident that must have been many years ago, when my one of my favorite aunts was taking me to lunch and we were chatting about life, and she said, "I want to figure out what I want to do with my life." She was 70 at the time, and I was maybe 50 or so and I remember thinking to myself "You better hurry up!" She had given up a nursing career to raise her family.

Yesterday, I watched for the second time the movie Finding Joe--a documentary about Joseph Campbell (full movie on YouTube here (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s8nFACrLxr0)), who I LOVE. The documentary goes through his description and examples of the Hero's Journey and the whole idea of his famous quote: "Follow Your Bliss"

So, my question is:
Where are you with your calling?
Have you followed your bliss?
How has living a simple life helped/hindered that?
Do feel you are still listening for your calling?

If you truly followed your bliss, where would that take you? What unfinished business do you feel you have in terms of living your own unique life?

[happystuff]

Very interesting questions and definitely food for thought. For me, these questions would be so much easier to answer if I lived alone - with no immediate family or responsibilities to others. I wanted children and more often than not, the decisions I made in life - and with regard to my own life - have been made with children and family in mind. Would they have been the same decisions had I been alone? In some instances, definitely not. Do I regret the decisions I have made? No. While I may not be living the life the teenage/young adult "me" had thought about living, I can honestly say that I have experienced things above and beyond what that young woman ever conceived!

Edited to add: I don't think I have missed my calling, but rather I think my calling has changed - and continues to change - as I, myself, continue to change.

[herbgeek]

I'm still looking for my calling.

The first part of my life was preparing to be financially independent so I could do something else. Now that I'm there, I'm still figuring out what exactly that should be.

I liked science and math, so engineering was a way to make a decent amount of money in an interesting way. I was slightly above average in engineering, and I think better than average at the people and project management, but it wasn't a calling in the sense that I would have continued to do that even if I wasn't being paid, though I have done some volunteer project management projects (organizing conferences and the like)

I need to figure out how to use all these dilettante skills I have in a way that feels satisfying to me. How do I combine interests in data analysis, herb gardening, hiking, visiting new places, trying new foods, knitting, learning, analyzing patterns, organizing, creating work breakdown structures, mentoring younger people, with my general laziness and tendency to want to move on to other things just as I start to get accomplished at something?

[catherine]

I'm still looking for my calling.


I need to figure out how to use all these dilettante skills I have in a way that feels satisfying to me. How do I combine interests in data analysis, herb gardening, hiking, visiting new places, trying new foods, knitting, learning, analyzing patterns, organizing, creating work breakdown structures, mentoring younger people, with my general laziness and tendency to want to move on to other things just as I start to get accomplished at something?

Wow! Did I relate to that! You put my current dilemma in a nutshell (especially the general laziness and tendency to want to move on to other things!). In fact, after DD's wedding, I decided to put my life in "life, edited" mode to see if I could create a void whereby SOMETHING would float to the top in terms of what I really yearn for. I'm cutting out all urges to go off in a random direction and just be still more often.

[JaneV2.0]

I'm still looking for my calling.

The first part of my life was preparing to be financially independent so I could do something else. Now that I'm there, I'm still figuring out what exactly that should be.

I liked science and math, so engineering was a way to make a decent amount of money in an interesting way. I was slightly above average in engineering, and I think better than average at the people and project management, but it wasn't a calling in the sense that I would have continued to do that even if I wasn't being paid, though I have done some volunteer project management projects (organizing conferences and the like)

I need to figure out how to use all these dilettante skills I have in a way that feels satisfying to me. How do I combine interests in data analysis, herb gardening, hiking, visiting new places, trying new foods, knitting, learning, analyzing patterns, organizing, creating work breakdown structures, mentoring younger people, with my general laziness and tendency to want to move on to other things just as I start to get accomplished at something?

At the point where I survey all the possibilities available to me, I usually give up and take a nap. I could have been a lot of things, but my general lack of drive and focus put paid to them all. "...tendency to want to move on to other things just as I start to get accomplished at something"--is exactly how my dear departed SO described me more than once. Maybe next time around, I'll get it right.

[iris lilies]

I didn’t have children purposely because they were not attractive to me. What was attractive to me was living a self actualized life. I completely understand that self actualization may or may not include children, it depends on the person.


But I will offer this as something to consider: people, usually women, substitute having children for doing the hard work of determining their bliss and following it.It is more of a well worn path to take the path of children, and then look back at what could have been.

