Origin of the novel virus Covid 19

[iris lilies]

https://www.technologyreview.com/2021/03/18/1021030/coronavirus-leak-wuhan-lab-scientists-conspiracy/

This is one of several recent articles where “the science” is being challenged. Or perhaps I should say “the science” is not settled as to origin of COVID-19 and competing theories are taking hold.


Now that Trump is out of office can we practice scientific inquiry and open up our minds to the possibility that this virus was in fact a lab leak from the lab in Wuhan? I’m so glad Trump is gone because the theory now can be examined Outside of politics. “The science “is influenced by a political agenda often though we peons are not supposed to think that.


Personally I know that nothing will ever be settled because we are unable to see “the data. “The Chinese government controls “the data. “

That is not open to scientific investigation. So whoever truly thinks “the science” will be a pure investigation of truth needs to have their head examined, or their skepticism button reset.

[sweetana3]

I also consider that China has apparently shut down a $70 billion dollar industry it started in Southern China to "farm" wild animal species to help impoverished populations. Fastest way to expose humans to viruses. Probably unhealthy farming methods which also breed disease. China has serious issues with animal disease like the African Swine Fever which according to research killed or caused to be culled and killed 50% of the pigs in China. ASF is also mutating. It did not take a lab (but could have added to it).

[pinkytoe]

Like so many things today, I continue to say "I don't know." We have so much information coming at us that is hard to figure it all out. All we can do is prepare for the next inevitable ones coming down the line. I read somewhere that a Chinese company is building some humongous pig factory that will rival all else. It will have special lights throughout to beam down and kill germs on all the swine.

[Jane v2.0]

Science is never settled and rarely immutable.
ETA: after reading the article, I found myself wishing politics could be separated from scientific inquiry, but it never has been and the loudest voices often win.

[iris lilies]

Science is never settled and rarely immutable.
ETA: after reading the article, I found myself wishing politics could be separated from scientific inquiry, but it never has been and the loudest voices often win.
But we are lectured quite often here about “the science” and told we are ignorant rubes for not accepting whole heartedly
“the science” .

[ApatheticNoMore]

Science is never settled and rarely immutable.
ETA: after reading the article, I found myself wishing politics could be separated from scientific inquiry, but it never has been and the loudest voices often win.

and then politics will just tend to make it "bad old China" when the U.S. has been involved in gain of function research as well, in Wuhan at one point as well (this was in MSM, I don't go to conspiracy sites for news and if stuff gets misreported in the MSM I am not their editor).

But those who argue it wasn't from a lab also argue based on virus characteristics, so there is that.

Of course as far as politics go, gain of function research on influenza, MERS, and what do we have, oh yea SARS, was banned in the U.S. in 2014 (though likely taking place in Wuhan by the U.S.) and un-banned again in 2017, so yea the actions of different administrations.

[ApatheticNoMore]

But we are lectured quite often here about “the science” and told we are ignorant rubes for not accepting whole heartedly
“the science” .

Is this the mask grumbling? The science we have indicate masks reduce transmission, it it turns out that was all wrong and masks have no effect on transmission, oh no we all wore masks for nothing, oh no, IT'S THE END OF THE WORLD!!! :0! :|(>8):doh:

[jp1]

Is this the mask grumbling? The science we have indicate masks reduce transmission, it it turns out that was all wrong and masks have no effect on transmission, oh no we all wore masks for nothing, oh no, IT'S THE END OF THE WORLD!!! :0! :|(>8):doh:

Hell yeah it’s the end of the world. These masks represent government control. Or something. I don’t remember what exactly, but next thing you know Bill Gates is going to be injecting us with a chip to supplement the one we all already carry in our pocket or purse! Or something.

But back in the reality world, masks and social distancing resulted in an almost nonexistent flu season in the US this year. Yay freedumb?

[bae]

I suffer from being an actual scientist...

[JaneV2.0]

But we are lectured quite often here about “the science” and told we are ignorant rubes for not accepting whole heartedly
“the science” .

Science, though rarely perfect, is generally a more reliable resource than wild-eyed rumors, conjecture,and deliberate disinformation.

[Yppej]

"Science" and "public health" used to say that people got sick because the four humors in their body were unbalanced, that epilepsy was demon possession, the earth was flat, and other now debunked things. It is good to question things.

Recently I read American Baby which talked about how babies in orphanages were subjected to painful procedures that in hindsight are seen to have had no medical value. This was in the second half of the last century.

The Tuskegee medical experiment was "science".

Beware self-styled science experts. There is one here who thinks he is an expert on science, economics, technology, public health, technology, dead languages, archaic weapons, you name it. And yet in an anonymous forum anyone can claim to be an expert. Don't believe everything you read.

[JaneV2.0]

Science has a checkered history, for sure. Phrenology and the demonization of Ignaz Semmelweis come to mind. But it's the best tool we have, especially if we can keep politics at bay.

[iris lilies]

"Science" and "public health" used to say that people got sick because the four humors in their body were unbalanced, that epilepsy was demon possession, the earth was flat, and other now debunked things. It is good to question things.

Recently I read American Baby which talked about how babies in orphanages were subjected to painful procedures that in hindsight are seen to have had no medical value. This was in the second half of the last century.

The Tuskegee medical experiment was "science".

Beware self-styled science experts. There is one here who thinks he is an expert on science, economics, technology, public health, technology, dead languages, archaic weapons, you name it. And yet in an anonymous forum anyone can claim to be an expert. Don't believe everything you read.

A healthy dose of skepticism need not interfere with friendly internet relations since we are all pretty distanced from each other. What real harm will come to us?

I have had In Real Life friends* who I dont quite trust in several areas, but since I am not sharing a bed or a bank account with them, I let them continue in their little deceptions. I consider self delusion to be one of those little deceptions.

*well, more like acquaintances I see often, or work mates, or fellow volunteers. In order to be a real friend I have to trust you.

[bae]

Beware self-styled science experts. There is one here who thinks he is an expert on science, economics, technology, public health, technology, dead languages, archaic weapons, you name it. And yet in an anonymous forum anyone can claim to be an expert. Don't believe everything you read.

Well, *someone* has to be Batman!

It is a shame that Russian trolls, their fellow travellers, and their useful idiots are so threatened by demonstrated accomplishment, knowledge, and skill. It must be dreadful going through life like that, instead of reveling in all of the real wonders this world has to offer.

Heck, I've been a member of these forums for over 20 years now, and haven't made any particular effort to conceal my identity. It would be trivial for someone to "fact check" many of my own contributions to society. And due to my having been elected to office, my financial holdings were a matter of public record until quite recently.

That reminds me, I should post some of my random research projects from the past few weeks....

[Tybee]

The photographs are spectacular! Really lovely.