Graveside Thumbs up?

[jp1]

Just curious how many people have ever thought it would be appropriate to have their photo taken of them smiling and giving a thumbs up while they were standing at someone's grave? And have you ever done such a thing?

[iris lilies]

Just curious how many people have ever thought it would be appropriate to have their photo taken of them smiling and giving a thumbs up while they were standing at someone's grave? And have you ever done such a thing?
Mormons seem to like graveside photos and yes, one wannabe influencer I know was smiling for the camera at her grandmother’s funeral as she stood by the casket. She is the topic of distain in snark circles however, but that incident is where I learned graveside photos with smiling family aren’t so unusual in that church.

And when you think about it, a visual comment on one’s elderly relative’s life well lived might be at the grave of that person.

[iris lilies]

I doubt that anyone is standing thumbs up at the casket of a small child or a young person.

[catherine]

I have never given a thumbs up in a photo at anyone's grave, and I do consider it gauche and inappropriate. I have never seen any of my friends or family do it, either.

[rosarugosa]

I've never even seen anyone taking pictures at a wake or a funeral or an interment.

[jp1]

I suppose theoretically if one was remembering the happy times they had with a loved one one could smile for a graveside photo. Although even the idea of taking photos at funerals seems weird since some people are likely to be crying and will not want their picture taken.

As an aside I see that JD Vance decided to take this as an opportunity to tell Kamala to go to hell due to a comment that she did not make about the event. Almost as classy as what trump did at the cemetery.

[iris lilies]

I suppose theoretically if one was remembering the happy times they had with a loved one one could smile for a graveside photo. Although even the idea of taking photos at funerals seems weird since some people are likely to be crying and will not want their picture taken.

As an aside I see that JD Vance decided to take this as an opportunity to tell Kamala to go to hell due to a comment that she did not make about the event. Almost as classy as what trump did at the cemetery.

Oh! I didn’t realize this post was your typical Trump-hate bait. God, I am so naive.

Here I thought you had an interesting story about someone you know or a relative who behaved inappropriately at a gravesite. And, I was going to share with you yet another Mormon mommy photo op gravesite story, but now you don’t get that story.

Unlike you, I don’t get embroiled In the stupid details of political headline news. My take away from the Trump graveside visit is that, and this is based on brief skimming, Arlington has a rule against campaigning/photos ops, and the Trump campaign broke it and should’ve apologized.

[jp1]

Fine. I'll throw something more important than "Trump yet again breaks the law" since apparently that's no longer newsworthy to the voters in his political party. Trump has now come out as pro-choice. It will be interesting to see how the anti-choice voters that make up his base feel about that.

[iris lilies]

Fine. I'll throw something more important than "Trump yet again breaks the law" since apparently that's no longer newsworthy to the voters in his political party. Trump has now come out as pro-choice. It will be interesting to see how the anti-choice voters that make up his base feel about that.
Come out as? Ok if you say so.

He has been for some time downplaying that issue and suggesting compromises on gestational limits. But hey, the majority of people who vote in your party agree with his position. Imagine that!

While I like this approach and find it to be more reasonable than, well, the position of others, this doesn't make me want to vote for Trump. It would be nice if he influenced my state legislature tho.

[jp1]

The pro fetus crowd seem to be quite upset about his recent statements. He stated, in as clear of a way as he ever states anything, that he’s probably going to vote for the Florida amendment that allows abortion until viability. It’s cool that he’s now in favor of socialized IVF. The democrats in congress already have a bill for that. They should bring it to the floor and see how trump’s party reacts. Earlier this year they didn’t seem so excited about it. Back then just claiming to be pro-IVF was as much of a commitment as they were willing to make.

The weird bit about this, as you pointed out Iris, is that this is not likely to get him any new votes, and is more likely to lose him some of his previously assured votes. I get the sense that he’s panicking and that has caused him to lose the political sense that served him so well in 2016.

[iris lilies]

What is “socialized IVF?”

[jp1]

What is “socialized IVF?”

IVF paid for by nanny G

[rosarugosa]

Well apparently he is not pro-choice anymore.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/other/trump-says-he-ll-vote-against-florida-amendment-enshrining-abortion-rights/ar-AA1pJP99?ocid=BingNewsSerp

[Tybee]

After hearing about this Arlington story I was so upset that I felt the need to try to do something positive. So I donated to Honor Flight in honor of my dad who served as a Marine in WWII and also the Navy Reserves, and to the the American Air Museum in Britain in honor of my uncle who was stationed in England and is buried in the Normandy American Cemetery.

Dad did not want to be buried at Arlington, but he would have loved to do Honor Flight, but became too ill to go.

