Writers/Actors Strike

[LDAHL]

So what are the issues, exactly? I just hear some vague stuff about streaming and AI and the usual “greedy CEO” stuff?

Is this just a sign that Hollywood is in a sort of commercial/cultural decline? I know I watch a lot more foreign content than I used to, thanks to streaming. Lately a lot of South Korean and Spanish stuff. Is our domestic “creative class” losing some of it’s piece of the entertainment pie and fighting over the leftovers?

[bae]

I think also streaming has restructured revenues in a way that removes writers/actors from the feed trough, because legal/contractual technology has not kept pace.

[pinkytoe]

I am about ready to blow up the TV anyway. The quality of programming - network and streaming - is mostly not worth watching IMO.

[Tradd]

I got rid of my TV a few months back. I went without from 2003-2016, then got one to watch the Olympics that year. I just had a 24” with digital antenna. I hadn’t had cable since 1999 or so. I watch the local news on my iPad. I’ve always been much more into radio, since I was a kid. I listen to the BBC online daily. I also read a lot. I’ll watch stuff on YT or stream PBS.

[happystuff]

We ditched cable several years ago and don't pay for any streaming. It's amazing how much there is to watch for free out there. Now if I could only get the internet bill lowered.

[iris lilies]

I am about ready to blow up the TV anyway. The quality of programming - network and streaming - is mostly not worth watching IMO.
I find that Netflix usually has something decent to watch. This plus Prime are my main services.

[LDAHL]

I find that Netflix is he has something decent to watch. The plus prime are my main services.

Especially if you do a little searching and don’t just browse their suggestions.

[Tybee]

We watched 3 Days of the Condor with Robert Redford on Prime.
Rented Red Joan--I made a list of potential spy movies to watch and they were both on it.

[catherine]

I find that Netflix is he has something decent to watch. The plus prime are my main services.

DH loves to watch movies. Every night at dinner time he asks, what movie do you want to watch tonight? Afterwards, typically we complain about the poor quality or weak narrative, or something, and I tell him, if your job were to produce enough entertainment to satisfy 300 million people 365 days of the year, you would be shooting for quantity, not quality. "It's not like the old days" when it was an event to have a new movie come out every so often and everyone would stand in line at the movie theatre to see it, and if you missed it you had to wait 10 years for it to appear on TV.

I am so sick of movies that I have given myself an earlier bedtime so I can escape the ordeal of sitting there through yet another mediocre movie.

[rosarugosa]

Catherine: I almost never watch anything. We plugged in the TV to play the "Lonesome Dove" DVDs, and I think that's all I've watched this year. I would just much rather read.

[iris lilies]

Especially if you do a little searching and don’t just browse their suggestions.
Yes, both Netflix and Prime have rich catalogs. For a while I was into Israeli and Middle .eastern dramas, and Prime had them.

I jump on and off HBO and the British .services for specific productions. HBO has a few top notch shows but not, from what I’ve seen,much depth in choices.

[Teacher Terry]

It’s not the stars that will be harmed but the unknown actors. They want to pay them once and then AI to use their image and voice repeatedly. Their image and voice is their property and what they sell. They won’t be able to make a living.

[bae]

It’s not the stars that will be harmed but the unknown actors. They want to pay them once and then AI to use their image and voice repeatedly. Their image and voice is their property and what they sell. They won’t be able to make a living.

Wouldn't the studio require permission from the actors to use their likeness and voice?

[catherine]

Wouldn't the studio require permission from the actors to use their likeness and voice?

Sure, but if they say no, the studio will just go find hungry actor that will take the one-time payment because it's better than nothing and it enables them to do what they love. Actors will sell their soul to work.

[iris lilies]

Sure, but if they say no, the studio will just go find hungry actor that will take the one-time payment because it's better than nothing and it enables them to do what they love. Actors will sell their soul to work.
But wouldn’t they actors equity scale adjust to reflect that this is a one time appearance, not multiple physical appearances?

example: actor used to get $, because the role required say, five appearances in a production

now the actor gets $$$$$ for that one time appearance.

I don’t know, you know more about this thing than I do ‘tho neither of us can predict what will really happen.

[catherine]

But wouldn’t they actors equity scale adjust to reflect that this is a one time appearance, not multiple physical appearances?

example: actor used to get $, because the role required say, five appearances in a production

now the actor gets $$$$$ for that one time appearance.

I don’t know, you know more about this thing than I do ‘tho neither of us can predict what will really happen.

No, the math in that case would definitely not work in the actor's favor, because the residuals are a huge source of income for actors. And it's not like every week you get a gig. Most paid actors will get maybe a couple of projects a year if that, and most of the time, unless they're big names, they get paid scale, which was about $2000 a week when my kids were acting. You take your manager's fee out of that and your agent's fee and taxes and you're left with very little. Meanwhile the studio benefits when the the movie is a hit and up until now, actors got a piece of that pie. If they are not paid for every time the movie is shown, they are not going to be able to sustain themselves financially on just their weekly pay unless they work a second job, and of course that second job is not going to be lucrative because an actor will quit any time a job opportunity comes along.

