Moron with a Gun

[Teacher Terry]

A few blocks from me I have a nice pond with a walking trail around it that’s very popular. I go daily with my dogs. People are friendly and often people want to pet them and chat for a few minutes. After awhile you get to recognize some of the regulars. I don’t go at the same time every day. Often I see a man that seems to be nice and he will walk with me for a few minutes and then take off because he goes faster.

Reno’s homeless problem is growing along with skyrocketing rents. Yesterday he started to walk with me telling me about an altercation with a young guy who threw a beer can in front of him. So the old guy confronted him and from the interaction the young guy sounded MI. Later the old man goes up to the young one feeding the ducks and asks why he went off before. This obviously is a dumb move. The young man picked up a rock and threatened to bash his skull in. The old man pulled his gun and the guy drops the rock and called the police.

He asked me what I do in those situations and I said I don’t engage with anyone in a negative way. He thinks because he is a senior he has a right to call people out about their throwing trash around. Now he’s showing a picture of this guy to people at the park warning them and asking them to complain to the police about it. Ugh!! Unless a person or animal is being harmed I think he should mind his own business.

Anyway now I definitely don’t want that man that I originally thought was nice anywhere near me. By the time I got home yesterday I realized that I had let him consume 24 minutes of my life telling me about that crap. In fact as I was walking away telling him I had to use the bathroom he was still talking. It was Xmas so I thought maybe he was lonely but yikes now not engaging with a nut with a gun will be my priority.

[bae]

I wonder what the correct response is to having a young man threaten to slay you with a rock, which he already has in his hand, when you are in speaking distance, when you are an old man? (Or even a young man yourself?)

I wonder what the correct response to an older man who has been traumatized by the threat of violence is, when you are hearing them tell of their trauma?

[Teacher Terry]

Bae, the old man started the trouble both times. The younger guy didn’t pick up the rock until the older guy followed him to a different spot in the park and continued to engage him. My opinion is that it’s the older guy’s fault.

Why would you choose to do that knowing it’s not going to end well and then all of a sudden he’s a defenseless senior and afraid for his life. If the old guy didn’t have a gun he might have behaved differently. The old guy created his own trauma. I am usually empathetic but not when you create your own drama.

[iris lilies]

From Terry’s telling it sounds like the old guy with a gun invited some acrimony unnecessarily. Whether or not the presence of his gun emboldened him it’s not some thing anyone besides him can know.

[bae]

From Terry's telling, the initial event was a beer can being thrown at the old guy by the young guy.

[iris lilies]

From Terry's telling, the initial event was a beer can being thrown at the old guy by the young guy.
It sounded to me like the old guy let the beer can incident lie for the immediate time. Terry’s narrative uses the key word “ later “when he talked to the younger guy about why he threw the beer can there was conflict.

On the surface that seems like a reasonable conversation to have as in “hey dude why’d ya throw that at me, you mad?” , it’s just that if there were social cues that the beer can thrower wasn’t rational, there’s really no point in trying to have a rational conversation. And we don’t know how the old guy approached the beer can thrower, with open friendly face, with closed scrunchy mad-face, etc.

[gimmethesimplelife]

I'm noticing more and more sketchy people and mental instability all over Central Phoenix these days. I haven't posted this as I wanted to take a break regarding my posting about US police - but since being promoted I've had to deal with the Phoenix PD three separate times due to altercations in the store. It really does seem to me on some days that society is quickly unraveling. Stay safe, everyone, as best you can. Rob

[Teacher Terry]

Yes Rob more people are acting crazy. What upsets me about the old man is that he has no empathy for people with MI or the homeless and thinks that they should all be locked up in a camp in the desert.

When I suggested in the future that he ignore people that appear unstable he said that he has a right to confront people that he deems necessary. He also couldn’t seem to accept his own part in this situation and also that it’s okay to confront people and then when threatened to pull his gun. This could have ended much worse not only for the MI guy but for innocent bystanders.

[Tybee]

Yes Rob more people are acting crazy. What upsets me about the old man is that he has no empathy for people with MI or the homeless and thinks that they should all be locked up in a camp in the desert.