I often make analogy to children and pets because that is my reality. And yes, there have been times when pets stop me from doing a Big Life thing. One time was many decades ago when we first got married and we were without pets at that moment. I always been interested in the Peace Corps and DH would’ve been able to get in like Flynn because they always want Aggie guys. So we went to an introductory presentation on joining the Peace Corps on the University Aggie campus. We didn’t pursue it but it was interesting, And later opportunities didn’t come up because we ended up with pets. Another time more recently was when my dog Teddy Bear died and we were without dogs and had only one remaining ancient cat who wasn’t going to last much longer. That’s when we could’veMade a series of overseas trips but then Covid hit and we added in a bunch of dogs and here we are. Now I won’t leave more than a couple weeks at a time.

[ApatheticNoMore]

Yea if you have an obvious calling follow it. But mostly I would advise a younger me/maybe a younger nearly anyone to not invest so much importance and calling in work, not expect to find *purpose* that way. It will very rarely fulfill it, it's a misdirection, a waste of resources and energy, very few people will find a calling in it, most work is fairly mundane, you might have some aptitude for it though. I mean I can understand how it is kind of what I was raised to believe, but by unfulfilled people anyway (mom was unfulfilled as a mother and uh I don't know what you do then, it affects the child for life, I mean there was palpable resentment).

I think a big problem with me is I have always been a fairly conservative person. Don't laugh. I mean politically I may be anything but and even utopian occasionally, but I mean at a much deeper level than that. I think life should somehow be lived "just so" (or else?). Whether or not my "just so" is someone's else "just so" is neither here nor there, but it's conventional in it's way. And if I thought more outside the box in terms of lifestyle options, I might have found more bliss and happiness really, but life has to be lived "just so" see.

And the thing about bliss is I was raised to see life as anything but following one's bliss, eh I'm not sure that being raised to see life as just about bliss is realistic of course, but kind of all that mattered was doing the right thing.

[happystuff]

But I will offer this as something to consider: people, usually women, substitute having children for doing the hard work of determining their bliss and following it.It is more of a well worn path to take the path of children, and then look back at what could have been.

I agree that this may be true for some. Not me, but for some.

The only thing "looking back" has every really done for me has been to show me how/where I am now. "Woulda, shoulda, coulda" may be a fun game to play, but the reality is that my life, the way it is now, is because of the decisions I have made - and I am confident that those decisions have been the BEST decisions for me at the time I needed to make them. :)

[Teacher Terry]

I feel lucky in that I was able to have kids, go to college for 4 degrees and have 3 careers I loved. The first was social work, the second was as a vocational evaluator and my retirement job teaching. No regrets at all. Living below my means made all that possible.

[iris lilies]

Yes, Living simply and saving a lot of money always made me feel like I had many choices in life and even though I didn’t do anything very exotic, I always knew that I COULD if I wanted to being mostly unencumbered with family obligation. But of course there were always those pets!

[iris lilies]

I agree that this may be true for some. Not me, but for some.

The only thing "looking back" has every really done for me has been to show me how/where I am now. "Woulda, shoulda, coulda" may be a fun game to play, but the reality is that my life, the way it is now, is because of the decisions I have made - and I am confident that those decisions have been the BEST decisions for me at the time I needed to make them. :)

When I look back at life pathways, I never regret taking the path I took. I do, however see the other path and I can see how that could’ve gone well too. I guess I’m lucky in that I always had opportunities where choice A or choice B either one was a pretty good choice.

[JaneV2.0]

Yea if you have an obvious calling follow it. But mostly I would advise a younger me/maybe a younger nearly anyone to not invest so much importance and calling in work, not expect to find *purpose* that way. It will very rarely fulfill it, it's a misdirection, a waste of resources and energy, very few people will find a calling in it, most work is fairly mundane, you might have some aptitude for it though. I mean I can understand how it is kind of what I was raised to believe, but by unfulfilled people anyway (mom was unfulfilled as a mother and uh I don't know what you do then, it affects the child for life, I mean there was palpable resentment). ...

And the thing about bliss is I was raised to see life as anything but following one's bliss, eh I'm not sure that being raised to see life as just about bliss is realistic of course, but kind of all that mattered was doing the right thing.

I agree. For most of us, paid employment is just a ball and chain--unless you're very lucky.
Like IrisLily, I never had the slightest interest in having children, and like ANM, I never got the idea that life was anything about one's "bliss."
I've managed to make a fairly comfortable life for myself, but have no idea what my purpose, if any, might be. I am, however, glad to be here.

[iris lilies]

Well again I am fortunate because I understood from the beginning that life is primarily about following your bliss. That’s what it’s about. And I was lucky because I was super engaged with my work. Until I wasn’t. And then I retired.

[pinkytoe]

I am one of those who still doesn't know what I want to be when I grow up. I never could make a living at the things I was good at (art/design) or the things I love to do (gardening) yet they remain passionate hobbies. In the end, my most satisfying "work" has been raising a child who has turned into a happy, responsible human now raising her own children. My paying job as a university executive assistant fulfilled my love of organizing and planning, allowed me to be around very interesting people/research and has provided me with a good retirement so no regrets really. As I get older, I often think that we all take ourselves way too seriously. A contented life with simple pleasures is all that matters now.

