For Those of You With Sloppy Teens/Young Adults [Archive]

Mighty Frugal

2-20-13, 1:59pm

So, I just finished reading Zoe Girl's thread on bugs in her home and her kids who don't clean up after themselves.

It got me thinking. Is this my life in 10 years when my boys are teens?

So, for those of you with teens/young adults-are they all slobs? Do they all leave a trail of sticky chocolate bar wrappers and half eaten hot dogs under couch cushions?

Or the ones that have messy teens-did they have chores when they were young? Are you a bit more lax with housekeeping or perhaps super diligent and did everything for them?

I guess I am trying to be proactive to see if there is anything I can do now to limit the amount of mold laced bitten apples I need to find in sock drawers!

For now, my boys know they need to clean up after themselves-dishes brought to counter. Toys put back after they finish playing with them, etc. I guess I go a bit overboard when it comes to cleaning/organizing. Beds always made, chairs straighten, no dirty dishes in sink, everything put back in it's place

So, anyone care to share their story about life with teens?

Float On

2-20-13, 2:07pm

We've always had a few set rules.
No food outside the kitchen/dining.
Do not stand on the furniture.
No jumping or throwing.
Those rules work at 3 and 16.

I've never made a big deal about cleaning schedule for their rooms or that beds had to be made before they came downstairs.
The 16 year old is a bit messy with papers and books.
The 15 year old cleans his room almost daily including sweeping the wood floor and polishing the furniture and organizing his closet but he's a little OCD anyway.

One key thing when they were little and it was time to clean up. Anything left out in the public rooms was thrown away. They learned really quick to keep their favorite things in their rooms. Still to this day when I say, 'time to get ready for bed', I see them both scan the living room to see if they forgot any items (and I haven't thrown away anything in over 12 years).

IshbelRobertson

2-20-13, 2:36pm

I read, open-mouthed some of the stories re teenagers on this site!

I had three!

Mrs-M

2-20-13, 2:41pm

We're a family of eight, so everyone has to help pull the load and do their share to keep things pleasant in our tiny abode. That's the rule.

When my kids were babies/toddlers, mucking-up and stickying-up their hands eating gooey messy things, I was never far away (washcloth in hand) to tackle the mess as it happened. Now that everyone is older and gaining more independence, I expect better, than dirty dishes left downstairs, milk-stained glasses in bedrooms, etc.

My parenting style is one that reflects fairness, while at the same time, strictness, so when I say something, I mean it, and the kids know it, so I find all it takes to rein-in the unacceptable, is a simple and direct warning. I don't partake in repeats, nor do I tolerate defiance.

As expected, I did absolutely everything for my kids from the time they poked their heads out, and I'm certain (to a large degree) they knew it and capitalized on it, knowing mom was always there, but slowly as more kids made their debut, I had to adjust my approach in the department of, doting mom of the year.

Those old enough to make their beds, I expect them to make an effort to make them, and for those who do, small rewards are made available to them as an incentive. As for dishes and things, particularly dishes that happen when mom and dad are out, I expect those dishes to be washed, dried, and put away, before our arrival back home again, and to date there hasn't been any issues.

Upbringing, starts from the very start. I don't (at all) side with raising children in a namby-pamby fashion for x-amount of years, then suddenly, without notice, expect the world from kids/teens. It doesn't work that way. Discipline, needs to be instilled and practiced from the very get-go, and I was always steadfast in that department.

My best advice to you, Mighty Frugal, start laying the groundwork now... and by the time your little ones reach teenage ones, they'll know and understand what is to be expected of them. There's a lot to be said about early-planning and intervention.

jasuko

2-20-13, 2:47pm

My sons were great at doing chores and being responsible when they were in elementary school, and somewhat in middle school. I had assigned chores for them every day, that alternated. Then they hit their teens and all hell broke loose. I eventually decided that household peace and love was more important than household tidiness. They have their own places now, and they get annoyed at their roommates for leaving things a mess - so they KNOW how to keep a place reasonably clean and orderly. No permanent damage was done by my house not being up to a certain standard, and our relationship was better - they were more likely to talk to me about the really important stuff when I wasn't harping on them about their rooms all the time. And it's still true today... when I don't cross-examine them about things going on in their lives, they tell me the important stuff when they are ready to. Worked for us.