Then there's the whole new dilemma with writers' careers being taken over by AI. There's really no precedent for that. Maybe there will be job titles: instead of a writer, an AI coordinator who edits content rather than creating it new. Scary thought.

[iris lilies]

No, the math in that case would definitely not work in the actor's favor, because the residuals are a huge source of income for actors. And it's not like every week you get a gig. Most paid actors will get maybe a couple of projects a year if that, and most of the time, unless they're big names, they get paid scale, which was about $2000 a week when my kids were acting. You take your manager's fee out of that and your agent's fee and taxes and you're left with very little. Meanwhile the studio benefits when the the movie is a hit and up until now, actors got a piece of that pie. If they are not paid for every time the movie is shown, they are not going to be able to sustain themselves financially on just their weekly pay unless they work a second job, and of course that second job is not going to be lucrative because an actor will quit any time a job opportunity comes along.

Then there's the whole new dilemma with writers' careers being taken over by AI. There's really no precedent for that. Maybe there will be job titles: instead of a writer, an AI coordinator who edits content rather than creating it new. Scary thought.
OK by residuals do you mean reruns? Why are you assuming there’s no compensation for reruns? Is there an actual proposed contract that you read that are striking over?

[jp1]

OK by residuals do you mean reruns? Why are you assuming there’s no compensation for reruns? Is there an actual proposed contract that you read that are striking over?

My understanding from the limited stuff I've read is that the actors don't get paid anywhere near as well for streaming, if at all, as they did from residuals before streaming existed. As streaming becomes more and more the way everyone watches stuff now is the time for this to get sorted out so that acting can remain a viable career. Both sides realize this, hence the current strike.

[iris lilies]

OK, thanks JP and etc. I read up on residuals. I guess they need new contracts that recognize streaming, CGI use of their faces, and etc.

[LDAHL]

I can just imagine lawsuits over whether some cgi image resembles an actor or not, especially if it’s close without being exact.

[catherine]

OK, thanks JP and etc. I read up on residuals. I guess they need new contracts that recognize streaming, CGI use of their faces, and etc.

Yeah, thanks, jp. My kids stopped acting in the 90s/early 2000s, before streaming existed. But whatever the medium, like most artists, actors will have a tough time making money off their craft unless they are organized and have strong leadership to speak with them. So I'm on their side all the way.

[jp1]

I can just imagine lawsuits over whether some cgi image resembles an actor or not, especially if it’s close without being exact.

True that. Similar to how OpenAI, the company that makes ChatGPT is being sued by authors trying to put together a class action alleging that by uploading lots of books into ChatGPT's knowledge-base the company is unfairly benefiting from the authors' work even if ChatGPT has never specifically plagarizes any of the writing. It will be interesting to see how that plays out. Especially for me since we write media liability insurance for lots of tech companies and as more and more are training AI systems in similar ways this could become a huge issue for my little part of the insurance world.

[LDAHL]

True that. Similar to how OpenAI, the company that makes ChatGPT is being sued by authors trying to put together a class action alleging that by uploading lots of books into ChatGPT's knowledge-base the company is unfairly benefiting from the authors' work even if ChatGPT has never specifically plagarizes any of the writing. It will be interesting to see how that plays out. Especially for me since we write media liability insurance for lots of tech companies and as more and more are training AI systems in similar ways this could become a huge issue for my little part of the insurance world.

Between climate change, AI, commercial space travel, intangible electronic assets and the changing environment of discrimination suits, I would think the insurance industry is in for some interesting years.

My kid is good at math and likes a good story. Maybe I should encourage him to study actuarial science.

[Rogar]

Between climate change, AI, commercial space travel, intangible electronic assets and the changing environment of discrimination suits, I would think the insurance industry is in for some interesting years.

I've actually wondered about the long term security or risk of my meager retirement investments in equities for the above reasons. What happens say, in Florida there are no insurance companies that will insure new homes and you can't get a mortgage without insurance? I can think of more extreme examples, but that come up in some news feed I had on. Or AI replaces a large part of the work force, or big oil goes bust as part of the transition away from fossil fuels?

[iris lilies]

I've actually wondered about the long term security or risk of my meager retirement investments in equities for the above reasons. What happens say, in Florida there are no insurance companies that will insure new homes and you can't get a mortgage without insurance? I can think of more extreme examples, but that come up in some news feed I had on. Or AI replaces a large part of the work force, or big oil goes bust as part of the transition away from fossil fuels?

I am not concerned about big oil going bust.

the other things, yep.

[jp1]

Between climate change, AI, commercial space travel, intangible electronic assets and the changing environment of discrimination suits, I would think the insurance industry is in for some interesting years.

My kid is good at math and likes a good story. Maybe I should encourage him to study actuarial science.

Yes, underwriting technology e&o is definitely interesting. Every account is unique and I have to figure out what it is they think is their value proposition since that’s what they are selling which is what we’re insuring. As AI keeps getting better there will be a lot of new tech exposures to consider. For now something like a medical diagnostic AI company needs to buy a separate led mal policy. At some point years from now insurers will likely be creating blended tech/med mal policies, blended tech/auto policies for self driving vehicles etc. Smart people will have a bright, secure future in this field.

[bae]

I have never regretted being a statistician.