[LDAHL]

Bliss, smiss. I think worrying about whether you’re living your best life is a pretty good way to stay miserable. Plan, sure; but expect to be the butt of a few cosmic jokes along the way. Happiness sneaks up and ambushes you. You don’t hunt it down.

Within reason, I say follow the money and the good stuff comes or it doesn’t in due course, but you will at least have some money. I don’t care how many time PBS airs it. We ain’t heroes and this ain’t a journey.

[happystuff]

Bliss, smiss. I think worrying about whether you’re living your best life is a pretty good way to stay miserable. Plan, sure; but expect to be the butt of a few cosmic jokes along the way. Happiness sneaks up and ambushes you. You don’t hunt it down.

Within reason, I say follow the money and the good stuff comes or it doesn’t in due course, but you will at least have some money. I don’t care how many time PBS airs it. We ain’t heroes and this ain’t a journey.

Disagree with this on so many levels, but if it works for you - yay!

[catherine]

Within reason, I say follow the money and the good stuff comes or it doesn’t in due course, but you will at least have some money. I don’t care how many time PBS airs it. We ain’t heroes and this ain’t a journey.

I couldn't disagree with you more. We get one shot at life. I agree that happiness is something that is not to "pursued" but rather is the result of being grateful and content with what you have. But... to "spend your life doing mundane work as a cog in the wheel and at the end at least you have money"?... that's not how I see it.

I think we ARE heroes. Life IS a journey. Why are we so drawn in by stories like Greek myths, and Superman, and Star Wars, and the Wizard of Oz? We are on our own paths and we strive to see ourselves in Luke Skywalker and Dorothy, and isn't it better to be on our own paths than someone else's?

And taking the journey towards the life I am called to do excites me.. there is NOTHING miserable about the prospect. As Helen Keller said, "Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."

I've had a few adventures and I've had to slay a few dragons, but I wouldn't mind another 3rd act trip into the unknown. I can't pack my suitcase fast enough. There is just so much to do!

[happystuff]

I think we ARE heroes.

This reminded me of a line from one of my favorite songs:

"And heroes don't look like they used to
They look like you do"


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9tXzlVjU1xs

[ApatheticNoMore]

If you have to see yourself as a hero very well, get on with that. But yea it strikes me as pretty pretentious most of the time as well. I'm not all about money, but I do appreciate money more with time, but maybe that has to do with getting singed a few times by jobs and the job market and the harshness of it all.

(Meanwhile Hellen Keller's shrink tells her she has an issue with black and white thinking.)

[happystuff]

If you have to see yourself as a hero very well, get on with that.

Speaking only for myself, I don't see myself as a hero... I see others as heroes.

Whether you see yourself as a hero or not, someone else may see you as one. :)

[Tybee]

I can think of several heroic people I have known, and they were all quite modest and self-effacing. I guess I perceived them as heroic because they did courageous things, often at great personal cost.

[catherine]

I can think of several heroic people I have known, and they were all quite modest and self-effacing. I guess I perceived them as heroic because they did courageous things, often at great personal cost.

Yes, that's it... I think the heroes are the people who push through fear and fight whatever the battle may be with no thought of self. The idea of following a calling sometimes involves personal sacrifice. And I'm not talking "let's build a statue in the town square" heroics. It can be the heroics of simply being ourselves and standing up for that. It can be the transgender person whose parents shut them out; it can be person whose parents pay for 3 years of Stanford for them to be a lawyer or doctor, but they quit just before graduation so they can become a farmer or a photographer. It can be the person who is completely comfortable but disrupts their comfort zone because they have a weird sense there's "something more" out there for them.

[razz]

To the original post of this thread, yes I have lived my calling.
*I wanted a farm from age 10 and experienced owning two. The first was expropriated giving us a substantial financial boost. The last was a dream come true. until my DH passed and it became time to move into the next adventure of my life.
* I wanted to be a lawyer advocating for children but recognized that I was way too immature and poor to do that but ended up advocating for change in oral health care, both legally and practically, for all ages which satisfied that wish to make a difference.
* I wanted children and had two who are delightful adults with good marriages and securely employed.
* I was iffy about a husband. I was too independent in my thinking to want anything less than a full partner in owning a farm. Fortunately, I met this smart remarkable man who became my best friend and willing to try adventures in life including the farming on a part-time basis. I learned so much from him.