Mighty Frugal

2-20-13, 2:54pm

thank you all! I feel I am fairly strict on cleanliness, tidyingup-ess. My boys know better than to walk away from the dinner table without taking their dishes with them. And the no food upstairs policy works quite well (except for the time we found a bag of contraband candy stashed in my 7 year old's SAFE-haha only he knew the combo!)

I suppose my fear was will my young boys (Almost 7 and 8) suddenly change their pretty tidy habits and morph into slovenly teens

Float on-haha on your 15 year old! That is too cute!

Florence

2-20-13, 3:08pm

I had only one child, a daughter. By the time she was a teenager, she could pretty much run the house. If she left something in a mess, there was usually a reason and she would straighten things out when she could. She now runs her own household much more efficiently than I ever did.

Mrs-M

2-20-13, 3:13pm

Originally posted by Florence.
By the time she was a teenager, she could pretty much run the house.That's my oldest daughter!

Mrs-M

2-20-13, 3:18pm

Peace, is so important, isn't it, Jasuko.

Gardenarian

2-20-13, 4:54pm

There is a pretty big personality change at around age 13 (for girls, may be a bit later for boys.) Kids who were formerly fairly organized and resourceful will sit there looking at an empty mug, or a pair of shoes on the floor, dumbfounded as what to do with it. The British have a word - gormless (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=gormless) - that to me expresses it pretty well.

I've given up trying to force dd to organize herself. We set limits (Float On's are similar) and I keep dd's stuff organized while she has to make up for it by doing other chores - vacuuming, cleaning the cars, sweeping the sidewalk. She does much better with a set task then a more general "pick this stuff up!" I think she is actually incapable of keeping all her cr@p from multiplying and spreading.

I have stopped resenting her for this, and just make sure she puts in some hours contributing to the household. She's a fun kid, and happy to work when it's something that's within her scope.

Note: dd's is profoundly gifted, with an IQ in the 99.9 percentile. We call it severely gifted. Calculus? Japanese? Easy! Remembering to bring a pencil - impossible! Gormless!

artist

2-20-13, 6:07pm

My son is 19 and he isn't a slob. Clutter bug yes... Slob no. He tends to need to spread out in order to function so his bedroom often looks like chaos. However, it's always clean. Vacuumed, bed made, no food dishes, clothes put away, dirty clothes in hamper etc... Just books and sheet music everywhere.

We did have rules. No food outside of the kitchen. Living room snacks were ok but dishes must be washed and put away afterwards. No dishes go unwashed, you take it, you clean it. (no dishes piled in the sink that way). We also had a rule where everyone had their own glass and was responsible for washing it. This saved us from having a ton of glasses piled up on the counter or in the sink. (Each glass looks different, same for coffee mugs). We also insisted that laundry be done by the owner by the time our son was 8. Everything must be put away as well. Strict rules but they seem to have stuck. Though he's more lax with the food in his room when he gets home (have to remind him he's not in the dorm) but he's good about it.

Fawn

2-20-13, 7:18pm

My three teens do a pretty good job. The common areas of the house are minimalist and easy to clean (both pick up items and remove dirt.)
We have some general rules like Float on's: no food outside the kitchen or dining room. Everybody clears their own dishes from the table. When you are 12 you get a lesson on how the washer and dryer work and after that you are responsible for cleaning your own clothes. I do iron the occasional dress shirt if someone asks nicely.