So if you are upset about what happened at Arlington, maybe think about ways you can honor someone in your family who served.

[catherine]

This article is what brought the whole issue to my attention, and I thought it was so beautifully written, it made me cry, and then made me mad. It is written by a person who used to have Arlington Cemetary military duty.

https://charlotteclymer.substack.com/p/in-praise-of-the-hardest-job-in-arlington

[iris lilies]

This article is what brought the whole issue to my attention, and I thought it was so beautifully written, it made me cry, and then made me mad. It is written by a person who used to have Arlington Cemetary military duty.

https://charlotteclymer.substack.com/p/in-praise-of-the-hardest-job-in-arlington

right, that is a beautiful piece.

[befree]

catherine that article, and also the comments, is beautiful and so meaningful

[iris lilies]

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/harris-calls-trump-cemetery-visit-disrespectful-political-stunt-2024-08-31/

https://www.yahoo.com/news/mom-invited-trump-arlington-cemetery-182235353.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAHQ2WBKmVOHl4B2NTEmSuyt7M1uC uS4X0MlciyOt4vwiX6n8oxXrwEiYTowPk6bS6be4JTfjXfwndn gfl6uOGsbvnzMS3QsA0yMJdzeh5TWyK5wIVEealPZ1JbY5UGJy RWTQE8xW5Ea1YFFh0b-EGqBvlWxJ7JpyHjD1oI_G1tBw


https://www.fox13now.com/news/politics/father-of-fallen-soldier-defends-cox-trump-in-arlington-controversy



Now I am seeing news that the families of 13 dead soldiers invited Trump to participate in a wreath laying ceremony at Arlington. While our vice president today accuses Trump of wrongdoing, there’s more than one voice all over the news now, voices of family members of these particular dead soldiers, who are making it clear they wanted Donald Trump there and they wanted photographs.

These soldiers were killed in the withdrawal of from Afghanistan so I have to assume they didn’t like how Biden – Harris administration handled that.

JP I don’t think this is a clear cut as you and Kamala presented it. Could it be you two were just parroting mainstream liberal biased headlines?

[iris lilies]

And now I’m a little hot under the collar because I see that one of these 13 dead soldiers honored at Arlington was someone local to me. And his dad is all over the Internet telling off Kamala Harris for her lies.

For anyone paying attention this is not a good look for the Harris – Walz team and they need to retire this issue pronto in the news cycle. They should pull their campaign ad for their own good that features this issue. I’m sure the Kamala followers will probably believe everything she says, without looking a little deeper.Several here have done that.

[iris lilies]

Well apparently he is not pro-choice anymore.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/other/trump-says-he-ll-vote-against-florida-amendment-enshrining-abortion-rights/ar-AA1pJP99?ocid=BingNewsSerp

I don’t like being a Trump apologist, but there is a certain logic in what he says, if it was accurately reported and if I’m interpreting it correctly. He thinks the gestational limit for legal abortions should be longer than six weeks, which is why he’s voting against the measure.


how many times have congressman voted against bills because the exact sentiment they favor isn’t carried out in the bill and they’re hoping for a later and better version.

[jp1]

The law is the law. It’s illegal to do what he did. Weird that the ‘law and order’ party so frequently is in favor of breaking the law. And I’m sorry. Anyone who doesn’t think it’s creepy to take a picture smiling and thumbs upping on a grave is also weird. Almost as weird as anyone wanting him anywhere near soldiers’ graves considering his opinion about veterans. Tim Walz totally nailed it when he pointed out that the sad maga party is just plain weird.

[Tybee]

And now I’m a little hot under the collar because I see that one of these 13 dead soldiers honored at Arlington was someone local to me. And his dad is all over the Internet telling off Kamala Harris for her lies.

For anyone paying attention this is not a good look for the Harris – Walz team and they need to retire this issue pronto in the news cycle. They should pull their campaign ad for their own good that features this issue. I’m sure the Kamala followers will probably believe everything she says, without looking a little deeper.Several here have done that.

Why are you an apologist for this man? His act was monstrous. He has no decency.

[iris lilies]

Why are you an apologist for this man? His act was monstrous. He has no decency.
Looking at the facts that I’ve presented, the Arlington cemetery headlines news from NPR etc. is not accurately representing what really happened.

The soldiers’ families wanted Trump there, they invited him, they wanted photos.

I can hold two thoughts in my head at the same time, that Donald Trump is unfit to be President of the United States AND ALSO the Arlington incident was not initially accurately reported by mainstream news, it was the usual Trump hit.