As far as simple living impacting my life, DH was emphatic on living within our means so we developed the skills to do most things ourselves and now I am enjoying the results of our joint thrift and investments.
I have traveled most continents in the world, driven across Canada but still have to go to the North West Territories as called under its old name.
I am grateful for so many things and even with Covid find myself just enjoying a very simple but satisfying life. I like people, my privacy, my little beagle, my little house and have enough to satisfy my curiosity each day.
There were peaks and valleys along the way but no significant regrets. Probably my bliss could be described as living life to its fullest and I am doing that.

[catherine]

To the original post of this thread, yes I have lived my calling.
*I wanted a farm from age 10 and experienced owning two. The first was expropriated giving us a substantial financial boost. The last was a dream come true. until my DH passed and it became time to move into the next adventure of my life.
* I wanted to be a lawyer advocating for children but recognized that I was way too immature and poor to do that but ended up advocating for change in oral health care, both legally and practically, for all ages which satisfied that wish to make a difference.
* I wanted children and had two who are delightful adults with good marriages and securely employed.
* I was iffy about a husband. I was too independent in my thinking to want anything less than a full partner in owning a farm. Fortunately, I met this smart remarkable man who became my best friend and willing to try adventures in life including the farming on a part-time basis. I learned so much from him.

As far as simple living impacting my life, DH was emphatic on living within our means so we developed the skills to do most things ourselves and now I am enjoying the results of our joint thrift and investments.
I have traveled most continents in the world, driven across Canada but still have to go to the North West Territories as called under its old name.
I am grateful for so many things and even with Covid find myself just enjoying a very simple but satisfying life. I like people, my privacy, my little beagle, my little house and have enough to satisfy my curiosity each day.
There were peaks and valleys along the way but no significant regrets. Probably my bliss could be described as living life to its fullest and I am doing that.

Thanks, razz.. Perfect. Great examples.

[Yppej]

I like the existentialist idea that there is no inherent meaning or purpose in life, the meaning is what you make it. So rather than some grand cosmic meaning my purpose is to do the best I can in the circumstances fate has placed me in with grace and equanimity, and to be of service to those who are in my path, most especially those whose welfare I am responsible for. It"s not about self-actualization.

[iris lilies]

I like the existentialist idea that there is no inherent meaning or purpose in life, the meaning is what you make it. So rather than some grand cosmic meaning my purpose is to do the best I can in the circumstances fate has placed me in with grace and equanimity, and to be of service to those who are in my path, most especially those whose welfare I am responsible for. It"s not about self-actualization.

These are not mutually exclusive concepts: self actualization and service to the world/others.

Following one’s bliss may not include service to others, though. But it might.

[catherine]

the meaning is what you make it. ....It"s not about self-actualization.

Aren't those two concepts similar?

BTW, coincidentally I just read this:

“Man’s ideal state is realized when he has fulfilled the purpose for which he is born. And what is it that reason demands of him? Something very easy—that he live in accordance with his own nature.” -- Seneca

[Yppej]

Aren't those two concepts similar?

BTW, coincidentally I just read this:

“Man’s ideal state is realized when he has fulfilled the purpose for which he is born. And what is it that reason demands of him? Something very easy—that he live in accordance with his own nature.” -- Seneca

The first is the attitude you bring, or endurance, to circumstances not of your choosing.

The second is being able to alter circumstances because you possess power. I see self-actualization as largely something privileged people get to pursue. Yes, I get some pockets of agency, but not the whole trajectory of my life. Though privileged people can also have wrenches thrown in their paths like a fatal illness that keep them from achieving self-actualization.

[iris lilies]

I agree with Jeppy that self actualization is pretty much something that privileged people get to pursue. It is a privilege to not be terrifically constrained by circumstances of your life

[frugal-one]

What about preparation meets opportunity? I know I sent out hundreds of resumes and went on MANY MANY interviews. Then, when I got a good job, I was told I was lucky. Sometimes you make your own luck and it is NOT privilege but hard work! Granted there are sometimes things out of your control but many times it is easier for someone to take the easy road and attribute success of others to luck or privilege.

[iris lilies]

What about preparation meets opportunity? I know I sent out hundreds of resumes and went on MANY MANY interviews. Then, when I got a good job, I was told I was lucky. Sometimes you make your own luck and it is NOT privilege but hard work! Granted there are sometimes things out of your control but many times it is easier for someone to take the easy road and attribute success of others to luck or privilege.

I think there’s a difference between luck and privilege. Did we actually talk about the word lucky?


Does it bother you to be called privileged? If so, why?

[catherine]

The first is the attitude you bring, or endurance, to circumstances not of your choosing.

The second is being able to alter circumstances because you possess power. I see self-actualization as largely something privileged people get to pursue. Yes, I get some pockets of agency, but not the whole trajectory of my life. Though privileged people can also have wrenches thrown in their paths like a fatal illness that keep them from achieving self-actualization.