If one of their items is left in the common room, I ask them to put it away. Generally they do. Rarely, I will place it barely inside the door to their room. Their rooms tend to be not minimalist and more cluttered. The kids clean the house every 2 weeks for money and sign up for specific chores, so on a Saturday AM, you might hear DD say to DS#2, you need to pick up your floor so I can vacuum. He will place all the clutter from the floor on the bed and after she vacuums, back on the floor again. None of them makes their bed unless a friend is coming over.

It generally works. Sometimes they get a little lax. DS#2 has Improve troupe here every Sunday afternoon, and they move the furniture around to make room for the craziness. A couple times he forgot to move it back, but did after I reminded him. DS#3 likes to eat in his room and leaves the candy wrappers where the cat can get to them (this is against my rule) so when I find cat puke anywhere in the house with a candy wrapper in it, DS#3 has to clean it up. Hasn't broke him of this bad habit yet, but its getting better.

I've had to deal with bugs a few times in my adult life: huge roaches when I lived in poverty in Kansas City, ants in the kitchen here in Springfield and the Summer of Head Lice when the kids kept getting re-infected at their dad's house. I have to tell you, when there are bugs involved, I am much stricter/meaner about the rules until the bugs are gone.

Zoe Girl

2-20-13, 8:30pm

I would love to tell you what not to do in order to avoid this, alas I think I am a pretty good mom. I tend towards logical consequences and they have always had chores and responsibilities. In fact my oldest could do laundry and cook a meal and watch her brother including trusting her with first aid at 13. Then things fell apart in the family and inside her, and we all went crazy for a few years. I am trying to pull something back and get our stability. There is a significant component of inherited mental illness is that helps you feel better, if all your relatives are able to live independantly that reduces your risk for your kids.

What I can look back and say I would change is not accepting her friends. That sounds harsh, but that really is what I would do. I let a lot of kids hang out in my garage, smoke, eat a few leftovers, create some art out of trash, and they pretty much are all lost causes. I spent a lot of years trying to get into teaching and so I worked 7 days a week surviving and trying to be helpful to these young people. When I bough groceries I made them help carry in. When the lawn was horrible I handed them a rake. Their families didn't teach them to drive or feed them a vegetable and I felt bad for them. There is one young man who is losing teeth in his early 20's due to such a poor diet. I don't know why I thought I could make any impact, it would have been better to help at more of a distance.

Geez, I gotta turn in my liberal card!!

Zoebird

2-21-13, 4:23am

Zoe Girl, I'm tired, so I'm trying to understand sentence structure. Bare with me.

Do you mean that, if you could go back, you would refuse to accept her friends and not do those things that you did (let them hang, feed them, give them a rake)? or do you mean that you would accept them, but not necessarily do so much for them considering everything that you were going through and that perhaps they needed more independence and less 'tending?'

If it is the first, do you think that their "lost-cause-ness" somehow rubbed off on your children? Do you think that other families might have viewed your children as "lost causes" not to be fed left overs or allowed to make art out of trash bits (found art, it's called! :) )?

What would your non-acceptance have looked like? And do you think that would have encouraged your children to seek out different friends, less "lost-causy" ones? And therefore, they, themselves, might be less lost-causy/challenging/difficult?

In my home growing up, we always had to tidy though mom did the lion's share. I remember my room in high school always beign clean because I preferred it that way, and same n university. I just tend that direction. my sister was more likely to be a mess, but she does art stuff, so she would have a lot of things in progress, drying, etc. And, she's naturally just messier -- even now. She has a BIG house and the tidy rooms are the dining room, guest room, bathroom, her son's room, and the up-stairs den. the rest are in various states of disarray -- sometimes due to rennovations, other times due to decorating, other times due to reorganization of her stuff, art/crafting projects, the kiddo's toys, etc.

So, we are different. Same household, just different people. And, it goes in waves with her. Sometimes her home is spotless, and other times it's a disaster.

