I hired an old guy

[San Onofre Guy]

I can say that because next week I turn 50! I have had a vacant position for six months and the fellow I hired began college four years before me so I guess his age at 54 or 55. He is a great fit, I actually think that he is probably a better fit for the position I have and he might have it as I will most likely get my bosses job when he retires next summer. This fellow, like 95% of the qualified applicants has gone through numerous downsizings and companies moving away. The only supervision he needs is learning "our way" which is needed at all employers.

We had 120 applications for the position of which only 20 were qualified and we easily pared that down to 12 to be interviewed. Of the twelve, only three were people that we could hire, the other 9 looked good on paper but were weak or pathetic when interviewed.

One thing that I have to say from the process of hiring is that I am amazed at how many people have gone back to school to get a masters in Organizational Management. Two of those interviewed had that degree and quite frankly they both wasted a lot of time and money to get that degree. Too many private colleges have sold people on the fact that with a Masters Degree the world is your oyster. I'm not against education for bettering oneself, but few people getting these degrees are benefitting financially from the process. There are very few part time graduate degrees that are worth the time and money.

[SteveinMN]

Too many private colleges have sold people on the fact that with a Masters Degree the world is your oyster. I'm not against education for bettering oneself, but few people getting these degrees are benefitting financially from the process. There are very few part time graduate degrees that are worth the time and money.
Public colleges are selling that dream, too. :( Lots of people who went and got an MBA because they saw other people get them and hit the management fast track. At one point, I think there was a linkage, but no more. One of my former colleagues got an MBA; it does not appear to have done him a single thing but put him in debt. Too many out there now.

[Spoony]

I have an MBA. When I got mine, my life dramatically changed as my MBA opened the gateway to the type of jobs I wanted. Today is a different story though, there is a saturation of MBAs and other business master's degrees out there.

I currently teach at an allied health two-year college. We have a 97% placement rate for our graduates. That is to say, 97% of our graduates get jobs in the field of their degree, not just jobs in general.

If more colleges and universities tracked and published their placement rates (most stats are abysmal), students would be able to make better decisions about going to school. Most schools do not track their placement rates because the numbers are so awful.

[KayLR]

SOG, thank you for considering an older candidate. It gives me hope as I continue to apply for positions competing with much younger people.

[rosarugosa]

I'm 54 and hired a 59 y.o. last year. It happens!

[ApatheticNoMore]

As for old guys, I was reading on H1B Visas and one person has done research that suggests they are being used to skew hiring YOUNG. And that may be why so many in STEM fields, in tech, engineering, science, may find they encounter wage discrimination (it's almost notorious really). Because there is really no reason to hire older poeple, there are plenty of new young immigrants who will take the job.

It is nothing new to suspect H1Bs are used to keep a lid on wages. However most H1B hires are also under 30, so the idea is they may also be being used to hire new young imigrants rather than older citizens in the same field. Why? Because younger people are generally cheaper in terms of salary of course, but also they are cheaper in terms of healthcare costs. The older an employer's workforce is on average the more healthcare costs they will be paying.

The healthcare thing is why age discimination actually makes rational economic sense to employers in ALL fields (that and some expectations of higher wages for experienced employees). It's not just about prejudice at that point, thinking: old grey hairs what can they do?, although it is about that, I don't deny that can also exists, but when your prejudices pay off economically they become much more entrenched. Though I have heard age discrimination exists even in countries with socialized medicine, where I'd think they'd make less sense.

Meanwhile in order to get these H1Bs to import new hires whole industries make up stories about fake shortages (yea the shortage wouldn't exist if you'd hire anyone over 40), shortages that aren't reflected in wages (it is the most basic economics that any true shortage will be reflected in prices - in this case the price of labor). Stories of shortage are more garbage information being spewed out there, jamming everyone's signals. Well there's a shortage of x, I better get x degree. Especially jamming the signals of naive 17 year olds entering college, because they really know nothing about the world :). It's exactly like the colleges talked about in this thread, promising the moon, if only you get y degree, and yet no REAL information, no info on placement, no TRUE SIGNAL, just fake info, empty promises, noise.

And if you fall for any of them it's all your fault, you should have been smarter. As if such smartness is even socially encouraged. We tell young people "stay in school" (not bad advice in any absolute sense of course), we don't tell them do research on placement, ASK THE COLLEGES, demand the info, any real shortage would be reflected in rising wages etc..