Well, I can see your point, given that Maslow himself said that survival needs have to be addressed first before you can start self-actualizing. When I had 4 kids and was in the crapper constantly and our house was forceclosed on and the first thing I did when I walked in the door after retiring every night from my low-paying job was to flick the light switch to see if the the power was still on... I admit, self-actualization was the furthest thing from my mind. My "bliss" was getting 5 minutes by myself in the bathroom.

But I was just waiting for those bad times to pass by so that I could pursue whatever I was meant to do. Self-actualization was always an aspiration.

[LDAHL]

I think there’s a difference between luck and privilege. Did we actually talk about the word lucky?


Does it bother you to be called privileged? If so, why?

I was born in Chicago instead of Chongqing. That was luck. I can say whatever I please in public. That is privilege. I don’t especially object to either term, although when people use “privilege”, they seem to be either trying to minimize some accomplishment, seek to create some level of guilt-fueled obligation, or excuse some difference in performance.

I think privilege does exist in the Chelsea Clinton or Hunter Biden sense; but I think it is too often used as some sort of race/class argument. Usually by more affluent white people to demand something from less affluent white people.

[JaneV2.0]

I think privilege does exist in the Chelsea Clinton or Hunter Biden sense; but I think it is too often used as some sort of race/class argument. Usually by more affluent white people to demand something from less affluent white people.

So privilege is only a Democratic attribute? Got it.
(If ever there were a useless clot of privileged protoplasm, it's Trump's offspring, plus Jared, IMO.)

[LDAHL]

I think privilege does exist in the Chelsea Clinton or Hunter Biden sense; but I think it is too often used as some sort of race/class argument. Usually by more affluent white people to demand something from less affluent white people.

So privilege is only a Democratic attribute? Got it.
(If ever there were a useless clot of privileged protoplasm, it's Trump's offspring, plus Jared, IMO.)

Fine. In the Ivanka Trump sense as well. I don’t think privilege is a political leaning thing, except perhaps in the sense that one political sensibility is more inclined to invoke it as an argument.

[Alan]

I think privilege is real but it exists primarily among the very affluent or famous, I think it's silly to attribute it to anything else such as race or gender. It's probably appropriate to use national origin in discussions of privilege since some countries are obviously more affluent than others and every one of us here were lucky enough to be born in one of them. I think LDAHL is right in suggesting that the idea of privilege is mostly used in the United States by affluent white people although I'd add that it may be a coping mechanism used to highlight their feelings of guilt for those less fortunate than themselves, but to me it just comes off as seeing everyone else as victims, incapable of reaching the same level of privilege they enjoy. I think it's a bit demeaning to those they think they're helping.

[ApatheticNoMore]

I think privilege is real but it exists primarily among the very affluent or famous

I think that's what yeppej meant, the ability to entirely set ones course indifferent to economic necessity depends on $$$$$$$, affluence. Not just non-poverty but affluence. And that's what often is pitched as self-actualization. But I don't know that I believe that self-actualization EVEN MATTERS THAT MUCH. Would I take a long lost rich uncle who donated their fortune to me or a winning lottery ticket? well of course. There are probably attributes that come merely from being upper middle class, but not that type of total freedom, I'm not sure freedom is really how it would even be described just more less stress. I'm only ever middle middle class.


I think LDAHL is right in suggesting that the idea of privilege is mostly used in the United States by affluent white people although I'd add that it may be a coping mechanism used to highlight their feelings of guilt for those less fortunate than themselves

to the subset of affluent white people who think about such (and believe me it is a subset because broad social consciousness isn't necessarily their focus) it doesn't necessarily have to have anything to do with guilt, it doesn't have to be all that much of a feeling at all, just an acknowledgement of reality, that they may have been born with or have certain advantages in life.

[LDAHL]

In the current Atlantic, there is a piece on an interesting issue of privilege. Apparently there is an ongoing fight to make English girls eligible for certain hereditary tItles of nobility currently only open to descendants in the male line. Sort of a privilege debate within a privileged caste.

[frugal-one]

I think there’s a difference between luck and privilege. Did we actually talk about the word lucky?


Does it bother you to be called privileged? If so, why?

Reread what I wrote.

[frugal-one]

I, although when people use “privilege”, they seem to be either trying to minimize some accomplishment, seek to create some level of guilt-fueled obligation, or excuse some difference in performance.



That's it exactly. The rest of what you wrote.. not necessarily.

[Tybee]

Thanks for starting this thread, Catherine. It's kind of devolved into a political thing, but that's what people like to fight about here, I guess.

I am having trouble answering the original question, I think because I'm in a difficult place emotionally. This early old age life review can be quite painful. Maybe I'll try again when feeling stronger.