[jp1]

There’s a difference between families taking photos and a presidential campaign filming a god damn commercial. Why is that so hard for people to understand?

[iris lilies]

The law is the law. It’s illegal to do what he did. Weird that the ‘law and order’ party so frequently is in favor of breaking the law. And I’m sorry. Anyone who doesn’t think it’s creepy to take a picture smiling and thumbs upping on a grave is also weird. Almost as weird as anyone wanting him anywhere near soldiers’ graves considering his opinion about veterans. Tim Walz totally nailed it when he pointed out that the sad maga party is just plain weird.
You can think it’s creepy to stand at a gravesite and smile. It’s a free country.

I’m not so sure that “the law is a law “applies in the situation.

Federal law prohibits photography on the grounds of Arlington for political campaigns or electioneering. I agree with you that any reasonable person could see this as a political stand. But I also think any prominent figure invited to speak at a dead soldier’s grave would not want to deny that dead soldier’s parents a photograph as they requested.

I see nuance in this. I’m not surprised that you’re unable to see nuance. That is really your loss.

[iris lilies]

There’s a difference between families taking photos and a presidential campaign filming a god damn commercial. Why is that so hard for people to understand?
please provide a link to the commercial

[jp1]

please provide a link to the commercial

I'll leave it to you to find. I just ate breakfast and watching that chitbag's commercial would probably cause me to suffer a reversal of fortune. My understanding is that they posted it on tiktok so it should be easy enough to find.

[Alan]

There’s a difference between families taking photos and a presidential campaign filming a god damn commercial. Why is that so hard for people to understand?
Here's a screen grab from a 2020 Biden campaign commercial of Biden and crew at Arlington. Politifact (https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2024/aug/30/tweets/heres-how-a-biden-ad-that-featured-arlington-natio/) (full video at link for anyone interested) says it's not the same thing as what Trump allegedly did because the picture was taken in 2010 when Biden was Vice President and the fact that it was later used in a campaign commercial is irrelevant.

I'm not so sure that's actually the case. It seems to me that we judge or ignore like events differently based upon our biases. I certainly don't recall anyone making an issue of it at the time.

https://scontent-ord5-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.15752-9/457181447_902627815220376_9112304702339377364_n.pn g?_nc_cat=111&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=9f807c&_nc_ohc=WPXHa_pz0gQQ7kNvgHWZIUy&_nc_ht=scontent-ord5-1.xx&oh=03_Q7cD1QE19-7BVY4ub8lVRwBH6TkcRgp3aTvXCmq0H3ti30djFg&oe=66FC1897

[Tybee]

IL, you honestly cannot look with your own eyes and see how he disgraced this hallowed ground?
For context, here's another quotation for you, "While often touting his support for the armed forces, he privately mocked the war dead while president and did not want to be seen near military amputees, according to his former chief of staff."
Trump entourage accused of shoving staff at hallowed US military cemetery (msn.com) (https://www.msn.com/en-in/news/world/trump-entourage-accused-of-shoving-staff-at-hallowed-us-military-cemetery/ar-AA1pAXPt)

[iris lilies]

IL, you honestly cannot look with your own eyes and see how he disgraced this hallowed ground?
For context, here's another quotation for you, "While often touting his support for the armed forces, he privately mocked the war dead while president and did not want to be seen near military amputees, according to his former chief of staff."
Trump entourage accused of shoving staff at hallowed US military cemetery (msn.com) (https://www.msn.com/en-in/news/world/trump-entourage-accused-of-shoving-staff-at-hallowed-us-military-cemetery/ar-AA1pAXPt)




Show me the exact link to image(s) you want me to diagnose. I’ve seen one.

There is no question in my mind that Trump acting like Trump would be seen by reasonable people as “disgracing” Arlington. So I don’t think you are entirely off base, but you also have to consider he was the invited guest of people who sincerely wanted Trump there, presumably to act like Trump.

in this event I let wishes of the the families trump (haha) your or my view of “disgrace.”

[littlebittybobby]

I'm just wondering if demmacratz could utilize summa that hypersensitivity to be kind to people who don't agree with them?

[jp1]

Only trump brought a videographer with him to the cemetary. And only team trump assaulted a cemetary worker and subsequently questioned her mental health status. I guess all republicans really will defend anything a politician with an R after their name does.

[iris lilies]

Only trump brought a videographer with him to the cemetary. And only team trump assaulted a cemetary worker and subsequently questioned her mental health status. I guess all republicans really will defend anything a politician with an R after their name does.

I believe the shoving bit and that is not cool at all.

