View Full Version : Iran then and now
I was reflecting on the political zeitgeist of 1979/80: Mickey Mouse on a t-shirt giving the finger with the words "Hey Iran" and the Beach Boys song made into "Bomb, Bomb, Bomb, Bomb, Bomb Iran". The woman I love now was there then and a ten year old little girl. She might have been called collateral damage. Remembering dead soldiers and veterans is fine and remember those who didn't sign up for war and will only be remembered as collateral damage. And don't forget what your supporting when you "supports our troops".
Back in the early 90's I had an Iranian woman living downstairs from me - she was Baha'i and her family had to flee the revolution, they probably would not have survived otherwise. She probably wasn't much older when they left Iran.
And don't forget what your supporting when you "supports our troops".
We've all talked many times about how it is possible to support the troops without supporting war. That seems to be the overwhelming sentiment here.
We've all talked many times about how it is possible to support the troops without supporting war. That seems to be the overwhelming sentiment here.
Ditto! I support the person, and what I consider a brave, selfless and honorable life choice someone makes to serve their country, even if I do not support the war.
The Storyteller
11-28-12, 6:10pm
And don't forget what your supporting when you "supports our troops".
I know exactly what I am supporting. I'm not sure you do.
We've all talked many times about how it is possible to support the troops without supporting war. That seems to be the overwhelming sentiment here.
Absolutely! And discussion about trimming and making leaner the military doesn't mean anti-military. It just means keeping the strength and influence we have now but making it more efficient. And maybe tweaking the 'influence' part...;)
ApatheticNoMore
11-28-12, 9:01pm
If one supports the troops can they also say "I support the trash collector!" and "I support the person packing my bags at the supermarket!", both social functions are both more useful at this point than all the foreign wars IMO.
We've all talked many times about how it is possible to support the troops without supporting war. That seems to be the overwhelming sentiment here.
I support our troops when they disobey orders to bomb or shoot at enemies that have been contrived.
I support our troops when they tell the true about their experiences of war that are not favored by chicken hawks or reported by media brainwashers.
I support our troops when they refuse to support mult-national corporation war profiteering.
I support (finacially) troops that never use violence to solve disputes which is the second most cowardly form of conflict resolution.
I support our troops when they disobey orders to bomb or shoot at enemies that have been contrived.
I support our troops when they tell the true about their experiences of war that are not favored by chicken hawks or reported by media brainwashers.
I support our troops when they refuse to support mult-national corporation war profiteering.
I support (finacially) troops that never use violence to solve disputes which is the second most cowardly form of conflict resolution.
That's one way to do it. Thanks, in no small way, to several generations of people who have served in the military you have every right to feel that way and have the opportunity to tell us about it.
If one supports the troops can they also say "I support the trash collector!" and "I support the person packing my bags at the supermarket!", both social functions are both more useful at this point than all the foreign wars IMO.
No ones bagging groceries ever voluntarily agreed to spend years away from their homes or their families, to live in pretty deplorable conditions where death or injury is imminent, for very little pay and an almost 24/7 365 day per year work schedule, to not be able to just walk off the job without being arrested, for the sole purpose of serving their country. The day my bagboy or trash driver does that is the day I'll give them my whole hearted support even if I don't think they should be working at that particular grocery store or dump site. Until that day what they have is just a job. Serving in the military requires a huge personal sacrifice - even when not at war or if someone isn't in a war zone - and the fact that people sign up voluntarily makes that sacrifice even greater. So yeah, I support and honor all the troops - at home or abroad - but I don't honor my trash truck driver or bagboy.
The Storyteller
11-30-12, 11:43am
to not be able to just walk off the job without being arrested, Just talking about that the other day as we were driving on base to deliver a Thanksgiving turkey.
I was reminded of that old feeling. Any job I have now, if I don't like the working conditions or want to tell my boss to take a flying leap, I can just quit. I may not like the consequences, but they aren't near those in the military. I put my mind back in that place, and it was not a pleasant feeling.
But I do give our cops and firefighters the same respect and support as our troopies. I think they deserve it. They make our way of life possible.
That said, I don't go gaga over any of them. I think the overboard "support" some give our troops is a bit sloppy, jingoistic, and insincere. To some, opposing a war shows a lack of support for the troops. It isn't the same thing. That may be where the misguided POV of the OP stems from.
Well earned programs providing various forms of assistance aside, maybe "support" could be better defined as "respect".
Yes, Gregg, respect implies that what needs doing for people gets done...no one should come back from combat without the appropriate medical and psychological services, home, job. None of them should have to beg or even do a whole lot to get the services. We owe them that respect. The best thing would be a world that doesn't need fodder for wars, but until this country decides to spend as much money making peace as we do making war and supporting the military industrial complex....the least we can do is provide for those we've damaged.
Just talking about that the other day as we were driving on base to deliver a Thanksgiving turkey.
I was reminded of that old feeling. Any job I have now, if I don't like the working conditions or want to tell my boss to take a flying leap, I can just quit. I may not like the consequences, but they aren't near those in the military. I put my mind back in that place, and it was not a pleasant feeling.
But I do give our cops and firefighters the same respect and support as our troopies. I think they deserve it. They make our way of life possible.
That said, I don't go gaga over any of them. I think the overboard "support" some give our troops is a bit sloppy, jingoistic, and insincere. To some, opposing a war shows a lack of support for the troops. It isn't the same thing. That may be where the misguided POV of the OP stems from.
I think what alot of people forget, is that most of the people joining the service are 18 year old, wet behind the ears, ideological kids just out of high school. They join for mostly altruistic, honorable reasons of protecting their country and way of life. So when a war does break out, they are often trapped in a world that legally mandates they fight or do support service in a foreign war that they may not agree with. Otherewise they will be arrested and jailed. When they joined they may have had totally different ideals for the reasons they were joining. To support a war against totalitarian oppression? A war against a Jihad type of terrorism? To protect the innocents of civil wars and mass genocide? Yet instead they are finding themselves in a war or situation much much different then they envisioned they would be in when joining - one that they cannot legally get out of. So by supporting the person (troop) you are supporting their idealized belief of what their service to their country was "suppose" to mean. It doesn't always turn out that way and you see young people fighting foreign wars that they do not support themselves.
Well earned programs providing various forms of assistance aside, maybe "support" could be better defined as "respect".
Yeah but then many people will think that if you "respect" the troops, you also "respect" the war. Not really sure there is any word to convey support for the person in the military, while not supporting how the military chooses to use that person.
Yeah but then many people will think that if you "respect" the troops, you also "respect" the war. Not really sure there is any word to convey support for the person in the military, while not supporting how the military chooses to use that person.
Conscientious supporter?
Conscientious supporter?
Supportive objector? Hmmm.... that almost sounds like a female undergarment :-)!
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