[iris lilies]

That's it exactly.

Yes, I got a sense that you were bothered by being called “privileged. “And as you bolded L dolls words that reinforces my thought.

[frugal-one]

Yes, I got a sense that you were bothered by being called “privileged. “And as you bolded L dolls words that reinforces my thought.

I, personally, have never been called privileged. Ldahl summarized the situation... people do not work or prepare and then because they don't get what they think they deserve.... regard those that get what they desire as privileged. He succinctly described the dilemma.

[ApatheticNoMore]

I am having trouble answering the original question, I think because I'm in a difficult place emotionally. This early old age life review can be quite painful. Maybe I'll try again when feeling stronger.

oh I didn't answer too much, as well mid-life crisis. Although I do in retrospect find work way overrated as a source of meaning (not income ha) and do find much of whatever we are supposed to pursue such as meaning, to be fundamentally meaningless to me.

[iris lilies]

I, personally, have never been called privileged. Ldahl summarized the situation... people do not work or prepare and then because they don't get what they think they deserve.... regard those that get what they desire as privileged. He succinctly described the dilemma.
OK well I’m going to call you privileged. So yeah you’ve been called privileged. So what? It’s just a label. According to our discussion it means several things. Being able to follow our calling is dependant to a large degree on our privilege. That’s what I think. You can argue it and you will and so be it.

And shush, Don’t tell Alan, but I think he is privileged as well.I think most regulars here on this board are privileged. So apparently I define the word differently than some of you, and that is OK I guess.

[JaneV2.0]

From a global perspective, I feel incredibly privileged--and it's not something I need to apologize for, IMO.

[iris lilies]

From a global perspective, I feel incredibly privileged--and it's not something I need to apologize for, IMO.
Agreed, no one has to apologize for privilege at any level. Even Ivanka.

[JaneV2.0]

Most of us in first world countries at the present time are privileged; we can acknowledge that without having to don a hair shirt.

[Tammy]

Almost anyone in America is privileged. It’s ok to admit it. It’s doesn’t say anything bad about us, it’s just the facts.

I think Americans are afraid of admitting we didn’t pull ourselves up with our own bootstraps. Our culture makes us ashamed of receiving help. But somebody changed our diapers and kept us warm and fed ... 😄

[iris lilies]

Almost anyone in America is privileged. It’s ok to admit it. It’s doesn’t say anything bad about us, it’s just the facts.

I think Americans are afraid of admitting we didn’t pull ourselves up with our own bootstraps. Our culture makes us ashamed of receiving help. But somebody changed our diapers and kept us warm and fed ... 

Well when you get into specifics then there’s a whole lot of unequal bootstrapping. For instance, Alan did a far bigger job of bootstrapping than I did, born as I was into middle class land. But then look at him! he’s smarter, better looking, and more talented than me. Those innate traints aint privelege???!?

:)

[frugal-one]

OK well I’m going to call you privileged. So yeah you’ve been called privileged. So what? It’s just a label. According to our discussion it means several things. Being able to follow our calling is dependant to a large degree on our privilege. That’s what I think. You can argue it and you will and so be it.

And shush, Don’t tell Alan, but I think he is privileged as well.I think most regulars here on this board are privileged. So apparently I define the word differently than some of you, and that is OK I guess.

In the scheme of things, it really doesn't matter what you think.... . Although, I consider someone to be privileged if things come easily to them. I may be privileged in the sense that I was born in this country where I have to opportunity to work for the things I want. My statement earlier.... preparation meets opportunity.

[iris lilies]

It really doesn't matter what you think.... after all you listen to Rush.
Does it really matter what any of us think?

[frugal-one]

Does it really matter what any of us think?

Depends on if you respect a person, are in a relationship, or that person has some control of your life (ie boss/supervisor). On this forum... ?

[happystuff]

My statement earlier.... preparation meets opportunity.

In my personal experience, it is/has more often been "introduction meets opportunity" - meaning it's been more often "who you know", not "what you know". To me, that falls into the "privilege" category.

[ApatheticNoMore]

I've gotten a good job 7 times:
- if by job you mean a job (not doing something entirely different 7 times although it's evolved in a lot of different directions - mostly lateral more than advancement frankly)
- and if by good you mean pays adequately and not un-cushy in some ways (if you want to exclude contract work and say jobs with bennies 6 times - contract work is more brutal).

Were some dead-end and mind numbing, were there abusive bosses and coworkers, sure sometimes, not all have been ideal. But I process the hard reality that it's likely going to be a lot harder to get a job if I end up unemployed over 50 or older. Because I met plenty such when unemployed. I keep in touch with people that are always doing contract work as well, it's harsh, endless hustle - but even the security of a full time job only buys you a moment of it, and if pushed back into the contract world, they have a better resume for it than me maybe.