In our home, we do tidying throughout the day, and it's everyone doing jobs. I do toys, and Ds might do shoes/bags (so not just his stuff), and DH might do the dusting/counter wipe-down, etc. I'll tidy the bathroom stuff (tooth brushes, combs, laundry into the washer, etc), and DS does the dishes while DH sorts the dried laundry. I'll then fold the laundry, DS puts it away, and DH makes dinner.

This way, we are all tidying everything, rather than DS has to do "his" stuff and i do "my" stuff and dh does "his" stuff. It's just that "the house needs to be tidied/cleaned" -- so we do it.

Hopefully, this will continue forward.

Zoe Girl

2-21-13, 9:24am

Mrs-M

2-21-13, 10:21am

Mrs. Hermit

2-21-13, 10:43am

Originally posted by Artist.
We also insisted that laundry be done by the owner by the time our son was 8. Everything must be put away as well. Strict rules but they seem to have stuck.

We had a similar age-based rule. But one of our daughters was so tiny, that at the "proper" age for learning to do laundry, she couldn't handle the washing machine. She would have to use a stepstool to reach the machine, then reach way down into it to get the clothes out. She would fall in, and not be able to get out. We ended up postponing the laundry age for her....

Mrs-M

2-21-13, 10:53am

Pleasantly laughing right now over the thought of how I used to darken the doorways of my sons/daughters rooms (like a prison guard) when they were toddlers, to ensure messy, toy-ridden spaces were pulled back together again. Sometimes I'd just stand there (minute-by-minute) watching and directing them, step-by-step, while other times I'd tell them, "if I come back in 5/10 and the job isn't done, I'm going to turn someone over my knee"!

I'd smack my hands together (once) loudly to confirm, then march off to busy myself with something or another to allow them time to make progress. Then, living up to the softie that I am... I'd return, only to get down on the floor with them to help with the process. No spankings... LOL!

Mrs-M

2-21-13, 10:55am

Originally posted by Mrs. Hermit.
We had a similar age-based rule. But one of our daughters was so tiny, that at the "proper" age for learning to do laundry, she couldn't handle the washing machine. She would have to use a stepstool to reach the machine, then reach way down into it to get the clothes out. She would fall in, and not be able to get out. We ended up postponing the laundry age for her....ROTFLMAO! Always been a supporter of starting them young!

MissMandy

2-21-13, 11:49am

I read, open-mouthed some of the stories re teenagers on this site!

I had three!

I agree. I think most teenagers are pretty sloppy, but there's a fine line between sloppy and bio-hazard.

IshbelRobertson

2-21-13, 12:21pm

Mine were trained to be clean in their habits from a very early age!

The idea of coming down to the kitchen and finding things had been left out overnight? Simply never happened.;)

jennipurrr

2-21-13, 6:30pm

Other Zoe,

I guess I don't know what exactly it would have looked like. I know that I was the only one who let these kids hang out and if I would have had an idea where they were going I probably wouldn't. Back in the day I was a white suburban punk and my group really were a bunch of rebellious but overly smart kids.

I think I get what you are saying. I think my parents have some regrets about how they went about making my sister get a part time job her senior year of high school. She had dragged on with it and they basically told her get a job this week or you are grounded until you do. She promptly did and ended up working at a breakfast/diner type place where most of the kids her age working there were pretty rough. She worked there three years and got involved in a crowd that she likely never would have had any meaningful interaction with otherwise...most never went on to college, trouble with the law, substance addiction, etc. She became involved with one of the guys there who was trouble trouble trouble and is now in prison. It took a good long while for her to untangle from that lifestyle and find her self again...but who would have known all that, they just wanted her to have a work ethic and earn spending money? You just wanted to provide these kids a safe place and through that they may have creeped further into your kids social circle than if you had been indifferent.

Funn thing it was, I was the one my parents actually worried about falling in with the "wrong crowd." While my sister was in a sorority and things like that, I went through a lot of rebellious phases and brought home odd looking friends, refused to shop anywhere but the thrift store (my mom had a meltdown once about that), etc...but like you, we were all just nerds with a bit of teenage rebellion. One boy my mother despised me running around with is a brilliant computer programmer now, hah.