[saguaro]

I have an MBA. When I got mine, my life dramatically changed as my MBA opened the gateway to the type of jobs I wanted. Today is a different story though, there is a saturation of MBAs and other business master's degrees out there.

I currently teach at an allied health two-year college. We have a 97% placement rate for our graduates. That is to say, 97% of our graduates get jobs in the field of their degree, not just jobs in general.

If more colleges and universities tracked and published their placement rates (most stats are abysmal), students would be able to make better decisions about going to school. Most schools do not track their placement rates because the numbers are so awful.

The same can be said for schools that advertise training for certain types of certification, licensing, etc.

My hairstylist went back to some for profit school to get training for a Computer Support Specialist certification. It might have been the Microsoft Computer Tech Support certification or something like that. The school, which is now out of business, advertised that grads would pass the certification exam. Well, she took the exam and failed; her training came nowhere near what was covered on the exam. She took out student loans, so now she has that debt, but no certification to show for it.

[ApatheticNoMore]

Oh I hope it's widely understood that those schools are often much worse. A lot of colleges actually offer pretty high quality education, they try to train people from the point of not having knowledge of a field to gaining knowledge, in often well crafted ciriculum aimed just at such. They are often very serious about that mission. It's just that that education, while perhaps quite decent at imparting knowledge, is no use if there aren't enough jobs!!! Kinda period, no matter how good the education is. A lot of the trade-y type schools dont' even do a half hearted attempt at really imparting knowledge in any form that a person could easily grasp (step by step etc.). Your hairdressers situation is just sad. There are a few decent trade schools though, your hairdresser maybe went to one to learn hairdressing originally :)

[Zoe Girl]

That is awesome, I know that it is harder to get jobs past 50 which is plain stupid to me. I think more people should understand that a lot of experienced workers can just walk in and handle so much of it. Things like showing up on time, dressing well, knowing social skills and time management. Well by the time you are 50 you pretty much have learned a lot of that or it is at least easier to tell that you suck at it.

I don't want to be age prejudiced myself (I am mid-40's) but it is interesting since all our upper mangement has changed in the last 2 years and they are all 10-15 years younger. Some things I learned with age they don't have. And since they are my supervisors that is not something to say.

[rodeosweetheart]

well, as someone who is 56, maybe you ought to reconsider calling him an "old guy"--just sayin. . . I work 2 jobs and do a much better job than many younger colleagues, although some probably do a better job than I do--just can't think of any off hand, LOL--oops, have to edit that, my boss if younger than I and she does a better job than I do, although it's a different job--but I don;t want to work 24 hours a day and she doesn't seem to mind. So better in the sense that she gives more hours to the company and is willing to do some pretty awful things that I am not willing to do.

I guess I am old to some people and young to others, but it's kind of offensive to be described as "the old gal" (just trying to change to see how it would sound about a woman colleague of 54--ugh.)

Maybe keep that terminology to yourself?

[San Onofre Guy]

Rodeo,

Men become part of a protected class when they reach age 40, for the other gender, you are part of a protected class when you emerge from the womb. When I was looking to hire six months ago, I posted something about it on these boards and many commented on how difficult it is for older people to get jobs as most employers will hire young people on the cheap. What is the opposite of young? OLD!

My teens think anyone over 30 is old.

Everything is relative and quite frankly unless you do physical labor and are disabled, I don't think someone is old in terms of the workforce until 70.

The point of my using the term Old Guy was to give people some encouraging words. It is tough to get a job, even tougher if you are over 50.

[JaneV2.0]

I don't mind acknowledging that 50 is considered old by many. I got hired by four different employers in my fifties, but that was before the great crash of 2000. In my best-paid job, I was hired at the same time as a 65-year old man who had retired from a similar job. Obviously, my employer was looking for experience.

[rodeosweetheart]

San, I don't understand what you are saying here:

"Men become part of a protected class when they reach age 40, for the other gender, you are part of a protected class when you emerge from the womb."

Maybe it went over my head, but I am not following you here.

[San Onofre Guy]

The protected class reference relates to discrimination in the workplace. The male gender under 40 is the only class of people that does not get protection as outlined by the EEOC.

[rodeosweetheart]

The protected class reference relates to discrimination in the workplace. The male gender under 40 is the only class of people that does not get protection as outlined by the EEOC.

Thank you, San, I think I now see where you are coming from.

[pony mom]

At least your new employee will have social skills and won't be texting every five minutes.

I have a right to be crabby because at 46, I'm considered middle aged.