[Tybee]

Only trump brought a videographer with him to the cemetary. And only team trump assaulted a cemetary worker and subsequently questioned her mental health status. I guess all republicans really will defend anything a politician with an R after their name does.

It is as though they are afraid of him.

[bae]

You’d think someone who had been Commander-in-Chief would understand these protocols.

[jp1]

You’d think someone who had been Commander-in-Chief would understand these protocols.

That would require that he actually gave a f*** about anything other than the power that came with the position. Which seems unlikely considering that he attempted to overthrow the government in order to keep that power.

[frugal-one]

And now I’m a little hot under the collar because I see that one of these 13 dead soldiers honored at Arlington was someone local to me. And his dad is all over the Internet telling off Kamala Harris for her lies.

For anyone paying attention this is not a good look for the Harris – Walz team and they need to retire this issue pronto in the news cycle. They should pull their campaign ad for their own good that features this issue. I’m sure the Kamala followers will probably believe everything she says, without looking a little deeper.Several here have done that.

Talk was the guard at the cemetery was manhandled and nothing was explained. The guard did not press charges because they were already threatened. Does not speak well for the trump side…

[Alan]

I'll leave it to you to find. I just ate breakfast and watching that chitbag's commercial would probably cause me to suffer a reversal of fortune. My understanding is that they posted it on tiktok so it should be easy enough to find.
Not being a TikTokker I haven't seen the video you mention nor have I noticed a link to it in any of the dozens of articles I've read about the incident, I'll keep an eye out for it though because I'm curious to see if it is a campaign related video. The last I read of the incident seems to indicate that the gold star families who invited Trump, Biden and Harris to the event wanted their pictures taken with the only invitee to show up, and Trump obliged.

Not being there myself, I'm struggling to decide whether these first hand accounts of what took place regarding the photographs transpired as the families described or whether it was a blatant disregard of protocol to affect an election as you and others imply. I'm also wondering that since it's OK to take pictures for personal use and is routinely done by visitors, how an un-named staffer knew what they were for as they surely must have supposed given the allegation that they tried to stop all photography. I've been to Arlington twice and have taken pics of the gravesites of JFK, RFK, Audie Murphy, etc., without anyone attempting to stop me.

All things considered I'm thinking I need more info before determining whether or not to be outraged, and should I decide that I should, I believe 'outrage' would be too strong a word.

[bae]

All things considered I'm thinking I need more info before determining whether or not to be outraged, and should I decide that I should, I believe 'outrage' would be too strong a word.

I think there are a sufficient number of more significant outrageous things about Trump to worry myself too much about this one. The list is so long that this likely wouldn’t make my Top-20 Hit Parade.

[iris lilies]

I think there are a sufficient number of more significant outrageous things about Trump to worry myself too much about this one. The list is so long that this likely wouldn’t make my Top-20 Hit Parade.
Agreed.

[Tybee]

I think what happened is important. The reason that the cemetery worker did not press charges is that she was afraid of retaliation from Trump supporters. After what they did to the Georgia campaign workers, that is not surprising.

If you don't think that matters, then maybe this matters to you:

Trump Calls Journalists “Enemy Of The People” During Pennsylvania Rally Minutes Before Man Storms Into Media Section | Vanity Fair (https://www.vanityfair.com/news/story/trump-rally-man-attacks-journalists#intcid=_vanity-fair-right-rail_0a477ab7-8e55-4770-b2c3-9066cd9fee28_popular4-1)

[iris lilies]

I think what happened is important. The reason that the cemetery worker did not press charges is that she was afraid of retaliation from Trump supporters. After what they did to the Georgia campaign workers, that is not surprising.

If you don't think that matters, then maybe this matters to you:

Trump Calls Journalists “Enemy Of The People” During Pennsylvania Rally Minutes Before Man Storms Into Media Section | Vanity Fair (https://www.vanityfair.com/news/story/trump-rally-man-attacks-journalists#intcid=_vanity-fair-right-rail_0a477ab7-8e55-4770-b2c3-9066cd9fee28_popular4-1)


I watched the video linked in the Vanity Fair article and it does not show Donald Trump saying what the headline said he said. I’m not disputing that, I’m just letting you know if it’s supposed to, it doesn’t. It does show some idiot climbing into the[what we are told] media box. What I saw was tons of Trump audience folks yelling at that idiot, tons.

of course I think a free 4th estate is essential to a free society, no question.

am I supposed to respect all journalists? Of course not. Do I even respect many of them today? Not really.

[Tybee]

I have seen eight years of him calling his followers to do violence against others. There is really nothing else I can say. I feel it is morally wrong to stay silent as to what this man has done and continues to do.