Zoebird

2-22-13, 1:07am

ZoeGirl,

I can't say that I yet get what you are saying, but please don't take that as a criticism because it isn't. :) I am still just tired (not sleeping well lately!). :)

I can see what Jennipurr is saying -- or the example expresses it.

Hmm.

Glo

2-22-13, 10:36am

Our three boys did plenty of chores both inside and out while growing up. They did plenty of complaining about it, too! All three were very messy and disorganized along the way. They are about to turn 35, 37, and 39. Two of them (one married and one not), are very clean and organized in their own homes; I'm always amazed! The youngest, who lives in our finished basement, still is very messy. So, IMO, its just the luck of the draw!

Mrs-M

2-22-13, 3:27pm

Originally posted by Glo.
The youngest, who lives in our finished basement, still is very messy.Call me old-fashioned... but I'm from the school of, if you're living under the roof of someone else's home, you had better live up to the ideals surrounding that home.

Mrs-M

2-22-13, 3:32pm

To add... my children were raised knowing how steadfast I am in relation to keeping things clean and organized, so shame on them if they attempted practicing anything, other-than, while living at home.

Zoebird

2-22-13, 10:27pm

I would say that, though, the caveat would be if the child were living as an actual tenant. If Glo had a tenant living in the basement apartment, then she really wouldn't have a say over how messy the tenant is -- within of course the reason of general health and safety/etc.

BarbieGirl

2-24-13, 10:13am

Wow! I'm impressed by everyone's posts. My boys are very messy. I have to constantly remind them to do the most basic things, like picking up after themselves. They don't seem to realize that if they don't clean up after themselves, then I have to do it. And frankly, I'm tired of it!

It doesn't help that we are in a tiny house, and we live in every square inch of it! I do demand that they pitch in and clean up after themselves. But why do I STILL have to start raising my voice until they comply?

Ill be reading these posts to try to find a new battle plan that might help me get results!

barb

Fawn

2-24-13, 11:19am

barb--if they do not comply until you raise your voice, you have two different, useful pieces of information. 1) they know what you want and 2) they are not motivated to comply until this event happens.

You know your boys better than we do. What else might motivate them? Objects disappearing after bedtime curtain call (as above poster did?)
Paying them in favors/money/meals to comply?

Be creative! It is my experience that children assume that their parents are going to do a chore/task and until they are taught differently. Which makes sense, when babies come into the house, parents do take care of all the chores. It is one of our jobs to move many of those tasks to the offspring over time. By the time they leave the house (and they will want to leave the house) they are capable of running their own.

I think many parents erroneously assume that the kids are going to start wanting to do chores that they are capable of as soon as they are capable and then get frustrated when they don't. We have to train them.

I remember in one of her books, author Martha Beck describing that behavioral scientists have trained pigs to push shopping carts and pigeons to bowl. I'm pretty sure that my kids are smarter than pigs. So, if their behaviors are lacking, then I am not a very good trainer.

That last sentence should start a firestorm of conversation about personality/free will/mental illness. I am applying this idea of training the children to the cleaning of the home, not determining a career path or mate selection.

Mrs-M

2-24-13, 1:38pm

Originally posted by BarbieGirl.
But why do I STILL have to start raising my voice until they comply?When/if you can progress beyond raising your voice, you'll find more solitude and balance in your home. I used to go on tirades... raising my voice... paddling bottoms... and it got me nowhere... got the kids nowhere, too, and looking back on it now, it made for an unsettled environment in our home.

I have always been the sole disciplinarian in the home, and because of that fact, friction and tension between DH and I, often erupted (albeit mild) whenever I exercised my authority, particularly when I spanked (especially with the boys). Now... because of my changed approach Re: discipline and how I hand it down, our home is more Zen-like. There's peace and calm, and a feeling of understanding and support (among all), and I get more results being calculatingly controlling, rather than overbearing.

nswef

2-24-13, 4:33pm

I love caluculatingly controlling!!!