I don't think much of this has anything to do with calling though :)

[rosarugosa]

Sorry if this is thread hijack, but I would like to say something on the subject of privilege. I've long known that I was incredibly fortunate to be born into the time and place that I was, especially being a woman. But it was only a couple of years ago when I really truly realized that if I had been born in certain parts of the world, even today, I would very possibly be illiterate with a passel of kids. I would be an entirely different person than the woman that I am. Not only would college not have been an option, but even graduating high school probably would not have been in the cards (or even going to school at all). And the decision not to have children would never have been mine to make. It really hit my like a punch in the gut that those women I see in pictures on the other side of the world might be just like me, and in fact might have been me, but for the luck of the draw as to where we were born. I mean, I knew that in a superficial sense, but not in a deep down really fathoming the full reality of it kind of sense.
I agree with IL that we here on the Forum are all privileged to a greater or lesser degree.

[razz]

It does matter what you think, a lot!

When someone is under acute distress and a calm caring voice steps up in support.

I had a very tense situation at a Board meeting during a plea for my community that was being denied, another board member watched me and at a key point simply looked directly at me and winked. I calmed down, waited and shortly the chair who was being an *ss was corrected by other board members.

How wonderful it would be if people would think instead of react thoughtlessly.

[happystuff]

Sorry if this is thread hijack, but I would like to say something on the subject of privilege. I've long known that I was incredibly fortunate to be born into the time and place that I was, especially being a woman. But it was only a couple of years ago when I really truly realized that if I had been born in certain parts of the world, even today, I would very possibly be illiterate with a passel of kids. I would be an entirely different person than the woman that I am. Not only would college not have been an option, but even graduating high school probably would not have been in the cards (or even going to school at all). And the decision not to have children would never have been mine to make. It really hit my like a punch in the gut that those women I see in pictures on the other side of the world might be just like me, and in fact might have been me, but for the luck of the draw as to where we were born. I mean, I knew that in a superficial sense, but not in a deep down really fathoming the full reality of it kind of sense.
I agree with IL that we here on the Forum are all privileged to a greater or lesser degree.

I agree, but also believe it's the actual degree in that "to a greater or lesser degree" where the significant differences lie.

[frugal-one]

In my personal experience, it is/has more often been "introduction meets opportunity" - meaning it's been more often "who you know", not "what you know". To me, that falls into the "privilege" category.

If you had not prepared (ie studied etc) you probably would not have succeeded even with an introduction. practice practice practice and then, maybe. And, sure there are those with the gold ring in their nose who are given everything.

[razz]

Rosa, your experience of awareness is similar to mine.
One day, I was reading about a woman's intense gratitude in a refugee camp who had a gallon of safe water delivered daily to her. This one gallon was for all her drinking, cooking and cleaning for the day. She didn't have to risk being assaulted on the way to obtain contaminated water. I walked over to my sink and turned on my tap and the water flowed. Whenever I feel down, deprived or any sense of lack, I walk to the sink and turn on my tap just for moment and am filled with gratitude for my privileged life.

[catherine]

Rosa, your experience of awareness is similar to mine.
One day, I was reading about a woman's intense gratitude in a refugee camp who had a gallon of safe water delivered daily to her. This one gallon was for all her drinking, cooking and cleaning for the day. She didn't have to risk being assaulted on the way to obtain contaminated water. I walked over to my sink and turned on my tap and the water flowed. Whenever I feel down, deprived or any sense of lack, I walk to the sink and turn on my tap just for moment and am filled with gratitude for my privileged life.

Thank you for sharing that.

[jp1]

Getting back to the idea of callings, this guy has found his calling. (yes, I know it's another tiny house video from Kirsten Dirksen...) He built his first tiny home out of necessity. Was good at it. Now he's amazing at it because he runs a company that makes them and has learned from every house he's built. And along the way he self-taught himself CAD software so that he can make even better houses. Truly amazing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TYgbcUbFSk0

Personally I've never had a "calling". There are things I'm good at. I can underwrite cyber insurance on par with anyone in the industry. Had an interesting conversation the other day with a non-insurance friend where she asked for examples of why/how I'm good at it. So I tossed out a few examples of submissions that had come across my desk that day and asked her thoughts on whether I should write them, what I should charge for them, etc. She didn't have a clue for things that are second nature to me. But is it a calling? I don't think so. I don't LOVE doing it. Nor do I hate doing it. I just do it because I'm good at it and get paid decently for my efforts. But I'm not making a difference in the world unless you subscribe to a professional friend's joking comment once when I asked how he was. "I'm fantastic! Doing god's work, transferring risk!" And jokes aside, I suppose he's right. Target's data breach 7 years ago ended up being a $300 million dollar disaster for them. The $100 million of cyber insurance they had didn't save them from bankruptcy, they would have survived without it, but it certainly didn't hurt. And today I imagine they have a much bigger tower of insurance to better weather another disaster. But honestly, I'm just utilizing a skill developed over the past 12 years to get a nice paycheck. And that's ok to me. At least I'm not causing harm in the world either.