When I suggested in the future that he ignore people that appear unstable he said that he has a right to confront people that he deems necessary. He also couldn’t seem to accept his own part in this situation and also that it’s okay to confront people and then when threatened to pull his gun. This could have ended much worse not only for the MI guy but for innocent bystanders.

In my experience within my own family, I associate aging with more defensive thinking that has at times verged into the paranoid as the aging person (myself included) becomes less able to cope physically, mentally, or financially with changing circumstances, which begin to feel like an accumulation of things that are threatening us.

So I would view both parties to this as coming at it from a limited and potentially dangerous viewpoint--the older guy is probably traumatized by the younger guy's threats and is reacting in the way that he feels will protect himself, which is only serving to escalate things and make things worse.

Thus I wouldn't try to talk older guy into anything or judge him too harshly but I'd give them both a wide berth. Just my opinion on it, anyway, and sorry this is happening in your favorite walking trail, that is a bummer.

[Tradd]

Yes Rob more people are acting crazy. What upsets me about the old man is that he has no empathy for people with MI or the homeless and thinks that they should all be locked up in a camp in the desert.


Have you ever dealt with aggressive/violent homeless people? I had repeated experiences with them when I lived in Chicago and took public transit daily. When the homeless are very aggressively panhandling, setting up camps in parks and other public areas, crapping all over the place, it changes your attitude. When kids and others can’t go to the park because they’re going to be harassed and whatever else, that’s the sort of thing that changes people’s attitude towards the homeless. Look at what has happened in San Francisco.

[frugal-one]

Reading this post reinforces the need for gun laws.

[littlebittybobby]

Okay----You kids are part of the problem, along with the legal system. We can't continue to coddle criminals! The "old guy" the OP has vilified is taking an old-school approach: You don't allow people to bully you, and get away with it! If the "MI" person your heart bleeds for, had his butt kicked for harassing people a time or two, he would leave people alone! See? That is a concept that he would surely understand. Don't you? Hope that helps you some. Thank Me.

[littlebittybobby]

Reading this post reinforces the need for gun laws.Yep. It sure does. Like the one in Missouri that allows: "Constitutional Carry", to ward off thugs. Yup.

[Teacher Terry]

Bobby, no that’s not a concept a Mi person would understand. Tradd, yes I have dealt with aggressive homeless people. See what I wrote about both Reno and SF In another thread on that subject. Frugal, you are correct that this old guy is a danger to society with his gun.

[Alan]

Reading this post reinforces the need for gun laws.
I wonder how many gun laws we already have on the Federal and State levels? I think what you're probably wishing for is a national gun ban, am I right?

[littlebittybobby]

Okay---Trayvon ain't botherin' nobody, no mo.

[dado potato]

New York City has tried multiple times to enable police to involuntarily transport people (who in the officer's discretion are a threat to themselves) from the streets and subways to hospital Emergency Rooms. Mayor Adams is calling for the city to make a higher priority of involuntary admissions. The hospitalization typically extends to about 11 days, usually paid for by Medicaid. Patients with a history that qualifies for Kendra's Law may be forced into mandated outpatient treatment before they are discharged.

New York State passed "Kendra's Law" in 1999, for "Assisted Outpatient Treatment", whereby patients with a history of going off their medications as out-patients may be ordered by a court to comply with a treatment plan as a condition of living in the community. A case manager is appointed to monitor the patient's compliance with the treatment plan.

During the first 9 months of this year, NYC police have removed 1,300 people from the transit system and transported them to hospital, often involuntarily.

http://www.nytimes.com/article/nyc-homeless-mental-health-plan.html

[frugal-one]

I wonder how many gun laws we already have on the Federal and State levels? I think what you're probably wishing for is a national gun ban, am I right?

You know my feelings. This has been discussed previously.

[Teacher Terry]

Well I think drawing the gun on the guy with a MI must have scared the older guy. I see him at the park and he shows me his new best friend which is bear spray. I said that’s a much better idea and walk away. I am assuming that he is still carrying so I don’t intend to be anywhere near him. Plus if he can’t see his role in the incident I don’t want to be anywhere near him the next time he can’t ignore people. Actually very few homeless people are usually here.