Mrs-M

2-24-13, 4:38pm

LOL, Nswef!

BarbieGirl

2-27-13, 3:39pm

barb--if they do not comply until you raise your voice, you have two different, useful pieces of information. 1) they know what you want and 2) they are not motivated to comply

I think many parents erroneously assume that the kids are going to start wanting to do chores that they are capable of as soon as they are capable and then get frustrated when they don't. We have to train them.

.

Fawn,
I really got a lot from your post. It rang true for me and I realize that I haven't trained them well. Since I'm currently a homemaker, I guess I've felt like its my job to clean the whole house. Then I get frustrated because I don't have help and I'm also picking up after them. I think clear, consistent lines need to be drawn...both for myself and then the kids. I need to realize that being a homemaker doesn't make me their servant. And that I need to explain what I expect from them and then see it through.

Thanks!
barb

BarbieGirl

2-27-13, 3:49pm

Mrs. M,

I'm not usually overbearing when I start to raise my voice....lol....it's more like I'm whining and complaining instead of being calm and firm. I DO need to be more calculating and in control, rather than whiny and self pity....I'm certainly not seeing good results in my home because of this, that's for darn sure!

I DO want and need to be in control. Especially with two on the spectrum. I do get easily exhausted dealing with our day to day situation and taking control back will help. I think I really thought they should know that they ought to be helpful and cleaning up after themselves, especially at their ages. But my lack of consistency has been to blame, not them.

so, I'm going to try a new way....and see how it goes. Jut a general....this is what's going to happen right now, no excuses.

thanks!
barb

BarbieGirl

2-27-13, 3:51pm

I love caluculatingly controlling!!!

Lol! I loved that Mrs. M line too! But she's right! :laff:

redfox

2-27-13, 7:43pm

We raised our kids with a chore chart, and as they got older, anyone could call for a re-allocating of the chores, or trade off. It was posted in the kitchen area, and was a month calendar that was a write on/wipe off one. It got re-done at the end of each month, and we rotated chores, annotated what the symbols meant, and color-coded it. It included cleaning the cat box, folding laundry, cooking meals, cleaning kitchen & bathrooms, vacuuming & dusting, and yard work.

I did not care about their rooms, except for the no food & no drugs/alcohol/cigs rule. They could have some food, like snacks, but not entire meals unless they were ill in bed. I confiscated cigs, alcohol (really bad cheap beer - yuck!) & pot several times from our son. He got the pot & pipe back after he moved out & was over 18, which was the deal.

Fawn

2-27-13, 8:36pm

Barb--glad to help. :)

redfox--what was the rational for returning the pot and pipe when he left the house, but not the cigarettes and cheap beer?

redfox

2-27-13, 9:34pm

Barb--glad to help. :)

redfox--what was the rational for returning the pot and pipe when he left the house, but not the cigarettes and cheap beer?

Hah! Great question. It reflects our personal biases. We had told him that due to the laws about pot possession, there were no illegal drugs allowed in the house by him - we held the risk, and made the decisions. He was informed that he'd get his stash back once he was over 18 & out of the house. The cheap beer got poured out & the cigs were tossed, both in disgust. The pipe was durable & the pot is something we don't feel is harmful like cigs n booze. My DH kept them in his studio under lock & key for 2 years. Actually, I'd forgotten about it all, till DH stumbled across them cleaning out his studio.

I use cannabis for osteoarthritis, and DH uses it recreationally, and we both use alcohol moderately. We always made our stance very clear about cannabis, that it was not a moral one, rather it was legal, and we did not want our home at risk due to his possession. Of course, now cannabis possession & use is legal for those over 21 in WA. He's 20, still smoking cigs (YUCK), his alcohol consumption has dropped dramatically, and he uses cannabis for his auto-immune illness.

iris lily

2-27-13, 10:14pm