[Tammy]

“Where are you with your calling?
Have you followed your bliss?
How has living a simple life helped/hindered that?
Do feel you are still listening for your calling?

If you truly followed your bliss, where would that take you? What unfinished business do you feel you have in terms of living your own unique life?“

I’ve enjoyed reading this thread. It’s an interesting time to think about this, with my unexpected career ending.

The one constant in my life has been that I really like and have empathy for people, but only one at a time and not constantly. I need time alone to recharge.

This translated into enjoying my kids and grandkids, but not really enjoying teaching Sunday school or volunteering for the church nursery. I did those things often because my kids used those services. But I like kids one on one much better.

I find kids under the age of 8-10 absolutely entertaining when they hang out with me as we baked cookies or dug potatoes from the garden. I like working with them and talking with them, not coddling them. They have lots of great questions.

It also translated into coffee or a movie with one friend at a time. Over the years I hosted many parties/barbecues with 30-50 people at my house because that’s my husband’s love. But I didn’t enjoy it so much. I just helped out on the party because I love my husband.

I was the person at work who the new people would seek out to get their questions answered. I was the senior in high school who sat with the lonely sophomore at lunch cause I cared about them, to the confusion of my circle of senior friends. I almost never went to parties. Too loud and too many people. The one time I was in a night club I hated it. My feet hurt and I couldn’t hear what anyone was trying to say to me. I’ve never even liked loud bars or restaurants. I want to be able to have a quiet conversation.

Maybe I should have been a therapist. A social worker once told me that I’m more therapist than nurse.

But I don’t regret things. Being a good nurse supervisor and manager these last several years made me happy. It wasn’t easy work but I felt like I usually was able to make things better for the people who reported to me.

I’m really looking forward to more time with my grandkids soon.

[catherine]

“Where are you with your calling?


I’m really looking forward to more time with my grandkids soon.

Enjoying time with grandchildren and providing them with your wisdom and presence is certainly a worthy calling. I've talked about the role my elderly great-aunt had in my life when she took me in every summer at her beach cottage, which was such a welcome respite from the chaos of my then-alcoholic family home. She was a role mode in every way. Classy, funny, and curious, she instilled routine and order in my life, and nurtured my gifts, teaching me how to sew for instance. I pray to her with gratitude every day.

So, Tammy, it sounds like you are ready to continue to fulfill that calling in your life by spending time with your grandkids, and don't ever think they won't be changed people for it.

[happystuff]

Tammy, not to take away from your kids and grandkids, but if you ever want to take it just a little further, there is also Big Brother/Big Sister - definitely one-on-one.

[razz]

Tammy, not to take away from your kids and grandkids, but if you ever want to take it just a little further, there is also Big Brother/Big Sister - definitely one-on-one.

I agree. I served in BBBS for 5 years and loved it working in a school setting with the little guy that I mentored from kindergarten age. It was fun watching him bloom into an 11 year old with opinions and faith in himself and being part of the team that assisted that development.
That said, I had to resign this year as the covid protocols made it difficult to continue. Grandkids are a whole other delight to help become all that they can be.

[Tammy]

Good ideas - thanks all

[Gardnr]

I knew at age 9 that I "HAD" to work in the operating room. I started with a 2 semester program to be a Scrub Tech (responsible for all of the sterile instruments and accouterments needed). I progressed with my RN associate and then Bachelor degree. I grew into Leadership. After 20 years, I was offered the position to build/Direct a privately owned Surgery Center for 15 Orthopods. BLISS! I had a fantastic team. We assembled our facility together and had 5 funfilled weeks together building teamwork and our focus of excellent patient care in a comfortable compassionate environment. We got great feedback from our patients and our Docs were happy . Our efficiency was high and we went home happy and tired every day. The best and most rewarding 8 years of my career. (It was sold to a local hospital at that point and I ran the facility for another 10y before retiring).

All the while, I developed my artistic side. I knit, crochet, cross-stitch and quilt. I make many community donation quilts and also donate quilts to fundraisers. This is how I now serve my community.

Hubster and I celebrated our 40th anniversary in June-well, we hung out at home instead of taking our 2 week trip to Calgary and the nearby national parks.

Life has been good to us and we count our Blessings every day. Happiness, Health and our needs are met.